HG and Robotech Debates

[Seto Kaiba]

Thank you for the interpretation I understand better now.

Glad I could help... I have a leg-up on understanding the whole legal mess, since a course in contract law and two in intellectual property law were a required part of the cognate for computer science majors back when I did my undergrad. Meticulous attention to detail doesn't hurt either.

But it still means Tatsunoko lost money on Southern Cross on not being very profitable.

While there's no denying that initially, Super Dimension Cavalry Southern Cross was a financial catastrophe, since the show was canceled prematurely and merchandise sold bugger-all even in Japan, Tatsunoko can probably console themselves with nearly twenty-five years of licensing revenue for Southern Cross and their other failed project, Mospeada, thanks to the worldwide distribution of both shows as part of Robotech. By the look of things, they escaped the failure of Robotech II: the Sentinels unscathed too, since that mess was bankrolled by Matchbox and Harmony Gold.

I have EVERYTHING against taking Macross Zero (or II, or Plus, or 7, or Frontier, or DYRL) and trying to connect it to Robotech.

What else are they supposed to do? Harmony Gold has yet to produce anything like a viable Robotech sequel, and they certainly haven't produced anything that even comes close to the quality of Macross, and the dialogue and music of the "original 85" aged about as gracefully as milk left out in the summer sun for several days. The only way Robotech fans can get quality material these days is to steal it from somewhere else... which is why we end up with crap like that, and fans "adapting" mecha from whatever show is popular into their RPGs and fanfics, and Robotech music videos made entirely from Macross visuals.

Yes, even if they shared similar qualities back in the day, Macross and Robotech are no longer the same thing. They're legally not related to each other either; it's now just one show riding the coattails of the continuing progress the other one makes.

While I can sort of agree with this, it doesn't really convey the gravity of the situation... Robotech isn't riding Macross's coattails... that would imply that there was someone working at Harmony Gold who was smart enough to realize Macross was quality and something to be imitated. No, Robotech is much more one of those cheap, low-quality "Made in China" imitation-brand products with a name and appearance that's suspiciously similar to a popular, high-quality brand. Were we to judge the Robotech franchise on its artistic merits alone, we would have no choice but to lump it in with Korean-made knockoffs like Space Gundam V. It's nothing new or original, just a blatant repackaging of someone else's artistic vision under a new name to make a quick buck.

It is kind of ironic how when they ran out of ideas they started ripping off ideas created by their former designated rip-off artist... building a whole movie out of bits and pieces from Mospeada and the failed Robotech II: the Sentinels series.

Edited September 9, 2009 by Seto Kaiba

[Whamhammer]

Enh. It's still classier than this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kfwj2IVc4OI

I have NO IDEA why someone would make such a video...

Some people like how Bob Dylan sings too ( I dont think either can sing though.) .

Ewwww Bob Dillan singing Robotech songs NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwww its in my head now!!!!!!!!!! Tuuuuuuuuu beeeee in luuuuuuuuUUUUUUv!!!

[Whamhammer]

Oops. You're right. That kind of blows up my argument, or at least proves I'm not a fan of Transformers (going by my own definition of what consistutes a fan), since I haven't ever ventured to discover the full story of Diaclone...

Man - I hate it when I write a book's worth of arguments that all get blown up in one sentence...

Pete

It doesnt blow up youre arguement, just kinda add to the notion of different levels of fandom. Kinda softens it.

[Whamhammer]

Glad I could help... I have a leg-up on understanding the whole legal mess, since a course in contract law and two in intellectual property law were a required part of the cognate for computer science majors back when I did my undergrad. Meticulous attention to detail doesn't hurt either.

While there's no denying that initially, Super Dimension Cavalry Southern Cross was a financial catastrophe, since the show was canceled prematurely and merchandise sold bugger-all even in Japan, Tatsunoko can probably console themselves with nearly twenty-five years of licensing revenue for Southern Cross and their other failed project, Mospeada, thanks to the worldwide distribution of both shows as part of Robotech. By the look of things, they escaped the failure of Robotech II: the Sentinels unscathed too, since that mess was bankrolled by Matchbox and Harmony Gold.

What else are they supposed to do? Harmony Gold has yet to produce anything like a viable Robotech sequel, and they certainly haven't produced anything that even comes close to the quality of Macross, and the dialogue and music of the "original 85" aged about as gracefully as milk left out in the summer sun for several days. The only way Robotech fans can get quality material these days is to steal it from somewhere else... which is why we end up with crap like that, and fans "adapting" mecha from whatever show is popular into their RPGs and fanfics, and Robotech music videos made entirely from Macross visuals.

While I can sort of agree with this, it doesn't really convey the gravity of the situation... Robotech isn't riding Macross's coattails... that would imply that there was someone working at Harmony Gold who was smart enough to realize Macross was quality and something to be imitated. No, Robotech is much more one of those cheap, low-quality "Made in China" imitation-brand products with a name and appearance that's suspiciously similar to a popular, high-quality brand. Were we to judge the Robotech franchise on its artistic merits alone, we would have no choice but to lump it in with Korean-made knockoffs like Space Gundam V. It's nothing new or original, just a blatant repackaging of someone else's artistic vision under a new name to make a quick buck.

It is kind of ironic how when they ran out of ideas they started ripping off ideas created by their former designated rip-off artist... building a whole movie out of bits and pieces from Mospeada and the failed Robotech II: the Sentinels series.

Ummmmm, it does make sence for them to use bits of Mospeada and Sentinels for thier future project. The continuation of Robotech timelines from the end of episode 85 (if you decide to have a project set in time approximate of ep' 85) is the return of the Robotech Expidionary Force following the Invids depature from Earth. That force constisted of the forces of the Pioneer mission which was in the Sentinels and was assisted by elements of the aliens they helpep in pushing the Regents Invid forces back from Tirol and the surrounding systems. Yes Robotech II did fail to come out as a carton , but it did manage to come out in script form in books and comics, its a reasonable point for Shadow Chronicles to have come from. The application has been less than desired, mostly due to less than exempliary planning and marketing.

[Whamhammer]

Im sorry, I have forgotten to put my point of view in several post before.

Unless Robotech is to make a story re-telling the beginning up untill before the Robotech Masters arrival to Earth, there is no need for Harmony Gold to use Macross products in a project. Pretty much anything at the time of the launch of the Pioneer mission has that equippment out of date and pretty much retired if not relegated to Second or Third line forces, therefore a footnote in the series equipmentwise, just as the F-4 Phantom II , the A-7 Crusader , the M-113 troop carrier and the M-60 MBT are today in the U.S. arsenals.

[jenius]

If Robotech wasn't a story being told, and was a factual depiction of a real world series of events, then yes, future Robotech products would sensibly have very little to do with The Macross Saga. As Robotech is instead a fantasy world with The Macross Saga being by far its most popular product it would make no sense, could they do so, for them not to use some aspects of it in future shows. There should be fan winks around every corner, flashbacks, and all the stuff Macross sequels have done to remind the viewers they are watching sequels to Macross.

[Moly_Sigang]

While we're on the issue of Shadow Chronicles, should RTSC be considered a sequel? For me it feels more like an extended edition of 'Symphony of Light'.

[Einherjar]

HG has said Sentinels, the novels, and most comics don't count anymore. They've been replaced by something they never talked about except in Prelude to the Shadow Chronicles, but whatever happened was supposed to be very important to the overall story. Who knows what officially happened in that chapter these days, except Rick Hunter getting punk'd at the end of it.

While I can sort of agree with this, it doesn't really convey the gravity of the situation... Robotech isn't riding Macross's coattails... that would imply that there was someone working at Harmony Gold who was smart enough to realize Macross was quality and something to be imitated. No, Robotech is much more one of those cheap, low-quality "Made in China" imitation-brand products with a name and appearance that's suspiciously similar to a popular, high-quality brand. Were we to judge the Robotech franchise on its artistic merits alone, we would have no choice but to lump it in with Korean-made knockoffs like Space Gundam V. It's nothing new or original, just a blatant repackaging of someone else's artistic vision under a new name to make a quick buck.

It's a fandom problem then. They see something Macross, understand the relationship it had with Robotech, and come to the conclusion that it should fit because of the obvious similarities. Most of the time that means only the mecha and visuals. Fans want Robotech, but with Macross characteristics.

This causes problems with HG because they're expected to deliver the same quality because of those similarities. Unfortunately, they were never responsible for any of it even in the very beginning. They can only take credit for a dub track, names, and maybe an acronym/backronym (Veritech). Now, in a story that is being forced to be original in animation and live action for the first time in years, HG wants Robotech, but with as much legally acceptable Macross characteristics as possible. They can't rely solely on novels, comic books, and video games to keep it going anymore.

EDIT - And Mospeada characteristics as well.

Edited September 9, 2009 by Einherjar

[VF5SS]

I still don't see why fanboys are fighting tooth and nail over Robotech especially in light of the originals being so readily available. A lot of people trying to act like the mindless middle just say they're not that different. So really what are the fans defending? The people in charge barely acknowledge all of that mindless extended universe crap save for some vague poo scrawled on a napkin by Carl Macek. The show itself barely has any of this generational epic crap the fans keep raving about.

I just don't get what these people care about. I have to agree with Daryl Surat's assessment. Robotech fans just aren't human beings anymore.

[Whamhammer]

If Robotech wasn't a story being told, and was a factual depiction of a real world series of events, then yes, future Robotech products would sensibly have very little to do with The Macross Saga. As Robotech is instead a fantasy world with The Macross Saga being by far its most popular product it would make no sense, could they do so, for them not to use some aspects of it in future shows. There should be fan winks around every corner, flashbacks, and all the stuff Macross sequels have done to remind the viewers they are watching sequels to Macross.

I disagree with you highly, a product need not anchor istelf on just one segement of its history unless it wants to. Just because Macross does it doesnt mean everyone else has to as well. I would be very happy if H.G. puts out a product and doesnt have a Valk/VF-1 or Rick Hunter or Minmay in it ever again. Im happy with the succession of these three (now four) wars and dont need to see related Macross stuff in Robotech anymore, the original saga served its purpose and Im ready to move on. Im happy with the Sterling kids being as close of a wink to the Macross portion as we can get. I sure as hell dont want fighter pilots trying to sing thier openents to death in thier cockpits. I dont understand why this concept is so hard for some people to grasp.

[Whamhammer]

I still don't see why fanboys are fighting tooth and nail over Robotech especially in light of the originals being so readily available. A lot of people trying to act like the mindless middle just say they're not that different. So really what are the fans defending? The people in charge barely acknowledge all of that mindless extended universe crap save for some vague poo scrawled on a napkin by Carl Macek. The show itself barely has any of this generational epic crap the fans keep raving about.

I just don't get what these people care about. I have to agree with Daryl Surat's assessment. Robotech fans just aren't human beings anymore.

I would love for you to be able intellegently articulate your thesis on Robotech fans not being human beings.

[Einherjar]

I disagree with you highly, a product need not anchor istelf on just one segement of its history unless it wants to. Just because Macross does it doesnt mean everyone else has to as well. I would be very happy if H.G. puts out a product and doesnt have a Valk/VF-1 or Rick Hunter or Minmay in it ever again. Im happy with the succession of these three (now four) wars and dont need to see related Macross stuff in Robotech anymore, the original saga served its purpose and Im ready to move on. Im happy with the Sterling kids being as close of a wink to the Macross portion as we can get. I sure as hell dont want fighter pilots trying to sing thier openents to death in thier cockpits. I dont understand why this concept is so hard for some people to grasp.

It might be easier if we can define the core of Robotech that makes it so unique beyond the legal situation. So what is the defining thing(s) that makes Robotech different from Macross and any other sci-fi series that makes it worth watching and investing in? How will people know whatever they're watching is genuine Robotech if it doesn't have much connecting it to what has come before? It could be Robotech in name only, if there really was a Robotech before and not just a blend of three shows together serving as the core.

[VF5SS]

I would love for you to be able intellegently articulate your thesis on Robotech fans not being human beings.

You aren't a human being. You people have literally bought the same show for twenty something years with no change at all and when they finally give you sequels they suck yet you still farting buy it. And thanks to you this poo is still profitable enough for it to keep farting up my ability get Macross stuff.

So yeah you're not a human being, you're a robotech drone.

[Whamhammer]

It might be easier if we can define the core of Robotech that makes it so unique beyond the legal situation. So what is the defining thing(s) that makes Robotech different from Macross and any other sci-fi series that makes it worth watching and investing in? How will people know whatever they're watching is genuine Robotech if it doesn't have much connecting it to what has come before? It could be Robotech in name only, if there really was a Robotech before and not just a blend of three shows together serving as the core.

That statement made no sence. By the logic your using, unless it continually re-uses Macross throughout every product, Robotech isnt Robotech . That unless you continue rehashing prior products it wont be identifyable to customers. That you cant continue a universe from three seperate wars unless you keep going back to the first two? That Macross is the only series that had people piloting transforming craft into robot-things fighting space aliens with a different culture, that it wasnt a re-occuring theme in animation?

I dont need to see Capt. Kirk or the original Enterprise all the time to know Im watching Star Trek, I can have different crews on different ships, heck I can even have a Klingon crew on a Klingon ship or a Romulan crew on a Romulan ship, its still in that universe.

I dont have to see Warhammers or even Mad Cats on a tabletop in a Battletech game to know its Battletech. The histories still there , the timelines still there.

You dont need Macross to make it Robotech anymore than Southern Cross to, its an element, not the whole premace , not the whole story.

[Einherjar]

You dont need Macross to make it Robotech anymore than Southern Cross to, its an element, not the whole premace , not the whole story.

So what is the core of Robotech then? Please explain it to me.

Edited September 9, 2009 by Einherjar

[VF5SS]

That statement made no sence. By the logic your using, unless it continually re-uses Macross throughout every product, Robotech isnt Robotech . That unless you continue rehashing prior products it wont be identifyable to customers.

Well thanks to your overlords, that's all anyone wants out of Robotech is Macross since its the most identifiable and well remembered of the three. Gundam even with its myriad of universes is still recognizable as Gundam. Robotech has subsisted so long on being tied to the original show that it really doesn't have a recognizable identity outside of Macross and the two derivative shows.

I dont need to see Capt. Kirk or the original Enterprise all the time to know Im watching Star Trek, I can have different crews on different ships, heck I can even have a Klingon crew on a Klingon ship or a Romulan crew on a Romulan ship, its still in that universe.

Except Star Trek is able to define itself because it has a unique way of doing things. Robotech has a story comprised other people's way of doing things and two of those things were derivative to begin with.

You dont need Macross to make it Robotech anymore than Southern Cross to, its an element, not the whole premace , not the whole story.

So then you're left with a generic sci-fi premise which is exactly how Shadown Chronicles turned out. Good job, you've successfully determined the core of Robotech is generic sci-fi.

[RavenHawk]

Except Star Trek is able to define itself because it has a unique way of doing things. Robotech has a story comprised other people's way of doing things and two of those things were derivative to begin with.

I'm not going to speak to Southern Cross, since I know little about it, but what are you suggesting that MOSPEADA is derivative of? Yes, a Legioss is derivative of a Valkyrie from Macross, but other than that one mech, what is it derivative of?

[VF5SS]

Mospeada is derivative of Macross and also Starship Troopers. Add in some other one-off TV show filler stories and you've got a fair chunk of Mospeada. And if you want to talk about the guerrilla war aspects well Dougram had already been out two years prior to Mospeada.

[Einherjar]

The Beta might be part of the derivative also to make the Legioss more unique.

You dont need Macross to make it Robotech anymore than Southern Cross to, its an element, not the whole premace , not the whole story.

Careful, that gives the impression that anything could be Robotech now.

[Whamhammer]

You aren't a human being. You people have literally bought the same show for twenty something years with no change at all and when they finally give you sequels they suck yet you still farting buy it. And thanks to you this poo is still profitable enough for it to keep farting up my ability get Macross stuff.

So yeah you're not a human being, you're a robotech drone.

"You people" and "farting" have always been the hallmarks of the beginning of an intellegent responce. I'm still waiting for an intellegent argument, I'd really like to hear one.

How about this, I'll give you some data to compile for thought and later use, sound good? Here we go. I've only ever purchased one copy of Robotech seiries, and that was the "Protoculture Edition". So no, I havent been buying the same show.

Now, In between the 85 episodes and buying that edition of Robotech where was my time and money put? Oh , yes, other hobbies. Musclecars, building my own computers, the occasional tabletop game with my friends and helping them run thier own hobby store, that year I helped tear down my Uncles Sunbeam Tiger with him while he was restoring it. There were Star Trek movies, and Star Wars , and Aliens. There was KISS , AC/DC and Metallica. Some military service, seventeen years of automotive field experience, some college, living in my apartement, you get the idea. I think I've had plenty to do in between releases.

They eventually relaeased a new product. It wasnt Macross (which is not a failing point) .I did buy it, it was definately midlands and showed a definate need of better planning. They havent shown much in way of a plan on its follow up either. I am gratious that they did refrain from musical aerial combat duelling however. Ive present my misgiving with the product, only a blind man could miss that.

So enough people keep buying H.G. stuff to keep it profitable. Thats thier right. I wish H.G> would do better with that money, for sure. People keep on buying Bob Dylan and Madonna records too.

I'm messing it up for you to get Macross? How inconvenient! Im sorry I hold that much power over you. If I was only going to use my powers for good? Bring me a Cherry soda!!!

Maybe H.G. hasnt been the only company whos had problems in their planning , maybe some forethought on international release rights in the beginning would have fixed this. It wouldve been killing two birds with one stone, international release control AND no Robotech! Another one for you? The makers of Macross could work with the people they have odds with on an equally profitable venture to release Macross in those markets? Some say money is a fabulous motivator. Is H.G. the only true party in the industry that has stopped Macross from comming in? I doubt it. Am I the biggest fan of H.G., no.

And being that I am all powerfull, I am certainly much more than a drone.

[VF5SS]

Mospeada is derivative of Macross and also Starship Troopers. Add in some other one-off TV show filler stories and you've got a fair chunk of Mospeada. And if you want to talk about the guerrilla war aspects well Dougram had already been out two years prior to Mospeada.

Look at me quote myself like a goddamn pro.

So in addition to this, don't forget that in Japan also had Orguss and Dorvack running around during this time. So Mospeada and Southern Cross look even less unique.

Look Whamhammer, I don't give a flyingfart about your hobbies. You're supporting this Robotech shite and I'm not. So you're not a goddamn human being.

[Whamhammer]

"Well thanks to your overlords, that's all anyone wants out of Robotech is Macross since its the most identifiable and well remembered of the three. Gundam even with its myriad of universes is still recognizable as Gundam. Robotech has subsisted so long on being tied to the original show that it really doesn't have a recognizable identity outside of Macross and the two derivative shows"

I have overlords? Yeah, ask McKeever and Steve of my obidience to a said Overlords, riiiiiiiiiiiight. Whos this anyone I hear? Are those guys the ones who drove the Aluminum Falcon? I for one have no interest in the Macross portion in continuance of the series, and among circles the Macross side being the future isnt brought up as well. Minmei can go take a Valk' down the middle of Tehran and have an Ice Cream Social for all I care!

"So then you're left with a generic sci-fi premise which is exactly how Shadown Chronicles turned out. Good job, you've successfully determined the core of Robotech is generic sci-fi."

"So what is the core of Robotech then? Please explain it to me."

Well, theres that whole galaxy of aliens chasing after a rare power source in the same way two Cigarette boats owners chasing after the last barrell of gas would. With transforming mecha and humans being stuck in the middle of it and not taking kindly to being pushed around by said aliens. And the religous fanatics that hate energy, too.

"Mospeada is derivative of Macross and also Starship Troopers. Add in some other one-off TV show filler stories and you've got a fair chunk of Mospeada. And if you want to talk about the guerrilla war aspects well Dougram had already been out two years prior to Mospeada"

And a space battleship made from the remnants of ship wreckage with a weapon that can destroy the targets in its path in a single hit, with space fighter planes to boot with an old man captain and a goob who becomes the leader. Doesnt sound a thing like Space Battleship Yamato, nope, not a thing.

[Whamhammer]

Look at me quote myself like a goddamn pro.

So in addition to this, don't forget that in Japan also had Orguss and Dorvack running around during this time. So Mospeada and Southern Cross look even less unique.

Look Whamhammer, I don't give a flyingfart about your hobbies. You're supporting this Robotech shite and I'm not. So you're not a goddamn human being.

Is this where the "Yo momma" lines come in?

[Whamhammer]

Look at me quote myself like a goddamn pro.

So in addition to this, don't forget that in Japan also had Orguss and Dorvack running around during this time. So Mospeada and Southern Cross look even less unique.

Look Whamhammer, I don't give a flyingfart about your hobbies. You're supporting this Robotech shite and I'm not. So you're not a goddamn human being.

Ah, the brilliance of intellectual debate, I miss it so. Wheres that Cherry soda?

Look guys I can quote myself too!!!

"And a space battleship made from the remnants of ship wreckage with a weapon that can destroy the targets in its path in a single hit, with space fighter planes to boot with an old man captain and a goob who becomes the leader. Doesnt sound a thing like Space Battleship Yamato, nope, not a thing. "

[Einherjar]

"So what is the core of Robotech then? Please explain it to me."

Well, theres that whole galaxy of aliens chasing after a rare power source in the same way two Cigarette boats owners chasing after the last barrell of gas would. With transforming mecha and humans being stuck in the middle of it and not taking kindly to being pushed around by said aliens. And the religous fanatics that hate energy, too.

So how is somebody supposed to keep that interesting in a story that doesn't end? For instance, remaking episodes 1-36 for Hollywood, going back and continuing with episode 87, and then with 37EX, the Sentinels retcon?

I'm being serious.

[Gubaba]

Some people like how Bob Dylan sings too ( I dont think either can sing though.) .

Ewwww Bob Dillan singing Robotech songs NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!

Eeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeewwww its in my head now!!!!!!!!!! Tuuuuuuuuu beeeee in luuuuuuuuUUUUUUv!!!

You're associating Reba West with the greatest American songwriter of the twentieth century???

Now, I think Reba West is nice person, but I wouldn't put here in the rarefied "living legend" category that Dylan is in.

[Whamhammer]

You're associating Reba West with the greatest American songwriter of the twentieth century???

Now, I think Reba West is nice person, but I wouldn't put here in the rarefied "living legend" category that Dylan is in.

No I am associating Reba West with one of the worst American singers in the history of our nation. Dylan might be able to right, but the man couldnt hold a tune to save his life!!!

[Gubaba]

No I am associating Reba West with one of the worst American singers in the history of our nation. Dylan might be able to right, but the man couldnt hold a tune to save his life!!!

You've clearly never really sat down and listened to "Bringing It All Back Home," "Highway 61 Revisited," "Blonde on Blonde," or "Blood on the Tracks" but I won't hold it against you.

And it's neither here nor there, really. Doubtless I'd think the music you love is crap, too.

[Whamhammer]

So how is somebody supposed to keep that interesting in a story that doesn't end? For instance, remaking episodes 1-36 for Hollywood, going back and continuing with episode 87, and then with 37EX, the Sentinels retcon?

I'm being serious.

Simple I never said remake episodes 1-36. You do a film , abbreviate the saga. Use transforming mecha that arent Valks, but post Raptor , pre Alpha (not swing winged). And get the story told! Honestly , I think the Robotech Masters war would benefit the most from a movie, show the ground pounder aspect of a war and make something better than those heapy Logans! It can be done, they just need to do it! And dont even put some high dollar cast (they kill flicks), just some good young actors! Give Lattitude for Sentinels, and by the time thats all done theyre either tired of doing anime and branch into movies, or stop doing the movies and stick with animation (by then I think the technology will be up to speed to do it well either way).

[Whamhammer]

You've clearly never really sat down and listened to "Bringing It All Back Home," "Highway 61 Revisited," "Blonde on Blonde," or "Blood on the Tracks" but I won't hold it against you.

And it's neither here nor there, really. Doubtless I'd think the music you love is crap, too.

Hes got that nasally off pitch thing going, if it helps that Imnot singling himout , I dont like Getty Lees voice either.

Im in to rock from late sixtes to mid nineties , and "mainstream" metal. You never know. Did I mention Cash?

[Gubaba]

Simple I never said remake episodes 1-36. You do a film , abbreviate the saga. Use transforming mecha that arent Valks, but post Raptor , pre Alpha (not swing winged). And get the story told! Honestly , I think the Robotech Masters war would benefit the most from a movie, show the ground pounder aspect of a war and make something better than those heapy Logans! It can be done, they just need to do it! And dont even put some high dollar cast (they kill flicks), just some good young actors! Give Lattitude for Sentinels, and by the time thats all done theyre either tired of doing anime and branch into movies, or stop doing the movies and stick with animation (by then I think the technology will be up to speed to do it well either way).

Or better yet, forget about movies, forget about animation, and just let Robotech fade into oblivion.

[VF5SS]

"And a space battleship made from the remnants of ship wreckage with a weapon that can destroy the targets in its path in a single hit, with space fighter planes to boot with an old man captain and a goob who becomes the leader. Doesnt sound a thing like Space Battleship Yamato, nope, not a thing. "

Only an idiot would think Macross doesn't have any Yamato in it.

[Funkenstein]

Considering that Macross was supposedly a parody of Space Cruiser Yamato....

[Gubaba]

Considering that Macross was supposedly a parody of Space Cruiser Yamato....

Is it time for this pic again...?

[BeyondTheGrave]

Is it time for this pic again...?

Looks like someone had had fun during production.

@ warhammer

I think what everyone is trying to say is that Robotech lacks the key elements that remain the same and make it stand out as Robotech.

You brought out Star Trek. Star Trek has the same key elements through out its long film history. Even if its not the enterprise you still by the elements scattered through such as Starfleet, vulcans, photon torpedo, red shirt, guy who always flips over the railing.

Proculture doesn't count b/c it changes meaning through out the series. At first it comes off as sex, then energy of life, then finally star ship fuel.At one point Gobal ask Exedor if the zentradi are decendants of protoculture. So which is it?

What vf5ss is saying is that other fans have been buying the same three items(Valkyries,Rpg books,RT.com) re-packaged over and over again.

I don't have an issue with Bob Dylan haven't heard much of his music. Just Imagine Brittany Spears singing Don't Be Late.*shutters*