Is Yamato too greedy?

[eugimon]

And you'll find the parts used in the Yamato valks in any model for that scale (Say 1/60 VF-1A) uses the same parts. All that's different between the different versions are their paint masks and plastic color. Remember Skyfire? New paintmask for the old 1/55. With Lego, they've got to maintain production facilities for hundreds of different parts. The 2X4 isn't the only Lego brick. And at least Lego has good QC. Have you ever had a lego fall apart? (Sets notwithstanding, as they do that. It's expected of them. What fun is a modular toy that you can't take apart?) Can you take a Lego 2X4 and snap it in half? A friction hinge with no friction is outrageous, and Lego agrees. QC starts from the minute they buy their molds. Each is measured with a micrometer. If the mold isn't within .2 millimeters of perfect, it's thrown out. This is why a Lego hinge has resistance.

Lego has 23 Properties. Of them, 13 are externally copyrighted/trademarked. Moving from there, more sets are made for the external properties than internal. Why? It sells better. Lego Star Wars is damn popular with the kids, and their parents, even more so. On the same token, a 25 year old is not very likely to buy a Lego City Airplane.

Yet, we see that Lego charges much less. If Lego made a Macross line, we'd have something GREAT!

It's just my belief, that based on other companies, Yamato overcharges, and is totally okay with it, because their customers are totally okay with it.

The point of distributed cost is that the price for developing a part gets displaced over all the units, over the entire service line of that brick. Yes, all the VF-1s are functionally the same but that left wing panel can only be the left wing panel for the VF-1. It can't be the left wing panel for the VF-0. However, the left wing on the a Lego Airlines set can be the left wing on the Lego Star Wars set, or the left wing on the Indiana Jones set or the left body panel on the pirate set or the left whatever they feel like it to be. That's the point. That part has myriad uses for myriad kits so the cost of that panel, gets distributed however many times it gets used in each kit by however many kits are sold for however many years it gets sold.

On the other hand, the left wing on the 1/48 has to pay for itself in far few number of units sold.

I don't even know where to begin with your comments whether or not I can snap a lego brick in half. I've seen plenty of SIMILARLY sized lego bricks to various yamato parts, break and distort under use. Of course my kids Duplo block is going to take more abuse, but that thin smooth brick used to make the slide rail for the MTT, not so much.

As for your number of lego properties:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Lego_themes

[SchizophrenicMC]

Put it to ya this way: Most of the CURRENT properties are external. Outdated and expired properties don't count. For example, what happened to Bandai's Macross properties between 7 and Frontier?

Similarly sized Yamato Components... Did you just say that? That's my entire point. Yamato parts break far more easily than legos of similar size. Some pieces aren't good enough to handle the strain, but overall... Overall, I keep hearing bad things about Yamatos breaking and I have over 16,000 Legos, 5 of which have broken over the last 12 years of collecting them.

And if all of this talk of components is moot, how about the pricing of QC? I mean, one would think Yamato's valks show how QC's been pushed aside for profit...

[eugimon]

Put it to ya this way: Most of the CURRENT properties are external. Outdated and expired properties don't count. For example, what happened to Bandai's Macross properties between 7 and Frontier?

Similarly sized Yamato Components... Did you just say that? That's my entire point. Yamato parts break far more easily than legos of similar size. Some pieces aren't good enough to handle the strain, but overall... Overall, I keep hearing bad things about Yamatos breaking and I have over 16,000 Legos, 5 of which have broken over the last 12 years of collecting them.

And if all of this talk of components is moot, how about the pricing of QC? I mean, one would think Yamato's valks show how QC's been pushed aside for profit...

" For example, what happened to Bandai's Macross properties between 7 and Frontier? "

EXACTLY MY POINT. Those 8 year old molds from the "7" license are at best rusting away in some factory or warehouse. There's not a SINGLE component used from the vf-19 to the vf-25. NOT A SINGLE part, okay, maybe the screws. However, other than some unique parts, like the broom on a harry potter kit, virtually 100% of the bricks from hairy potter can be repurposed for any other kit.

What? I can snap a lego rail just as easily as I could snap a yamato wing. more so cuz the yamato wing uses a softer plastic that bends while the lego is much more brittle and more likely to snap than bend.

As for lego's QC, my nephew's MTT has those little turret things and they pop right out when you try to pose them. That a design issue. If that happened on a yamato or bandai people here would be shitting up a storm. And actually, when Lego first opened up their factories there were lego fans up in arms in the reduced quality of the bricks.

As for your claim that lego kits are done by hand:

http://gizmodo.com/5022769/exclusive-inside-the-lego-factory

And here's Lego themselves talking about economies of scale and how it relates to them:

http://www.brothers-brick.com/2008/08/01/w...st-lego-prices/

Edited December 14, 2008 by eugimon

[SchizophrenicMC]

You know what? We're off-topic. I don't wanna be banned from another forum for being off-topic. My points:

Legos are cheaper

Legos don't break as easily

Yamato is too expensive

Yamato breaks a lot

Lemme put it to you this way: would you mind if Yamato REDUCED their prices? If you would, you got problems, dude.

[eugimon]

You know what? We're off-topic. I don't wanna be banned from another forum for being off-topic. My points:

Legos are cheaper

Legos don't break as easily

Yamato is too expensive

Yamato breaks a lot

Lemme put it to you this way: would you mind if Yamato REDUCED their prices? If you would, you got problems, dude.

legos are cheaper, yes, but it's apples to oranges

legos don't break easier, a flat piece of lego ABS will break just as easily a flat piece of yamato ABS

yamatos are too expensive, if you can afford a 500 dollar millenium falcon, you can afford a 200 dollar yf-21

yamato breaks a lot, your mileage may very, there are people here like myria, scream man, kensei who have had very few if any problems with their yamatos, but yes, I would agree that yamato needs better QC.

that argument is rather weak. Would I mind if any company reduced their prices? lol.

Edited December 14, 2008 by eugimon

[do not disturb]

another fine example of making mountains out of mole hills.

it wouldn't be MW any other way!

[VFTF1]

Oh pish posh. I found Eugimon and Schizophrenic MC's little debate to be very interesting and enlightening. Nothing wrong with some good old fashioned back and forth, and both of them were not being mean or anything but giving very well reasoned arguments.

Be that as it may - I would like to change my opinion on one matter that I wrote about earlier: namely, I wrote that it is not possible to really lambast "greed" because people greedily wanting money encourages them to try their best to satisfy the needs of others in order to get that money.

In light of Toynami's recently basically black mailing BBTS to stop selling Yamato products (not that it effect me personally as I don't live in the USA) is an instant where greed prompts someone to muscle out competition and muscle in their sub par way over priced product.

In light of this - whatever you might think of Yamato and the price of its' products - I think you'll agree that you should be free to choose whether to buy or not to buy from them.

Toynami and HG are the real greedy ones here - their greed is so overwhelming that rather than focus on making a good product, they simply focus on using litigation to push their product to the detriment of others - that is a type of greed that does not serve anybody, particularly you as consumers.

And Yamato isn't engaged in that type of greed - to their credit.

Pete

[boota]

You wanna talk about greed, there are many ways to look at it... Yamato's slipshot quality is one form of greed, HG/Toynami's is another. What HG/Toynami is doing to Yamato... the way I see it, is two greedy bast@rds ganging up to lay a smackdown on another greedy fool... I like that... Yamato has no choice but to do better for real this time. Their gravy train is coming to a stop. Serves them right.

[Aurelin Hawk]

Put it to ya this way: Most of the CURRENT properties are external. Outdated and expired properties don't count. For example, what happened to Bandai's Macross properties between 7 and Frontier?

Similarly sized Yamato Components... Did you just say that? That's my entire point. Yamato parts break far more easily than legos of similar size. Some pieces aren't good enough to handle the strain, but overall... Overall, I keep hearing bad things about Yamatos breaking and I have over 16,000 Legos, 5 of which have broken over the last 12 years of collecting them.

And if all of this talk of components is moot, how about the pricing of QC? I mean, one would think Yamato's valks show how QC's been pushed aside for profit...

I know all about them breaking: I'm curently trying to repair my vf-1s 1/48!!!

I'm not impressed with yamato's quality, and with the price they are charging, I think their product should be better than that. So I'm going to have to go with greed. JMHO.

[VFTF1]

You wanna talk about greed, there are many ways to look at it... Yamato's slipshot quality is one form of greed, HG/Toynami's is another. What HG/Toynami is doing to Yamato... the way I see it, is two greedy bast@rds ganging up to lay a smackdown on another greedy fool... I like that... Yamato has no choice but to do better for real this time. Their gravy train is coming to a stop. Serves them right

But there's a big difference between making a product and then "greedily" charging a high price versus making a product and then telling retailers and consumers that if they don't buy EXCLUSSIVELY your product, then they will get in legal trouble, particularly if your "rights" to this product are based on fairly flimsy legal claims.

I'm just saying that Yamato doesn't force people to buy their products, whereas Toynami clearly is not even going to let you have a choice.

So Yamato could improve a million times over and it apparently won't make a difference.

Besides - please note that if it were legal in the USA to sell Macross Yamato valkyrie then the price would be lower. If Yamato could establish legal distribution centers in the USA, then its' products would be cheaper because the cost of transportation would be spread out over an enormous amount of goods which Yamato itself would just ship to the USA without having smaller retailers compelled to do it, or even individual customers.

So really - Americans should be blaming HG for the high price of Yamato, because HG is not even allowing Yamato to get a foothold to just COMPETE in America.

Finally - please note that Yamato DOES make superior products. Just because a few of them have QC problems can't possibly be the basis for suggesting that the entire range of their products for Macross are inferior.

Just take any valkyrie without QC problems and compare it to what Toynami put out for obscene prices as "Masterpiece Robotech."

It's absurd to suggest that a fully good condition 1/48 or 1/60 fighter from Yamato is in any way inferior to Toynami's stuff - this is not even a matter of 'preference' or 'subjectivity.'

After all - look - I understand that you can't compare the Bandai Chunky Munkys to the Yammies - the Chunkys are old models from decades past that are still around because people have sentimental attachments to them. It's therefore of course pointless to say "boy that Bandai VF-1S is terrible compared to Yammies" - since you just can't make the comparisson. Bandai wasn't able to make it more accurate back then, and it's selling the old one because people want the old one.

But Toynami makes something that they claim is a Masterpiece. It's called the blasted Masterpiece Robotech series. These things retail for between 75 and 150 USD.

Have you ever compared them side by side? I have. I owned Toynamis Masterpiece VF-1S and compared it to my Yamato VF-1J 1/48 stealth VERY carefully.

Toynami's "Masterpiece" (which costs pretty much as much as a Yamato v.2 1/60):

1) Has ugly swing bars

2) Has hands that just stick out of the back in fighter mode rather than being covered by panels with vents

3) Is missing most of the pannel lines and details of the Yamato

4) Doesn't come with super and strike parts and in fact Toynami NEVER even issued any of them for their "Masterpieces"

5) Doesn't have poseability at the waste like a Yamato

6) In fact has far less poseability in the legs and arms than a Yamato

7) The "chest" sticks up over the cockpit in fighter mode.

There are sooo many things wrong with it.

This would be fine if this was just Toynami's line of old VF-1S "Veritechs" - it would not be a problem if Toynami was just trying to make some knock off figures to capitalize on the line, or if, like Bandai with Macross 7, they aimed to market them to little kids who would be like "wow! that's cool!" and really wouldn't care THAT much for the details.

But Toynami called them "Masterpiece" - suggesting that these are somehow top of the line. They were aimed at collectors. They were meant to embody the very best in that particular design.

And they failed - not just a little, not because of shoddy QC causing 1 out of 10 fighters to havea flaw - no - they failed in the stage of conception. They were shoddy and rushed and more work was put into a beautiful box for a really lousy figure.

And now they'll be forcing that figure down consumers' throats.

That's greedy - that's not productive greedy, that's just bad greedy.

In fact - this situatiion and polls like this just make me feel like Yamato should raise their prices to spite some people. I seriously think that Yamato is a good thing for fans. Yeah - it's expensive - but not as exclussive as Studio Half Eye and - as Graham's gallery of the old 1/72 vs the SHE version of the YF-21 shows - even surpassing SHE in many respects) - Yamato is trying, as far as I can see to make perfect beautiful figures and mass produce them in affordable prices for a niche market.

They are trying to do something which SHOULDN'T WORK and they are making it work. That's cool. We are getting better and better Valkyrie as the years go by and the real value/price is not going up in terms of how much that money could purchase today vs. say - how much it could purchase when the 1/72s came out.

Pete

[ff95gj]

I incline to agree with you...

Yamato has problem on QCs, but you can choose to buy it or not, and they do have the after sales service to fix the parts.

Toynami, on the other hand, is trying to take away your choices.

Oh pish posh. I found Eugimon and Schizophrenic MC's little debate to be very interesting and enlightening. Nothing wrong with some good old fashioned back and forth, and both of them were not being mean or anything but giving very well reasoned arguments.

Be that as it may - I would like to change my opinion on one matter that I wrote about earlier: namely, I wrote that it is not possible to really lambast "greed" because people greedily wanting money encourages them to try their best to satisfy the needs of others in order to get that money.

In light of Toynami's recently basically black mailing BBTS to stop selling Yamato products (not that it effect me personally as I don't live in the USA) is an instant where greed prompts someone to muscle out competition and muscle in their sub par way over priced product.

In light of this - whatever you might think of Yamato and the price of its' products - I think you'll agree that you should be free to choose whether to buy or not to buy from them.

Toynami and HG are the real greedy ones here - their greed is so overwhelming that rather than focus on making a good product, they simply focus on using litigation to push their product to the detriment of others - that is a type of greed that does not serve anybody, particularly you as consumers.

And Yamato isn't engaged in that type of greed - to their credit.

Pete

[jenius]

Ugh, it's really come to this old debate. No one disagrees that HG holds the license outside of Japan for merchandise for the original Macross. That means it's totally in their rights to insist people include them in any profits made on Macross merchandise outside of Japan (again, related to the original show). To sit their and make it sound like they're bad guys for insisting they get what they paid for when they acquired the license is wrong. The reason this is affecting you is because BW and HG can't come to any sort of agreement. HG would love to have all that merchandise in Japan being sold here under the Robotech name but BW refuses to work with HG (for valid reasons). Where HG screwed up, and created the hostile environment with BW, is when then started claiming all derivative Macross works as falling under the original agreement. That was a ham-fisted, bone-headed, and greedy move... but it doesn't suddenly invalidate their rights to the original Macross show and merchandise. If all they're trying to do is get BBTS to stop selling original Macross show toys then that's something BBTS should have always known could happen.

[VF5SS]

I know all about them breaking: I'm curently trying to repair my vf-1s 1/48!!!

I'm not impressed with yamato's quality, and with the price they are charging, I think their product should be better than that. So I'm going to have to go with greed. JMHO.

If you lived in Japan you would have access to free replacement parts.

[VFTF1]

No one disagrees that HG holds the license outside of Japan for merchandise for the original Macross.

I still don't understand the legal basis of this contention? From what I understand, courts in the USA have claimed that HG holds the license for merchandise for the original Macross in the USA, while courts in Japan have claimed otherwise for Japan. Has there also been an international arbitrage settlement or case whereby HG was given these rights?

HG would love to have all that merchandise in Japan being sold here under the Robotech name

That's really the problem, as I see it, because there are people in America who would love to see all that merchandise being sold under the...Macross name. And people who would love to see figures packaged and called Ichijo Hikaru and Kakizake rather than Rick and Ben.

I know that initially, this might sound silly - but why should collectors who simply prefer the original Japanese Macross not be allowed to make that choice for themselves?

No one is saying that Toynami/HG/Robotech should be banished from the Earth. All I'm saying is that it would be fair, since these are essentially two seperate franchises and two completely separate universes - if people were free to choose which one they prefer.

In business NO BODY likes taking the "legal route." It's just bad business. It costs a lot. It leaves a very ugly stain on a company - you get a reputation for being litiguous rather than amiable to developing business solutions.

Yet HG still insists on litigation over negotiation.

Finally - what would it look like to have Yamato products brought to the USA under the banner of "Robotech?" If I were still living in America - I WOULDN'T BUY THEM.

Why?

Because I like Macross. Because I want my Macross box to say DYRL Macross on it. Because I want it to say Ichijo Hikaru and not Rick Hunter - because I am a Macross fan.

Why can't Macross fans in America be free to enjoy the original Macross and its' merchandise?

Transformers fans can purchase Takara Masterpiece Starscream rather than Hasbro's recolor. They can purchase MP-01 or 04 Convoy instead of Hasbro's 25th anniversary.

Why can't Macross fans also be free to choose?

I think it's just really unfair to be bashing Yamato for being "greedy" when a company like HG and Toynami don't even give you the dignity of being able to make a choice for yourself and simply try to stick Robotech products in your face and basicaly tell you:

"Either you repeat after me: Rick Hunter, Rick Hunter, Rick Hunter - or you have to move to Japan." - which is basically what HG is saying - now THAT is greedy.

Yamato is not greedy.

Pete

[boota]

VFTF1, I'm not taking sides. All this "bad" news is simply telling me that I'll either get a damn good quality 1st release Yamato product, or I'll get to save my money for something else. Other than that, I get nothing out of rationalizing for any of them.

[Aurelin Hawk]

If you lived in Japan you would have access to free replacement parts.

That would be wonderful! I need a heat shield, cockpit landing gear doors, and alerons for my mech, which is a vf-1s Roy .

Now, to convince Yamato I live in Japan.....

domo arigato mr roboto...

Edited December 15, 2008 by Aurelin Hawk

[edwin3060]

That would be wonderful! I need a heat shield, cockpit landing gear doors, and alerons for my mech, which is a vf-1s Roy .

Now, to convince Yamato I live in Japan.....

domo arigato mr roboto...

Wait-- does the cost of getting replacement parts through places like Overdrive include the cost of the parts themselves or just the cost of shipping+ admin fee from Overdrive?

[jenius]

If you lived in Japan you would probably get your parts directly from Yamato (like US people did when the Garland broke). So if you're getting your stuff through Overdrive the service isn't really comparable.

Pete, Robotech exists because HG got the "international" (meaning not in Japan) rights to the original Macross series. This means anything from the original Macross series outside of Japan should fly the Robotech banner. This part of the story is just about the only thing that isn't disputed. All of the court cases and such that have happened since revolve around things like derivative works, concept rights, etc. and those cases have shown that HG had no rights to any concepts or derivatives(sequels) of the Macross universe. All the litigation angered all parties so now they refuse to work together. Still, anything from the original Macross series is now, and has always been since the invention of Robotech, a license of Harmony Gold outside of Japan (although if you wanted to be a real litigator bad ass you might argue they've asserted their right inconsistently in some regions...).

[VFTF1]

Not to totally derail the thread - but who has the authority or jurisdiction to grant HG "international" rights outside of Japan? I understand US courts granting these rights within the United States, but what if someone in a third country wanted to promote the specifically Japanese part of Macross, which of course includes things from SDFM TV?

Is the whole world expected to put on blinders and pretend that Macross doesn't exist because some court in theUS ruled it? I know that there are international treatises which govern copyright law - however to my knowledge, each country or multi-country legal entity prefers to judge such matters within its' own specific legal system. Barring that, there is also something called the international Arbitrage court which is an extra-legal institution, a gentleman's agreement of sorts where big companies agree to go to iron out such cases which is a much less threatening and more businesslike way of doing things. If HG went through this second route, then I could see how they could claim international distribution rights - but if it's just a US court which says so...then I don't see it.

And last point/question: There is such a thing in law - at least in Europe - as a cultural good which is the common property of all people. For example - if I want to put on a play about Biblical figures, I don't need to buy a license from the Vatican to do so. If I want to make a garage kit of a World War II B-52 bomber, I don't need to call Lockheed Martin and get their permission. If I want to put on a musical interpretation of Winnie The Pooh, I don't need to consult the script with Disney. If I want to write a theatrical interpreation of Hamlet and then have it performed, I don't need to find the heirs of Shakespeare's estate to put on my personal interpretation of his play. etc.

I do understand that this view has its' limits - but copyright law is actually not as cut and dry as it sometimes seems (and I'm speaking as someone who owns the copyright to a bunch of published works - ergo who has a seemingly vested interest in a more conservative interpretation of copyright than the one I presented above) - yet even I recognize that in this world, once you mass market and mass produce something - of course you CAN claim copyright infringement whenever someone starts using the thing in a way that you don't like - but there is also the issue of other people's rights to enjoy the thing that you have put out there for them - that has gotten into their consciousness.

Are we criminals for liking Macross? Should everything fly the Robotech banner? Do we all have to move to Japan because we prefer the original Macross?

I think that if HG were smart, they would focus on expanding their property and doing something creative with Robotech. Yamato could have whined and complained and said "boo hoo we won't make any Macross figures because we can't sell them outside of Japan and that limits our market and it's too risky and yaddee yaddee yadee da" - but instead they just went ahead and did it. Meanwhile all HG seems to have done is litigate and try to secure their market not through the quality of their product, but using the law.

They might be within their rights, but they aren't doing what's right - in my opinion.

If anything, this is just a good example of why people need to sit down and re-think copyright laws and reconsider them because we live in a global society (sorry to be so cliche).

This isn't 1982. It's not like only 4 people and their Japanese cousin are going to know about Macross while everyone else will just eat up Robotech even if it' s garbage, and it's not like you can litigate away people's right to watch youtube, to borrow films, to hold open discussions and to trade information about art works (I think Yammies are art).

So - from a practical business level I think this is bad business for HG (proven by the dismal performance of Robotech over the years), and also, in theory - it doesn't hold water.

And it's truly greedy - unlike what Yamato does.

[Aurelin Hawk]

Not to totally derail the thread - but who has the authority or jurisdiction to grant HG "international" rights outside of Japan? I understand US courts granting these rights within the United States, but what if someone in a third country wanted to promote the specifically Japanese part of Macross, which of course includes things from SDFM TV?

Is the whole world expected to put on blinders and pretend that Macross doesn't exist because some court in theUS ruled it? I know that there are international treatises which govern copyright law - however to my knowledge, each country or multi-country legal entity prefers to judge such matters within its' own specific legal system. Barring that, there is also something called the international Arbitrage court which is an extra-legal institution, a gentleman's agreement of sorts where big companies agree to go to iron out such cases which is a much less threatening and more businesslike way of doing things. If HG went through this second route, then I could see how they could claim international distribution rights - but if it's just a US court which says so...then I don't see it.

And last point/question: There is such a thing in law - at least in Europe - as a cultural good which is the common property of all people. For example - if I want to put on a play about Biblical figures, I don't need to buy a license from the Vatican to do so. If I want to make a garage kit of a World War II B-52 bomber, I don't need to call Lockheed Martin and get their permission. If I want to put on a musical interpretation of Winnie The Pooh, I don't need to consult the script with Disney. If I want to write a theatrical interpreation of Hamlet and then have it performed, I don't need to find the heirs of Shakespeare's estate to put on my personal interpretation of his play. etc.

I do understand that this view has its' limits - but copyright law is actually not as cut and dry as it sometimes seems (and I'm speaking as someone who owns the copyright to a bunch of published works - ergo who has a seemingly vested interest in a more conservative interpretation of copyright than the one I presented above) - yet even I recognize that in this world, once you mass market and mass produce something - of course you CAN claim copyright infringement whenever someone starts using the thing in a way that you don't like - but there is also the issue of other people's rights to enjoy the thing that you have put out there for them - that has gotten into their consciousness.

Are we criminals for liking Macross? Should everything fly the Robotech banner? Do we all have to move to Japan because we prefer the original Macross?

I think that if HG were smart, they would focus on expanding their property and doing something creative with Robotech. Yamato could have whined and complained and said "boo hoo we won't make any Macross figures because we can't sell them outside of Japan and that limits our market and it's too risky and yaddee yaddee yadee da" - but instead they just went ahead and did it. Meanwhile all HG seems to have done is litigate and try to secure their market not through the quality of their product, but using the law.

They might be within their rights, but they aren't doing what's right - in my opinion.

If anything, this is just a good example of why people need to sit down and re-think copyright laws and reconsider them because we live in a global society (sorry to be so cliche).

This isn't 1982. It's not like only 4 people and their Japanese cousin are going to know about Macross while everyone else will just eat up Robotech even if it' s garbage, and it's not like you can litigate away people's right to watch youtube, to borrow films, to hold open discussions and to trade information about art works (I think Yammies are art).

So - from a practical business level I think this is bad business for HG (proven by the dismal performance of Robotech over the years), and also, in theory - it doesn't hold water.

And it's truly greedy - unlike what Yamato does.

you have a point. Robotech is garbage, and I like the storyline from macross better.

I think what's really at issue here is how hard it is for us in the states and other places to get honest-to -goodness macross stuff. i still think yamato could improve it's QC though.

[jenius]

Why is this complicated at all? Tatsunoko, a Japanese company acquired the rights from BW for helping finance the Macross TV show. Tats then sold those international rights to HG to recoup their investment. There's no evil international henchmen here... it was a pretty straight forward business deal that granted HG international rights to Macross.

EDIT - it's kind of ironic in a thread about the greed of a Japanese company (and whether or not they are greedy) to infer that HG is evil and greedy and that Macross should fall under "fair use" laws. None of it adds up. There's still clearly money to be made on the license, licenses that are fairly owned both within and without Japan.

Edited December 15, 2008 by jenius

[Roger]

My points:

Legos are cheaper

Legos don't break as easily

Yamato is too expensive

Yamato breaks a lot

My points:

Raw fruits and vegetables are cheaper

Raw fruits and vegetables are better for you

Red Lobster is expensive

Red Lobster is worse for you

Thank you.

[Roger]

Regarding the original topic:

do you think they are too greedy with their prices? simple poll...you can post why or why not

For everyone who votes "yes," I'd love to know if they think they're greedy when they ask for more money in exchange for their own time, effort, and resources. I want to see them at their next review and tell their manager, "You know, I've been asking for too much money, so next year I'm going to do the same job for less."

;p

[jenius]

For everyone who votes "yes," I'd love to know if they think they're greedy when they ask for more money in exchange for their own time, effort, and resources.

I'll bet their answer would hinge on whether or not the people who paid for their services were left with useless pieces of broken plastic and little else to show for it...

[Roger]

I'll bet their answer would hinge on whether or not the people who paid for their services were left with useless pieces of broken plastic and little else to show for it...

Maybe if they worked at a recycling center? ;p

[SchizophrenicMC]

Maybe if they worked at a recycling center? ;p

Except a Yammie uses too dense plastic to recycle...

[Roger]

Except a Yammie uses too dense plastic to recycle...

Then it shouldn't break, should it?

[jenius]

That kind of thinking might just blow your mind.

[SchizophrenicMC]

Except density doesn't mean strength.

For example, have you ever snapped a plastic bottle in half? Yet it's WAY less dense than a shoulder on a Yammie and it's recyclable.

On the other hand, the price is kinda worth it because Yammies aren't partsformers.

[Roger]

I really don't understand what you're trying to say here. Yamato Valkyries should be made of recyclable materials? Why?

[m0n5t3r]

poll asking for YES or NO =

debates about personal opinions???

debates about legos vs yammies???

debates about plastic???

and now... a looming debate about recycling??? LOL

Edited December 15, 2008 by m0n5t3r

[eugimon]

Except a Yammie uses too dense plastic to recycle...

lol, and hydrogen peroxide is a base right.

[SchizophrenicMC]

And Eugene is a prick....

[eugimon]

And Eugene is a prick....

both POM and ABS is readily recyclable. You should pay more attention in school. you certainly whine enough about it, maybe you should try to get something useful out of your experience there.

Edited December 16, 2008 by eugimon

[SchizophrenicMC]

both POM and ABS is readily recyclable. You should pay more attention in school. you certainly whine enough about it, maybe you should try to get something useful out of your experience there.

Recyclable: Yes! Easily or practically so: No. ABS and POM fall under the category of the denser types of plastic not suitable for recycle. More common plastics like polyethylene terephtalate and HD Polyethylene are what is easily recycled. ABS and POM fall under plastic classification 7, as in other plastics. While recyclable, they are harder to do so than is economically feasible. It costs too much to recycle ABS, so it's not practiced commonly. In fact, Class 3(PVC) and higher are generally picked out of recyclable rubbish and thrown out, due to their difficulty of recycle.

Not only that, but bringing ABS too high above melting point will cause it to burst into intense flames. Polyethylene plastics, though they do burn, burn slower and cooler. Add to that the fact that thermoplastics, in general, are not good for subsequent melting, as the polymers degrade and the resulting plastic is more brittle.

Moving on, though, this is about how Yamato is believed or not believed to be charging too much for their products. And a perfect example is the 1/60 VF-0 series. They are roughly the same size as the VF-1 1/48s, yet they cost much more. Similar size, smaller design process (Anything with a pre-rendered 3D model is), and a higher cost.

And besides the cost of production, do YOU wanna pay $200 for a toy that breaks? I know I don't.