Duke Togo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 Oh, come on now, they showed the actual Megaroad design at the beginning of Frontier, its canonical. Quote
Zinjo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 (edited) Oh, come on now, they showed the actual Megaroad design at the beginning of Frontier, its canonical. That's the puzzle now isn't it? In Chronicles it is listed with the DYRL movie ships, outside of the "official" historical reference materials in the officially sanctioned books. There is also the depiction of Hikaru in the movie uniform in the very same prologue. Now as most state, SDFM is the canonical depiction of the the events of SW1, therefore how is it that Ichijo is in a movie costume as opposed to his actual Spacy uniform or flight suit? Is the Megaroad liftoff meant to be real or the in universe movie depiction of the event? Consistency would suggest the latter. Is it real or is it memorex? Until something is otherwise published, the DYRL lineart for the Megaroad 01 design is now suspect, with respect to canon.... Your rules... not mine... Edited September 25, 2008 by Zinjo Quote
RedWolf Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 Your rules... not mine... We actually saw the Megaroad 1 lift off in Flashback 2012. Not to mention original Frontier footage of it. And we also saw the Megaroad 13 in the Macross 7 Plus clip Spritia Dreaming. Quote
anime52k8 Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 That's the puzzle now isn't it? In Chronicles it is listed with the DYRL movie ships, outside of the "official" historical reference materials in the officially sanctioned books. There is also the depiction of Hikaru in the movie uniform in the very same prologue. Now as most state, SDFM is the canonical depiction of the the events of SW1, therefore how is it that Ichijo is in a movie costume as opposed to his actual Spacy uniform or flight suit? Is the Megaroad liftoff meant to be real or the in universe movie depiction of the event? Consistency would suggest the latter. Is it real or is it memorex? Until something is otherwise published, the DYRL lineart for the Megaroad 01 design is now suspect, with respect to canon.... Your rules... not mine... it's pritty much accepted that in terms of story and spacific events, SDFM is the offical canon, but DYRL is currently canon with respect to designs. Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 That's the puzzle now isn't it? No, there's no puzzle. Megaroad Class is Megaroad Class, Macross Class is Macross Class. Quote
sketchley Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 Didn't it appear in the start of M7, too? Anyhow, the point of my confusion was the use of both classes of ship. Though someone else pointed out that the Space Destroyer (which has the Megalord) is as the UN Spacy was in 2009, before both SWI and the change of the SDF-1 from Megalord to Megaroad. I'm still mid-translation of the Chronicle article (in fact almost finished the SDF-1 Macross episode and about to start the Megaroad section), and I'm sure that will clarify things, somewhat. Though, I'm still a bit confused why the Megalord image was used... as the other article specifically states that it's the SDF-1 Macross design which is copied, not the Megalord one. Quote
Zinjo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 We actually saw the Megaroad 1 lift off in Flashback 2012. Not to mention original Frontier footage of it. And we also saw the Megaroad 13 in the Macross 7 Plus clip Spritia Dreaming. That's the point... Was FB2012 similar to DYRL or canon? Already addressed the Frontier footage. We saw a Megaroad in Mac 7??? Any screenies. I don't recall that one... I do enjoy how some will adamantly argue against any notion that they don't personally accept, as non-canon due to their various rules and regulations, but make exceptions for those elements they like or accept regardless of how they may contravine those very same rules. Quote
Zinjo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 No, there's no puzzle. Megaroad Class is Megaroad Class, Macross Class is Macross Class. That's not the puzzle. The puzzle is whether the Megaroad depicted is the actual design or was it merely a Macross class ship "called" Megaroad XX... Though, we'll need to wait to see if Sketchly finds the clarification in Chronicles... Quote
Zinjo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 I'm still mid-translation of the Chronicle article (in fact almost finished the SDF-1 Macross episode and about to start the Megaroad section), and I'm sure that will clarify things, somewhat. Though, I'm still a bit confused why the Megalord image was used... as the other article specifically states that it's the SDF-1 Macross design which is copied, not the Megalord one. Is not the SDF-2 Megalord a copy of the SDF-1 Macross? It is still a Macross class vessel is it not? Somewhat larger, but still a copy of nearly all the elements that went into the SDF-1... To say otherwise is like saying the NMC 13 is not a copy of the NMC 1 because it looks slightly different... Quote
Gubaba Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 In Chronicles it is listed with the DYRL movie ships, outside of the "official" historical reference materials in the officially sanctioned books. No, it's in the World Guide Sheet on the Emigration Fleets, too. And of course the Megaroad-01 is only listed on the DYRL-version Macross sheet...we don't have TV-version Macross or Megaroad-01 sheets yet. Using Chronicle as a definitive resource is fine, but it's a little early in its publication history to start talking about what it's excluding. Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 25, 2008 Posted September 25, 2008 The puzzle is whether the Megaroad depicted is the actual design or was it merely a Macross class ship "called" Megaroad XX... No, its the Megaroad Class. Its always been the Megaroad Class. We see a bunch of them at the beginning of Frontier. Quote
Zinjo Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 No, it's in the World Guide Sheet on the Emigration Fleets, too. And of course the Megaroad-01 is only listed on the DYRL-version Macross sheet...we don't have TV-version Macross or Megaroad-01 sheets yet. Using Chronicle as a definitive resource is fine, but it's a little early in its publication history to start talking about what it's excluding. I didn't say it was excluded, I said it's design may be in question. No, its the Megaroad Class. Its always been the Megaroad Class. We see a bunch of them at the beginning of Frontier. We see icons at the beginning of Frontier, not ships. Exactly what the Megaroad looks like "historically" is still in question. Granted the Chronicle may yet clarify this, but at this moment with the issues thus far published, we can no longer be definitively sure. Quote
sketchley Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 correction: we see one launching from Earth. Quote
Gubaba Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 I didn't say it was excluded, I said it's design may be in question. Again, I think saying that the Macross Chronicles might be pointing towards a design change when they have no entry yet about the design in question...well, seems like jumping the gun a bit. There's nothing so far in the magazine that even hints that the Megaroad-01 has been relegated to only the DYRL continuity. Quote
RedWolf Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 I didn't say it was excluded, I said it's design may be in question. We see icons at the beginning of Frontier, not ships. Exactly what the Megaroad looks like "historically" is still in question. Granted the Chronicle may yet clarify this, but at this moment with the issues thus far published, we can no longer be definitively sure. Zinjo they actually show Megaroad class ships originally animated in both Macross 7 Plus and Macross Frontier. It's canon. Quote
Zinjo Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 Zinjo they actually show Megaroad class ships originally animated in both Macross 7 Plus and Macross Frontier. It's canon. I'll wait for the write up in Chronicles before conceading the point... Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 I'll wait for the write up in Chronicles before conceading the point... Dude, its in the frigging animation. More than once, LOL. They've been part of the canon for over 2 decades. Quote
Xeros Posted September 26, 2008 Posted September 26, 2008 You know guys... Who cares if it's canon or not when SK & Co will decides to change something they'll do it without ask Quote
Zinjo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Dude, its in the frigging animation. More than once, LOL. They've been part of the canon for over 2 decades. Got a screenie of the Mac 7 animation or an episode? I'd Love to review it. As for being part of canon, we've already seen "canon" change several times in 2 decades. The author of the universe has also stated he won't be tied to it, so that really isn't a strong argument. You made a similar argument about the Global and well we know how that turned out... As I've said, I will wait until the Chronicle comes out with the write up. With 50 issues coming, I'm sure we'll be getting specs on all the capital ships eventually, including the Megaroad class. Quote
Gubaba Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Got a screenie of the Mac 7 animation or an episode? I'd Love to review it. I don't have a screenshot, but it's during the "In 2009, mankind encountered an alien race known as the Zentradi" narration that begins nearly every one of the first fourteen or so episodes. I'm not really sure why you're arguing for the Megaroad design being changed, though. AFAIK, nothing has suggested that it's been changed...not Frontier, not the Chronicle, not the Remastered DVDs. Why do you think it may have been changed? Quote
Zinjo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 I don't have a screenshot, but it's during the "In 2009, mankind encountered an alien race known as the Zentradi" narration that begins nearly every one of the first fourteen or so episodes. I'm not really sure why you're arguing for the Megaroad design being changed, though. AFAIK, nothing has suggested that it's been changed...not Frontier, not the Chronicle, not the Remastered DVDs. Why do you think it may have been changed? I am suggesting it is now questionable, since so far it has only been included in the DYRL entries in Chronicles. It may not have been changed, however unlike some, I am open to the possibility that it may see a design change or what some originally held as sacred canon is now different. I am fully open to all possibilities, those being: that it is the same as we've always thought or that it is somehow different now (whether that be a physical design change or even the inclusion of Macross Class warships like the NMC system utilizes). Challenging convention is not nearly as evil as some might think or want others to believe.... Quote
Gubaba Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 I am suggesting it is now questionable, since so far it has only been included in the DYRL entries in Chronicles. It may not have been changed, however unlike some, I am open to the possibility that it may see a design change or what some originally held as sacred canon is now different. I am fully open to all possibilities, those being: that it is the same as we've always thought or that it is somehow different now (whether that be a physical design change or even the inclusion of Macross Class warships like the NMC system utilizes). Challenging convention is not nearly as evil as some might think or want others to believe.... Oh, I have no problem with challenging convention...and I have to give you props for being on the "right" side of the WTF-1 discussion. But the FB2012-style Megaroad-01 was in the Chronicles' World Guide section, which doesn't include DYRL. So to say it has so far only been in the DYRL section isn't correct. The Queadluun-Rau has only shown up in the DYRL section...but I don't think anyone would argue that they've retconned the TV version out of existance... Quote
Zinjo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 (edited) Oh, I have no problem with challenging convention...and I have to give you props for being on the "right" side of the WTF-1 discussion. But the FB2012-style Megaroad-01 was in the Chronicles' World Guide section, which doesn't include DYRL. So to say it has so far only been in the DYRL section isn't correct. The Queadluun-Rau has only shown up in the DYRL section...but I don't think anyone would argue that they've retconned the TV version out of existance... Yes it is! (checked my copy of issue 1) Well that effectively eliminates the "redesign" question. However, I did notice that is isn't given the SDF Registry in the Chronicle, just the Megaroad 01. I believe (and Sketchly can correct me) that the only mention to the SDF-2 appears to be that the Megaroad's origins are from the SDF-2 warship chassis. Therefore (if that is correct) the question of whether it will retain that SDF registry name for the colony ship itself (or subsequent ships) does remain. If the registry name doesn't refer to the colony ship, then it must refer to something else... Edited September 27, 2008 by Zinjo Quote
Gubaba Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Yes it is! (checked my copy of issue 1) Well that effectively eliminates the "redesign" question. However, I did notice that is isn't given the SDF Registry in the Chronicle, just the Megaroad 01. I believe (and Sketchly can correct me) that the only mention to the SDF-2 appears to be that the Megaroad's origins are from the SDF-2 warship chassis. Therefore (if that is correct) the question of whether it will retain that SDF registry name for the colony ship itself (or subsequent ships) does remain. If the registry name doesn't refer to the colony ship, then it must refer to something else... Well...yeah, I think that it's possible they could futz with that. Although I think they shouldn't, because it might cause Duke Togo to split open and spew out twenty gallons of highly pressurized blood, like a Hokuto no Ken character. Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Therefore (if that is correct) the question of whether it will retain that SDF registry name for the colony ship itself (or subsequent ships) does remain. Except its in the opening animation of Macross Frontier. And before more than one episode. But hey, why let the facts get in the way? Quote
Hiriyu Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Yes it is! (checked my copy of issue 1) Well that effectively eliminates the "redesign" question. However, I did notice that is isn't given the SDF Registry in the Chronicle, just the Megaroad 01. I believe (and Sketchly can correct me) that the only mention to the SDF-2 appears to be that the Megaroad's origins are from the SDF-2 warship chassis. Therefore (if that is correct) the question of whether it will retain that SDF registry name for the colony ship itself (or subsequent ships) does remain. If the registry name doesn't refer to the colony ship, then it must refer to something else... Pardon my intrusion, but isn't the above an exact confirmation of what Togo's been going on about here for the past couple of months? Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 (edited) Tell me I am seeing things: Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-01 SDF-002 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-02 SDF-003 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-04 SDF-005 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-06 SDF-007 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-09 SDF-010 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-13 SDF-014 Edited September 27, 2008 by Duke Togo Quote
daeudi Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 (edited) Tell me I am seeing things: Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-01 SDF-002 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-02 SDF-003 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-04 SDF-005 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-06 SDF-007 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-09 SDF-010 Super Dimension Fortress Megaroad-13 SDF-014 And there is no dount that the light green shadow behind the words are indeed the Megaroad.... makes it "Currently" official, at least. However, that does NOT mean that there were no Macross class ships escorting the Megarod fleets, like Mac 7/25 and Battle 7/25. ===== THAT SAID>>>> Look very closely underneath the MEGAROAD-02... You will see that it was accompanied by the SDF-003... the Megaroad-04 by the sdf-005, etc... You have just pointed out... GASP! That you are BOTH right!!!! Edited September 27, 2008 by daeudi Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 THAT SAID>>>> Look very closely underneath the MEGAROAD-02... You will see that it was accompanied by the SDF-003... the Megaroad-04 by the sdf-005, etc... You have just pointed out... GASP! That you are BOTH right!!!! Uh, no. The SDF-003 is its designation. Quote
Duke Togo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 bah... it was worth a shot 5 points for effort! Quote
VF-25 Messiah Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 We also see "Super Dimension Fortress" written over all the Megaroad's, and "New Macross Class Aircraft Carrier" over Frontier and All the Macrosses. Too blurry to read, but what's the designation for the latter? NMC? Quote
Zinjo Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 (edited) Uh, no. The SDF-003 is its designation. Not necessarily. If the naming convention is consistent, then the SDF-003 as shown here, could denote a warship escourt, just as the NMCV denotes the Battle 025, not Island 1... The naming convention appears to be the escourt ship type, then the colony vessel name (in the case of Frontier it includes all the Islands), then the designation of the warship. In the case of Mac 25, it is the "New Macross Aircraft Carrier"- "Frontier"- "NMCV-025". If the naming convention is consistent then the Megaroad-02 shows a: "Super Dimension Fortress" - "Megaroad-02" - "SDF-003". It isn't definitive, however it does raise the question of "Were the subsequent post Megaroad 01, Megaroad colony vessels escorted by Macross class warships?" The only exception would be the Megaroad 01 which had predominately Zentreadi escourts. As the Megaroads by their very design were by no means a "Fortress." Edited September 27, 2008 by Zinjo Quote
VF-25 Messiah Posted September 27, 2008 Posted September 27, 2008 Ah, so it said NMCV... leads me to question, what does the V stand for? Also if the SDF is reffering to a macross class escort, that would mean that the Global was either the escort for Megaroad 03 before it became the flagship of the 117th research fleet, or that there were two lines of Macross class warships exisiting in paralell (04 Macross "Global" and SDF-4) SDF-2 is clearly listed with Megaroad 01 though, so that would mean it also had a macross class escort. Or that the SDF refers to the megaroad itself like we thought all along. Quote
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