I was right thread

[Keith]

-Bilner wanting to use the hyper fold network to meet Minmay

-Frontier settling down on the planet as the ending, with an apparent cohabitation with the Vajra

!

[JustinStrife]

Then what was the giant vajra that crushed the space station that Ranka escaped from? I thought that was the queen but apparently not. It looks like a giant version of the red vajra.

Alto x Ranka is the only way, Alto x Ranka is the only way, Alto x Ranka is the only way, Alto x Ranka is the only way

Frankly i don't think it will EVER get resolved. Oh and the kisses were ALL initiated by Sheryl....and Alto never ever savours the moment each time she does it. He's just doing it in pity of her.

You forgot episode 22 where Alto kissed Sheryl... -coughs-

[cyde01]

There was also flashback on a humanoid alien thing and the birdman in one flashback scene. Need better encode and subs.

I was wrong for Michel cause the anime pacing definately hinted to his return. I mean look at freaking Code Geass. LOL everyone lived this season but it was expected. In frontier, Kawamori rickrolled us. Ppl who were expected to die didn't and ppl who were expected to live died.

Luca didn't die either. Neither did Nanase. Zzzzz

you must not realize it but i don't need subs. the birdman flashback was a flashback to the birdman on earth from macross zero. during the flashback, grace explains that the protoculture feared and admired the vajra and even tried to emulate them (strongly suggesting that they made the birdman in an attempt to emulate the vajra). i think that's a clear indication that the vajra were not made by the protoculture at all.

as far as the "protoculture stone" on the vajra planet. bah, that doesn't prove anything, that could just be some rock. even if it is a rock similar to those found in the mayan ruins it could just as easily be explained as a vajra rock. the protoculture could have made rocks and symbols similar to the vajra because they admired the vajra and tried to emulate them. so imo there is nothing that proves the vajra settled on a former protoculture homeworld.

Edited September 26, 2008 by cyde01

[RedWolf]

The Vajra came from another galaxy.

Makes me start to think that the Protoculture left behind artifacts for their "children" like humans and Zolans to communicate with intelligent non-humanoid fold capable species.

Fold quartz for the humans to communicate with the Vajra. Intelligent symbiotic snakes for the Zolans to read the history of the Galactic Whales.

That is why the Birdman was programmed to destroy humanity if it became a violent species.

The Protoculrure do not want their mistakes to destroy the galaxy anymore.'

[cyde01]

The Vajra came from another galaxy.

Makes me start to think that the Protoculture left behind artifacts for their "children" like humans and Zolans to communicate with intelligent non-humanoid fold capable species.

Fold quartz for the humans to communicate with the Vajra. Intelligent symbiotic snakes for the Zolans to read the history of the Galactic Whales.

That is why the Birdman was programmed to destroy humanity if it became a violent species.

The Protoculrure do not want their mistakes to destroy the galaxy anymore.'

actually no where during the series do they actually say that the vajra came from another galaxy. they say that there are other hives in other galaxies, but it is never mentioned whether they first originated from this galaxy or not. assuming that the vajra originated from another galaxy would be pure speculation at this point. also, no where in the series does it suggest that the protoculture left behind the fold quartz. in fact, fold quartz allows for technology that the protoculture never had, which strongly suggests that the protoculture did not leave behind the fold quartz. rather, during the series it is stated that the fold quartz are created by the vajra and can only be found in their bodies. in this last episode grace clearly states that the protoculture did not have the tech that the vajra had and feared and admired the vajra because of it. if you're not gonna take my word for it then you'll just have to wait for subs.

Edited September 26, 2008 by cyde01

[RedWolf]

In the series no. In the Blu-Ray disc recon of Macross Zero the fold quartz earrings are present on Mayan island.

Besides Mao's daughter said she'd give the earring which she inherited from Mao to Sheryl.

Which Mao inherited from one of her parents.

The Protoculture may have not used fold quartz like humans-Zentradi did but they did leave it on Earth for the Mayan people.

Also notice that the ancestors of the Zolans also revered Galactic Whales.

The writing and drawing on the Whale bones is a bit reminicent of the Mayan hieroglyphs and planet Lux mural.

Galactic Whales own organic composition can make fold engines more efficient that is why they are wanted by pirates and smugglers.

It could suggest the Protoculture did not discover fold by themselves they studied these creatures and made their own version of folding space.

The Protoculture's own history started 500,000 years ago. These creatures millions.

[wolfx]

You forgot episode 22 where Alto kissed Sheryl... -coughs-

Never happened. He was just comforting her.

And even if he did he was just being nice.

[Duke Togo]

you must not realize it but i don't need subs. the birdman flashback was a flashback to the birdman on earth from macross zero. during the flashback, grace explains that the protoculture feared and admired the vajra and even tried to emulate them (strongly suggesting that they made the birdman in an attempt to emulate the vajra).

That's just all sorts of bad. As in, that's the best they could come up with? Ugh.

[RedWolf]

That's just all sorts of bad. As in, that's the best they could come up with? Ugh.

Well certainly explains to me why Zentran ships look organic.

When I saw Space Whales in Dynamite 7 they remind me of Zentran ships.

The Protoculture were a bunch of Fold creature worshiper pagans?

If they were the ones who wrote on bones of the Whale cemetery that the White Whale is a god well never expected them to be like that.

[kyoufuu]

I'm still waiting for the subs (damnable non-fluency in Japanese!), but I am intrigued by the idea that the Protoculture tried to emulate the Vajra. It would explain partially why the Bird Human looked the way that it did (as well as some members of the Evil series of Zentradi). If all this is true, then I would be thoroughly satisfied with how well SK managed to tie many different elements together. I was never fond of the idea that the Protoculture was the only game in town, and that no other sentient life existed.

[RedWolf]

I'm still waiting for the subs (damnable non-fluency in Japanese!), but I am intrigued by the idea that the Protoculture tried to emulate the Vajra. It would explain partially why the Bird Human looked the way that it did (as well as some members of the Evil series of Zentradi). If all this is true, then I would be thoroughly satisfied with how well SK managed to tie many different elements together. I was never fond of the idea that the Protoculture was the only game in town, and that no other sentient life existed.

Space Whales lets not forget Space Whales.

I get the feeling that the Ancestors which Graham refers to writing on Whale Bones in the cemetery were the Protoculture.

When I saw first Ai-kun the Vajra larva I assumed it was a Protoculture creation like the Zolan snake because it also had three eyes, which is intelligent and can read ancient Ancestor writing on Zola. (Macross Dynamite 7)

I was wrong the three eyed Zolan snake was based upon the Vajra larva. It even skips like a Vajra larva.

Given two fold capable species that can sing I think I'm beginning to see the origins of Anima Spiritia which defeated the Protodevlin.

[Duke Togo]

If the Vajra are that almighty, why didn't they step in and stop the PC extermination? They seemed to have no problem laying waste to human fleets that they didn't understand, you'd think an interstellar civil war would have gotten their attention.

[kyoufuu]

If the Vajra are that almighty, why didn't they step in and stop the PC extermination? They seemed to have no problem laying waste to human fleets that they didn't understand, you'd think an interstellar civil war would have gotten their attention.

Well, clearly anything is speculation, but I suppose it is possible that the Protoculture, being in such awe of the Vajra, tried to keep the Interstellar Republic away from Vajra territory. So maybe the Vajra were completely unaware of the events that were transpiring.

[RedWolf]

If the Vajra are that almighty, why didn't they step in and stop the PC extermination? They seemed to have no problem laying waste to human fleets that they didn't understand, you'd think an interstellar civil war would have gotten their attention.

They didn't understand humans and Zentradi what make us think the Vajra understood the Protoculture too?

Also the Mayan creation story could be an analogy to human evolution to us.

But what if it was Protoculture religion involving the Vajra and the Vahl Ena? (Space Whales)

The Birdman and the Fishman.

[freya]

Never happened. He was just comforting her.

And even if he did he was just being nice.

better than alto and ranka, who got..... nothing. Nothing!

[Duke Togo]

Well, clearly anything is speculation, but I suppose it is possible that the Protoculture, being in such awe of the Vajra, tried to keep the Interstellar Republic away from Vajra territory. So maybe the Vajra were completely unaware of the events that were transpiring.

It didn't seem to me like the Protoculture had much control over what was going on. And the Vajra seem to be all over the galactic core, I am just not sure how all of this stuff goes down without hearing from them before.

[Duke Togo]

They didn't understand humans and Zentradi what make us think the Vajra understood the Protoculture too?

Also the Mayan creation story could be an analogy to human evolution to us.

But what if it was Protoculture religion involving the Vajra and the Vahl Ena? (Space Whales)

The Birdman and the Fishman.

Well, if they didn't understand the Protoculture, how come they didn't wipe them out? The Vajra seem to be all about attacking things they don't understand.

And your Birdman/Fishman theory, well, see, that makes too much sense to be what Kawamori intended, LOL.

[JustinStrife]

Never happened. He was just comforting her.

And even if he did he was just being nice.

To deny it happened... I'd have to wonder if you've ever kissed anybody before. It's the exact motions involved to a T.

[cyde01]

If the Vajra are that almighty, why didn't they step in and stop the PC extermination? They seemed to have no problem laying waste to human fleets that they didn't understand, you'd think an interstellar civil war would have gotten their attention.

haha must admit the same question crossed my mind when i was watching ep 25. as i said in other threads, ep 25 left us with many plot holes and unanswered questions, but it still didn't prevent me from enjoying it!!

[VF-25 Messiah]

One possiblity could be that the Vajra were encountered during the 500.000 years after the Protodeviln were sealed. The PC would have been in shambles by then (less than 15% of their original number being left?), with the rest dissappearing in time as the SA and Zentradi continue to wage war. Believe that in Zero the AFOS is determined to be aproximately 10.000 years old, indicating that a very small number of PC could still have been around by then.

[wolfx]

To deny it happened... I'd have to wonder if you've ever kissed anybody before. It's the exact motions involved to a T.

To a T? You can see that it was obviously a kiss to a T in a badly animated series with anime magic and animation bloopers?

If it happened, it would've been obvious and in your face to squash the opposing idea of them not kissing. But too bad it wasn't and the end proves that Alto can't give two fishes about Sheryl and Ranka at this point. He likes flying in a real sky above all.

[Gubaba]

I predicted that the story would end with the power of love and song conquering all, and I was right.

I also predicted that if Alto didn't end up with Sheryl, the few REALLY hardcore Sheryl shippers would bitch and moan and whine, and lo! It has come to pass.

[JustinStrife]

To a T? You can see that it was obviously a kiss to a T in a badly animated series with anime magic and animation bloopers?

If it happened, it would've been obvious and in your face to squash the opposing idea of them not kissing. But too bad it wasn't and the end proves that Alto can't give two fishes about Sheryl and Ranka at this point. He likes flying in a real sky above all.

Says who? Not every kiss is in your face in anime my friend. The kiss doesn't detract from his love for a real sky. No one ever said he had to choose one over the other. I love cars(got a good little collection started), yet I still have space for a relationship.

[taksraven]

I was wrong with most of my predictions (apart from peace being made with the Vajra, but that was REALLY obvious), but I am not disappointed at all. I am happy that the ending was not as predictable as I expected.

Taksraven

[Zinjo]

-Bilner wanting to use the hyper fold network to meet Minmay

You posted that?!

[wolfx]

Says who? Not every kiss is in your face in anime my friend. The kiss doesn't detract from his love for a real sky. No one ever said he had to choose one over the other. I love cars(got a good little collection started), yet I still have space for a relationship.

We can argue about this till the cows come home but for all its worth, i have more visual proof than you. So stuff it with your fan-wankery.

Sheryl has forced herself on Alto on all occassions which can't be denied since it was shown on anime. And every single time Alto didn't seem to enjoy said kiss....even the final one he got. It was heavily hinted as well as his true love is flying and further cemented by supporting characters mentioning "So this is your love".

The love triangle isn't resolved. That's that. LOL sheryl shippers are RAGING now. That's good enough for me.

[RedWolf]

We can argue about this till the cows come home but for all its worth, i have more visual proof than you. So stuff it with your fan-wankery.

Sheryl has forced herself on Alto on all occassions which can't be denied since it was shown on anime. And every single time Alto didn't seem to enjoy said kiss....even the final one he got. It was heavily hinted as well as his true love is flying and further cemented by supporting characters mentioning "So this is your love".

The love triangle isn't resolved. That's that. LOL sheryl shippers are RAGING now. That's good enough for me.

So Alto is sky idiot like Isamu?

He can't be worse than a mountain and galaxy idiot like Basara.

[Sumdumgai]

I was right that the Global was NOT the SDF Macross....FTW

Add me to this, so now it's

"we were right that the Global was NOT the SDF Macross" And people called zinjo crazy, said he was off the deepend, and that there were invisible dragons behind him that he'd never see. He argued it more vocally, so he got more flak. We were right.

[cyde01]

i argued that wtf-1 was very likely not sdf-1 as well.

[Gubaba]

Add me to this, so now it's

"we were right that the Global was NOT the SDF Macross" And people called zinjo crazy, said he was off the deepend, and that there were invisible dragons behind him that he'd never see. He argued it more vocally, so he got more flak. We were right.

i argued that wtf-1 was very likely not sdf-1 as well.

I didn't. I was POSITIVE it was the SDF-1.

The airing date of episode 13 marked the day I officially swore off speculating on Frontier's plot.

[me2]

I was right, I WILL get trolled.

Kidding aside, I was right Sheryl (or Ranka) won't end up with Alto (T_T, why you SK! j/k) by the end of the series. I was right Michel won't come back as a cyborg (Hides under desk. Sorry!). I was right Klan Klan will be piloting a Valk (But what happened to Klan Klan FAST Pack?). I was right that the Vajra weren't bad at all. I was right that we won't be seeing Minmei and Megaroad. I was right that there'll be lots of cannon fodders. And I was right I won't be seeing those poor Hippocows again at the end of the series (T_T).

But Finally, I was wrong that Leon didn't get shot, gutted, sucked-up in space and gets blown-up by Quarter's Cannons.

[crasis]

I was right that we won't be seeing Minmei

Well, technically we did get to see her... a picture of her, anyway. That was more than I was expecting.

[Xeros]

I didn't. I was POSITIVE it was the SDF-1.

The airing date of episode 13 marked the day I officially swore off speculating on Frontier's plot.

Anyway, all the WTF-1 thing was the best debate about this series

[Sumdumgai]

But Finally, I was wrong that Leon didn't get shot, gutted, sucked-up in space and gets blown-up by Quarter's Cannons.

I wish you were right on that one... I wonder what the penalty is for assassinating the UN president... Especially when you think about how Isamu was warning Yang that they could be executed for stealing the YF-19.

[VF-25 Messiah]

I wish you were right on that one... I wonder what the penalty is for assassinating the UN president... Especially when you think about how Isamu was warning Yang that they could be executed for stealing the YF-19.

I'd imagine capital punishment since it was in effect a coup d'etat.