Free Misterryno!

[ruskiiVFaussie]

:edited: gee aww better do the right thing duh. f'n nazis >____> g/g jenius

Edited September 25, 2008 by ruskiiVFaussie

[jenius]

^ d'oh!!!!

Seriously Ruskii, two posts back to back, why not just edit your last post? Aw crap, now i'm becoming the forum nazi.

[nightmareB4macross]

^ d'oh!!!!

Seriously Ruskii, two posts back to back, why not just edit your last post? Aw crap, now i'm becoming the forum nazi.

Out of 50 points on the scale of funny...I'll give you 35.

[vermillion01]

Out of 50 points on the scale of funny...I'll give you 35.

Now THAT is funny! ROFLMAO!!!!

[eugimon]

There's a topic and you two aren't on it.

But seriously, this is going to get this thread locked.

[ruskiiVFaussie]

lol fine, i was at work and didn't think better of it, oh and stfu u 2 (not you Eugimon...). >

We are all here because we love Macross. I would guess that most of us, myself included, are obsessed with macross and inspired with macross, the series, the characters, the mecha, the toys, models, customs, the art and Shoji Kawamori, etc. . .

Many of us who are "overly enthusiastic" fans spend a large portion of our lives reading, looking, and commenting on macrossworld even in risky situations where our job or our relationship may be at stake.

I have never intentionally spammed but sometimes I get really excited and speak my mind quite a bit here (maybe too much for some people's taste).

It makes me sad to think that Ryan's positive influence here including substantial contributions like custom WIP threads, great sales, photo poses, as well as his positive way (I have also never seen him be personally venemous), and his good sense of humor, all be overlooked and disregarded. I personally like Ryan and like to have a little bit of comic relief during my work day, getting a little off topic with him here. I consider him a friend but I have never met him in person.

However I also understand the critisms that people have. <insert "opinions" joke here>

Anyway, I am sure that my vote does not mean much, but I vote to get him back at some point.

EDIT: (for additions)...

This whole situation also is making me feel like my posts are not welcome and for the last week I have been more hesitant to post my thoughts thinking that they will be hated and considered spamming. It is probably all in my mind but from my side I feel a bit unwelcome, self-consious, and outcast. And I am not even the one being banned but I have a feeling that I am included in that group of people that "followed Ryan and spammed too". (I know, "Get over it dude! and be a man! you little wuss!" is probably the appropriate response to my comment). Anyway, I probably spend too much time on this forum anyway. But yeah, I feel like now I have to walk on eggshells.

f that! Whats the point of being here then. Be real or tell everyone to beep off.

re-editied for jenius. *hey good start to becoming the next mod i guess mate!* hiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiissssssssSss wooo that was close, i might just get away with a warning... :-0

Edited September 25, 2008 by ruskiiVFaussie

[EXO]

I just want to reiterate what has been said. Ryan wasn't banned because of the post whoring/spamming. It was because he continually broke other rules such as multiple accounts and continually ignoring the moderators of this site's private warning. And he denied the private warnings and played it like he was being persecuted publicly to make the mods look bad. So it's not like he wasn't given multiple chances. I even had a thread of PMs with him and I carefully spelled out what kind of thin ice he was walking on. He tells me he understands and promises to be good, but then continually does moronic things. I met Ryan at MWCon, and yes he was a nice guy. But he's totally disruptive.

Again, his banning is not given to him on his first strike... he was given MULTIPLE CHANCES.

And yes the mod's actions are inconsistent, but that's because we take banning as something serious, if it's an obvious troll then it's easy, but if it's someone that is a genuine member that has caused a ruckus, then it's not as easy. We actually take time to decide what the final action will be.

And another thing, a permaban is a permaban. We allowed one member to come back, but don't press your luck... once it's decided you're gone... you're most likely to stay gone. But banning someone is the last option so the members don't have to worry about walking on eggshells.

On a personal note... the first time I spoke to ryan about the matter, I told him that what we were talking about was off the records and I didn't want him to tell anyone what I was telling him. And the asswipe forwarded my PM via BCC to his buddies, but the idiot hit reply to me instead of forwarding... right there and then I knew that he had total disregard for rules or what anyone thinks. I'm sure he's enjoying reading this thread but that's pretty much all he's going to get to do.

[VFTF1]

Well - Exo - your post only demonstrates one thing:

The only person capable of eventually bringing Ryan back is Ryan. He has to convince the people he offended that he's sorry and take to heart that some people do feel offended at him for various reasons.

Oh well.

Pete

[Mog]

Before I start, I do have a few points in defense of the whole Eugimon's Omega Pants thing. But this is neither the time nor thread to go into that topic.

As >EXO<'s post above points out, it's important to remember that we, as rank-and-file members, don't always see the "whole picture." There was a bunch of behind-the-scenes stuff going on that we just don't see or have access to on the regular board. There's probably a whole slew of PM's and mod discussions related to this topic that we aren't even aware of. As >EXO< pointed out, there was a ton of deliberation and warnings given prior to the ban.

Now, I'm sure there's a bunch of folks that will say, "Boo-hoo, we have a RIGHT to see those PM's and discussions." But frankly, we don't have a right to squat. Remember, this board is Shawn and Graham's world; we're just squirrels who get to have a little fun in it. The mods were put in place to keep things running smoothly and to relieve the two head guys of the day-to-day administration of things. If there's stuff they gotta talk about (such as this whole issue or something less serious such as debating whether or not to issue a warning to some member), we have no inherent right whatsoever to see those PM's or discussions. It's just one of those facts of life you have to accept as a member of any message board.

But knowing our mods, they'll probably bust out that evidence if folks refuse to consider what's already out there on the boards. Our mods have a way of proving their point and backing their words up with evidence.

But at the end of the day, there are rules in place for being a member of this board. Misterryno was given MULTIPLE warnings and even a temporary ban. Regardless of his enthusiasm and exuberance, I can't have too much sympathy for someone who knowingly violates the rules (setting up multiple accounts).

Funny thing is, if he had just kicked back and waited for a mere three days, we wouldn't even be having this conversation. He had his chance at "redemption" during that temporary three-day ban.

And frankly, he blew his chance.

[yellowlightman]

On a personal note... the first time I spoke to ryan about the matter, I told him that what we were talking about was off the records and I didn't want him to tell anyone what I was telling him. And the asswipe forwarded my PM via BCC to his buddies, but the idiot hit reply to me instead of forwarding... right there and then I knew that he had total disregard for rules or what anyone thinks. I'm sure he's enjoying reading this thread but that's pretty much all he's going to get to do.

That's probably the best part... That a lot of the people on here arguing for his defense probably already knew he was on thin ice, but are still willing to plead that he's completely innocent and that "being a big Macross fan" makes up for everything.

[MacrossMan]

A couple of years ago my wife was searching for chairs to decorate our home. She could not find what she wanted and ended up at Ethan Allen to have some chairs custom made. She referred to the sales people in the store as furniture snobs and I didn’t fully understand what she meant until all the palabba that has gone down on the forums lately.

In my signature line I jokingly refer to myself as “A Lying Macross Purist”. In actuality I’m just a guy that liked the Transformers character robot Jetfire. In looking for him on E-bay in early January of this year I kept coming across “Macross: Do You Remember Love?” toys that were prohibitedly expensive. Long story short, my search on Macross led me to Macross World where I learned about the incredibly cool Yamato Macross: DYRL toys as well as the Robotech association.

I am not a Macross Purist, or snob for that matter so for the most part my contributions to the forum will be nothing short of excitement at pictures of other members’ collections, custom work, news of upcoming toys and of course goofing off with fellow members in good fun.

I say all that to say that I am no Macross guru. I don’t do extensive reading on the story and its transforming fighter planes. I do not own a bunch of technical manuals chocked full of data on the imaginary fighters. I do not know all the characters in the story and so and so on. I’m just a guy who can appreciate cool looking toys and that is about the brunt of why I frequent the forums.

My passion and technical knowledge lies with music, DJ’ing, home theater, and computer networking. I have “substantive” post on forums of this nature because I am far more into these things than I ever will be with Macross, but I would never and have never seen an administrator or moderator knock a member of one these forums for being overly excited and excessively posting their enthusiasm at the discovery of content from these forums. Members can state what they want, but the fact remains that his spamming/enthusiasm is what sparked everything. Ultimately, his being banned lies all with this:

"I told him that what we were talking about was off the records and I didn't want him to tell anyone what I was telling him. And the asswipe forwarded my PM via BCC to his buddies, but the idiot hit reply to me instead of forwarding."

I was out of dealing with a death in the family over the weekend and got a call from misterryno on Sunday morning. I checked things out for myself and could only shake my head. Ryan is a cool and harmless guy. We’ve had several transactions and we often shoot the gib on Macross toys off the forums. How asinine is it for anyone to become irritated what has been considered spamming? I never take the time to read through several pages of a topic because I don’t have the time. I just post the damn question and I’m usually pointed to where to find the info.

I can’t see why Ryan would want to come back and participate, but I could surely see how he would want to lurk for information. That’s going to take some stealthiness on another level, but that’s a conversation I’ll save for him.

I have interacted with several awesome members of the MW site and I’ll always be a fan of Macross, but as far as some of the site’s leadership…meh; whatever.

OO

[miriya]

f that! Whats the point of being here then. Be real or tell everyone to beep off.

Thanks for the encouragment ruskiiVFaussie! Can I be real AND tell everyone to beep off?

[eugimon]

That's probably the best part... That a lot of the people on here arguing for his defense probably already knew he was on thin ice, but are still willing to plead that he's completely innocent and that "being a big Macross fan" makes up for everything.

Again man, stop putting words in our mouth. Find me one post here where anyone, other than YOU, has said he's innocent at all or that the ban wasn't warranted.

If not, STFU, you don't like him, we get it but that's no reason to start going after the people who do.

And EXO, thanks for taking the time to paint a fuller picture of what happened.

[MacrossMan]

Thanks for the encouragment ruskiiVFaussie! Can I be real AND tell everyone to beep off?

It aint gonna happen miriya. They're afraid to call it out for what it is at the expense of being banned. You can put lipstick on a pig, but it's still a pig. It is what it is; the guy was banned for having a backbone. The fact of the matter is >EXO< has put it out there that the guy is banned and he's not backing off on his position. More than anything he's backed himself up against the wall with those words he's not going to eat them. I'll say it again, I don't know why ryno would want to come back and participate at this point. Lurk for info and deals on Macross stuff yes, but be active, nah.

OO

[VFTF1]

Maybe if we all started singing Ai Oboeteimatsuka then peace, love and pink bunnies would reign?

Pete

[MacrossMan]

but I know this... learn to suffer fools; to tolerate other people that aren't like you, act like you, think like you, etc; it's part of real life, you're doing yourself a disservice by pushing or blocking this type of person from your everyday instead of learning to deal with them, in real life and on the web. Imagine "banning" your boss from your life, or putting your mother in law on "ignore", would it get you anywhere? It's the lazy easy way out.

He's SOOOO enthusiastic and energetic about Macross and this site? Why don't you guys use this to your advantage? Get him involved in a MW webpage project, or give him an actual responsibility on the site, etc. Seems from what I read he'll give you 100% effort and say "thank you sir, may I have another".

Edit: here's a suggestion for a responsibility; as part of his "parole", he's made the Official MW Spam Sweeper - he's responsible to browse through ALL the threads, checking the daily posts, and to mark the ones that fit the definition of a SPAM post. The marked posts would generate into a daily report sent to the mods, one of whom could review it before deleting the SPAM posts in bulk. If anyone has the brilliant idea of spamming on purspose to give him more work, he could flag the behavior to a mod for them to review and deal with, etc. This place would be squeeky clean in no time.

That first paragraph says it all. Problem is, there are Macross snobs on the site that interpret enthusiasm for spamming.

As for the third paragraph, with great power comes great responsibility. It seems some of the mods can only appreciate the power of being a mod, without accepting the responsibility of being one. If spamming is a problem get your moderating a$$ to work and simply remove it with your power then contact the member in PM. If the problem persists, then ban'em; end of story. These issues should never make the light of the boards if handled properly.

[VFTF1]

If spamming is a problem get your moderating a$$ to work and simply remove it with your power then contact the member in PM. If the problem persists, then ban'em; end of story. These issues should never make the light of the boards if handled properly.

But the mods say they PMed Ryan numerous times.

I seriously think we should sing.

If everybody just stubornly insists on one point of view that does nobody any good.

Also - writing "piss off" to a mod is not the way to express your disagreement with him.

Creating a new user account isn't the way to deal with a 3-day temporary ban when you also have at least 25% of the forum willing to stick up for you.

Let's not start defending Ryan for things he shouldn't have done.

Pete

[Jeremy007]

i dont think the mods misinterpreted enthusiasm for spamming at all. There is a huge difference in the two things. You can be enthusiastic in a thread and show your support with a comment here and there but when you respond to EVERY SINGLE post in a thread, quoting each post, just to reply to each and every person...thats not enthusiasm, that is nothing but spamming to get your post count up.

Dont get me wrong, Ryan seems like a nice guy, ive dealt with him on several occasions and have always been happy with the transaction but the truth of the matter is that he shot himself in the foot. plain and simple.

Signing up with a different account name after being suspended is not a sign of enthusism either...its being sneaky and he was trying to get around the rules. period. We have all bashed ebay sellers with schill accounts who try to mislead us...how is this different? Ryan was trying to mislead the forum.

I dont have a lot of respect for forum mods to begin with...some of them think they have way too much power for what they do(im not talking about any MW mod here) but like it or not, ryan broke the rules. Just because he likes macross doesnt mean he is above the rules. Doing what he did, being called out for it and then bad-mouthing the mods for calling him on his mistakes and then re-registering with a different name and continuing to pull his antics is just underhanded and bush-league.

a ban is a ban...not a temporary time out.

Edited September 25, 2008 by Jeremy007

[EXO]

Thanks Jeremy007, at least someone understood what I was trying to say.

The fact that he forwarded my PM wasn't the decision making instance, but it did help me realize that he was never going to take warnings. The more he got in trouble the more he used it to make a big deal about himself. It seemed like he was innocet, but everytime he posted he started it with a "I don't want to get banned for posting..." which made people feel bad for him and then the thread would get derailed about how evil the mods were. It was highly disruptive.

The mods here don't care if the member's liked them or not. We're not here to make friends as mods. That can be easily done as a member. If you guys are not talking about mods and how evil they are then all is good. It's that type of job that don't get appreciated. If things are smooth then we're doing a good job. Unfortunately this thread spawned out because there was a disruptive nature. Spamming and post whoring was only part of it but there was enough of the other stuff that warranted the end result.

And no, Ryan can't save Ryan anymore. He had his chance, we're dealing with what came after.

[MacrossMan]

But the mods say they PMed Ryan numerous times.

I seriously think we should sing.

If everybody just stubornly insists on one point of view that does nobody any good.

Also - writing "piss off" to a mod is not the way to express your disagreement with him.

Creating a new user account isn't the way to deal with a 3-day temporary ban when you also have at least 25% of the forum willing to stick up for you.

Let's not start defending Ryan for things he shouldn't have done.

Pete

I see what you're saying Pete, but what happened after the fact is really irrelevant. I'm in a position of authority or leadership in my job daily. As an "Administrator" or leader it is my job to keep my side of the street clean no matter how grimey a situation gets. As a leader you can not afford to stoop to certain levels because people are not going to judge the character of the individual, but rather that of the person in charge. If you witness a 15 year old fighting with a 5 year old does it really matter what the 5 year old did? Who's supposed to have more sense in how to handle the situation?

This was handled poorly from what I have seen. It started with snotty custom titles. Myself and a few others thought it was actually funny, but didn't see the underlying "warning" in it. That's not how you moderate or administrate. That's what sparked the whole issue; the way it was handled.

Was Ryan wrong for how he acted after the fact? Without a doubt he could have done things differently, but I stand firm on the fact that it would have never gotten here had things been handled properly by those in charge.

Certain mods' hands are just as dirty as Ryan's for the way the situation has been handled.

All this for harmless enthusiasm/spamming. It's just silly to me.

[Hurin]

Just a few quick points:

Despite calls for it, we're not about to start implementing hard-and-fast rules about consecutive posts. Sometimes it happens naturally and that's not a problem. But there's a distinction between the occasional double-post and someone who feels compelled to visit the forums several times per day and reply to nearly every single response in every thread in which he participates. Nearly always to the same people. And nearly always merely to repeat "w00t!" at each other. It may have been enthusiastic. But it was also disruptive and the forums were beginning to become drowned in the babble of a very few who felt it necessary to post "w00t!" at each other several times per day. And the vast majority of it tended to swerve off-topic into private jokes, etc.

We shouldn't need any more rules than we already have. We all depend on each other to behave with some eye towards etiquette and common decency. Being in a community means that we don't all just get to "get our freak on" as much as we want and behave however we see fit regardless of how that affects others or the community as a whole. People shouldn't feel free to go from thread to thread posting nonsense (even if it's enthusiastic nonsense) anymore than they should expect to be able to stand up in a nice restaurant at regular intervals to scream at the top of their lungs about how very much they love the food. And when the restaurant owner or staff asks them to please stop disrupting the enjoyment of others in the restaurant, it takes someone with a pretty big problem with any type of authority to say: "F--k you man! Don't tell me how to enjoy this restaurant." And just because a few people in the restaurant know and like the guy and his constant outbursts of "THIS FOOD ROCKS!" . . . and a few even begin to join in. . . that doesn't make it appropriate. Nor does it make it good for the restaurant no matter how much of a kick a few patrons might get out of it.

It comes as no surprise that there's a pattern of people who personally know and like Ryan coming to his defense and stating that his habits did not bother them. However, that's not really the point. The point is that a poster's habits shouldn't be disruptive or overtly annoying to a substantial subset of the other 99.9% of the members that have *not* met him personally or gotten to intimately know and appreciate whatever quirks so endear him to some.

And please, let's not act as though we're all a hair's breadth away from being sh*t-canned because we make a short post from time to time or share a private joke in public occasionally. To conflate that with what we've been dealing with here is to be pretty wilfully and conveniently obtuse. Despite all the private warnings, depsite all the public warnings, despite all the times he flipped the staff the bird, blatantly flouted the warnings and actually increased his disruptive activities, went out of his way to provoke the staff, and incite his friends to "support" him in his fight against "nazis", he still wasn't banned until he couldn't wait out a 3-day temporary ban and decided to create a shill account and pretend he was someone else.

Finally, though I am probably the most verbose staff member in taking the time to write out the reasoning behind our actions, I am by no means the "hardest line" staff member here. And despite some making this a personal thing between me and misterryno, I really wouldn't have cared if he were to tell me repeatedly to "go f--k myself" in private so long as he had actually acted upon the warnings being issued by the rest of the staff. So this isn't about apologizing to me as far as I'm concerned. And based upon the overall pleasant communications we've had since his banning, I think he knows that.

[EXO]

I totally agree with Macrossman. But disagree with the end results and I think he refuses to see what the end results were. It started out with the whole spamming thing but there was a lot more after that that maybe he was unaware of. But this is where we're at because of both parties... I don't really see the point of arguing it anymore than this so this is where we lock it. I'm glad both sides are argued on this thread but this is the point where the horse died and we're still beating it.

[Roy Focker]

a ban is a ban...not a temporary time out.

He actually was given a temporary time out. It was meant for 3 days. He seemed to end it early on his own.

A couple of days off is nothing serious. Just a reminder that a member need to cool down and that there are rules here. It was meant to help before things get too serious. His attitude before and actions during convinced me there wasn't much help for him. In the future I hope when we mods (especially I) have to give someone a time out they use the time wisey.

Shall we close this topic now?