A Question about dubbing animes that have lots of English in them alre

[talonlm]

And probably a noob one, at that. Why is there so much English in anime that will never be dubbed into English and released in the US? DYRL, Gundam, MacF--all of them are loaded with either spoken English or English text. Why put it in there?

Edited June 27, 2009 by talonlm

[VFTF1]

Why not?

English words often enter the lexicon of foriegn languages nowadays due to so many foriegners learning english and so much television/movies made in english. English words and idioms become part of other languages.

That's at least been my experience overseas.

Pete

[wolfx]

Why is there french in an english film. Why is there japanese in a german film. Why is there chinese in an italian film.....

or English in Japanese anime (which might not find its way to US)

I don't see what's wrong with it.

And if you are in Japan, alot of their products have English written on them....and there's alot of english words borrowed and incorporated into the Japanese language.

[Keith]

Becuse English is still "cool" and has never gone out of style. Also dubs suck, watch shows in their original language!!

[JB0]

And in Macross' case, it gets some authenticity. English is, as I understand it, the official language of flight.

[VFTF1]

And in Macross' case, it gets some authenticity. English is, as I understand it, the official language of flight.

Disiz Fright Numel 33990 callying garactic fally Shelyr Nome. Lepry to me prease

Love that opening line - though I kinda paraphrased...from MF

Pete

[talonlm]

Fair enough.

I travel a good bit overseas (I'm military), and I have seen in pretty much everywhere. I just don't watch much local television overseas--too much other stuff to do!

And English is the official language of flight; sort of wondered if that didn't have a lot to do with it.

I've noticed it in other anime, as I mentioned, just not to the extent it was in MacF. I was also curious if there wasn't some cultural aspect to it I wasn't aware of, like the emphasis on the young saving everyone from some existential threat.

[Ghost Train]

I would say that Japan has a rather unhealthy obsession with the English language: http://engrish.com/

It goes way beyond the fact that English is a pseudo-global language of business. As for how frequently it shows up in anime, it's great when it's proper English, makes the work look more polished and refined. Works like Gundam 00 and DYRL did a mighty fine job with that. It's an eye (or ear) sore when it's butchered - the first 30 seconds of Macross Frontier is a good example .

I'm just from the thought process that if you're going to incorporate a language other than that of your native audience it would be good to invest the time to get it right! It adds much more polish and refinement to the finished product.

[Bri]

English (and before that Latin) can be used to hide lack of expertise on a subject and make it sound official. Also cheesy or embarrasing lines become exotic. The quality of the English is irrelevant as long as it's better then what the of majority of the viewers or readers can produce.

[VFTF1]

English (and before that Latin) can be used to hide lack of expertise on a subject and make it sound official

There's a great play by Machiavelli, a comedy, called Mandragula (or Mandragora?) about a guy who fakes being a medical doctor by spouting off Latin. He peddles knock off fertility drugs which actually make guys go limp - and then he convinces their wives to have sex with him and pretend the resulting baby is their (now limp) husbands It's a riot and it pretty much probably still holds true today insofar as using foriegn languages to make yourself sound refined.

Polish people do it all the time too - adding "englishisms" to their language and tossing them about in every day speach to make you look smart. Kind of like Americans who toss around bon motes...

Pete

[taksraven]

There's a great play by Machiavelli, a comedy, called Mandragula (or Mandragora?) about a guy who fakes being a medical doctor by spouting off Latin. He peddles knock off fertility drugs which actually make guys go limp - and then he convinces their wives to have sex with him and pretend the resulting baby is their (now limp) husbands It's a riot and it pretty much probably still holds true today insofar as using foriegn languages to make yourself sound refined.

Polish people do it all the time too - adding "englishisms" to their language and tossing them about in every day speach to make you look smart. Kind of like Americans who toss around bon motes...

Pete

Prefer this Mandragora

[VFTF1]

With Tom Baker as Doctor Who - who wouldn't!? Cool.

Pete

[Excillon]

Becuse English is still "cool" and has never gone out of style. Also dubs suck, watch shows in their original language!!

I hate subs, I only watch them when I have no other choice. Broken "engrish" translations, and the worst part is that you're supposed to READ a book and WATCH a movie, not READ a TV.

[Gubaba]

I hate subs, I only watch them when I have no other choice. Broken "engrish" translations, and the worst part is that you're supposed to READ a book and WATCH a movie, not READ a TV.

I've never understood that line of thinking. So if a book has pictures, you don't look at them, and if a movie has text, you don't read it?

Is it too hard to do both at the same time?

And "broken 'Engrish' translations"? What are you watching? HK bootlegs?

[EXO]

I've never understood that line of thinking. So if a book has pictures, you don't look at them, and if a movie has text, you don't read it?

Is it too hard to do both at the same time?

And "broken 'Engrish' translations"? What are you watching? HK bootlegs?

Also, it's not like you're watching it in a movie theatre. If it's worth going thru the first time, watch it again or rewind a little to see if you missed anything.

[eugimon]

I dunno... why do non-Asian Americans talk about Feng Shui? Or get their names or other words tattooed on their body in Chinese or Japanese? Why do they buy t-shirts with random chinese words on them?

[Beltane70]

I hate subs, I only watch them when I have no other choice. Broken "engrish" translations, and the worst part is that you're supposed to READ a book and WATCH a movie, not READ a TV.

What about graphic novels, huh?

[Ghost Train]

lol the white man has an obsession with anything that's Asian (not all, but a good 50% do). Part of this is because of Hollywood and the media's portrayal of Asians as either:

1) Mystical kung-fu <insert other martial art> masters

2) Asian women as merely sexual objects

3) Asian men as oppressors, tyrants, who mistreat #2

They take anything they see on film on face value, which leads them to think they have some in depth knowledge of any Asian culture by watching The Last Samurai. By getting tattoos, they think they are integrating themselves into Asian culture in order to save it with their "righteousness."

Now, that is not to say I hate on anyone for being that way, it's all preconditioning, and thus I can't blame someone for acting the way they do. There are non-Asians with a legitimate scholarly interested in Eastern civilizations that have taken the time to take courses, learn the language(s), and visit the locale. Way back in the day, I had a Caucasian Chinese literature professor.... despite having a lisp, this guy's Chinese is better than most native speakers.

[Warmaker]

Becuse English is still "cool" and has never gone out of style. Also dubs suck, watch shows in their original language!!

WORD, MY BROTHER!

The quality of this thread has increased tenfold due to that cover. LOVE the facial expression!

Edited June 28, 2009 by Warmaker

[eugimon]

lol the white man has an obsession with anything that's Asian (not all, but a good 50% do). Part of this is because of Hollywood and the media's portrayal of Asians as either:

1) Mystical kung-fu <insert other martial art> masters

2) Asian women as merely sexual objects

3) Asian men as oppressors, tyrants, who mistreat #2

They take anything they see on film on face value, which leads them to think they have some in depth knowledge of any Asian culture by watching The Last Samurai. By getting tattoos, they think they are integrating themselves into Asian culture in order to save it with their "righteousness."

Now, that is not to say I hate on anyone for being that way, it's all preconditioning, and thus I can't blame someone for acting the way they do. There are non-Asians with a legitimate scholarly interested in Eastern civilizations that have taken the time to take courses, learn the language(s), and visit the locale. Way back in the day, I had a Caucasian Chinese literature professor.... despite having a lisp, this guy's Chinese is better than most native speakers.

you forgot

2a) sexual objects who need a strong white man to save them from: 3, 4, 5.

4) asian men as physically weak geeks

5) asian men as the sexually deviant pervert

[VFTF1]

I just like Chinese food, sushi and anime is all...

Pete

[kung flu]

English is what you call an "International Language". Also Britain controlled a large portion of the globe during the empire days, so english is taught in the territories which they controlled and influenced. But these days its mostly america influencing other countries with their hollywood movies and culture.

[MilSpex]

you forgot

2a) sexual objects who need a strong white man to save them from: 3, 4, 5.

4) asian men as physically weak geeks

5) asian men as the sexually deviant pervert

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

Edited June 29, 2009 by MilSpex

[Renato]

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

Wait, you actually got some human interaction... and it annoyed you? I greet people all the time over here and more often than not, they just ignore me. Pisses me off.

[Ghost Train]

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

So you base your whole assessment on #4 & #5 being true on a few chance encounters lol? I mean granted there are probably perverts in Japan ... ok, that is more like a 100% certainty, but there are pervs in every country and culture, what you discussed is not really specific to Japan.

I hear plenty of stories of inbreeding, and "keeping it in the family" habits of people who live in the South here in the US, but I don't go around believing that this is the norm for all people in this country and even in that region for that matter.

Also, just because you stood up to a few punks does not discredit their whole male population as being weak. I worked in Detroit (the most dangerous city in America) for a year, and had quite a few encounters where I had to raise my voice on some little punk gangsta wannabe - yet this does not decrease, increase, or affect my perception of a black / latino male.

Edited June 29, 2009 by Ghost Train

[wolfx]

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

13 yo is stretching it...but i dun see what's wrong with dating a 22 yo when you're 31. Heck some of my friends' wives have that age gap.

[eugimon]

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

thanks for illustrating my point.

[Beltane70]

Funny, I find most teenage "punks" in the US react the same way when confronted by someone older than they are.

[DJ Loe Kee]

I live in Japan and 4) and 5) aren`t myths. I constantly have Japanese guys ask me why I don`t date the Junior High School girls I teach. And when I tell em how I`m a little uncomforable that I have a 22 yo gf at 31 yo they say don`t worry about it coz they had like 13 year old girlfriends when they were like 28. Also Japanese dudes shake like leaves whenever you stand up to them. I was walking in the street the other day and a group of teenage punks shouted "HAROOOOOO!" at me and were laughing their asses off. I turned around walked straight up to them and said "do I know you?" in Japanese. They weren`t so tough then, looking at the ground, scared as poo, shaking like pussies. 5 of them, 1 of me. I just stood there for a minute and kept on asking them why the hell they said hello to me, waiting for a reply, they just kept apologising, I laughed and walked off, I`m a skinny guy with thick glasses too.

don't group all of the countries together. japan is not like korea and korea is not like china and china is not like vietnam and vietnam is not like the philippines, ect. he said asian myths, not japanese myths. also, the age of consent in japan is like 14 approx. really, the kids in neon genesis evangelion are all 14 in the japanese release but they changed their ages to 18 in the U.S. release 'cause of the age of consent here in the states is 18, not 14, and the sexual content shown in the series.

it sounds like he tried to say HELLO to you, the japanese L is a sound inbetween L and R (i took spanish, french and japanese in college and korean after college with a private tutor). you are talking about cultural things from japan that the western world doesn't understand, not myths. i would ask my friend from japan if she ever had a 28 year old boyfriend when she was 13 but i'm not even goin' to cross that line. that is kinda disrespect to her husband...

and i won't even repeat what my korean friend said about the japanese. a mod would find his comment disrespectful/hateful and delete my post.

Edited June 30, 2009 by DJ Loe Kee

[MilSpex]

The Japan dinosaur apologist faction is strong on this website. I have lived all across Japan for 4 years, in tiny towns, in Tokyo, speak Japanese and think I understand the Japanese a lot better than most of you.

Do you know what "baka ni suru" is? Its when Japanese make fun of something. Why did the punks laugh their asses off when they said hello? Its coz they thought I was a big joke, they didn`t want to say "hello" just to be nice. When you get to know the language and what Japanese actually say you learn that foreigners are a constant source of laffs for them. I also once walked past a street comedian surrounded by a small crowd. He suddenly stopped his act and waved to me and said "Haro, Gaijin San!" (Gaijin san is outdated and the equivalent of calling someone "of color" in America, its condescending.) , the crowd all turned and stared at me and laughed their asses off. Foreigners are funny to them. I snapped back in a big voice "Haro, Baka-san". The crowd then turned on him and laughed at him. I don`t let Japanese make fun of me for being white, you might and right it off to "different culture," but you are kidding yourself and you are often a laughing stock here.

[Renato]

The Japan dinosaur apologist faction is strong on this website. I have lived all across Japan for 4 years, in tiny towns, in Tokyo, speak Japanese and think I understand the Japanese a lot better than most of you.

Do you know what "baka ni suru" is? Its when Japanese make fun of something. Why did the punks laugh their asses off when they said hello? Its coz they thought I was a big joke, they didn`t want to say "hello" just to be nice. When you get to know the language and what Japanese actually say you learn that foreigners are a constant source of laffs for them. I also once walked past a street comedian surrounded by a small crowd. He suddenly stopped his act and waved to me and said "Haro, Gaijin San!" (Gaijin san is outdated and the equivalent of calling someone "of color" in America, its condescending.) , the crowd all turned and stared at me and laughed their asses off. Foreigners are funny to them. I snapped back in a big voice "Haro, Baka-san". The crowd then turned on him and laughed at him. I don`t let Japanese make fun of me for being white, you might and right it off to "different culture," but you are kidding yourself and you are often a laughing stock here.

I know what you mean. Yeah, it all depends on how people define "culture". I do not rank the Japanese behaviour towards foreigners nor their general lack of international consciousness among aspects of "culture", but hey, there's not much they can do. I don't count myself among the apologists because God knows I complain about Japan every other hour, but the situation is not going to change any time soon.

Why is there so much "English"? Because it's "cool", yeah. But heaven forbid they make any type of effort to make sense of what they write, because after all it is just for show, there is not supposed to be any meaning in what they have written on their T-shirts, for example.

I have a Led Zeppelin T-shirt with a reproduction of the poster used for their Japan tour in the 70's, and some Japanese friends told me they think it looks "uncool" because it has katakana on it. But they do not know who "Led Zeppelin" is! They see レッド and they think "oh, Red Hot Chilli Peppers!"

Technically, they have had little interaction with the outside world for until 150 years ago. They're still like a very small community despite everything and yeah, they will judge outsiders and have little interest in knowing much about the outside since they're far too preoccupied trying to stay alive in their own, overly bureaucratic society. In this global age, the Japanese are becoming even more domestic. For me, yes that is a cause of great frustration, but I do realise that it will not change any time soon. As far as the Japanese people who have no concept of the outside world are concerned, better just to leave them be in their tiny little world.

[DJ Loe Kee]

The Japan dinosaur apologist faction is strong on this website. I have lived all across Japan for 4 years, in tiny towns, in Tokyo, speak Japanese and think I understand the Japanese a lot better than most of you.

Do you know what "baka ni suru" is? Its when Japanese make fun of something. Why did the punks laugh their asses off when they said hello? Its coz they thought I was a big joke, they didn`t want to say "hello" just to be nice. When you get to know the language and what Japanese actually say you learn that foreigners are a constant source of laffs for them. I also once walked past a street comedian surrounded by a small crowd. He suddenly stopped his act and waved to me and said "Haro, Gaijin San!" (Gaijin san is outdated and the equivalent of calling someone "of color" in America, its condescending.) , the crowd all turned and stared at me and laughed their asses off. Foreigners are funny to them. I snapped back in a big voice "Haro, Baka-san". The crowd then turned on him and laughed at him. I don`t let Japanese make fun of me for being white, you might and right it off to "different culture," but you are kidding yourself and you are often a laughing stock here.

ignore them. i've had ppl in the u.s. say far worse things to me regarding my "color" since i was born. it's better to ignore them to start a fight and "catch a case" or lawsuit because of it. welcome to the real world, the u.s. isn't the "most loved country" on earth like alot of americans who have never left their country think that it is. japan is a little different 'cause they think that way towards all foreigners, not just americans. what i can say that my friend did say that isn't hateful/disrespectful is "did you know that koreans are still discriminated against in job openings in japan" (his words, not mine, i have no source to back up this claim). so it's just not directed towards europeans and americans. look at it this way, you can join the rest of the "East" who still have very bad feelings towards the japanese because of WWII. but hating the japanese is really nonsensical on this forum. macross is from japan. sorry, i've forgotten 99% of my japanese, korea has a much better writing system and i really don't have to learn chinese characters in order to read the daily newspaper (and it's very rare that chinese/hanja is used in my korean hip hop, r&b and dvd titles). and i won't even start on anti-americanism in other countries. i don't choose what language to study based on how "well liked" america is in the native country. it's more based on how many ppl i know that speak the language (and the reason why i don't study french at the moment).

[Ghost Train]

The Japan dinosaur apologist faction is strong on this website. I have lived all across Japan for 4 years, in tiny towns, in Tokyo, speak Japanese and think I understand the Japanese a lot better than most of you.

Do you know what "baka ni suru" is? Its when Japanese make fun of something. Why did the punks laugh their asses off when they said hello? Its coz they thought I was a big joke, they didn`t want to say "hello" just to be nice. When you get to know the language and what Japanese actually say you learn that foreigners are a constant source of laffs for them. I also once walked past a street comedian surrounded by a small crowd. He suddenly stopped his act and waved to me and said "Haro, Gaijin San!" (Gaijin san is outdated and the equivalent of calling someone "of color" in America, its condescending.) , the crowd all turned and stared at me and laughed their asses off. Foreigners are funny to them. I snapped back in a big voice "Haro, Baka-san". The crowd then turned on him and laughed at him. I don`t let Japanese make fun of me for being white, you might and right it off to "different culture," but you are kidding yourself and you are often a laughing stock here.

Nobody has made the assertion that Japan is some sort of multicultural paradise where everyone is respected and treated equally. The cases of discrimination, "Japan-only" and where landlords will never rent to foreigners, etc are well known to anyone who has ever bothered to read about it.

The reason people got defensive about your post is that you asserted that somehow your experience as being a "victim of discrimination" in Japan has led you to conclude that all Asian men are perverts and spineless punks as you stated in your last post.

You undoubtedly bring experience to the table since as you say you have lived there for 4 years - but to sort of classify a whole continent comprised of thousands of culture in such a manner is stretching it. The argument here is that your negative experience is not particularly unique to Asia or Japan. And in all honesty... although the insults taunted against you are nothing short of low brow and retarded, it is relatively mild compared to what some people endure elsewhere. Go cry to a victim of Apartheid / Jim Crow, an Auschwitz / Nanking survivor, and count your own blessings.

... and congrats on being a pro in Japanese.

Edited July 1, 2009 by Ghost Train

[Roy Focker]

All very interesting and stuff.. Yeah