Currently watching Macross 7

[The Shade]

Hey guys, for those who are interested, episode 4 of M7 subbed by Anime in Action is now available on bittorrent.

You can find it here.

[Effect]

-Physica, his cheating whore wife, & his cheating whore wife's new husband

I just felt like hell when I saw that part. I had wished that Gamrin would have gone over and at least slapped the taste out of her mouth.

I felt the same way. I just skip over that part now. I can't watch it anymore to be honest.

Edited November 22, 2003 by Effect

[Agent ONE]

So when we say "fan service" what we really mean is "man service."

More or less....

Well, when most fans are male.. what do you expect? Giant robot animation isnt quite a big draw for females.

Is that why most men in anime are kinda wimpy?.. So the weak guys can see the weak guys get the hot chicks? IE: No reason to put in some real stud guy to please chicks.

This could account for Hikaru's timid nature with girls.

[Nightbat]

What's the problem with the fanservice?

Most of us are above 21, but it seems like we forgot how we were when we were 15 (some Chaste if I take their reactions seriously )

And from what I thought: Macross is targetted at an audience of 14-16 year old boys

when you're 15, you take every chance you get to see hooters, panties and tails

Wish we had Mahoromatic when I was 15

[Keith]

Wish we had Mahoromatic when I was 15

heh

[Deigo]

sorry for bringing up an old post. Isn't Gamlin only 18/19? And Mylene is actually 15 later in the series? That only makes them 3/4 years difference.

[Valkyrie addict]

I thought Gamlin was sort of hallucinating/daydreaming the whole physica's wife thingy since he was so devastaded of all that was happening?

althought I think the love triangle between Basara, Gamlin and Mylene was silly and unresolved, it makes sense when you point out their ages, Basara only cares about himself and his music, Gamlin wants Mylene and Mylene is just to young to fully understand love, so, they just had to leave it like that... she's too young to be able to choose wisely

then again, there is the whole thing: 'how could a 14 year old girl be capable of piloting advanced valkyries in space battles without complete military training and not get killed thing?'

EDIT: terrible spelling

Edited December 29, 2006 by Valkyrie addict

[Keith]

Gamlin wasn't hallucinating, he went to go report Physica's death, and saw his wife & child with the new guy. As for Mylene, Milia was an ace at 16, and Hikaru was flying in his fathers circus even younger than that.

[Valkyrie addict]

Milia was 16??? cool, but remembered they were engineered for war... and Hikaru loved flying but stil went thru proper military training, Mylene was just a girl who wanted to be a singing star

damn, Physicas wife's a whore!!! I remember when I started seeing that episode and noticed it was too centered in Physica I was like... oh boy, he's gonna die, hehehehe

oh yes, I would have also liked for Macross 7 to resolved the whole Milia and Max marriage, I really wanted them to get over their jobs and get back togueter

[sketchley]

One thing to keep strongly in mind is that Macross is not reality. I mean it in the sense that the situation in the Macross universe, especially after SWI, and the almost complete eradication of humanity, it is fundamentally different from the world that we know. Add to it that Macross is made in Japan, by Japanese, for Japanese, and you get cultural elements that may be unique to Japan being thrown in. For starters, there's the whole age of concent/marriable age difference.

Macross 7 isn't suggesting anything against the law. However, it does go semi-against the modern (Japanese) culture, which has most people getting married later in life, and having less children than in preceeding generations. In addition there are more and more people who are not getting married at all (either by choice, circumstance, or the failings of the modern culture paradigm being imported from North America - but that's another topic entirely.)

The Macross universe, especially that of the late 2040s, is one where almost everybody is a decendant of a clone. Not to mention that there are probably incentives to get married and have more children sooner in life - survival of the species, et al.

The other angle is that Miria was played as an overbearing mother. Her behaviour may not be an accurate barometer of the *actual* culture in Macross. In a way, her role was to help justify Mylene's actions, and to get the audience (especially the young female demographic) to relate to Mylene.

The Max/Miria relationship is for us old timers who have gotten old, and grown up, and gotten married ourselves. Max essentially married the prom-queen. Look how their marriage turned out. Makes us happy, eh.

That, or would they be interesting if they were always disappearing off camera to make more children? Drama, and especially conflict/arguements make for a much more interesting story than two people living happily ever after (isn't that the usual end to a love story?)

[briscojr84]

Let's not forget Milia turned into a neurotic hypocondriac [sp] in Macross 7, which is kind of annoying, at least they didn't have Max snorting cocaine in his office

[JB0]

Let's not forget Milia turned into a neurotic hypocondriac [sp] in Macross 7, which is kind of annoying...

But she was still hot!

[SpacyAce2012]

Milia was a trip in M7. It was one of the reasons I enjoyed the show.

But the old Milia was still there. Stubborn, aggressive, opinionated, a show boat, and a soft spot when it comes to her fellow Zentraedi.

Yep. It's still her all right.

[Keith]

Milia being a hypocodriac is totally in character. Don't forget:

-She threw Komilia!

-She hung out in the Macross, and sustained herself in an arcade.

-Her idea of revenge was a badly animated knife fight, the idea for which I can only assume came from watching a bad drama while aboard the Macross.

Etc. She was always on the neurotic side.

As for their relationship in 7, at the end it is pretty much all but said that they've reconciled.

[Scream Man]

Ive not seen all of Mac 7, but why did max n Milia split anyway?

[Roy Focker]

oKAY BUT IT'S A BIT of a spoiler:

Milia found Max nude in a hot tub with Doctor Chiba.

[JB0]

Ive not seen all of Mac 7, but why did max n Milia split anyway?

Because they'd been married for 40 years, raised 7 kids, and were starting to annoy each other just a tad.

[jenius]

Ive not seen all of Mac 7, but why did max n Milia split anyway?

Dude, if you thought Milia was a handful when she was 16, just imagine what's she's like going through menopause! Every time Max didn't put the clothes in the laundry basket he'd have to go through a big knife fight that wouldn't end until she was on the ground cursing another hot flash. Very very tough relationship to stay in...

Also, it appears Max was neutered at some point. It may have been self-inflicted after having seven daughters.

[eight_car]

oKAY BUT IT'S A BIT of a spoiler:

Milia found Max nude in a hot tub with Doctor Chiba.

I have seen all of Mac7, but don't remember that scene.

If that was a joke that was a bad one

[SpacyAce2012]

Also, it appears Max was neutered at some point. It may have been self-inflicted after having seven daughters.

When I see the numerous references to Max Jenius losing his "manliness" in M7, I just laugh.

The character of Max is simply being portrayed in a realistic light. It's called "getting older" and "laid back".

I find it refreshing that he's isn't protrayed as the same 16 year old hotshot girl chaser in SDFM.

He's still the top Ace in the U.N. military (his flying in Operation Stargazer proved that). But the character has matured into a leader who has to look at the "big picture", a concerned father, and (hopefully once again) a good husband. He's now a "fifty-something" in charge of an entire fleet, with numerous civilians and military personnel counting on him. A huge responsibility. Not the kind of job you give someone with the mentality of a young hotdog fighter pilot.

But that's just my opinion. Others will differ.

[Zinjo]

Milia being a hypocodriac is totally in character. Don't forget:

-She threw Komilia!

-She hung out in the Macross, and sustained herself in an arcade.

-Her idea of revenge was a badly animated knife fight, the idea for which I can only assume came from watching a bad drama while aboard the Macross.

Etc. She was always on the neurotic side.

I don't see how any of those examples prove Millia was a hypocondriac???

She got freaked out by catching a flu which I believe was established had never happened to her before, so she over reacted "a tad"...

If anything Millia became even more overbearing and arrogant than when she was still under Lap Lamis' command.

Max did loose his kahonies when it came to Millia, and only her. Mylene had her dad wrapped around her little finger as I suspect all her sisters did before her and particularly because she was the baby of the family.

The reason they split was because apparently Max was a bit overbearing as the ace pilot of the military and eventually Millia got tired of him bossing her around and not being around for the kids. However you never get the impression that Max was anything like that at all during the M7 series.

[SpacyAce2012]

Max did loose his kahonies when it came to Millia, and only her. Mylene had her dad wrapped around her little finger as I suspect all her sisters did before her and particularly because she was the baby of the family.

The reason they split was because apparently Max was a bit overbearing as the ace pilot of the military and eventually Millia got tired of him bossing her around and not being around for the kids. However you never get the impression that Max was anything like that at all during the M7 series.

A married man has to master the art of compromise. And learn to give in once and a while. Gotta keep the Ol' Lady happy, ya know. It can work wonders for a man's sanity.

As for Little Miss Mylene, it is a similar situation with many teenaged daughters in Real Life. They are "Daddy's Girl". And those same teenaged girls will play this up for all that's it's worth, if they have an "agenda" (want something). Considering that even the "tough guys" (who have young daughters) are suceptable to such, I don't percieve it as any sort of wimpiness on Max's part.

Regarding the split, this was a similar impression I got from the series, as well. But I always theorized that allegations of an affair had something to do with it, in addition to the other problems. It was rumored in M7 Thrash that Max had a son from another woman at some point (Shiba Midou). But since I haven't read the entire manga, I don't know the actual truth behind it or the details regarding that plot element.

Being tempermental as she is, I could see Millia flying off the handle if those rumors reached her ears. Her and Max were supposedly already having problems over the years. Something like this would only make things worse for any couple in a shaky marriage.

Edited January 1, 2007 by SpacyAce2012

[Keith]

Actually, I think the official reason for the split was regarding their ranks in the 7 fleet. Max being fleet commander had the highest rank, and Milia being a bit jealous that she couldn't match his place in the fleet decided to retire her commission and take up the highest civillian position (i.e. running for mayor). The problem then being that the possitions of fleet commander & city mayor caused them to butt heads on enough issues to put a strain on their personal relationship, hence the split.

The rumors of Max's affair in Trash were just that, rumors. The situation seems to have had far more to do with Milia's bullheadedness, and perhaps a lack of sensitivity on Max's part. By all appearances, it never got any bigger than a seperation, and again, by the end of the series, all seems to be resolved.

[Graham]

Ive not seen all of Mac 7, but why did max n Milia split anyway?

Beacuse after popping out 7 kids she was as loose as a goose.

There were many younger, cuter (and tighter) bridge bunnies available to Max.

That's my theory anyway.

But seriously, I think Keith's post (above mine), pretty much hits the nail on the head with regard to why they split.

Graham

[jenius]

Beacuse after popping out 7 kids she was as loose as a goose.

There were many younger, cuter (and tighter) bridge bunnies available to Max.

Good God, I can't believe Graham went there before any of the clearly less mature people did (like damn it, he beat me to it!).

I don't know Spacy, you're whole argument against my statement that Max has no balls seems more apologist than anything else. It's kind of a "See, you gotta understand WHY Max has no balls" rather than "No, seriously, Max still has balls." I mean, I don't run a space ship, but I imagine it takes being rather assertive... I didn't see Max getting very assertive at all. Then again, maybe I should rewatch the original series, maybe Max was never all that assertive in the first place... but that'd make me wonder how he ended up in charge of anything... or how his marriage with Milia would have lasted this long in the first place.

[SpacyAce2012]

Good God, I can't believe Graham went there before any of the clearly less mature people did (like damn it, he beat me to it!).

I don't know Spacy, you're whole argument against my statement that Max has no balls seems more apologist than anything else. It's kind of a "See, you gotta understand WHY Max has no balls" rather than "No, seriously, Max still has balls." I mean, I don't run a space ship, but I imagine it takes being rather assertive... I didn't see Max getting very assertive at all. Then again, maybe I should rewatch the original series, maybe Max was never all that assertive in the first place... but that'd make me wonder how he ended up in charge of anything... or how his marriage with Milia would have lasted this long in the first place.

Me an apologists? That's a new one on me. You're the first person to ever associate me with that label. History has been made.

Even the younger Max was an easy going, fun loving, girl chaser. He was modest (but sometimes got a fat head when someone called him a genius). A perfect gentleman with the ladies. And judging by his arguement with Hikaru over his proposed marriage to an enemy alien, he demonstrated that he was a hopeless romantic.

Max was the first one to begin taking out enemy mecha, without killing the pilots. All at the pleadings of his new bride.

All of these things listed would make Max seem like highly skilled dandy, similar to the military gentry of ages past.

So, Max had always been something "nice guy" character. But does that mean he never had balls? Or lost them at some point?

Being a leader means being more than just assertive. Different leaders have different styles of leadership. Max's style seems to work well on Battle 7. The troops respect him. And people seem to follow his orders without much grumbling. And the troops that went on Operation Stargazer, appeared to follow him without reservation. A sign of respect for a legendary man who earned it.

As for having balls in M7, lets look at some examples:

1-He was prepared to kill his own daughter, his most elite pilot, and the rest of Sound Force with a reaction weapon, if Mylene's gamble to save Gamlin had failed.

2- He personally took charge of Operation Stargazer, knowing it was a suicide mission

3- During Stargazer, in feat of pure ballsyness, he defolded into the middle of a firefight, blazed through the Varauta's automated defenses, to deliver the "egg" (reaction weapon) to the target. When it was evident that he wouldn't escape, he ordered the others away to safety. That's what I call guts, being a leader, and a hero.

4- He ordered Battle 7 to ram a Varauta ship in a vain attempt to stop the enemy fold operation from stealing away with City 7. That demonstrates decisive leadership on his part, able to make snap judgements and quickly act on them.

5- He refused to abandon City 7 as it was falling into that star, even if it meant the destruction of Battle 7.

6- At the end of the series, he took the fight to the enemy's doorstep.

7-He still doesn't shy away from a fight.

Yep. While still being something of a skilled dandy and nice guy character, Max has proven he still has something in his sac. Why be an apologists, when there is nothing to apologize for? The facts speak for themselves.

[Keith]

Ballsiest moment still goes to Exedor. Intentionally misfiring the Macross cannon, & making it appear to be a mistake was classic.

[SpacyAce2012]

Ballsiest moment still goes to Exedor. Intentionally misfiring the Macross cannon, & making it appear to be a mistake was classic.

I laughed my ass off at that.

[jenius]

Ballsiest moment still goes to Exedor. Intentionally misfiring the Macross cannon, & making it appear to be a mistake was classic.

Darn, I don't recall this

As to the Max thing, I don't doubt he's respected, I don't doubt he's a great pilot, I don't doubt that his heart is in the right place. After having watched Mac7 though I definitely had the impression that if someone walked up to him, told him he was walking excrement (not that anyone had reason to) he'd probably cower or maybe shrug. Sure, he's still gold in a valk, and yes, people really like and trust him, it just seemed to me that when dealing with people (mostly through Milia) the guy had no ability to stand for himself. Brave in the line of fire? Absolutely. Brave when face-to-face with anyone? Not-so-much. Again though, I should re-watch the original, maybe that's totally in line with his character. I seem to recall him totally oogling Milia in the arcade though, randomly asking her out, and fighting his way through a Chinese restaurant... none of which seem in line with the guy I saw in Mac7. Like you say though, maybe time has just mellowed him... but that sounds more accepting of what has happened rather than a disagreement. Perhaps saying he "lost his balls" goes too far, let's just say I felt he simmered down too much.

[JB0]

After having watched Mac7 though I definitely had the impression that if someone walked up to him, told him he was walking excrement (not that anyone had reason to) he'd probably cower or maybe shrug. Sure, he's still gold in a valk, and yes, people really like and trust him, it just seemed to me that when dealing with people (mostly through Milia) the guy had no ability to stand for himself.

Does he NEED to get worked up over everything? His record speaks for itself.

A shrug is about what accusations of fecal-ness deserve. It's a blatantly absurd accusation, and not worth a response.

Brave in the line of fire? Absolutely. Brave when face-to-face with anyone? Not-so-much. Again though, I should re-watch the original, maybe that's totally in line with his character. I seem to recall him totally oogling Milia in the arcade though, randomly asking her out, and fighting his way through a Chinese restaurant... none of which seem in line with the guy I saw in Mac7.

He acted like a complete fool between his random date request(which wasn't exactly the height of cool) and the actual date. He was a nervous wreck BEFORE Millia attempted to disembowel him.

Of course, his official bio says he has good luck with women, so... maybe he was just overly excited about the prospect of scoring the town's hot gamer chick?

And he wasn't exactly the ONLY person fighting through the restaurant. Or even the one that threw the first punch.

He kicked ass in self-defense. Just like Hikaru, only more effective(and if Captain Jenius was castrated, then Hikaru was a woman). Or even Kaifun.

But he struck me much the same in SDF and Mac7. A laid-back, easygoing complete badass.

[kung flu]

But he struck me much the same in SDF and Mac7. A laid-back, easygoing complete badass.

"A laid-back, easygoing complete badass" with huge responsibilities for the fleet and his family.

[Valkyrie addict]

I now a lot of people who are the best at what they do, respected and somewhat of a leader, but very pussywhipped!!!

[s001]

macross 7 sucks.

[s001]

but Max is still the best!

[JB0]

Thank you for sharing your deeply profound insights.