Does it bug anyone else?

[Gokurakumaru]

That said, if I was going to bet, I'd bet that Kawamori's intent is for the VF-0 to be a prototype in the VF-1 development program, and that existing continuity regarding the VF-X and VF-X-1 is being cast aside.

This is my take on it too. Forget your VF-Xs, the VF-0 is their replacement as one of the final iterations of VF-1 prototypes.

I highly doubt so , if they haven´t said that by now then it´s very difficult they´ll say it in the next episodes.

The VF-Xs were never mentioned in Macross either, but that doesn't stop people taking their existence as gospel.

I've typed some VF-0 information into a text file and attached it to this post. The first part "VF-0" is background on the VF-0 from the booklet that came with the official R2J DVD of Episode 1. It mentions that the engine delays were VF-1 related. Some people speculate that the VF-0 is a parallel project rather than a prototype and that it was originally planned for thermonuclear engines. Both the larger body design and the fact that the delays are VF-1 based suggest otherwise.

The second part "Comment of Kawamori" is a dialog from the man himself about his VF-0 design -- again from the DVD booklet -- in which he draws an analogy between "show model" concept cars and production models addressing why the VF-0 may appear to be more advanced than the VF-0 in spite of being a test model for it. He says he started with the VF-1 design and tried to make it older and more familiar looking but he ended up with a plain old F-14 which just wouldn't do as the main mech in the new show. Any tech which seems more advanced he justifies as stuff that gets dropped in the transition from concept fighter to production model. He's talking VF-0 and VF-1 here, not VF-0 to VF-4 or the later Valkyries. The VF-0 is referred to as being a precursor to the VF-1, not a parallel project or testbed for post VF-1 fighter technology.

The final section "Macross Zero Official Web Site" comes from the VF-0 information section of the official Macross Zero website www.macross.co.jp/zero. It explicitly states that the VF-0 is just a VF-1 prototype which was outfitted and deployed when the VF-1's engine development fell behind schedule. You can translate them all yourself at babelfish.altavista.com by cutting and pasting the text and selecting Japanese to English, or by using your favorite translation site. The results aren't good but if I translate them myself (which I've done on a couple of past occasions) they seem to get glossed over. There must be more than one Japanese speaker on Macross World and they can read the text and translate it themselves. This is official information straight from the horses mouth.

Here's the results for those to lazy to bother. The first two sections come out as mostly gibberish. But read the very first sentence of the Macross Zero Official Web Site translation. There's no misinterpreting that.

VF-0

Including the over technology which is obtained from the combatant ship of the opposite sex person who falls in 1999 in everywhere, the new model strange fighter plane which was developed. Originally, the development of VF-1 which uses the thermonuclear reaction jet engine was preceding, but because utilization of the thermonuclear engine is late, rapidity, ???????? doing the jet engine of conventional type, it loads, it was decided that the type of this VF-0 is tested is disposed. The fighter, moth walk, variable it does in 3 forms of ?????, supposes the battle in all aspects and is made. Because usually the jet engine is used unlike VF-1 Valkyrie which is utilized afterwards, succeeding distance is short extremely, also the engine being delicate, quite high-level ability is required to operation.

Comment of Kawamori

Because basically it is the fuselage which becomes the advance of VF-1, design is not changed substantially, don't you think?. Simply, because the usual jet engine is mounted, the fuel tank becomes large, the fuselage cannot collect to the compact by any means, it is. Truth stacking in the space warship, to keep carrying long distance, because the fact that it goes in the enemy ship was prerequisite, when we would like to make if possible small, however it is, development of the engine was not in time. Because size about approximately 4 meters is different at total length, it is the fuselage which extent around the cover is larger than VF-1. At first glance, VF-0 from VF-1 like the fuselage which evolved it is visible, it is, but, when to the technology where the experimental model is future being used, being mass production, a little the actual ? ? ill-smelling there is a ? ? thing even with when it is actual, don't you think?. If it compares by the car, when the difference of the show model and the marketing car, first, you designed outmoded than VF-1, it became simply F-14, is real, however it is, does not become the mechanic of the protagonist, with that, being able to meet, the experimental model with those the part where modern technology is used may be, with it is the interpretation red sandal wood.

Macross Zero Official Web Site

VF-0 was no more than one of the experimental model series of VF-1, but it hit to the situation, variable fighter plane encounter throwing of counter integration combination, rapidity armament was administered and was decided that the experimental operational unit is formed.

VF_0.txt

[KingNor]

Kinda OT but I think people's views on VF-0 compared with the VF-1 (which being advanced and "advanced looking") may actually change if we see a VF-1 in future Macross Zero episodes.

i'm willing to accept that

[imode]

That said, if I was going to bet, I'd bet that Kawamori's intent is for the VF-0 to be a prototype in the VF-1 development program, and that existing continuity regarding the VF-X and VF-X-1 is being cast aside.

This is my take on it too. Forget your VF-Xs, the VF-0 is their replacement as one of the final iterations of VF-1 prototypes.

I highly doubt so , if they haven´t said that by now then it´s very difficult they´ll say it in the next episodes.

The VF-Xs were never mentioned in Macross either, but that doesn't stop people taking their existence as gospel.

Looks like you're right. From what I read from the Japanese text, the VF-0 is a experimental testbed of overtechnology implementation for what seems like all current and future VF's. The only reason it looks like the VF-1 was because it was designed within the same time period, but the design is definitely an advancement, and not a precursor.

Also, whether or not we'll see the VF-1 is really based on how long the story is going to drag out. If you look, at the chronology on the compendium, the official rollout of the trial VF-1A takes place only two months after the events of Macross Zero!

[Max Jenius]

Looks like you're right. From what I read from the Japanese text, the VF-0 is a experimental testbed of overtechnology implementation for what seems like all current and future VF's. The only reason it looks like the VF-1 was because it was designed within the same time period, but the design is definitely an advancement, and not a precursor.

like I said.

[Aegis!]

Looks like you're right. From what I read from the Japanese text, the VF-0 is a experimental testbed of overtechnology implementation for what seems like all current and future VF's. The only reason it looks like the VF-1 was because it was designed within the same time period, but the design is definitely an advancement, and not a precursor.

Also, whether or not we'll see the VF-1 is really based on how long the story is going to drag out. If you look, at the chronology on the compendium, the official rollout of the trial VF-1A takes place only two months after the events of Macross Zero!

That´s what I´ve been saying , glad someone agrees with my perspective.

As I said , Kawamori oughts to show the VF-1 (maybe the low-vis , who knows ) in Macross Zero , at least by ep.4 as a mean to have a more powerful VF in the war against the Anti-UN and if not making a glorious appearance in ep.5 , independently of wheter the VF-0 is a prototype or not.

[ewilen]

That said, if I was going to bet, I'd bet that Kawamori's intent is for the VF-0 to be a prototype in the VF-1 development program, and that existing continuity regarding the VF-X and VF-X-1 is being cast aside.

This is my take on it too. Forget your VF-Xs, the VF-0 is their replacement as one of the final iterations of VF-1 prototypes.

I highly doubt so , if they haven´t said that by now then it´s very difficult they´ll say it in the next episodes.

The VF-Xs were never mentioned in Macross either, but that doesn't stop people taking their existence as gospel.

Looks like you're right.

I don't get it, Imode. Gokurakumaru is on the side of those who believe that the VF-0 is a precursor or prototype of the VF-1, not a parallel or advanced design, and his evidence is pretty solid.

[imode]

That said, if I was going to bet, I'd bet that Kawamori's intent is for the VF-0 to be a prototype in the VF-1 development program, and that existing continuity regarding the VF-X and VF-X-1 is being cast aside.

This is my take on it too. Forget your VF-Xs, the VF-0 is their replacement as one of the final iterations of VF-1 prototypes.

I highly doubt so , if they haven´t said that by now then it´s very difficult they´ll say it in the next episodes.

The VF-Xs were never mentioned in Macross either, but that doesn't stop people taking their existence as gospel.

Looks like you're right.

I don't get it, Imode. Gokurakumaru is on the side of those who believe that the VF-0 is a precursor or prototype of the VF-1, not a parallel or advanced design, and his evidence is pretty solid.

Haha, oops. Indeed he is. It's really hard to say. In Kawamori's comments, he calls the VF-0 an advancement over the the VF-1. And on the Macross Zero page it's called a prototype. Usually, I would take Kawamori's word over the webpage anyday, but it's a little vague as to whether he means an advancement of his own personal design of the VF-1, or an advancement of the variable fighter within the Macross universe.

[ewilen]

For those who want to try their own translations (but who are Japanese-impaired), I found one other site that wasn't too hard to use:

http://nifty.amikai.com/amitext/index2.jsp

Make sure you use the right option on the popup menu. (Use the option that has three characters pointing to two characters, which I assume means "Japanese -> English".)

The translator has the merit of giving the romanization of kana. Some of the other sites I tried seem to have trouble with the length or complexity of the quotes, and it's tiresome to try to break them up into smaller parts. Anyway, here's what I got for the M0 official site quote:

Although VF-0 was only one of the experimental model series of VF-1, in the situation of the variable fighter battle injection of anti-integrated union, rapid armaments will be given and an experimental operational unit will be composed.

A little bit clearer than the babelfish version, though still not great.

[Mr March]

Mr March:

Very very well said.  I have to say you make a good case, though i still see the VF-0 as a more advanced looking vehicle.  It looks to me like the step between the vf-1 and the thunderbolt valk you have shown in your post.

In my opinion, they to make it appear like a less technologically advanced vehicle it should have been drawn big, blocky, and awkward.  to me it looks  refined. smaller usually means more advanced when it comes to the military.

Thats just the way i see it.

Well, I was just hoping to get across my interpretations. Ultimately, Macross Zero is a piece of art and every aspect of it leaves some room for interpretation. Some areas more than others, but we all know what a fan Kawamori is of alternative human perceptions. He loves it when his audience interprets his art as something he never expected. In fact, he encourages it.

I've always concentrated on reaching a middle road with my interpretations of any artwork. Especially retroactive redesigns that are so common in today's industry of prequels and classic revisitations (Star Wars, Mobile Suit Gundam, etc). It's important to remember (ESPECIALLY because we are such ardent fanboys who think we know everything about our beloved franchise) that we have not and never will be told "the whole story" of Macross. Any story is given to the veiwer as only a small look into the unvierse through the eyes of the characters upon which the story focuses. Even after 20 years, there is not nearly enough information or product avaialble to us as Macross fans that we can simply dismiss or reject parts of the continuity that conflicts with what we thought happened. That's ultimately Kawamori and company's pervue.

Nonetheless, a very worthy discussion. Beleive me, I do understand your points. You have some valid criticisms.

Edited August 27, 2003 by Mr March

[Basara Nekki]

Dumb question. When in Macross Zero 3 coming out?

[azrael]

Dumb question. When in Macross Zero 3 coming out?

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...ct=ST&f=2&t=352

[Draykov]

So pretty much no one has anything good to say about the VF-0 or Macross Zero for that matter...I wonder why does Kawamori eveb bother to make new series when there´s so many nitpicking.

I want my Macross Zero OVA in 1/48 scale!!!

Apart from the thermonuclear engines I don´t see any difference in performance between the VF-0 or VF-1 to come to the concclusion that the VF-0 is a prototype or an older model of the VF-1 , which would be a stupid assumption if it was based solely in the numbers of the valkyries.

One of them had to come first (even if only on the design table). All future variable fighters have designations that are in ascending numerical order. Why would that be a stupid assumption?

Edited January 30, 2004 by Draykov

[Syngyne]

Nope. What the VF-0 has is 1 big (expensive and probably 5 ft tall on the single seat version) LCD for the front. 2 monitors on the side and 1 above their head.

Are you sure about that? In the first episode, when Roy's seat tilts back during transformation you can see a monitor go all the way behind him.