If companies send VF designs to colonies...

[RedWolf]

Taking inspiration from Macross Frontier on the development of the VF-25 and VF-27 thanks to the YF-24.

VF companies send specs of their VFs to other colony fleets for further development.

We saw how different the VF-19S and VF-19F from the VF-19A and the VF-19P.

One is built for space the other for atmosphere.

General Galaxy did send the VF-14 Vampire design to the Megaroad 13 fleet. But they chose to build a more armoured version of it.

[Master Dex]

It is a good possibility. I'd even believe that Megaroad 13 just wanted the 14 to have bigger hands, but that is just me (lol ).

I can easily believe that any colony can modify and redesign valkyries to their liking or for specific purposes.

Edited February 16, 2009 by Master Dex

[SchizophrenicMC]

It's all about flavor.... Or maybe the original GG design was scrapped and the larger one was MP'd. I mean, look at the YF-19. It has VG wings, but later, the VF-19 was decided to be MP'd with fixed wings.

So, maybe it's a colony's choice to fit its needs.

Maybe it's the producer deciding to build differently than the original design.

F-14As have Glove Vanes

F-14B-D don't...

[anime52k8]

I still support the idea that the Macross 7 plus design is the VA-14 and the M3 design is the VF-14, and it's just an issue of clarification. (i.e. Sk/studio Nue haven't bothered to clear things up since its an obscure design)

[Killer Robot]

It is a good possibility. I'd even believe that Megaroad 13 just wanted the 14 to have bigger hands, but that is just me (lol ).

Megaroad 13 captain: "It's not bad, but I want some HANDS on the thing! Enormous steel fists!!"

Engineer: "Um, sure. You know, the balance is going to be shot if we don't scale up some of the rest."

Captain: *waves hand* "Do whatever else you need. I just want to look at the thing and know it could strangle a destroid easy."

Engineer: "But sir, destroids don't actually br..."

Captain: "You heard me, get to work!"

[sketchley]

I still support the idea that the Macross 7 plus design is the VA-14 and the M3 design is the VF-14, and it's just an issue of clarification. (i.e. Sk/studio Nue haven't bothered to clear things up since its an obscure design)

But he already has...

[Master Dex]

Megaroad 13 captain: "It's not bad, but I want some HANDS on the thing! Enormous steel fists!!"

Engineer: "Um, sure. You know, the balance is going to be shot if we don't scale up some of the rest."

Captain: *waves hand* "Do whatever else you need. I just want to look at the thing and know it could strangle a destroid easy."

Engineer: "But sir, destroids don't actually br..."

Captain: "You heard me, get to work!"

"That'll do pig, that'll do."

[SchizophrenicMC]

How I see it:

Project Lead: Well, it's a good design, but I think the new model needs some hands!

Engineer: But you realize you'd have to change everything, otherwise the balance will be screwed.

Project Lead: Do what you must, but I wanna be able to look at that thing and know it can strangle a destroid.

Engineer: But, sir, destroids don't actually bre-

Project Lead: Shut up and get to work.

[anime52k8]

How I see it:

Project Lead: Well, it's a good design, but I think the new model needs some hands!

Engineer: But you realize you'd have to change everything, otherwise the balance will be screwed.

Project Lead: Do what you must, but I wanna be able to look at that thing and know it can strangle a destroid.

Engineer: But, sir, destroids don't actually bre-

Project Lead: Shut up and get to work.

now I wonder who decided that the thing also needed laser boobs?

[Master Dex]

Ah... that is so true, the captain can want it to look however he wants, but it is the project lead that gets it his way in the end. Of course the middle man engineer gets to have fun finding ways to make the system better while making sure it ends up with its requisite beefy hands.

The chest lasers... probably an inside joke from the engineering team.

Edited February 17, 2009 by Master Dex

[Morpheus]

Considering most of Megaroad 13 military consist of Zentraedi, I think its normal if they made several variation to the VF-14, maybe they tried to combine Zentraedi old technology from a power armor into it (the chest blaster) and also bulkier design.

Boy, I wish Battle 5 we're given a chance to transform into attacker mode, I love to see what the trigger-happy Zentran engineer would done to her.

[RedWolf]

Considering most of Megaroad 13 military consist of Zentraedi, I think its normal if they made several variation to the VF-14, maybe they tried to combine Zentraedi old technology from a power armor into it (the chest blaster) and also bulkier design.

Boy, I wish Battle 5 we're given a chance to transform into attacker mode, I love to see what the trigger-happy Zentran engineer would done to her.

Wait..Wha?

Two other fleets were victimized by the Protodevlin.

Megaroad 13 fleet and Macross 5 fleet.

I think you're confusing them with Macross 13.

[SchizophrenicMC]

now I wonder who decided that the thing also needed laser boobs?

Why, the designer of the VF-11MAXL, of course!

[Morpheus]

Wait..Wha?

Two other fleets were victimized by the Protodevlin.

Megaroad 13 fleet and Macross 5 fleet.

I think you're confusing them with Macross 13.

Nope, its Macross 5, it was a Zentraedi colony fleet after all.

BTW, VF-11 MAXL have speaker-boobs instead of laser-boobs. Now lets talk about rocket-boobs.........

[anime52k8]

Nope, its Macross 5, it was a Zentraedi colony fleet after all.

BTW, VF-11 MAXL have speaker-boobs instead of laser-boobs. Now lets talk about rocket-boobs.........

you called?

[badboy00z]

I used to watch that show when I was a kid. Good times. Lol.

[sketchley]

now I wonder who decided that the thing also needed laser boobs?

Try speakers.

[Master Dex]

Yeah, it is apparent that some of the designers in Shinsei (I know they do the VF-11 and various derivatives, I don't know if Shinsei did the VF-14 though) loved putting random objects for valkyrie boobs, I would seriously bet they were inside jokes from the engineering teams that designed them (in real life it was probably an inside joke from our dear friend with the floating head).

Funnily enough my friend, who isn't really a fan of Macross but he knows enough about it thanks to me talking of it nonstop, likes to joke that my VF-25S model has a uni-boob (referring to the pointed chest). He has also made jokes about the VF-1's nosecone position in battroid mode, but we all know those jokes have probably been made before.

[Zinjo]

You mean these?

[Zinjo]

The VF-19F & S fighters were "optimized" for space flight, hence the fixed wings. The VF-19A & P fighters were "optimized" for atmospheric flight.

Both could fly in either environment, but performed better in the one they were optimized for.

I am doubtful the Megaroad "adapted" their valks. The PD versions were adapted to be visually intimidating as well as heavily armed. Something the PD would know based on the effectiveness of their own bodies.

[SchizophrenicMC]

Nope, its Macross 5, it was a Zentraedi colony fleet after all.

BTW, VF-11 MAXL have speaker-boobs instead of laser-boobs. Now lets talk about rocket-boobs.........

Well, they're covering all the bases. First, speaker boobs, then laser boobs, then GG and LAI stole their thunder with the nosecone boob, now all that they need is a set of rocket boobs, and their work will be COMPLETE!

[Master Dex]

Well, they're covering all the bases. First, speaker boobs, then laser boobs, then GG and LAI stole their thunder with the nosecone boob, now all that they need is a set of rocket boobs, and their work will be COMPLETE!

Well.. you might be able to say the SDF-1 has rocket boobs. The main vertical thrusters for cruiser mode are on the chest in attacker mode. Hey I think it is better than hanger bay boobs as the original concept was, as well as the Breast Fighters, lol.

[SchizophrenicMC]

Well.. you might be able to say the SDF-1 has rocket boobs. The main vertical thrusters for cruiser mode are on the chest in attacker mode. Hey I think it is better than hanger bay boobs as the original concept was, as well as the Breast Fighters, lol.

No, those are Fusion Drive boobs...

And, all this time, I thought I was the only one who referenced Breast Fighters...

I've never seen that anywhere else during my short run here at MW.

[Master Dex]

My roommate makes me wonder if anything in Macross has cannon boobs... we have laser boobs which is close but I don't know if that qualifies for a cannon. Apparently Gundam has done cannon boobs before.

This is going to be one of those infamous topics where the conversation shifted from something specific to a talk that in the end is another boob-related discussion. Macross World really is a charmed place.

[SchizophrenicMC]

My roommate makes me wonder if anything in Macross has cannon boobs... we have laser boobs which is close but I don't know if that qualifies for a cannon. Apparently Gundam has done cannon boobs before.

This is going to be one of those infamous topics where the conversation shifted from something specific to a talk that in the end is another boob-related discussion. Macross World really is a charmed place.

Cannon Boobs? No... Unfortunately, not.

Now, I must say this: Boobs are win, and should be talked about always.

Pussy is NSFW, so we can't talk about it. (Unfortunately... God's gift is frowned upon at work...)

[edwin3060]

Pussy is NSFW, so we can't talk about it. (Unfortunately... God's gift is frowned upon at work...)

Not to mention that VF's for some reason always seem to have male-type crotches, all the way since the VF-1

[Master Dex]

Not to mention that VF's for some reason always seem to have male-type crotches, all the way since the VF-1

Though a lot refer to the VF-25 as being feminine due to it's skinny-ness, despite it's cod piece and all the talk about it. It is tradition to refer to vehicles and ships as she, but I know what you are saying, battroid features aside some seem very manly.

[edwin3060]

Though a lot refer to the VF-25 as being feminine due to it's skinny-ness, despite it's cod piece and all the talk about it. It is tradition to refer to vehicles and ships as she, but I know what you are saying, battroid features aside some seem very manly.

Yea but the VF-25 has this giant big crotch piece that is thrust forwards. I see it more as a really tall, skinny guy than a chick

[SchizophrenicMC]

Not to mention that VF's for some reason always seem to have male-type crotches, all the way since the VF-1

25's just usin' a strap-on, and you know it.

Anything that Alto flies is automatically feminine, and also in his Harem. He treats the girls in his Harem badly, if the VFs are anything to go by. Working on the pimp hand, I see, Alto.

[Macross GURU]

My roommate makes me wonder if anything in Macross has cannon boobs... we have laser boobs which is close but I don't know if that qualifies for a cannon. Apparently Gundam has done cannon boobs before.

This is going to be one of those infamous topics where the conversation shifted from something specific to a talk that in the end is another boob-related discussion. Macross World really is a charmed place.

The Queadluun-Rau has impact cannon boobs... Perhaps the Zentradi have beaten them to it?

[edwin3060]

25's just usin' a strap-on, and you know it.

Anything that Alto flies is automatically feminine, and also in his Harem. He treats the girls in his Harem badly, if the VFs are anything to go by. Working on the pimp hand, I see, Alto.

Aww comeon. Ozma 'The Man' Lee was flying the VF-25 long before upstart Alto.

[Nied]

The VF-19F & S fighters were "optimized" for space flight, hence the fixed wings. The VF-19A & P fighters were "optimized" for atmospheric flight.

Both could fly in either environment, but performed better in the one they were optimized for.

This is just a Dave Deitrich brainbug. If you do some digging for translations of official sources you'd find that the F & S versions were more optimized for cost than anything else. Hell when you look at the F & S and the A they have roughly the same amount of lifting surfaces (the wings on an F model 19 are much broader than the 19A even if they don't have the wingspan, and the lack of canards are made up for by the extended LERXs). Hell if you look at the line art for the VF-19A you'll see that same three vernier thrusters that supposedly replaced the canards on the VF-19F/S.

[SchizophrenicMC]

Aww comeon. Ozma 'The Man' Lee was flying the VF-25 long before upstart Alto.

Yup. He's a man, so he rides women!

[RedWolf]

I've been rummaging around the Compendium lately and found out that Az-130A Panzerzorene was based upon the VA-14 Vampire.

Which sets up the question whether the VF we saw in Spiritia Dreamming Macross 7 PLUS clip is in fact the VA-14 not the VF-14.

It has been established the reason why the Fz-109 Elgerzorene was determined as a UN Spacy derived VF is because of its similarity to a VF unit present in the Megaroad 13 Varauta expedition.

The VA-14 is supposedly a Zentradi spin on the VF-14 pretty much like their own versions of the Bolognese class and NMC class. Now that doesn't mean giants use them but regular miclone Zentradi. It has been established most Zentradi in the NUN sphere of influence are miclones.

Az-130A Panzerzorene comparison with Varauta VF.

Fz-109A Elgerzorene

VF-14 Vampire (Macross M3)

[Valkyrie Driver]

If we use the F16/F2 example we can see that notable changes have been made on real world aircraft too. The F14 example mentioned earlier is not so apparent, and is just a variant. The Mitsubishi F2 is a different aircraft from the Lockheed F16. The F2 was derived from the General Dynamics Agile Falcon upgrade to the F16, while the F16 block 40 and onward were simple upgrades to the existing airframe. The same might be said for the disparities between fighters based on the same platform, that differ from fleet to fleet. Another good real world example might be the F-35 A/B/C, where each is optimized for the different services.

Other differences might arise from the Purchaser. Is the Squadron the VF is for based in space on a colony fleet, or on an established colony planet? Looking back on the VFs from 0-27 I've seen a parallel trend to the real world fighter development. The Body of an F16 does almost as much to produce lift as the wings do (I may be exaggerating a bit). The Current teen series fighters have more lifting surfaces than did the old century series, and comparable navy counterparts.

The VF-1 and VF-4 had only the wings to produce lift, whereas the VF-11, VF-19, and VF-22 all used strakes (extended wing roots) and/or lifting bodies to provide more aerodynamic stability and lift, thus making them more efficient. Going back to the F2/F16 example, the differences were relatively minor, the F2 is longer, has more wing area, larger tail planes, a drogue parachute, two piece canopy, a more powerful radar. Those sorts of things determine what sort of modifications would be made to a ship.

Think of it, Colony X requires a fighter that is low cost, so they choose a proven air frame like the VF-1. More powerful sensors are available, so the nose is resized. The avionics and control suite is newer so the cockpit gets laid out differently. The ship needs more lift and maneuverability so the wing area is increased. More powerful engines are available so the engine nacelles are enlarged. You come up with a fighter whose parentage is unmistakable, but that is different enough to warrant a new classification. That's how I see it working.