Official Bandai 1/60 Scale DX Toy Thread Ver.3

[ntsan]

If you consider the min wages there is like 5000 yen per day, 12500yen seems not so bad (only need 3 days work?)

Edited December 27, 2008 by ntsan

[Master Dex]

If you consider the min wages there is like 5000 yen per day, 12500yen seems not so bad (only need 3 days work?)

Really.. that is almost about $55 a day give or take how our economy feels like slapping us today. That is some really good minimum wage there.

Yeah, the DX isn't horrible.. but it isn't that good either. Don't know if I will get the Michael now... you can see my trying to debate it with myself in my sig below while I go on about how I like the 1/72 VF-25S model.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

a lot of people have gone and said some outrageous excuses for Bandai, my favourite was how Bandai did the vf-25 cause of an sketch of Kawamori and how the VF-25 was supposed to be...riiight... well, now we all know the truth, that they didn't really care about this and all they wanted was to put a vf-25 toy in the market

No it is called "giving the benefit of the doubt" and look at the sketch on the box, the toy looks more like that than the CGI model.

[carzooyah]

The game has the cockpit prominently showing at the ass as well. For what it is, I'm pretty happy with how it turned out. I'm still on the fence whether to get this or not however.

[Valkyrie addict]

ok, but you have to agree...in spite all the bad mouthing Bandai here, we all expected a lot more from them...I know I wanted to be proven wrong on this

[VFTF1]

I agree with Valkyrie Addict.

As much as I love Yamato and as much as I defend their prices I would really have had nothing against being shown by Bandai that a superior sculpt and finish is possible at a good price.

And what did Bandai show me?

Bandai basically said: "Well kid, it's like this. Yamato takes Macross very seriously, and they want lots of money for it. We on the other hand just want lots of money."

Pete

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I love gloss coating, maybe I am in the minority, but I know for sure I was not the only one that liked how Yamato gave one of the VF-1A Max types for DYRL a semi-gloss coating. I wasn't the only one that thought it was a neat thing for them to do, and hoped it was a sign for things to come. I think this was on the first 1/60 versions.

As for Bandai engineering a way to protect the pilot...Yamato never really did, all they did was go off of what Kawamori designed. The heat shields covering the canopies on the VF-0, VF-1, VF-11, et al, that has nothing to do with Yamato's approach, that's all Kawamori. You have him to thank, not Yamato. Yes the 25 plamo does a better job of hiding the cockpit but it's not like there is a heat shield covering the thing.

The PVC lasers can be angled out more and straigtened by softening them with a hair dryer, bending to the preferred position, then immediately dunking the part(s) into cold water. This is an old trick for PVC.

I don't see anything wrong with anyone giving Bandai the benefit of the doubt. They succeeded in making a good toy of the VF-25, just not one accurate to the show. The mecha plamo market in Japan is much larger than it is here in the states, and larger than the toy market. The Japanese fans are used to buying kits for accuracy, and having more options and variety more than us. Does that mean we shouldn't get an accurate VF-25 toy? Of course not, but at the same time, I can see why Bandai and Kawamori chose a different approach for their toy. Kawamori has already stated that he initially wanted the battroid to be big, and the DX, already called chunky over here(not surprising) is definitely bigger than it is in the anime. To say that they did not care about this toy is ridiculous. Why would they go out of their way to make it sturdy and durable, as well as get Kawamori's supervision while designing this toy? If they really didn't care they would have just given us a toy that falls apart out of the box, has design flaws all over the place, horrible quality control, and not a second thought to parts composition and how the materials might have some unforseen chemical reaction resulting in defective toys and an inevitable 2.0 version months later that still might not even fix problems. Hell they even tampoed the entire thing up. Yes they are the biggest toymaker in Japan, but Graham once mentioned how expensive tampo printing was and how Yamato(years back) wasn't tampo printing most of the details on their toys due to cost. If Bandai did not care, they would not have even bothered painting and tampo printing everything on the toy. That is easy money saved if they chose not to do so. Even their 1/55 Origin of Valkyrie reissues don't have everything painted/tampo printed, there are at least +20 stickers to apply if you choose to do so. Yet here we are with the DX, and everything is tampoed/painted.

The toy is significantly bigger than the 1/60 VF-1 so I can see why the prices are very similar. As for being out of scale by 2cm, that is no big deal to me. Pilot figures are never a good judge of scale, you guys posting in the Mospeada thread know this. Even the 1/72 kits have out of scale pilots. I wouldn't be surprised if Yamato ever had underscaled pilots. Anyways, Bandai, Yamato, Toynami, whoever, the scale of the pilots doesn't matter as much to me so long as they are in the cockpit and the vehicle itself is relatively close. For example BBI's supposed 1/18 scale F-16 is actually 1/17....but do I care? Not at all!

I appreciate accuracy, but I don't abide by it all the time. For example, I love the movie Starscream figure, and Masterpiece Starscream, both being inaccurate in many ways, especially the former, but fun toys. I don't care about any of the inaccuracies of the upcoming VF-1D, the only things I worry about are the shoulder hinges. The main gripe I have with the VF-11 is the small size of the tailfins. At the same time I was disappointed with the DX Fire Valkyrie toy. To me the DX VF-25 is nothing like the highly inaccurate DX Fire Valkyrie. You don't see the LERXs shoved so far up the nose that they look like a Legioss hybrid, or an EVA like battroid mode. Yes the DX 25 is not anime accurate, but yes it was approved by Kawamori, yes it looks like the sketch on the box, no I'm not using this as an excuse, but rather a reason for explaining why Bandai went with a different approach. Does it bode well for you guys who wanted something accurate? No. Yet not being accurate doesn't make it a bad toy, not at all. There had to be a reason why the DX turned out the way it did after Bandai spent all their money, resources, and sessions with Kawamori to produce the DX.

There are things I am dissapointed in. The main things being the lack of a space to store the gun holder in battroid mode, the neccessity to swap hands to hold the weapons and the fact that the weapon hands cannot store in the shield, the gear being underdetailed, the nose drooping too much, and the front gear not being longer. The plamo and DX get the gear wrong, the VF100s version get's it right. Nonetheless, the DX does many things right in my eyes, such as the gloss coating, durability, balanced appearance, having everything painted on, and much more.

It's good that we have more variety to choose from now, and I hope this is just the beginning of what Bandai will bring out. If it inspires Yamato to become more competitive with pricing and quality, then GOOD! How is that bad at all? More variety for all of us, and when have we ever had variety? What if Yamato decides to do the VF-9? What if Bandai can't make it but decides to make the VF-14? Bandai entering the foray is a good thing for all of us.

Bandai basically said: "Well kid, it's like this. Yamato takes Macross very seriously, and they want lots of money for it. We on the other hand just want lots of money."

Taking a brand seriously doesn't equate to suspect quality and making new toys with broken parts out of the box. Taking 8 years to have an aggressive quality control guy onboard doesn't show very much seriousness on Yamato's part. Having that guy onboard, and still having broken parts on the v2 1/60(like mine) doesn't show seriousness on Yamato's part. If Yamato was truly ready to take on the big dogs they ought to have been critical on the quality of their toys before they even hit the market. I have defended them numerous times and still stand by my stance that the fragility of their toys tends to be highly exaggerrated, but I cannot lie about the breakages that fans like us have witnessed from them over the years. From broken VF-11 hips(happened to me), Tab B, missing pieces, broken VF-0 arms, hairline cracks/breakages on the v2 1/60 VF-1S/A shoulders, stress marks on Ivanov's SV-51, BP8, cracked v1 1/60 hips, cracked intakes on the 1/48, et al. Yes Bandai has it's share of lemons but the majority of their toys are not. If you guys are willing to give a company like Yamato,with all the breakages I just mentioned, the benefit of the doubt, Bandai deserves it too. You guys are some loyal fans. Broken parts does not equal seriousness.

You guys that wanted the anime accurate 25 didn't get it. No one is forcing you to like the DX 25, but there is probably a good reason for why it turned out the way it did, Bandai didn't do it just to irritate fans. I have a feeling if Yamato made it, with Kawamori's supervision, it may have turned out looking very similar.

Edited December 27, 2008 by Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0

[jenius]

I think someone really needs to get a tape measure out and solve this whole "out of scale" thing. It's just as possible that whatever Yamato toy Graham used for reference (i forget which one) is too large by one centimeter and the VF-25 is too small by one centimeter. You also should measure it in two modes, it may simply be small in fighter but the right size in battroid.... you see that sort of thing with EVERY Legioss/Alpha toy ever made.

[Ginrai]

God, you guys are whinetronic.

[VFTF1]

Fine, fine. I'm still getting mine after all... Don't have the skill to paint the durned model anyways... and I guess if that cockpit placement in Battroid mode is just Kawamori's crazy idea then yeah - can't blame Bandai.

I've now moved into the "acceptance" phase and will be happy to have these DXs when they arrive....though I would really love a custom Mikhael with speakers and little Ranka figure which can sing songs:)

Pete

[Guest sh002]

scale doesn't look that bad to me. here is a pic of a 1/60 vf-1j with a 1/60 vf-25s. the other pic is of a 1/72 vf-25f with a 1/72 vf-1j. i still have my preorders for the vf-25f and s at hlj and plan on getting the super pack from overdrive. worst case scenario i keep everything unopened like some of my quality control deficient yamato valkyries that may have problems once i open the boxes.

[tank]

can someone email bandai about all the issues just hoping if there is enough ranting about the toy they will improve it, like what they always do with the soul of chogokin doing renewal versions.

[promethuem5]

Christ the whining has reached a new high (or should I say low)... I'm no Bandai fanboy, but I think the 25 looks great and eagerly await mine... some of the stuff you guys are mentioning is valid (not being able to store the gun clip or knife) but alot of the lineart show-art nazis have reached an impressive crescendo in this thread... remember we're still talking about a toy here, which has to be mass producible and profitable before being 100% lineart accurate.

[UN Spacy]

Please feel free to contact me and I'll take your disappointing VF-25 off your hands.

[mitch]

Hats off to Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0 and jenius for making their points far more eloquently than I did.

Maybe we should start up a support ring for MF fans to help us through the 5 stages;

1) Denial - There MUST be a neck on the 25S...

2) Bargaining - Lets see, if HLJ has their preorders in Yen and BBTS is in USD, factor in the shipping charges and who will have it in stock first...

3) Anger - Bendy head lazers! Shopping trolley wheels! For HOW much?! I can see Alto sticking out of it's bum! BANDAIIII!!!!

4) Dispair - WHY?! Why the day-glo white plastic and web-site exclusives? WHYYYYY?!?

5) Acceptance - Watch episodes 7 and 25 and imagine being able to hold a VF-25 in your hands and 'fly' it around the room (Reeeeeeoooow, BOOM! Bd-d-d-d-d-d-d, kyuun kyuun kyuun! RANKAAAA!!).

Seriously guys, I really like the fact that MWF is here so we can discuss these things with people who know what we're on about, whatever it is that we look for in a Valkyrie, so that we can decide what we want to add to our collections. Good times.

[AcroRay]

If your unhappy about some of the shoddy work email Kawamori Im sure he would love to hear from us about how unhappy we are and might refuse to work with Bandai in the Future until they get their act together. The Japanese have a very strong sense of Pride about the things they do and thats were we can take advantage.!

I doubt Kawamori or anyone else involved is in a position to say 'no' to Bandai, simply because Bandai is the only company able to sponsor a show like Macross.

If Yamato - or instance - was large enough to underwrite a Macross show, the situation might be different.

I'm fine with what I'm seeing from Bandai with the VF-25. All things considered, I think they're comperable to Yamato's Valks after averaging in features, flaws and price.

Honestly, though, I think the basic VF-25's Battroid mode - which is my main interest for any Valkyrie style - is just damn fugly and I don't like it much at all - particularly Alto's. Bandai's little inaccuracies are neither here nor there as far as I'm concerened. For my money, I'm waiting on Michel's or Luca's VF-25s, or a super pack for Ozma's. At least to my eye their additional armor and accessories give a bit more mass and interest to what I've felt is a skeletal-looking, uncomfortable design.

So - Kudos to Bandai for bringing a mainstream Valk product back to the masses that won't totally bust your bank account.

[MacrossJunkie]

I think someone really needs to get a tape measure out and solve this whole "out of scale" thing. It's just as possible that whatever Yamato toy Graham used for reference (i forget which one) is too large by one centimeter and the VF-25 is too small by one centimeter. You also should measure it in two modes, it may simply be small in fighter but the right size in battroid.... you see that sort of thing with EVERY Legioss/Alpha toy ever made.

Well, Graham compared it to the Yamato's "1/60" YF-19.

According to official numbers, fighter length is 18.62m or around 61 ft. 1/60 scale would make that 12.22 inches. The toy is around 13.13 inches making it close to 1/56 scale I believe.

Just for reference for some other fighter modes:

YF-21 - 19.62m -> 60.6ft -> (1/60 scale) 12.87in - (actual) 13.38in - (approx toy scale) 1/58

VF-0 - 18.69m -> 61.32ft -> (1/60 scale) 12.26in - (actual) 12.31in - (approx toy scale) 1/60

SV-51 - 22.77m -> 74.7ft -> (1/60 scale) 14.94in - (actual) 15.06in - (approx toy scale) 1/60

VF-25 - 18.72m -> 61.42ft -> (1/60 scale) 12.28in - (actual) ?? Someone measure it in cm or inches please and let us know.

So if it were 1/60 scale, it should be close to the VF-0 in length.

In my opinion, it's really hard to do a battroid scale. Macross variable mecha are designed from fighter first and Kawamori goes from there to derive a battroid. So if your fighter parts are in scale, whatever you get in battroid is what you get.

Now if we really want to get nitpicky, we should find the heights of the characters and measure the pilot figures

Edited December 28, 2008 by MacrossJunkie

[ff95gj]

scale doesn't look that bad to me. here is a pic of a 1/60 vf-1j with a 1/60 vf-25s. the other pic is of a 1/72 vf-25f with a 1/72 vf-1j. i still have my preorders for the vf-25f and s at hlj and plan on getting the super pack from overdrive. worst case scenario i keep everything unopened like some of my quality control deficient yamato valkyries that may have problems once i open the boxes.

Hmm... It's about the same size as the 1/60 VF-1J... and that's a problem. It should be about the size of a 1/60 YF-19.

VF-1 series are one size smaller.

[Guest sh002]

just wondering is the scale on the 1/60 yf-19 completely accurate?

if anyone is not satisfied with their vf-25's, i'll also take them off your hands. please send them to me and i'll pay for the shipping costs.

[MacrossJunkie]

just wondering is the scale on the 1/60 yf-19 completely accurate?

if anyone is not satisfied with their vf-25's, i'll also take them off your hands. please send them to me and i'll pay for the shipping costs.

Nope, it's a tad bigger than it should be. I as mentioned in my previous post, it's around 1/56 scale. A good comparison would be against the VF-0 as they should be around the same length and the VF-0 is really close to it's intended scale.

[IAD]

I can't help it, I was never in the market, but...

THE WHEELS! OH THE HUMANITY!

~Luke

[transfan52]

Man the only vf-25 alto on ebay is sold out already! oh well even if I did get mine through ebay he probly wouldnt be able to ship to me from japan until the 5th... Thats when japan new years vacation ends.

[Wicked Ace]

Man the only vf-25 alto on ebay is sold out already! oh well even if I did get mine through ebay he probly wouldnt be able to ship to me from japan until the 5th... Thats when japan new years vacation ends.

I admit, I looked on ebay as well. For me, the rush to get one of these in my hands isn't about my inner child's impatience so much as it is about getting the Macross hobby bug somewhat out of my system before grown up life consumes all my time.

edit: If there is some way to get one of these faster than mid-January, then I'd like the option -- will cover the expense(s). Maybe one of our members who can go to a local retailer and pick one of these up can help me.

Edited December 28, 2008 by Wicked Ace

[nugundamII]

what scares me is that I am patiently waiting for Michaels VF-25G yet I cant seem to find pics of it in flight mode or Lucas for that fact???

Why is that?

[MacrossJunkie]

what scares me is that I am patiently waiting for Michaels VF-25G yet I cant seem to find pics of it in flight mode or Lucas for that fact???

Why is that?

IXTL put a magazine scan up back on page 14.

Here's the link to it for your convenience.

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&id=61430

I'm afraid now that the stabilizers on Michael's rifle might be crooked bendy pvc, or possibly the whole gun itself. That would really piss me off.

[IXTL]

what scares me is that I am patiently waiting for Michaels VF-25G yet I cant seem to find pics of it in flight mode or Lucas for that fact???

Why is that?

Cuz you haven't been reading through this thread carefully that's why.

Here're the links to the posts in this thread with pics of the G and RVF in various modes for your viewing pleasure:

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=694851

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=695099

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=695730

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=695891

I'm afraid now that the stabilizers on Michael's rifle might be crooked bendy pvc, or possibly the whole gun itself. That would really piss me off.

What's worse (to me at least) is that it will probably come in the extremely cheap looking unpainted glossy plastic like the gun pods for the F and S variants.

The DX figures would have looked better if unpainted matte plastic was used. It probably wouldn't match the painted die-cast parts but they don't match now anyway on the actual figure.

Edited December 28, 2008 by IXTL

[ATLMYK]

I like them.

For once it will be nice when some one ask me to transform a valk I can say sure!.

Yam's get transformed once, posed and never touched again out of fear.

[Valkyrie addict]

God, you guys are whinetronic.

hahaha! guilty!

[anime52k8]

Really.. that is almost about $55 a day give or take how our economy feels like slapping us today. That is some really good minimum wage there.

5000 yen is about 625 yen per hour for an 8 hour day, and that number can actually go up or down based on industry and prefecture. so it's right in the same around the US minimum wage which is $6.55 per hour.

state minimum is that or higher. here in california, it $8 an hour

(to bad i can't find a part time job... )

[the_foul_fowl]

More pics of Alto's:

http://www.toysdaily.com/discuz/thread-82831-1-1.html

While Ozma's is a pass for me, Alto's looks much better in these photos...

[SDF-ONE]

I found this size comparison on Toysdaily.

http://www.toysdaily.com/discuz/thread-82904-1-1.html

Edited December 28, 2008 by SDF-ONE

[badboy00z]

One more thing to add to the list: the holes for the shoulder missile add on. The super pack should've simply gave us a swappable plate.

[Graham]

OK, somebody asked for a size comparison of the Bandai 1/60 scale VF-25 with the Yamato 1/60 scale VF-0, so there's a photo of that below.

I've also posted a photo of the 1/60 scale Yamato VF-0 pilot sitting close to the Bandai 1/60 scale VF-25 pilot, so you can get a good idea of the size difference.

Lastly, somebody also asked for some pics of the VF-25 in fighter mode with wheels up and gunpod off, so there's a couple of pics of that as well.

Graham

[IXTL]

Another gallery of the 25F.

http://d.hatena.ne.jp/type97/20081226

[IXTL]

OK, somebody asked for a size comparison of the Bandai 1/60 scale VF-25 with the Yamato 1/60 scale VF-0, so there's a photo of that below.

I've also posted a photo of the 1/60 scale Yamato VF-0 pilot sitting close to the Bandai 1/60 scale VF-25 pilot, so you can get a good idea of the size difference.

Lastly, somebody also asked for some pics of the VF-25 in fighter mode with wheels up and gunpod off, so there's a couple of pics of that as well.

Graham

Thanks for the new pics Graham. One question, is the visor on the 25S clear green plastic or just painted on?

That pilot is really tiny. When the DX VF-25G is released, you could pretend the pilot is micloned Klan Klan (as seen in ep 25) instead of Michael. It'd be about the right size.

Edited December 28, 2008 by IXTL