Official Bandai 1/60 Scale DX Toy Thread Ver.2

[Sumdumgai]

Bandai has had a while to work on the VF-25 toy. Hell they even pushed the release date to work on it more.

The subject of the 1/100 Yamato VF-0 vs the 1/100 Bandai VF-25 is a good point. Yamato realized they were going to release a POS that was a bad representation of the VF-0, so they scrapped it and made the 1/60 VF-0.

I'm not defending the f$ck ups that Yamato have done in QC and broken shoulders. They have been and continue to deserve all the grilling they get from irate owners of busted valkyries. They screwed up big time on the 1/60 VF-1 v2 shoulders. But Yamato's problems aren't the issue here, Bandai and the VF-25 is the issue.

I brought up Yamato as an example of what can be done by a smaller company with less resources in terms of looks. Bandai is a giant with a lot more resources and experience in toys. Bandai should be able to engineer something better than they've put out, experience in valkyries or not. They've made other transforming toys before and they've made buttloads of mecha. And with all the experience that Bandai has, they should be able to engineer and sculpt something better at a lower cost than it would take Yamato through all their baby-steps and growing pains.

Bandai is not Yamato, they should be able to do as good or better in terms of looks, better in durability, and should kick the crap out of Yamato in terms of QC. A lot of Bandai fans thought that they would, and were so vocal about it before we got pics of what was being planned for release. Then they went really quiet or started comparing the unknown sturdiness of the new toy to Yamato's failures.

And though Yamato isn't the only company to choose from anymore when it comes to valkyries, guess what? Bandai has the monopoly on Macross Frontier. If you want a VF-25 in toy or model form, they're the ONLY game in town.

It is refreshing to see the 1/100 line coming out with other valkyries so we get an alternative to Yamato with other non-Frontier valkyries.

Edited November 3, 2008 by Sumdumgai

[Graham]

I’m curious as to what is Bandai’s intended demographic for the 1/60 DX?

You would think that with a ¥12,000 retail price point (on the medium-end for collectables), it’s not pre-teen kids and probably not high school kids either. Also, with Frontier airing late at night, it’s never likely that kids were the intended market anyway.

So, IMO it’s likely that either adult Macross/Macross Frontier fans with disposable income, or adult mecha toy collectors who like the VF-25 and have disposable income are Bandai’s target.

I’m really curious to know what Macross fans and toy collectors are saying on Japanese boards and whether their comments mirror ours? Or is their opinion of the DX overwhelmingly positive

Graham

[drifand]

I think the closest thing to compare the Bandai DX Chogokin VF-25, in order to see their way of doing things, is the previous DX Chogokin Aquarion. That one was a Kawamori design as well and has quite a few fans of the intricate multi-mode transformation system (though I do not like it). That toy was 'Deluxe' in size, gimmicks, detailing and engineering, but certainly not to the extent of being a 'displayable finished-model' ala Yamato's CAD-era offerings. If anything, that is what distinguishes the two companies' output: Bandai makes toys differently from models; Yamato makes completed models that fall short of being 'toys'.

Those are the facts, whatever we may wish differently from Bandai (or Yamato, for the matter).

So... I think the DX VF-25 was made for folks who don't want the fragility of a completed model, but do enjoy the deluxeness of size and playability. Could it have been 'better' than what we're getting? Probably, but it's a moot point.

[badboy00z]

Well they need to set that bar higher for quality. They are oft compared as being the David that brought down Goliath(Bandai) with regards to accuracy of Macross toys, yet whenever the durability/sturdiness is brought up, the whole "they are a smaller company" defense is brought up. With the new 1/60 VF-1S they came so f**king close and yes I have even said that they are a smaller company in their defense. Now obviously it costs a lot for them to even make a valkyrie of high accuracy, but why isn't some of that money being spent towards durability or at least competent factory workers who don't make stupid mistakes? This is the case of having one over the other and there is no excuse. Making a toy more durable is a lot easier than making something highly accurate. Does anyone really mean to tell me that the broken VF-0S arms, the BP8, the breaking 1/60 shoulders, and many other various parts over the years were more expensive to prevent than taking the time to make something very accurate to it's onscreen counterpart and perfect variable? I would think Yamato broke more sweat and banks trying to figure out how to make the new 1/60 look more TV accurate and better in all three modes than than coming up with a more durable shoulder hinge. Designing a durable hinge is not as expensive as spending an assload of time and resources on making something accurate and perfect variable. A simple change of materials might even help the 1/60 shoulder hinge, as it would have on the BP8 and others. Hell a simple change of materials IS what made the difference between the TAB B on the 1st 1/72 YF-19, and the 1.5. Some may say that part was overlooked for the sake of concentrating on accuracy. That to me, would be a stupid oversight.

If having one over the other is no excuse then why did Bandai give us this thing that resembles a VF-25? Surely a bigger company can do both but they took the easy way put and just went with it being durable (which is still unknown). Yamato's selling point is their accuracy. If they made their toys more durable and less accurate, that would go against their selling point. Sure it would be more balanced but it would make it just a mediocre product with no selling point.

If all of Yamato's valks had the ugly proportions of the DX VF-25 and was more durable, would people be happy?? Their accuracy is what makes fans want to buy them. If their products were less accurate and their QC problems were unknown, would the same amount of people buy them?

When I get a model whether it's a toy or kit, I want it to LOOK like what I see on the show. And since QC problems are often times unknown until you get it, the product has to look damn awesome for me to be interested and buy it in the first place. If it doesn't look like what I want I simply won't buy it regardless if it was indestructible.

[drifand]

If having one over the other is no excuse then why did Bandai give us this thing that resembles a VF-25? Surely a bigger company can do both but they took the easy way put and just went with it being durable (which is still unknown). Yamato's selling point is their accuracy. If they made their toys more durable and less accurate, that would go against their selling point. Sure it would be more balanced but it would make it just a mediocre product with no selling point.

The point is: Bandai's overall business strategy explicitely separates 'accurate models' from 'playable toys'. Like Graham was wondering out loud: this toy is obviously NOT for folks who want a 'completed display model' ala Yamato, but more for those who prefer large-size gimmicked-out TOYS.

If all of Yamato's valks had the ugly proportions of the DX VF-25 and was more durable, would people be happy?? Their accuracy is what makes fans want to buy them. If their products were less accurate and their QC problems were unknown, would the same amount of people buy them?

Again, some fans here have been more than happy with what Yamato has been doing despite (or in spite) of the QC problems. Quid pro quo: there is a 'small but significant' group of fans who are turned-off by Yamato's shortcomings. For Yamato to win over the nay-crowd, they need to maintain their famed 'accuracy' with a substantially better QC record.

When I get a model whether it's a toy or kit, I want it to LOOK like what I see on the show. And since QC problems are often times unknown until you get it, the product has to look damn awesome for me to be interested and buy it in the first place. If it doesn't look like what I want I simply won't buy it regardless if it was indestructible.

As you have pointed out, it IS a very personal decision. Both companies' products target a different kind of collector, and neither seems interested in treading into the other's territory. We just have to live with it, whether it's 'inaccuracies' on one hand, or 'fragility' on the other.

[Graham]

Reviewing some of the older photos and I find it encouraging that in some of them the Ozma VF-25S does appear to have the head extended.

Graham

[badboy00z]

But with QC issues unknown, wouldn't you want the toy to look like what is shown on the show in the first place?

[anime52k8]

But with QC issues unknown, wouldn't you want the toy to look like what is shown on the show in the first place?

have you ever considered that maybe, just maybe, some people don't care if it looks EXACTLY like how it does in the show? or that some people would prefer that it to be a bit bulkier than it was rendered in the anime? or that someone who's never seen the show would see this in a store and think"hey, this looks cool!"

it looks enough like what's in the show to be recognizable, and for some people that's fine. bandai is selling these to the people who fall under these aforementioned conditions. if you're not one of them, then this isn't the toy for you, buy the model kit, or the 1/100th, or just move on and wait for something better.

[badboy00z]

Well then I guess it's fine for people who don't like the original design.

[MasterOfPuppets]

Bandai are offering the 1/60 DX VF-25F and VF-25S for 12,000 Yen, which is 4,800 Yen cheaper than the similar size Yamato VF-0 and 6,800 Yen cheaper than the similar size Yamato 1/60 YF-19. This is great for consumers in these troubled economic times.

I remember many people rejoiced when the cost of the VF-25 was announced. However, obviously, the cheaper price means some corners have been cut and we are not getting quite the same level of features, accuracy and gimmicks as we have been used to from Yamato. I think many of us need to move on and learn to accept this.

I guess at the lower price point, it's unreasonable to expect as many feature and gimmicks compared with the Yamato offerings. This cheaper price point is obviously why we are not getting things such as translucent nose sensors or nose verniors made of separate pieces of plastic, which are par for the course for Yamato. Instead on the Bandai they are just engraved on. The cheaper price is probably also the reason for things like the cheap looking landing gear and the incorrect 'one-type-fits all' chest plates, instead on the individually sculpted chest plates.

On the plus side, according to the Japanese press, we will be getting a higher level of durability. And from the pics so far, it does seem like Bandai have included all the panel lines from the line art, which is a good thing.

I do still hold though that the designers could easily have made a more anime accurate looking toy, without increasing cost and probably without sacrificing durability. It does seem that the chunkiness and downward droopiness of the nose was a deliberate design choice, rather than a necessity.

Anyway, while I'll probably never love the toy, I am trying had to learn to at least like it based on the latest GA Graphics photos.

Not a hater, was just expecting better from Bandai.

Graham

I've yet to chime in on the discussion/hate on Bandai's VF-25 but what Graham has said here is exactly how a feel about the situation.

I just started watching Macross F recently and expectantly I want VF-25 now that is in scale the rest of my Valks or Valks to be. When I look at the DX, then the 1/72 model, then the show and line art I'm just kinda bummed about the DX. Bandai already made an incredible looking and perfect transformation (except fists) VF-25 in a smaller scale. I don't see any reason why they couldn't have taken the same design and modified it for a larger scale which would undeniably give them more flexibility to do things like make the fists part of the perfect transformation. It boggles my mind how anyone can argue against this. Bandai has made an awesome $45 VF-25. I would gladly pay $120 for the same design but larger, more durable and completed out of the box and it seems the market that Bandai is trying to tap into would as well. It's just a shame.

The current VF-25 doesn't look ugly, it just doesn't look as cool as the model that Bandai has already made is all. The only problem I see with this is that it would completely defeat the purpose of the model which I disagree with. A model leaves a lot more flexibility, freedom to a modeler and customization options at a much smaller cost (not to mention smaller scale which gives consumers more choices for size). A 1/60 figure that looked the same as the model at the current DX price would be for those that aren't in the modeler crowd and it would definitely yield less bitching.

I also didn't realize that because something is considered a large scale collectors toy that it isn't allowed to look as nice as it's smaller model counterpart which is proportionally cheaper. Nor did I realize that making proportions wonky made development costs cheaper when you already have a perfectly good design to use that could be up scaled and adjusted slightly to add more features in a larger product.

Meh, I'm tempted to get this VF-25 because I love the design of the mecha. But I think I'll wait a couple years before I dive and hope that my options for an accurate, durable and in scale VF-25 increases. Who knows, maybe Bandai will pull a "Renewal" version out of their ass like they do for some Chogokin's that just weren't right the first time around. Doubtful, but sometimes false hope is better than no hope at all.

[mr.chogokin]

Maybe Bandai's VF25 is a little different now but they have the wisdom to use sturdy materials, so if they ever fine-tune this design later things will look nowhere but up! If they don't well... I don't think they'll be any other VF25 version to best this one... unless Yamato secretly makes one to console themselves.

[David Hingtgen]

IMHO, the *defining* feature of the VF-25 is how skinny it is. (So as to accomodate full armor yet not look like the Stay-Puft Marshmallow man that the VF-1, VF-0, and VF-11 do). I believe that was Kawamori's stated goal/intention/reason for the -25's appearance. If it's not skinny--it doesn't look like a VF-25.

(you have to admit, it's incredibly generic-looking in fighter mode, so battroid mode has to be the defining feature)

[badboy00z]

Maybe Bandai's VF25 is a little different now but they have the wisdom to use sturdy materials, so if they ever fine-tune this design later things will look nowhere but up! If they don't well... I don't think they'll be any other VF25 version to best this one... unless Yamato secretly makes one to console themselves.

I wonder if licensing allows prototyping things and making actual toys and showing the public? I think it would be ok if they don't ever sell it right?

[Getsuga Tenshou]

During my hobby shop hopping in Akihabara, I was able to see these VF-25s on display in some stores. To be quite frank, I would rather shell out more $$$$ for a more detailed and cool looking Yamato Valkyrie toy than buy the VF-25.

Im just starting up my macross valkyrie hobby collection and so far I have the YF-19 with Fold and fast pack and the Sv-51 nora. I wouldnt want to put the Bandai VF-25 beside those Yamato beauties. That's just me though.

[miriya]

During my hobby shop hopping in Akihabara, I was able to see these VF-25s on display in some stores. To be quite frank, I would rather shell out more $$ for a more detailed and cool looking Yamato Valkyrie toy than buy the VF-25.

Im just starting up my macross valkyrie hobby collection and so far I have the YF-19 with Fold and fast pack and the Sv-51 nora. I wouldnt want to put the Bandai VF-25 beside those Yamato beauties. That's just me though.

Its not just you though.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I’m curious as to what is Bandai’s intended demographic for the 1/60 DX?

You would think that with a ¥12,000 retail price point (on the medium-end for collectables), it’s not pre-teen kids and probably not high school kids either. Also, with Frontier airing late at night, it’s never likely that kids were the intended market anyway.

So, IMO it’s likely that either adult Macross/Macross Frontier fans with disposable income, or adult mecha toy collectors who like the VF-25 and have disposable income are Bandai’s target.

The target market is probably the adults who want a toy to play with that will not break, for accuracy it is obvious a lot of them are going for the plamo, it's already been said that there are people who want something to play with other than the kit(which is not supposed to be played with). The plamo market is huge in japan, for us outside japan it really isn't for Macross, as most Macross fans on this forum would want a toy rather than a model, so it might boil down to perception, the japanese market willing to get a model if they want accuracy and not minding a toy that can be played with but not completely accurate. Both serve different purposes. Seems like then japanese market is more willing to accept a toy that is not completely accurate, but is durable, because they can get an accurate plamo if they wanted to. It really is no different from what Bandai does with their other franchises. They make accurate plamo, and several toys to be played with. With Macross, this is the first time anyone is really doing this. Hasegawa never made variable versions of their Macross Zero or Plus kits, so the only alternative was a Yamato toy. With Macross F we have two toy lines and a plamo line.

When I look at the DX, then the 1/72 model, then the show and line art I'm just kinda bummed about the DX. Bandai already made an incredible looking and perfect transformation (except fists) VF-25 in a smaller scale.

You forgot retractable landing gear.

The current VF-25 doesn't look ugly, it just doesn't look as cool as the model that Bandai has already made is all.

The same can be said of every Hasegawa model compared to a Yamato in fighter mode.

it looks enough like what's in the show to be recognizable, and for some people that's fine. bandai is selling these to the people who fall under these aforementioned conditions. if you're not one of them, then this isn't the toy for you, buy the model kit, or the 1/100th, or just move on and wait for something better.

That's what I think Bandai was aiming for too.

When I get a model whether it's a toy or kit, I want it to LOOK like what I see on the show.

A model isn't a toy.

Nor did I realize that making proportions wonky made development costs cheaper when you already have a perfectly good design to use that could be up scaled and adjusted slightly to add more features in a larger product.

Scaling up a plamo and turning it into a toy does not always yield good results. Anyone remember the MPC Legioss? Yes it looks good, but god damn it has terrible quality.

I don't think they'll be any other VF25 version to best this one... unless Yamato secretly makes one to console themselves.

Wouldn't surprise me if they were already working on one, waiting to handle the Bandai one, to study it in depth and figure out ways to best it and look more accurate, have the molds tooled up and waiting to finally get the license to produce the 1/60 Macross F toys, and already have tooled up molds for the inevitable 2.0 fixed versions after the first runs have broken arms, LERX's, and just about everything that usually goes wrong(like arm hinges that break even though they added articulation which is then cancelled out because it breaks and you can no longer move the damn thing at all because it is no longer attached!).

[Vifam7]

During my hobby shop hopping in Akihabara, I was able to see these VF-25s on display in some stores. To be quite frank, I would rather shell out more $$$$ for a more detailed and cool looking Yamato Valkyrie toy than buy the VF-25.

Im just starting up my macross valkyrie hobby collection and so far I have the YF-19 with Fold and fast pack and the Sv-51 nora. I wouldnt want to put the Bandai VF-25 beside those Yamato beauties. That's just me though.

How could the DX VF-25 possibly be on dispay in Akiha when the thing isn't even out yet? Not sure if Bandai is already distributing store samples but with the official release still 2 months maybe 3 months away, the most recent magazine articles still reviewing test shot #1, and the most recent event showing only a painted up test shot #1, it just seems odd. You sure you saw the DX toys?

[adrianop]

I think he probably mistook the 1/72s (which looks alot better) with the DX 1/60s.

[badboy00z]

A model isn't a toy.

By model I mean a copy of an object. Not model as in a kit. And by scaling up the 1/72, they have more room to use thicker/ stronger plastic and joints.

[MasterOfPuppets]

line.

You forgot retractable landing gear.

Yes I did, I was going to edit that back into my post but I decided against it. The point still remains valid, the figure will be larger and have more room for some extra engineering. I know the landing gear looks bad now, but I'm sure people would be a lot happier if the DX looked the same as the model but have crappy landing gear than how it looks now. Extendable landing gear still looks entirely possible in the current DX but for whatever reason, Bandai opted not to do it.

The same can be said of every Hasegawa model compared to a Yamato in fighter mode.

A Hasegawa also doesn't transform for the most part and take more expertise to build than the already transforming Bandai VF-25. And Yamato has made some arguably gorgeous fighter modes that still have gorgeous gerwalks and battroids since after the original 1/60 VF-1s and the 1/72 M+'s.

A model isn't a toy.

Damn straight it isn't but who made it law that a toy isn't allowed to look as nice or damn close to the model?

Scaling up a plamo and turning it into a toy does not always yield good results. Anyone remember the MPC Legioss? Yes it looks good, but god damn it has terrible quality.

I'm not familiar in the specifics of the development of Legioss's as I don't collect them but just because 1 company had a bad experience up scaling a model doesn't mean that it should be forever written off. If anyone could pull it off, we all know it would be Bandai. They just chose not to for whatever reason, which I hope we someday will know.

The problem is that if Bandai made the DX as accurate to the VF-25 as the model then the market of people that "don't care about accuracy but want a durable toy" would still buy it. If they made it durable and accurate they would also attract the Yamato crowd. All they did was potentially alienate a buyer market when they could have appeased both easily.

[badboy00z]

The problem is that if Bandai made the DX as accurate to the VF-25 as the model then the market of people that "don't care about accuracy but want a durable toy" would still buy it. If they made it durable and accurate they would also attract the Yamato crowd. All they did was potentially alienate a buyer market when they could have appeased both easily.

That's exactly what I was saying about them killing 2 birds with 1 stone. They have a model for people who only want accurate models and they can still have an accurate toy for people who want durability.

I would really like to ask the DX team at Bandai what they were thinking.

[drifand]

The problem is that if Bandai made the DX as accurate to the VF-25 as the model then the market of people that "don't care about accuracy but want a durable toy" would still buy it. If they made it durable and accurate they would also attract the Yamato crowd. All they did was potentially alienate a buyer market when they could have appeased both easily.

Quid pro quo for Yamato: They alienated plenty of Macross fans who have different needs with their 8 years of industrial production tragi-comedy :-)

[Sumdumgai]

A number of us are arguing Bandai's failings, but a number of others are deflecting Bandai's failings by attempting to switch the topic to Yamato's failings.

Yamato isn't the topic, the 1/60 inaccurate fatty VF-25 DX is the topic.

The whole argument of "if it looks as good as a model it must break easy" is lame. If anyone could pull off a good looking accurate toy that isn't brittle, Bandai could.

[Fatalist]

/yawn

[Vifam7]

/yawn

Yeah, I think we're getting to that point. The arguments are starting to go around in circles.

Edited November 4, 2008 by Vifam7

[Hereticpoo]

No new pics today? 2 more pages of mindless he said she said. This thread is disgracefull and lame. Shame on the topic starter for encouraging complaints in the title.

"Complain about all the latest pics here." This thread was doomed from the start. It could have said "Share your opinions here" Mods may we please have a thread with the pics in it stickied to the Toys forum? Also may we have the thread locked? That way people can look at the images and appreciate Bandai's effort without wading through this vile puke of a thread.

This thread is embarrassing to the Macross community.

Thanks.

[Graham]

Actually, not sure who changed the thread title, it certainly didn't have the word 'complain' in it when I orginally started the thread.

Graham

[Radd]

Come on, tell us how you really feel.

But seriously, lighten up. We're talking about a toy here. No need to go about making personal attacks. The thread would have gone this way regardless of the thread's subtitle. People here have always been opinionated about what they want to see in a toy, and whether you agree or disagree with their opinion, there's nothing wrong with that. In a world where no one complains, nothing ever gets fixed.

I do agree, though, that we could use a thread just for pictures. That's a good idea.

[SDF-ONE]

No new pics today? 2 more pages of mindless he said she said. This thread is disgracefull and lame. Shame on the topic starter for encouraging complaints in the title.

"Complain about all the latest pics here." This thread was doomed from the start. It could have said "Share your opinions here" Mods may we please have a thread with the pics in it stickied to the Toys forum? Also may we have the thread locked? That way people can look at the images and appreciate Bandai's effort without wading through this vile puke of a thread.

This thread is embarrassing to the Macross community.

Thanks.

Yep, that sums it up really well. Collecting toys is supposed to be fun. Certain people take their toys way too seriously. However I do believe the thread's subtitle was meant to be sarcastic. Here is how they deal with complainers at toyboxdx. Talk about OT

[Hereticpoo]

Come on, tell us how you really feel.

But seriously, lighten up. We're talking about a toy here. No need to go about making personal attacks. The thread would have gone this way regardless of the thread's subtitle. People here have always been opinionated about what they want to see in a toy, and whether you agree or disagree with their opinion, there's nothing wrong with that. In a world where no one complains, nothing ever gets fixed.

I do agree, though, that we could use a thread just for pictures. That's a good idea.

Fair enough. I wasn't trying to attack anyone and if I have offended anyone please excuse me, that wasn't my intention. I just find it frustrating that there are over 1300 posts (in both threads) all going around the same yamato vs bandai track. Bring on the release date.....

[Ghost Train]

/yawn

lol greatest movie ever. I also loved the Family Guy take on it a few weeks ago.

But back on topic, I honestly just continue following this thread for its comedic value. Same section, different thread: "waaaa yamato shoulder broke off m0therf***ers took mah money!" and on this one: "waaaa it's ugly." There is just no pleasing anyone. It took Yamato many years to perfect their valkyrie toys to this point, and it's still far from perfect from the QC perspective.

This is Bandai's first big re-entry into Macross since Seven, so I personally believe that some slack-cutting is reasonable in particular with regards to slight deviations from the line-art, but if that bothers people so much, then just go buy the model (don't own one, but I hear the model is basically an MG kit with slightly more detailing work to do). Collectors are going to be "displaying" it anyways, and not swooshing it around, which I think is the role the DX was designed for - making the kit fragility a really minor issue to consider in my opinion.

I would rather a company start with a durable product and work its way towards better aesthetics, then in the case of Yamato of starting with picture perfect looks but ramping up quality as they release products... in fact I think the latter approach is dishonest, I really don't feel like paying 100+ USD to "test" and "obtain data" for Yamato so they can come up with a version 2 which might or might not contain fixes (which I will have to pay for again).

The assumption to all of this, is of course that the product is indeed more durable, which remains to be seen - which is why I decided against a pre-order on this one.

[gingaio]

Yep, that sums it up really well. Collecting toys is supposed to be fun. Certain people take their toys way too seriously. However I do believe the thread's subtitle was meant to be sarcastic. Here is how they deal with complainers at toyboxdx. Talk about OT

If that TBDX thread had made it to 20 or however many pages this thread has included/will include, rest assured that it would be pages devoted to the finer points of charred cow meat.

The constant whining here, over an as yet to be materialized toy, and whether it's against Yamato or Bandai, is amusing, too, but in a more depressingly absurdist Beckettian manner.

Carry on, gentlemen!

[wwkkim]

Forget the giant crotch. What made me really disappointed was the shitty quality of the landing gear.

Seriously...

This looks like the landing gear of airplane toys I can buy in a Duane Reade for coupe bucks.

Simply horrified at the lack of details in this part and also at the paint chipping.

This valk must have gone few transformations and is already have its paint chipped.

Please change the landing gear... for God's sake.

[David Hingtgen]

I changed the topic description----it was incredibly descriptive IMHO, that's all people do around here...

[anime52k8]

Yep, that sums it up really well. Collecting toys is supposed to be fun. Certain people take their toys way too seriously. However I do believe the thread's subtitle was meant to be sarcastic. Here is how they deal with complainers at toyboxdx. Talk about OT

by the way... BEST. THREAD. EVER.