Are the downward economic times affecting your toy buying habits?

[Vermillion21]

This is not meant to be a political discussion on the economy. I just wanted to ask my fellow MW members if the recent seemingly downward spiraling/crisis/panic of the global financial stock markets have affected/will affect your your toy purchases?? Are you cutting back on what you're buying in upcoming months? Do you think that the economic slowdown will hopefully make/force retailers lower their prices?? Or just make toy companies produce less variety of products??

Lately, I really haven't been too much into Macross toys. Last item I bought was the YF-21. So I don't have to worry about dropping $130+ on a single toy item. I have been heavily into Transformers and the 25th GI Joe lines. While these 2 lines are cheaper than Macross toys on an individual basis - collecting them add up after awhile. I love the fact that Wal-Mart sells TF Deluxes for $7.77, but single carded Joes cost frakking $7 apiece!! I've always been selective with the TFs, but have been a completionist with the 25th Joes (up to wave 9). Now, with the economy the way it is (in the proverbial crapper), I am going to be selective with the Joes as well. I'll probably just continue to collect these 2 toy lines and forget the rest (e.g., Revoltech, BGC, etc.) unless things get better. My toy budget has definitely gotten smaller in light of the downward economic times.

Comments?

Edited October 8, 2008 by Vermillion21

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Yes: so yamato better not make toys break so easily!

-Smaller boxes.

-Spread the releases out more and take your time. Importers can't get the replacement free.

-Better announcement system so people know what is going to be released in advance and can better save up for it. Being too secretive is counterproductive to fans imo. Often fans can give early feedback on stuff which will allow changes to things they don't like. (eg how you guys never put the side parts on the 1/60 VF-1 valks and now it's too late)

I'm glad I ended up buying my CMs Legioss and Tread before the aussie dollar went down hehe. If I didn't buy it earlier I simply would never have bought it after it went down to .70 to the USD. It was already freakin overpriced as it is. This hobby is more expensive than my other expensive hobby: computer and video games. It's a lot to ask for mere pieces of transforming plastic.

If times get harder, I will just sell all the old crap I own to buy newer crap I want to own more badly. This is why I wish yamato put some differences on their boxes to let us know which are the earlier releases of toys and which are the later releases of toys so that when a guy sells all his stuff on ebay he can have some way to tell the customer what release he is likely selling to you (take the megazone garland for example: people can know they have a fragile shoulder release just because the red garland was the earlier version) and then based on that, buyers are more confident and informed; allowing the buyer to haggle with sellers better to see if they can get a discount; which moves old stock quickly.

When buyers are confident in something, they will be more relaxed about purchasing. When you make it hard to find info, you only hurt yourself in the long run imo.

I'm also glad I skipped all the Mospeada toys that came out prior to the Beagle release because now that I know this kicks the asses of all the other toys I don't feel so bad for holding off and being more patient.

Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[mikeszekely]

Macross toys have always been to expensive for me.

But yeah, I used to be very heavy into video games. I'd pick up 1-3 a month, depending on how close it is to Christmas, and I'd keep most of them. This year, I've traded in a good portion of my collection for what few disc-based games I've bought, and I've actually been more into downloadable games like Castle Crashers or WipEout HD.

I've also cut back on books, and my wife and I limit eating out to once a weekend. And when that weekend rolls around, we've been doing stuff more like Eat N' Park than Olive Garden. And it's been at least six months since we've been someplace really fancy.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Another thing is: it wouldn't be so bad if there wasn't a lot of things you wanted to buy.

But for those who are content with what they already have: High prices are great for the collectors who may have bought all their import toys at a time when the dollar was strong so now they can actually feel good. You might be able to sell some of the older things you bought and demand better price from a seller now than what you originally bought it for. (especially if you are talking mint condition)

People won't buy as much items in total, but they will understand that they have to pay more per individual item they buy. (ie they are more fussy over 'what' they will choose to spend money on, now that money is harder to come by, but will not have as great leverage in trying to bargain you down since prices are high everywhere else)

What I predict is more people going to group buys to reduce cost.

Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Roger]

We had a similar thread going a few months ago.

http://macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?show...c=26016&hl=

I wonder how the participants' attitudes have changed, if at all.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Personally I don't think prices will fall to get more people to buy. People will buy because the demand for them remains high. People will just cut back on buying other things. That's my speculation. Sometimes people will react emotionally and get scared, but there are as many opportunities to profit from the scariness as there are to panic at the scariness.

That's always been my view.

Americans: Start thinking about money reform. Forget these central banks. They only want to steal the nations real wealth, and I bet any attempt to stop them results in some assassination or mysterious death to whoever tries to free themselves from their hold.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article18205.htm

At the end of the day they want to profit too. I say cut the middleman out of it.

Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

When your belt needs to tighten, hobbies are the first thing to go. We should count ourselves lucky if all we "lose" is the ability to fritter money away on plastic crap. Just as they say restaurants are the canaries in the economy coal mine, trinkety hobbies are the same to collecting. When people stop eating out due to budgetary concerns, restaurants close... when people stop buying trinkety collector crap, it dries up. But at the same time it forces companies to "get smarter" when it comes to how they design, build and market their items.

IMHO the collector toy market is in dire need of a kick to the teeth. Companies have been getting lazy and complacent, as have collectors. We think nothing of dumping $100 here and $100 there on repaints, duplicates and toys that would normally be unworthy of purchase... but we buy them anyway because we have to "complete the collection" or some such nonsense. Our own "addiction" and bad "good economy" habits have aided in the creation of an unstable market that will partially collapse very quickly under a widespread bad economy. Kind of like the whole SUV thing... people were just so eager to run out and buy an eighty thousand dollar land yacht that blows gas like a flamethrower when times were good, but when times turn sour that lumbering guzzling behemoth is unsupportable.

If you ask me (which no one does but I show up and talk anyway) this downturn in the economy is the perfect time for many of us to ween ourselves off of these crazy stupid buying habits we have. We should learn to close our wallets more often, pass up that duplicate, repaint or repackaging. Pass up that ridiculously expensive toy, even if "we have to have it". That is the addiction talking. Then take all that money we would have spent and roll it into an interest bearing account or some stock... hell, with the stock market dropping I bet we could all pick up some good buys that will turn around once this slump is behind us. We would have "thrown that money away on toys" anyway. A few years back I took this advice and started only buying that I really thought I needed and not what I simply "wanted". I stopped buying everything just because it said "Macross" on it, et cetera. Once I put a ton of discretion in my toy buying habits I found myself overly critical of things that in the past I would have just "impulse purchased" without a second thought. It also lets me be more appreciative of the things I do eventually buy. Before when I bought tons and tons of junk I'd just "throw it on the pile" or stick it in a display case and leave it... now I actually relish my few toy purchases and they give me more entertainment because I get to spend more time with them. I've also saved literally thousands upon thousands of dollars, which has enabled me to do other, larger things with my spare "pocket money" finances. It's quite shocking and depressing when you do a tally and realize just how much money you were pissing away on... well... "the same old" crap.

The thing is collectors don't think logically: the more money you have the more worthless it is to you because it comes to you easy. The less you have, the more valuable.

So I think what happens is people buy stuff to encourage more of that stuff they love to be made without thinking about whether the thing made is worth the money to those where money is hard to come by. So then it allows the companies to keep the cost high but no incentive to listen to the complainers and whiners who are more tight with money.

Often you would see fights where the guys with money would pick on the guys who would point out flaws and they would say: "you got to pay to play. These are expensive collector items"

This silences any criticism of the item and whether or not it is worth the asking price. It's just sellers haggling the buyer to pay more more more. But the buyers, even if they wanted to, may not have the funds to do so. Meaning there will be a lot of unsold stuff floating around out there taking up space. Imo it's much better to listen to the harshest critics to sell items at a decent price so more people can afford it, than to keep price high and have to suddenly sell stuff at sale price when you desperately need money in emergency. By that time, buyers might have already spent all their money or not had a chance to prepare in time to be able to buy anything.

You will enjoy today but suffer tomorrow if you are too greedy. In fact those who are tight with their money may be waiting on purpose for sellers to reach a point where they price themselves out of the range of most people as a form of protest. "Improve or die" So it's important to realise that although they are aimed at collectors, you could make more selling to more people at reduced price than if you only sold to a few at a high price.

If people were not value conscious, they wouldn't constantly complain about the cost of items. The rich don't don't spend all their weeks savings on one or two items. They can afford to pay high prices without them thinking its high because it's a tiny amount of money to them despite the item being a large amount to the "almost going broke buying this" guy.

Edited October 8, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Noriko Takaya]

Well, winter is coming and I heat my home with fuel oil. I won't be buying any toys, guns, DVD's, etc for quite a while.

[eugimon]

I tend not to buy multiples anymore. thankfully we're in a position where our income isn't really dependent on the market.

Edited October 8, 2008 by eugimon

[Noriko Takaya]

The rich don't don't spend all their weeks savings on one or two items. They can afford to pay high prices without them thinking its high because it's a tiny amount of money to them despite the item being a large amount to the "almost going broke buying this" guy.

You cannot be more wrong here. I do a lot of HVACR service work in Annapolis, MD and a lot of those people are rich as hell. And they are usually the worst ones when it comes to arguing about prices. How do you think they stay rich? In my experience, middle to lower income people will haggle with you less than a person who is loaded.

[eugimon]

You cannot be more wrong here. I do a lot of HVACR service work in Annapolis, MD and a lot of those people are rich as hell. And they are usually the worst ones when it comes to arguing about prices. How do you think they stay rich? In my experience, middle to lower income people will haggle with you less than a person who is loaded.

I tend to agree with you, but there's a difference between old money mentality and new money mentality. I think low viz is better describing the new money mindset where it's all about immediate gratification and showing off their wealth.

[ruskiiVFaussie]

yes and no. At the moment i'm getting all the important stuff i want, while it's bearable.

I f'n hate paying an extra 50 aussie dollars more for something. It's a killer.

It's gonna get worse i feel, hopefully it will pick up soon.

Edited October 8, 2008 by ruskiiVFaussie

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

You cannot be more wrong here. I do a lot of HVACR service work in Annapolis, MD and a lot of those people are rich as hell. And they are usually the worst ones when it comes to arguing about prices. How do you think they stay rich? In my experience, middle to lower income people will haggle with you less than a person who is loaded.

But does buying something expensive actually represent a large percentage of their total income such that it would put them in danger of having to sacrifice something else like savings for college or medical expenses, or danger money set aside for emergency?

I'm willing to bet there are a lot of middle class people who might be wearing way too expensive clothes, buying the latest HD TV which they can only just barely afford to buy, at the expense of something else more important. imo that is the 'irresponsible' spender where they put luxury ahead of more important things. If they see a wealthy guy driving a nice car, wearing better clothes than them, using the best home entertainment setup, they got to realise that's only because those people could afford to buy it without it taking up like 50-80% of their weekly earning right?

Whereas if a guy who earns a lower income tries to buy a high end item, he may eat into something else more than just the disposable income for the week. Those guys imo are not "spending within your means" and mustn't assume that just because some other guy who earns more money than them or has more things than them, that those people are irresponsible or wasteful in any way. It's not really going to waste if the money they spent on the items doesn't represent much money to them because they actually earn enough to not put themselves in any kind of danger or risk putting themselves in debt. The luxury items that are expensive to rich guy, only represent a small percentage of their total earning for the week. Maybe there are people who owe a lot of money earning lots of money at the same time, and buying luxuries they don't need, but so too are there people in middle class doing that. (ie acting irresponsible)

Both individuals (people spending too much on luxury which they can barely afford) and businesses (making poor irresponsible decisions costing jobs) shouldn't be acting irresponsibly.

Edited October 9, 2008 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[Wes]

No. Yah being single!

[Mog]

I don't think we'll get cheaper toys until the cost of oil drops down to something a bit more reasonable. All those transportation costs for getting the goods here--whether they be by plane, boat, or truck--adds up in the end. (It kinda sucks the fun out of the hunt too when you come up empty-handed and used up your own precious gas in the process.)

Yeah, with this B.S. recession upon us, I might think twice about purchasing some high-ticket toys (that Beta bastard in my avatar being the exception). And don't even get this accountant started about this whole economic situation and bailout......Stupid investment firms crying about having to mark their crappy mortgage derivatives to fair market value.........FRAK YOU!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I didn't see you crying when that same fair market value was generating profits upon profits for you a few years ago!! (Sorry, had to get that off my chest.)

Getting back to toys, the good thing is that I've never been a completist, and I've become pretty selective these past few years about the toys I buy.

These are two traits that aren't necessarily bad things to adopt during these rought times. When you add in the fact that most information about upcoming toys is fairly easy to find here on the Internet and that most toy companies wind up being a bit late with their releases anyways, you can plan earlier enough (and save some money) to make those select few toy purchases a little easier on your wallet.

[sqidd]

Hasn't affected my Macross toy collecting (not much coming out though) but it has put buying my Drft car and building a "race" motor for my Mustang out of reach for now. Gotta keep a chunk of change on hand in case of trouble.

[kensei]

It's hurting at the moment. I paid a large sum while the dollar was at 0.88. Wise choice. Look at it now down to 0.68. While my country is not in a recession yet, my Macross World is.

[macross_fan99]

Well, I just got into collecting the toys and I'm not worried about the economic conditions at all.

Granted, I'm in Canada which hasn't been hit as hard as some other countries, but with the amount of work my company has it will be a while before I have to worry about money. If I were to lose my job I would obviously have to cut back on all expenses, but for now I might as well spend. Lets not forget that not spending money is part of what leads to a weaker economy.

[Impreszive]

Definitely killing my wants. I'm pretty much in the poor house for the near future. Hell, my 401k dropped 37% in the last 10 months.....even with diversification. Go US economy!

[bandit29]

I don't buy toys that much anymore...so no. But when it comes to everything else. Ya. When I have extra money I have to decide where it will be better spent.. A videogame, I'll play for months or a movie I might watch once or twice in 6 months. I'll go with the videogame.

My wife and I like to cook so we never really eat out that much. Trust me, you'll save alot of money that way. I know people who eat out at least 5 days a week..and they wonder why they have no money...

I sell fasteners/screws/bolts etc ..and things are so slow right now. Alot different than this time last year. The high oil and steel prices this past year have been part of the problem...

Edited October 9, 2008 by dejr8bud

[VFTF1]

Lets not forget that not spending money is part of what leads to a weaker economy.

Not true. If it were, then we might as well all ask the government to dig a big hole in the ground and throw all our money into it as the "price" for the hole. Then everyone would have a "job" digging the hole. Yay.

In reality, people spend money because they want to get something that they value more than the amount of money they are paying for it. Some people will spend more, others less, and all people value different things, and the supply of those things is also in a constant state of flux. All of this is reflected in ever changing prices.

Spending money just for the sake of spending it is something normal people don't do but sadly, government often does, and they even have a theory for it called "stimulating the economy" or "stimulating agregate demand."

All it does is create a bubble that will burst because as there is more completely artificial spending, this spending is seen as a signal by the market that there really IS higher demand out there - when in fact, there isn't - there's just a central bank with a printing press that works from morning till night. The result is that prices tend to rise in response to artificially rising demand, and as that happens, investors tend to think "well this is a lucrative market" and pump money into those markets with high price margins in the hopes of reaping higher profits.

Then it suddenly turns out that this is all an illusory bubble, and when it pops, people find that their houses are worthless, their paper money is worthless, and their investments have gone sour.

And to answer the topic question: No. I've been recently buying more toys/figures etc than at any previous time in my life. Although this is probably because the economy in Poland is doing fairly ok; although there are signs of weakness (in my opinion) they have yet to bloom into economic meltdown.

Pete

[macross_fan99]

Not true. If it were, then we might as well all ask the government to dig a big hole in the ground and throw all our money into it as the "price" for the hole. Then everyone would have a "job" digging the hole. Yay.

In reality, people spend money because they want to get something that they value more than the amount of money they are paying for it. Some people will spend more, others less, and all people value different things, and the supply of those things is also in a constant state of flux. All of this is reflected in ever changing prices.

Spending money just for the sake of spending it is something normal people don't do but sadly, government often does, and they even have a theory for it called "stimulating the economy" or "stimulating agregate demand."

All it does is create a bubble that will burst because as there is more completely artificial spending, this spending is seen as a signal by the market that there really IS higher demand out there - when in fact, there isn't - there's just a central bank with a printing press that works from morning till night. The result is that prices tend to rise in response to artificially rising demand, and as that happens, investors tend to think "well this is a lucrative market" and pump money into those markets with high price margins in the hopes of reaping higher profits.

Then it suddenly turns out that this is all an illusory bubble, and when it pops, people find that their houses are worthless, their paper money is worthless, and their investments have gone sour.

And to answer the topic question: No. I've been recently buying more toys/figures etc than at any previous time in my life. Although this is probably because the economy in Poland is doing fairly ok; although there are signs of weakness (in my opinion) they have yet to bloom into economic meltdown.

Pete

But if people don't spend, like many aren't doing now because they fear they might not have a job in the future, that means that the money you are making is not going back into the economy.

If you don't spend the money then the stores don't make a profit, if they don't make a profit then they fire employees. If they fire employees then those employees can't buy things at other stores so those stores fire employees. Its a vicious cycle. Even in the best of times if we all just hoarded our money in a safe in our homes the economy would crumble because the cycle would be broken.

[Mog]

But if people don't spend, like many aren't doing now because they fear they might not have a job in the future, that means that the money you are making is not going back into the economy.

If you don't spend the money then the stores don't make a profit, if they don't make a profit then they fire employees. If they fire employees then those employees can't buy things at other stores so those stores fire employees. Its a vicious cycle. Even in the best of times if we all just hoarded our money in a safe in our homes the economy would crumble because the cycle would be broken.

I've got an issue with that first paragraph above. Do you pay rent? Do you pay a mortgage? Do you pay bills, such as phone, cell, cable, water, heating, or electric? Do you pay for gasoline or public transportation? Do you go to the grocery store or market to purchase food? Regardless of how crappy the economy may be, you can't not spend some chunk of your money and have it circulate back into the economy.

And just because people don't spend doesn't mean that money is just being hoarded somewhere. Realistically, the funds are probably in a bank or some other investment, earning the wise saver some interest or return. As for the funds themselves, the bank or the investment are probably using that money as a loan to a homeowner or to help a business turn a profit. In other words, just because you don't spend doesn't mean the money isn't eventually going back into the economy.

Getting back on topic, how much do most folks here spend on toys in a year? (A monthly number probably varies too much because toy releases are sporadic on a month-to-month basis.) Without asking for percentages or anything, is that toy fund amount a huge chunk of your annual take-home pay?

[thegunny]

True collectors don't care

Who needs heating, housing, clothing & food. You're all a bunch of wusses (if you need oil you can always throw some plastic on the fire and I'm sure the boxes taste good with a bit of seasoning)

The toy/figure/model cabinet comes first! Grow a pair, buy more toys

It also helps when you're single, own everything you have and have heaps of income

[Scream Man]

It's hurting at the moment. I paid a large sum while the dollar was at 0.88. Wise choice. Look at it now down to 0.68. While my country is not in a recession yet, my Macross World is.

What he said The dollatr in Australia is bad ri9ght now, which means less buying for me. Its why I cancelled my 1A and Tomahawk: i just cant afford it right now.

[Vegas]

yes. i dont buy multiples now. im just basically saving my money and liquidating for whatever assets i have.

[miriya]

I should be more careful but budget wise I am spending like usual. But that is one of the problems with an obsessive hobby.

[taksraven]

This is not meant to be a political discussion on the economy. I just wanted to ask my fellow MW members if the recent seemingly downward spiraling/crisis/panic of the global financial stock markets have affected/will affect your your toy purchases?? Are you cutting back on what you're buying in upcoming months? Do you think that the economic slowdown will hopefully make/force retailers lower their prices?? Or just make toy companies produce less variety of products??

Lately, I really haven't been too much into Macross toys. Last item I bought was the YF-21. So I don't have to worry about dropping $130+ on a single toy item. I have been heavily into Transformers and the 25th GI Joe lines. While these 2 lines are cheaper than Macross toys on an individual basis - collecting them add up after awhile. I love the fact that Wal-Mart sells TF Deluxes for $7.77, but single carded Joes cost frakking $7 apiece!! I've always been selective with the TFs, but have been a completionist with the 25th Joes (up to wave 9). Now, with the economy the way it is (in the proverbial crapper), I am going to be selective with the Joes as well. I'll probably just continue to collect these 2 toy lines and forget the rest (e.g., Revoltech, BGC, etc.) unless things get better. My toy budget has definitely gotten smaller in light of the downward economic times.

Comments?

Toy buying habits!!!???? Forget that. Its affecting all of my potential purchases. Living in Australia, I purchase a lot of stuff from Amazon since we generally get squat released in this country. Next year, a complete 4-season set of Duckman is being released. With the poor economics at the moment and the value of the Australian dollar plummeting through the floor, I am seriously considering if I can afford this set now.

Taksraven

[Uxi]

Not personally affected yet. Still buying the Macross, Star Wars, and assorted toys and games that interest me.

[Vermillion21]

Another angle to consider: if collectors slow down on their toy purchases, thus reducing profits, then toy companies may produce fewer toys to retail ...

[MacrossMan]

Nope. Just as people with billions of dollars are buying up cheap stock; i'm investing in toys, just on a lot smaller scale. Now is the time to pick up many goodies as prices are relatively cheaper than what they were a year ago. I'm seizing the moment and making some cool purchases as the toy prices will undoubtedly go back up when things stabalize.

[Roger]

Nope. Just as people with billions of dollars are buying up cheap stock; i'm investing in toys, just on a lot smaller scale. Now is the time to pick up many goodies as prices are relatively cheaper than what they were a year ago. I'm seizing the moment and making some cool purchases as the toy prices will undoubtedly go back up when things stabalize.

You realize that if you want to invest, stocks are a much better choice than toys, right?

[miriya]

But with toys one is investing in their current happiness! My collection brings me much happiness. That is good medicine!

[big F]

Well I have been ramping down things for a while now, with the price of fuel in the U.K and the fact that I do over 300 miles a week just for work.

Add that to the rising cost of living, I also just lost £2500 from one of my shares based savings acount, basically all the money I have put in this year is gone maybe it will go back up but Im not holding my breath. Finally my lack of space (I've filled it all), cant remember the last time I bought a toy. Models wise I limit my self to the Captains creations and the odd bargin buy. The last kit I got was a part done one from eBay. The world wil eventually right its self and we will all get back to spending our green on Macross stuff.

[jenius]

I was going to sell a bunch of my toys this Christmas season... but now I think I'll wait for the next Christmas season as I suspect many people are watching their wallets for fear their company may soon be unable to pay them or something like that.