Concern about new Yamato valks prices

[BlueMax]

CAUTION: LONG RANT AHEAD. If you are alright with how much you are paying for your valks, you probably do not need to read this thread.

To be sure, I love Yamato valks and I am very thankful to Yamato we are getting them but...I am very concerned about upcoming valk prices:

Maybe some of you have already realised this long time ago, maybe I was in denial, but the full realization only hit me recently, especially with the announced prices for the VF-11C (no change, and the VF-11B was noted for being very pricey) and M&M VF-22Ss.

I was hoping against hope that the prices for these babies will be slightly lower, since we know from basic economics and conventional wisdom that the average and marginal cost for producing each additional unit can only get lower, but maybe the prices have already taken into account this. But then again, the YF-21 (and possibly the Vf-11B) was produced when Yamato probably have not secured the license for the Macross (Dynamite) 7 valks. True, the YF-21 was 3000 yen more expensive than the VF-22Ss, but the difference can be attributed more to the lack of a stand for the VF-22Ss rather anything else.

Add insult to injury: The Yen has been appreciating against most currencies and shows no signs of abating anytime soon... means we are suffering a double whammy....

No... wait, if we take Bandai's DX line into the picture, the folks at Bandai seemed to have taken cues from Yamato: the prices are on par, if not higher than Yamato valks. Add the super export-unfriendly web exclusives, makes for a triple or even quadruple whammy for valk lovers who wants valks from each series.

Fast forward to next year, where we will probably be getting some or all valks from the VF poll that Graham had made, how much will we have to pay for each valk? This is even when some of the valks, like the VF-19s, can be milked for a few variants (VF-19 Kai, F, S, P: Normal, P: Whale blood edition). I know that they can't be milked as much as the vF-1, but I seriously suspect that all these non-VF-1 valks will be priced at 18800yen or higher, and this is something I can't really justify in the long run for each purchase. Each of this is almost like 10% of my net income!

Sure, I DON'T HAVE to buy everything that is released, but I know that some day I will be going after "the ones that got away". They might be cheaper or more expensive to get later, but mostly more expensive and way more troublesome to find, should anyone of them become rare.

While I welcome wholeheartedly the new valks, I sincerely hope that the prices can come down.

While I know this may be a long shot, I sincerely wish that Graham can give some feedback to Yamato regarding the prices.

Like I said, this is just a rant. I will still buy whatever valk that Yamato comes out with, as long as the quality is good and I can afford it.

Edited October 20, 2009 by BlueMax

[arrow]

I agree.

[eugimon]

yes, things we want should be cheaper.

[Rabidweezil]

I agree. When I think about how much I drop for these things it makes me question my sanity. It was fine back in the day when it was a $100 here and there. But lately it's getting kind of crazy. Especially since I'm pretty much a completist. The recently released Blue and Orange YF-19's are the first 2 Yamato Valks I didn't purchase right away. And am not sure if I actually ever will because of the money.

And I was all on board with the Bandai DX line when it was announced. But then I learned all the accessories were exclusives. That turned me off right away and I never picked any up because of it.

I actually was hoping Yamato would run out of Valks to make one day. But with the addition of the Macross 7 line that probably will not happen any time soon. And all the designs for this series seem to fall into the higher price range.

Have you noticed though, it's not just Yamato and Bandai. But everything Macross tends to be expensive. Outside of trading figures, what out there is below $50?

One day I'm going to get tired of it all. Not tired of Macross, but tired of spending my money on expensive things that have no business being the prices they are.

It's funny though, I remember many years ago there was nothing Macross out there. And things like Joons bootleg 1/55's were all the rage. And now here we are with many, many choices. But prices keep everyone but the dedicated fan with a decent job away.

Macross, a hobby or curse?

Edited October 20, 2009 by Rabidweezil

[eugimon]

It's funny, I remember years ago when people were paying out over a grand for a 20 year old toy and bragging about it. Now we're sob sob sobbing about 200 bucks. boo hoo us.

[Knightdramon]

I'm not that worried. The prices tend to get a bit crazy but look at the product in return.

The SV-51 [one of the first Yamato valk. over 20.000 yen] was packed full of accessories [display stand, all sorts of missiles, boosters etc] and the biggest, at the time, transformable fighter.

The trend continued with the YF-21 and hasn't since resumed. I still don't have a VF-11 [plan to get C though] so I can't know if the price is absurd or not.

YF-19 was a tad more expensive than I hoped for the measly gunpod accessory it came with, but at the time it was an engineering marvel getting rave reviews all over the place.

Furthermore, how can Bandai follow the trend when almost all their pricing is substantially lower? The base VF-25 model is big enough for it to feel a bargain at 12000 yen, the fast packs bundles are 15-16000 yen each [even then, lower and "meatier" than the VF-0] and the armoured fast pack is 18800 yen, rivaling the VF-22 in price but far surpassing it when it comes to accessories and all.

No offense to any, but sometimes fans are cheaper than they realize. Never before any major company I buy products from did a straight up repaint cost less than the original unless accessories were missing.

[eugimon]

It's not that fans are cheap but that a large segment of fans feel entitled.

And lets be fair, yamato has introduced mid level priced macross toys, revy has 20 dollar toys, there's the 1/100 scale market, most of this stff can be had for 20% off if you wait for a sale.

Frankly, these aren't staples, your life doesn't depend on toys. If you can't afford something then the problem really isn't with the company it's with you.

Edited October 20, 2009 by eugimon

[mr.chogokin]

I'm just glad that the market demand dictates the eventual prices for these things; not how much these makers think their stuff are ought to be worth. In that spirit, I don't mind being labeled cheap or shameless for wanting things cheaply just because I feel entitled to it but not wanting to overpay, because these companies will not consider your financial positions when they price their stuff.

What I believe is, there are dues to be paid by both sides (the makers and the collectors), sometimes the collector looses out in paying more than he should due to demand or rarity or impatience, but that is few and far between and the makers don't make this money... what pleases me is most of the time, these makers are forced to markdown their prices because business is slow and they can't sustain the initial price they wanted. In the staring game between "them" and "us", it is the makers, the retailers that will blink first. Of course, they can opt not to make the things we want, but it will never happen. Some company always make what we want eventually. For the market monopoly, they won't just up and allow things to belly up or stagnate either.

[VFTF1]

Speaking as a retailer here - these are just my opinions basd on my personal experience - no statistic or "hard" facts to back it up on a universal scale:

Yamato have lowered their prices and retailers are doing their best to pass those lower prices on to customers

And just to be exact, Yamato have not so much "lowered their prices" overall as they have set up certain pricing schemes which make it possible to secure Yamato products at less (in Yen) than was possible last year. And retailers are doing their best, as far as I can tell, to offer these products at lower prices.

The only reason YOU aren't seeing the benefits of this is the weak USD dollar, not the "appreciatng Yen." The Dollar is collapsing because the Prime Interest rate in America is nearly Zero and the US has done nothing but print money for the last two years.

Also - keep in mind another thing - while I have no proof of this regarding Yamato's Macross products, it is widely known that many toy factories went out of business in China due to the huge fall in consumer demand (buying) resulting from the financial crisis.

I am fairly convinced that Takara-Tomy, Yamato, Kaiyodo, even Bandai have now limited the production of their goods, and that retailers who, two years ago, used to order "blindly" in massive bulk, with a plan to "over-stock" due to the generally appreciating value of these items, have now reversed course and are ordering ONLY what they get in pre-orders.

In fact, producers sometimes base their production runs on how many units are ordered up to a certain date by retailers.

So ironically - if you want cheaper Valkyrie but you are one of those people who say "no - I'll wait...I won't pre-order and pre-pay now, but I'll wait until later when the price falls" - then ironically you are contributing to the higher price of the new stuff (like the VF-22S Max/Millia and VF-11C that's been complained about here).

Why?

Becaue if you don't pre-order, then the retailer has that much less units on order with the producer - and the producer JUST DOESN'T MAKE MORE.

It's that bad. That's how piss poor the economy is right now. Nobody wants to risk over-stocking or over-producing. And consumers who don't place pre-orders in the hopes of "waiting for lower prices" only guarantee LOWER SUPPLY - ergo HIGHER PRICES.

I'm not saying anybody in particular is to "blame" here - everybody's in the sewers with this bad economy.

But please don't think Yamato and others haven't done all they could to put good prices on fantastic products - I'm convinced they have.

Pete

Edited October 20, 2009 by VFTF1

[bluemax151]

Sarcasm aside no one is entitled to things they "want" at a price they want. That said I agree some of the items seem over priced like the VF-11, to a lesser degree the destroids and don't even get me started on the power armours. I can't really make a comment on Bandai's Frontier line because I don't own any, I haven't handled any and I never plan to. Even revoltechs in general are kind of over priced IMO but again it's an import and as always you pay a premium and sometimes it's the only way you can get some particular licensed merchandise. The 22 (although lacking accessories) is totally worth the cost IMO. I would say the 19 would be too but it's engineering/design has not aged well plus the repaints aren't really that exciting. What people should be thankful for is the fact Yamato gives us awesome VF-1s for what I would say minus various hiccups is an extreme value. The best way to show Yamato pricing is hurting their market penetration is to just stop buying whatever you feel isn't worth the cost and wash your hands of the situation.

As for the strength of the Yen the irony of the situation is the Japanese economy is tanking just as hard as everyone's...

[eugimon]

What do you mean "seems"?

Do you have any idea what the overhead is? Materials, rent, lease, salary, wages, the time it took to design it, the licensing fees, marketing? Anything... a single hard number to base anything on?

If *you* think it's expensive for *you* that's fine, I'm sorry you're hurting, a lot of us are. But it's ridiculous to say yamato is charging too much because *you* can't afford it.

And no, the east asian economies are the balloon raising the economy, so no, the Japanese economy isn't tanking as hard as everyone else's. Countries that actually make things recover faster than the countries that just buy stuff.

Edited October 20, 2009 by eugimon

[ruskiiVFaussie]

For me it's not so much the cost (no, i don't have the money), it's the rate Yamato is punching all these out lol.

Lucky i denounced my completistism a while back.

If Yamato could punch these out a few or more months apart from each other that would be nice, but then the stuff we want now would pain to wait for lol.

like the Yamato 1/2000 SDF-1.....

Edited October 20, 2009 by ruskiiVFaussie

[bluemax151]

What do you mean "seems"?

Do you have any idea what the overhead is? Materials, rent, lease, salary, wages, the time it took to design it, the licensing fees, marketing? Anything... a single hard number to base anything on?

If *you* think it's expensive for *you* that's fine, I'm sorry you're hurting, a lot of us are. But it's ridiculous to say yamato is charging too much because *you* can't afford it.

Actually I have some management experience from retail (years ago so it's a bit dated) but I get the general concept. I'm not sure why I'd have to give you any hard data/charts/graphs and/or a power point presentation but to try to call me out on my wordage is a bit zealous considering the use of word itself. I never said "YAMATO OVERCHARGES I KNOW IT!!!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!one!!!!1!!!!". Hopefully you understand the concept more clearly now that's it's "CHANNED/INTERWEBBED". In case there is still any confusion though, by comparison to products not only from other manufacturers but Yamato's own product lines (even in it's Macross line) some products are of a better value!

And no, the east asian economies are the balloon raising the economy, so no, the Japanese economy isn't tanking as hard as everyone else's. Countries that actually make things recover faster than the countries that just buy stuff.

East Asia is a pretty broad area and again Japan does not really "produce" these products. Deflation, rising homeless levels and the growing prevalence of contractual labor in Japan are real problems. Maybe not directly for you and me but as people have learned from the current state of the world economy eventually it effects everyone. What does Japan care though? Much like America they'll just keep throwing money at their failing companies.

I was just going to just copy paste the definition of seems to be an *sshole but I figured I'd address you points for the sake of the discussion.

just in case though

1. To give the impression of being; appear

2. To appear to one's own opinion or mind

3. To appear to be true, probable, or evident

Lastly there is no way anyone can honestly believe the power armours are $100+ toys. Even when it first came out Milia's was pretty sad and to rerelease them at the same price much later was a shame. Thankfully I got a good deal on Max's and for about $60 it "seemed" a decent buy.

[arrow]

I love Yamato products but haven't bought any this year. For that same price range, I bought a Bandai Mac F toy instead. It feels like a flight to quality with the die-cast in there.

[Save]

Thanks VFTF1, there is no reason for me to add any points you covered it well.

[STL]

Y'know as an Australian, we've had plenty of swings in fortunes with the currencies. The US has long been the prime currency but if it ain't, a lot of you yanks are gonna be in the same boat as the rest of us.

[eugimon]

Actually I have some management experience from retail (years ago so it's a bit dated) but I get the general concept. I'm not sure why I'd have to give you any hard data/charts/graphs and/or a power point presentation but to try to call me out on my wordage is a bit zealous considering the use of word itself. I never said "YAMATO OVERCHARGES I KNOW IT!!!!!!!!!!!1!!!!!!!one!!!!1!!!!". Hopefully you understand the concept more clearly now that's it's "CHANNED/INTERWEBBED". In case there is still any confusion though, by comparison to products not only from other manufacturers but Yamato's own product lines (even in it's Macross line) some products are of a better value!

East Asia is a pretty broad area and again Japan does not really "produce" these products. Deflation, rising homeless levels and the growing prevalence of contractual labor in Japan are real problems. Maybe not directly for you and me but as people have learned from the current state of the world economy eventually it effects everyone. What does Japan care though? Much like America they'll just keep throwing money at their failing companies.

I was just going to just copy paste the definition of seems to be an *sshole but I figured I'd address you points for the sake of the discussion.

just in case though

1. To give the impression of being; appear

2. To appear to one's own opinion or mind

3. To appear to be true, probable, or evident

Lastly there is no way anyone can honestly believe the power armours are $100+ toys. Even when it first came out Milia's was pretty sad and to rerelease them at the same price much later was a shame. Thankfully I got a good deal on Max's and for about $60 it "seemed" a decent buy.

Comparing one product against another product is in what way a good way to determine anything, exactly how?

Again, how much does it cost to make a yf-21/vf-22? How many unit are likely to sell versus the vf-11? What were the licensing fees for each? You have zero facts and yet you and every other arm chair economist on this board keeps making pronouncements of how yamato over charges and offering helpful advice like, "they would sell more if they charged less!" Because that's brilliant advice, I'm sure no one at the company ever took Intro to Economics in High School.

Maybe they're marketing data shows that the vf-11 just won't sell, that even if they sold it at 20 bucks they'd never sell enough for it to ever make back their investment. Because the tiny little whiny macross fan community is too small to support a transformers pricing structure... so yeah, they need to stick it to us because that's the only way they'll stay in business. And maybe they can sell the vf-1 at 100 dollars a pop because more people will buy it period, then the non-hero, canon fodder valkyrie that has less paint schemes and wasn't as popular as the original design.

And gee, if your wordage is saying:

That said I agree some of the items seem over priced like the VF-11, to a lesser degree the destroids and don't even get me started on the power armours. I can't really make a comment on Bandai's Frontier line because I don't own any, I haven't handled any and I never plan to. Even revoltechs in general are kind of over priced IMO but again it's an import and as always you pay a premium and sometimes it's the only way you can get some particular licensed merchandise. The 22 (although lacking accessories) is totally worth the cost IMO. I would say the 19 would be too but it's engineering/design has not aged well plus the repaints aren't really that exciting. What people should be thankful for is the fact Yamato gives us awesome VF-1s for what I would say minus various hiccups is an extreme value. The best way to show Yamato pricing is hurting their market penetration is to just stop buying whatever you feel isn't worth the cost and wash your hands of the situation.

Why wouldn't I read it as for exactly what I criticized it for?

And yes, everywhere in the world there are problems, but on the whole, Japan makes things like cars and gadgets, things people buy and they sell them to countries like us, who make hardly anything. And yes, they farm a lot of the manufacturing out to China, etc, etc, but the actual companies, the ones based in Japan, are in the business of making stuff. Stuff other people buy. Other people being us.

In the end, people are still taking their personal situation and shoving it at yamato. The toy isn't too expensive, why? Because people are buying it. If you're not one of those people but you want to be, that's too bad, but yamato or sony, or whoever, is under no moral, ethical or economic obligation to make a f*cking luxury item cheaper for your or my convenience.

But again, sure, yeah, I wish things I liked were cheaper. I wish LED HDTVs cost 50 bucks, grrr, evil Samsung charging 3k for the set I want, how dare they!

[ff95gj]

I have little knowledge on North America general consumer price level to comment how expensive Yammies are in North America.

I just wish to express my thoughts, related or unrelated to the discussion above. Or even consistent myself.

I am living in a city that I do not have to pay for a hefty shipping fee on top of the Yammies. I have some experiences buying overseas, and the shipping cost is a major pain.

Talking about the price of the toy itself; the local price < yen price x exchange rate (by 30%).

It sounds like a cheap deal now... but the Yammies are still very expensive by local standard. Say, a VF-1 w/o SSP would cost around 22 Big Mac combo. That's 3 weeks of lunch money for many.

It was a tough decision for me when I wanted to get my first valk; it is just too much money for a toy, I thought. So I didn't buy it after a couple of years later.

It's not only Yammies that the price is inflated during the years. Video games, Chogokin, Gunpla model kits, the perception has changed. I don't drink, smoke or party-things, and I don't even go to movies. Toys and video games are the only thing I would spend my entertainment money. So I fell for Macross merchandizes.

Would someone please give me an idea on the price they pay for a 1/60 VF-1 in terms of Big Macs?

[logos]

From where I live in Canada a big mac costs about $5 so not including the the ridiculous shipping I could buy about 22 Big Macs for the price of a VF-1. If you take HLJ's price of $106US and consider the Canadian dollar is almost at parity with the US now.

But back on topic I didn't mind the $80-$90 Canadian I paid for a VF-1 or a Destroid. I thought I was getting good value for my money there. Now while I do have a bit of a problem with the price of a VF-22 being almost double the cost of a VF-1 (I know molds, numbers produced, production costs, etc. play into this), what really makes it hard for me is all the valks that they are releasing in such a short time span.

How can I be expected to come up with $400-500 for the Max and Mira VF-22 when I just paid $300 for a VE-1 and a VF-1D and have been consistently been paying $2-300 per month this whole year on Macross toys. Ive hit the bottom of the barrel and if Yamato and to a lesser extent Bandai and others expect us to pay for these they need to spread them out a bit. Not all of us can afford to buy more than 1 or 2 of these toys every couple of months (if we are lucky). We still need to buy things like FOOD........just me 2 cents anyways.

[Bri]

Ah the Economist's Big Mac index, fun way to get a rough approximation of purching power in different countries.

For me a VF-1 after delivery and taxes would cost roughly 135 euro. (Western Europe)

In Big mac's thats about 44, or alternatively if you mean combo meals then its 26 combo's.

As for the discussion VTF-1 pretty much summed it up.

Yamato is not a charity foundation, they charge the price that will maximize their returns. If the exhange rate turns unfavourable that is not something they or you can do anything about, it's a given. The only two options: accept it or wait till the exhange rate returns to more acceptable levels.

For myself: as far as hobbies go I find Macross not particularly expensive. Sure valks are not cheap but a night out clubbing, a concert or dinner for two will set me back the same amount or more. It''s just about making choices.

[Rabidweezil]

Comparing one product against another product is in what way a good way to determine anything, exactly how?

Again, how much does it cost to make a yf-21/vf-22? How many unit are likely to sell versus the vf-11? What were the licensing fees for each? You have zero facts and yet you and every other arm chair economist on this board keeps making pronouncements of how yamato over charges and offering helpful advice like, "they would sell more if they charged less!" Because that's brilliant advice, I'm sure no one at the company ever took Intro to Economics in High School.

Maybe they're marketing data shows that the vf-11 just won't sell, that even if they sold it at 20 bucks they'd never sell enough for it to ever make back their investment. Because the tiny little whiny macross fan community is too small to support a transformers pricing structure... so yeah, they need to stick it to us because that's the only way they'll stay in business. And maybe they can sell the vf-1 at 100 dollars a pop because more people will buy it period, then the non-hero, canon fodder valkyrie that has less paint schemes and wasn't as popular as the original design.

And gee, if your wordage is saying:

Why wouldn't I read it as for exactly what I criticized it for?

And yes, everywhere in the world there are problems, but on the whole, Japan makes things like cars and gadgets, things people buy and they sell them to countries like us, who make hardly anything. And yes, they farm a lot of the manufacturing out to China, etc, etc, but the actual companies, the ones based in Japan, are in the business of making stuff. Stuff other people buy. Other people being us.

In the end, people are still taking their personal situation and shoving it at yamato. The toy isn't too expensive, why? Because people are buying it. If you're not one of those people but you want to be, that's too bad, but yamato or sony, or whoever, is under no moral, ethical or economic obligation to make a f*cking luxury item cheaper for your or my convenience.

But again, sure, yeah, I wish things I liked were cheaper. I wish LED HDTVs cost 50 bucks, grrr, evil Samsung charging 3k for the set I want, how dare they!

I'd appreciate your posts a lot more if they weren't filled with rage, insults and sarcasm. But sure I'll respond anyway..

Do you have Cable TV? If so, do you look at your bill and say "Why does this cost so much?" I work for a cable company. When I tell people that price complaints are the first thing out of their mouth. Truth is, cable companies do not make the mountain of profits people think they do. Prices are high mostly because of the cost networks charge to be carried as well as the cost of existing and new technology to bring the cable to the customer.

So the price is actually justified. Does that mean people shouldn't question it? Not at all. I welcome the opportunity to educate those that ask. I believe consumers have every right to wonder what they are being charged for. Especially these days when families are trimming expenses.

You say we don't know how much it costs Yamato to make the Valks. Do you? Does Yamato make $5 or $150 off a $200 Macross item? I'd love to know, but I imagine you do not have that information either.

Let's look at gasoline. Sure it's different they a toy plane, but gas doesn't qualify as a necessity. From what I gather about your logic, if a gas company decides to charge $10 a gallon for gas we should accept it as justified just because we do not know what is involved in getting it to the gas pumps. Some people would still pay for gas at $10 a gallon. Does that mean if it's still being purchased it's not too expensive?

Most of us work for our money. Purchasing things, whether it be for fun or necessity, is one way I justify the time and energy I spend at a job. And I'm more likely to spend when I don't feel that I'm giving money to somone that slaps a price tag on something to clean up with a huge profit.

I don't believe anyone is questioning Yamato's (or any company for that matter) need to make money and cover operating costs to be a successful business. It's just that no one wants to be on the end of a company saying "these suckers will pay anything."

I can't say that's true for Yamato. But whether or not it's the case is what I, and I assume others, are wondering.

Edited October 20, 2009 by Rabidweezil

[CF18]

With Macross Frontier TV, movie and concerts putting Macross back into spotlight, and possible threat from Bandai making smaller dups in VF-100/hi-metal line, Yamato is smart to try bringing out as many product as possible.

[VFTF1]

Thanks VFTF1, there is no reason for me to add any points you covered it well.

Thanks for being apparently the only person who read my post Save

Pete

[JuanJovv]

I am living in a city that I do not have to pay for a hefty shipping fee on top of the Yammies. I have some experiences buying overseas, and the shipping cost is a major pain.

I aggre whit that and the custom in my country for the big box

but the Quality is the best deal

regards

please Yamato go down your prices

[Vifam7]

I often opt for the wait and see approach these days. Wait for a price drop sometime in the future and keeping an eye out for sales. If I miss some limited run version or web special, so be it. Sometimes you get better deals/options if you wait.

[nugundamII]

CAUTION: LONG RANT AHEAD. If you are alright with how much you are paying for your valks, you probably do not need to read this thread.

To be sure, I love Yamato valks and I am very thankful to Yamato we are getting them but...I am very concerned about upcoming valk prices:

Maybe some of you have already realised this long time ago, maybe I was in denial, but the full realization only hit me recently, especially with the announced prices for the VF-11C (no change, and the VF-11B was noted for being very pricey) and M&M VF-22Ss.

I was hoping against hope that the prices for these babies will be slightly lower, since we know from basic economics and conventional wisdom that the average and marginal cost for producing each additional unit can only get lower, but maybe the prices have already taken into account this. But then again, the YF-21 (and possibly the Vf-11B) was produced when Yamato probably have not secured the license for the Macross (Dynamite) 7 valks. True, the YF-21 was 3000 yen more expensive than the VF-22Ss, but the difference can be attributed more to the lack of a stand for the VF-22Ss rather anything else.

Add insult to injury: The Yen has been appreciating against most currencies and shows no signs of abating anytime soon... means we are suffering a double whammy....

No... wait, if we take Bandai's DX line into the picture, the folks at Bandai seemed to have taken cues from Yamato: the prices are on par, if not higher than Yamato valks. Add the super export-unfriendly web exclusives, makes for a triple or even quadruple whammy for valk lovers who wants valks from each series.

Fast forward to next year, where we will probably be getting some or all valks from the VF poll that Graham had made, how much will we have to pay for each valk? This is even when some of the valks, like the VF-19s, can be milked for a few variants (VF-19 Kai, F, S, P: Normal, P: Whale blood edition). I know that they can't be milked as much as the vF-1, but I seriously suspect that all these non-VF-1 valks will be priced at 18800yen or higher, and this is something I can't really justify in the long run for each purchase. Each of this is almost like 10% of my net income!

Sure, I DON'T HAVE to buy everything that is released, but I know that some day I will be going after "the ones that got away". They might be cheaper or more expensive to get later, but mostly more expensive and way more troublesome to find, should anyone of them become rare.

While I welcome wholeheartedly the new valks, I sincerely hope that the prices can come down.

While I know this may be a long shot, I sincerely wish that Graham can give some feedback to Yamato regarding the prices.

Like I said, this is just a rant. I will still buy whatever valk that Yamato comes out with, as long as the quality is good and I can afford it.

Man i couldnt agree with you more.

[nugundamII]

From where I live in Canada a big mac costs about $5 so not including the the ridiculous shipping I could buy about 22 Big Macs for the price of a VF-1. If you take HLJ's price of $106US and consider the Canadian dollar is almost at parity with the US now.

But back on topic I didn't mind the $80-$90 Canadian I paid for a VF-1 or a Destroid. I thought I was getting good value for my money there. Now while I do have a bit of a problem with the price of a VF-22 being almost double the cost of a VF-1 (I know molds, numbers produced, production costs, etc. play into this), what really makes it hard for me is all the valks that they are releasing in such a short time span.

How can I be expected to come up with $400-500 for the Max and Mira VF-22 when I just paid $300 for a VE-1 and a VF-1D and have been consistently been paying $2-300 per month this whole year on Macross toys. Ive hit the bottom of the barrel and if Yamato and to a lesser extent Bandai and others expect us to pay for these they need to spread them out a bit. Not all of us can afford to buy more than 1 or 2 of these toys every couple of months (if we are lucky). We still need to buy things like FOOD........just me 2 cents anyways.

wait a minute you paid 90 bucks Can. What, I think with shipping i paid 120 can for mine???

One thing i want to point out is Canada is not land of the free but land of the taxed

We have car tax property tax , road tax to build the road and then sold to spain and then we get taxed to drive on it??????

buying a new house tax

airport tax

gas tax garbage tax property tax again to cover the garbage tax new Harmonized tax tax tax tax

F'n unbelievable and While HLJ is great for prices and shipping i think im going to move back to ebay. I mean 4 of 5 shipments have dinged me with customs fees of 30 to 50 bucks. I have sent an email to them letting the know to stop plastering HLJ all over the boxes. It tips off the customs agents

1 of 9 packages from ebay i get dinged. Dam Taxes. And you get nothing in return. So the already expensive valk then with shipping factored into the price and then customs it might be better to charter a flight to japan once a month and buy all your stash! Oh and if you want to live in toronto your going to get reamed another 14% on your insurance (car)

I am SOOOOOOOO desparate to get out of this country and get hooked up in Hong Kong

Edited October 21, 2009 by nugundamII

[Arthurius]

NuGundam, you have to STOP buying from a seller that declares real value if you want to avoid taxes and duty. I have bought so many products from pll who will declare low, that i always avoided the tax/duty from them. Why risk it? I think Overdrive doesnt declare actual, so you are safe there.

As for the rest of you, why are you fighting over whether or not to try to get Yamato to drop suggested selling/retail prices? Dont you want more discount? If you dont want the discount, thats fine, its not like the one who really really wants something is NOT going to buy something they really want eventually anyways, however, it "may" help for more people to buy that same product, and not keep skipping and skipping. Besides, we could use some discounts, would sure help me justify some...but.....but the problem is....how much discount do we want really??? Can the poster please specify for everyone what he had in mind making this thread, what kind of discount are we talking about exactly here, what is sought to be a fairer price???

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Sure, I DON'T HAVE to buy everything that is released, but I know that some day I will be going after "the ones that got away". They might be cheaper or more expensive to get later, but mostly more expensive and way more troublesome to find, should anyone of them become rare.

While I welcome wholeheartedly the new valks, I sincerely hope that the prices can come down.

While I know this may be a long shot, I sincerely wish that Graham can give some feedback to Yamato regarding the prices.

Like I said, this is just a rant. I will still buy whatever valk that Yamato comes out with, as long as the quality is good and I can afford it.

I hope nothing gets rare. I just spent money on beagle mospeada ride armour stuff, causing me to fall behind a bit on the expensive macross toy stuff. If they get rare and ebayers abuse that by boosting the percieved value of the toys to insane price, that's only going to make things worse.

But if they have to make the toys expensive, then at least make sure that the QC isn't lousy so that buyer confidence is there. I hate that there is going to be bad versions of the same thing floating around out there more than I hate price being high. (since I'm not a multiples guy or a guy that must have everything)

For me it's not so much the cost (no, i don't have the money), it's the rate Yamato is punching all these out lol.

Lucky i denounced my completistism a while back.

If Yamato could punch these out a few or more months apart from each other that would be nice, but then the stuff we want now would pain to wait for lol.

like the Yamato 1/2000 SDF-1.....

Yamato need to offer a "take it home now and pay us later" scheme to use us to help them free up space for when the next swarm of macross products is released to shelves.

If only they sold this stuff at bunnings warehouse and we could get macross goodies at the warehouse prices.."I think I'll buy a new hammer and a shovel, oh and 3 of those transforming planes while I'm here".

Edited October 21, 2009 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[arrow]

I find yammies expensive but one thing I won't fault them for is the variety of valks they are pumping out.

[sigma20xx]

Add the super export-unfriendly web exclusives, makes for a triple or even quadruple whammy for valk lovers who wants valks from each series.

Whoa hold on there. You've gone over your allotted amount of whammy's for a life time. No more than a double whammy per soul.

I do however feel your pain. In order for me to pay those prices, Yamato is going to have to go all out. I'd also like some heavier models.

[buffalostyle]

So ironically - if you want cheaper Valkyrie but you are one of those people who say "no - I'll wait...I won't pre-order and pre-pay now, but I'll wait until later when the price falls" - then ironically you are contributing to the higher price of the new stuff (like the VF-22S Max/Millia and VF-11C that's been complained about here).

Why?

Becaue if you don't pre-order, then the retailer has that much less units on order with the producer - and the producer JUST DOESN'T MAKE MORE.

It's that bad. That's how piss poor the economy is right now. Nobody wants to risk over-stocking or over-producing. And consumers who don't place pre-orders in the hopes of "waiting for lower prices" only guarantee LOWER SUPPLY - ergo HIGHER PRICES.

No truer words were ever written in regards to this particular subject. It's kinda funny, though. The biggest problem that I (and many other Macross collectors) have is the frequency at which these new Valks are coming out because the prices are, actually, secondary to me. I don't mind them because I think the toys are worthwhile.

Who knew that there could be such a thing as "Yamato Macross Valkyrie release" overload...

[bluemax151]

Thanks for being apparently the only person who read my post Save

Pete

I was writing my post before you posted yours I agree you made some valid points.

Comparing one product against another product is in what way a good way to determine anything, exactly how?

Why wouldn't I read it as for exactly what I criticized it for?

I dunno you tell me?

meh, I would never pay full price for another yammie q-rau, especially considering how poorly it measures up to yamato's more recent offerings.

edit: actually, it measured up pretty poorly back when it was first released. I remember my first thought as I got it out of its box, "I paid how much for this?".

Ironically I didn't even actually disagree with you and your points just your methods. I think I should change my sig to "Beware eugimon the unofficial official MW troll mascot, do not feed him."

[BlueMax]

I'd appreciate your posts a lot more if they weren't filled with rage, insults and sarcasm. But sure I'll respond anyway..

Do you have Cable TV? If so, do you look at your bill and say "Why does this cost so much?" I work for a cable company. When I tell people that price complaints are the first thing out of their mouth. Truth is, cable companies do not make the mountain of profits people think they do. Prices are high mostly because of the cost networks charge to be carried as well as the cost of existing and new technology to bring the cable to the customer.

So the price is actually justified. Does that mean people shouldn't question it? Not at all. I welcome the opportunity to educate those that ask. I believe consumers have every right to wonder what they are being charged for. Especially these days when families are trimming expenses.

What a coincidence. Up til 6 months ago, I worked for my local cable company as well, and similarly, loads of disgruntled customers grumbled about how much they are paying, especially for English soccer (Barclay's English Premier League), similarly, we did not have a choice for exactly the same reasons mentioned.

In this case, all the money went to the owners o the clubs and the insane paychecks of the players.... hundreds of thousands of pounds each week! With the fans footing the bill and we at the cable company getting all the blame for the high prices!

but back to the topic

........

Most of us work for our money. Purchasing things, whether it be for fun or necessity, is one way I justify the time and energy I spend at a job. And I'm more likely to spend when I don't feel that I'm giving money to somone that slaps a price tag on something to clean up with a huge profit.

I don't believe anyone is questioning Yamato's (or any company for that matter) need to make money and cover operating costs to be a successful business. It's just that no one wants to be on the end of a company saying "these suckers will pay anything."

I can't say that's true for Yamato. But whether or not it's the case is what I, and I assume others, are wondering.

Pretty much my sentiments.... I consider myself very fortunate: an above average income earner and with no financial obligations... . I was pretty much OK with the VF-1 pricings.. found them reasonable, but with the newer ones, especially with the bulk of canon VF-1s done pretty soon, that means all non-VF-1s will bear the price tag of 18800 yen or thereabouts, seeing their pricing scheme now. Effectively a higher price tier.

As I've said, I remain committed to buy Yamato's macross products and will continue to do so as long as they maintain their quality and I can maintain my economic status, but these are just my own sentiments although... others might give up along the way if not already because of the price....

What i am afraid is that Yamato is pricing themselves out of the market. Alot of macross fans and casual fans buy only selectively or just a few representative pieces because they know these are expensive and they have obligations that take priority over toys.. and rightly so of course. But with the new price tier, even these fans might be put off by the price of each unit and buy even lesser or not at all!

I agree with Pete's (and some others) argument about the Paradox of Waiting for Bargains. Low perceived demand-> low production commitment-> higher cost per unit-> higher price per unit. However, that is only 1 side of the story. The reason why people why people only buy during clearances is because clearance prices tell consumers how much prices can be lower (up to 60% or even 70% off?!) and as a result they are not willing to pay the much higher asking price again. Can't blame them really. I myself feel tempted to do that sometimes.... especially the valks i spend so much money on goes into the bargain bin just a few months later....

On a seperate and maybe positive note, I believe Yamato is the beneficiary of some form of ambush marketing lately! Besides the "gate guardian" VF-1A in Hikaru's colors, the recent Pachinko game and its ads on prime time TV should have generated quite abit of awareness for the SDF: M and especially for the VF-1J in particular. This should only bode well for Yamato... all the publicity for nothing!

[jenius]

I vote with my wallet. I didn't feel I got good bang for my buck out of the VF-11B and to a lesser extent the VF-22S. As such, I won't be buying any more of those toys unless they're on mega sale.