Macross Frontier Series Discussion Thread *READ 1st Post*

[Gubaba]

And just think how many headaches would be solved if everyone did the Hepburn romanization and not an Anglicization. Kuran Kuran.

...Except for the fact that anyone who doesn't know how to pronounce Japanese would probably put the stress on the first syllable, and we'd have a bunch of people saying "KOO-ran KOO-ran," which doesn't sound anything like her name either.

Let's just call her クラン・クラン and be done with it.

BONUS REASON FOR DOING SO: It would drive Misaforsaken up the frickin' WALL!

(Actually, Klan Klang isn't all that bad, despite sounding a little silly. It's certainly heaps better than "Klan Klein.")

Edited November 23, 2008 by Gubaba

[sketchley]

If we're talking butchered pronunciation, even Klan could be. Different speakers of English have different ways of pronouncing, not to mention stressing, the "a". Ever heard the multiples of different ways "drama" can be spoken?

Therefore, the onus is on the reader/speaker to learn or at least be aware of the Japanese vowel pronunciation. In this internet age, there's no excuse not to. If one can find and read this, they sure as heck can find and learn about Japanese pronunciation*.

*Finding that link took 3 seconds. Typing in the BB code to hotlink it took 10 seconds. 3 times longer!

Edited November 23, 2008 by sketchley

[Zinjo]

The connection with Macross Zero is great, is it just me or the Macross Zero logo is what the Vajras have somehow tattued on their shells?

The Vajra markings are clearly natural, however it would not surprise me if the PC adopted the markings as their Republic insignia, since it bears a strong resemblance to a simplistic galaxy picture anyway.

[Nexx Stalker]

After a complete marathon through the whole series (this time with Italian subtitles, which are really very good even if the karaoke thing is a little bit unnerving) I must say that Ranka really spoils the fun for me in the latter episodes of the series (13 and 19 to 22 in particular). She's so annoying I am always tempted to fast forward her scenes. This is the first time in a Macross series I don't look forward to seeing some episodes because I know she will irritate me beyond any measure. Loli Klan is still bad, but my dislike for this artistic choice pales compared to my hate for Ranka.

To add to this, after repeated views the CG mecha do appear for what they are: big computer generated toys. I must confess they are really well done and have mazing detail for a TV series (space battles and all, coreographically speaking they are magnificent), but I miss traditional animated mechas very much. After the excitment for this new series has settled, now I would lower my vote from 7 to 6.

Luckily, there's Sheryl. If Ranka missed the mark, Miss Nome is really an intriguing character and a wothy addition to the Macross universe, along with Bobby (Canaria has potential, even if she had a very short screen time).

Episodes 17 (thanks, Fukuyama!) and 25 remain the best for me.

I would have preferred a more adult story, but I guess it was mainly aimed at gathering new fans instead of the "old guard".

All in all a nice series in general, 100% better than any Gundama (hahaha) and a good Macross series at that, but it could have been so much better.

[azrael]

The special goods in vol. 4 is the "Bird Human" movie insert.

Directed by George Yamamori

And the promotional roadshow of the movie is around July 12th, 2059.

[Morpheus]

BONUS REASON FOR DOING SO: It would drive Misaforsaken up the frickin' WALL!

(Actually, Klan Klang isn't all that bad, despite sounding a little silly. It's certainly heaps better than "Klan Klein.")

Klan Klang sounded very wrong, its like a SFX when two mecha are ***** each other

But its no better than naming her "Kalvin Klein"......

[edwin3060]

The special goods in vol. 4 is the "Bird Human" movie insert.

Directed by George Yamamori

And the promotional roadshow of the movie is around July 12th, 2059.

Wow... any idea how long the movie insert is?

[mewarmo990]

I'd rate Macross Frontier an 8.9 out of 10. When it comes to rating things, 1 is terrible, 5 is average, and 10 is excellent.

Pros: Almost always incredibly satisfying, to say the least.

Tributes abound to other previous Macross series. From the subtle (Miranda Merin in Miss Macross) to the hilarious (dying over pineapples? not this time!) to the plain awesome (Fire BOMBAAH!!!), Shoji Kawamori made sure that there were plenty of references to satisfy fans that have been sticking around since the original series. As soon as I finished MF it made me want to go back and watch the entire SDF Macross and DYRL? movie. So I did

A superb soundtrack. I've always been just accepting of Yoko Kanno's work, but she really outdid herself this time, composing an epic score to MF as well as all of the new songs for Sheryl and Ranka.

MF returns directly to the politics, love triangles, and fighter combat that we all loved in the original SDF Macross and DYRL. The complex web of subplots, made all the more interesting by new and unexplained characters and antagonists, was IMO executed well enough so that audiences had a good feel of what was going on by the end. IMO the Vajra in particular were a worthy addition to the Macross universe, as they provide a lot of interesting backstory and answers, while raising many new ones.

From the first episode, you can already tell by the quality that Macross Frontier had a huge animation budget. Like Macross Zero, MF also uses CG to draw its mechanical models and scenes. I personally think that Studio Satelight did a really good job with this, even if the Valkyries do look a bit like toys. Kawamori did state, however, that he wanted to move away from more realistic, traditional fighter design and focus on just making them look cool rather than maintaining aerodynamics or passive stealth. IMHO he succeeded in this regard.

New talent Megumi Nakajima did a great job being both the spoken and written voice of Ranka Lee, especially since this is her first role in both anime and music. Even if the character herself got a bit annoying at times, I think they really nailed it with choosing someone who could live up to Mari Iijima's legacy.

MF brings in some very interesting new characters and backgrounds. Alto might be a typical hothead, but whoever heard of kabuki actors piloting fighter jets? Bobby Margot is both kickass and very frightening to straight men. Sheryl seems like a tsundere tough girl at first, but develops significantly over time, and her later confirmed ancestry makes it even more awesome.

Cons: A few significant issues, but otherwise minor complaints

Hit-and-miss visual quality. Though MF's budget is certainly considerable, it really seems like they threw all the money into animating the first and last episodes. The 2D animation gets really drab towards the end of the first half, where models and people are often distorted or missing details. By the time the final episodes rolled around the quality was better than ever, but I feel that this inconsistency could have been avoided.

Length. Or rather, lack of it. Given the probable production costs, I can understand Studio Nue's desire to cap MF at 25 episodes. However, I felt that if there had more more episodes, or if the plot had been distributed more evenly among the slower paced early-middle episodes, a lot more could have been explained. Canaria's back story, along with Grace's co-conspirators, for example, were barely touched on in the series. Because of the limited length, events were rushed towards the last few episodes, and there is never time to show the aftermath of the war or fully resolve the love triangle as SDF Macross was able to do with another ten or so episodes.

Uneven writing exacerbates the short plot. There are some episodes where almost nothing of note happens, and time in MF seems to move at a turtle's pace. Other times, evil political intrigue, action-packed dogfighting, and the loss of major characters completely immerses the audience in the universe and makes you never want to stop watching. Unfortunately, those slow episodes take up a good half of the series, so I wouldn't be surprised if some people felt turned off before the series had a chance to redeem itself. (And redeem itself it did.)

25 years have passed since the production of SDF Macross. Much of what was once considered "original" and "classic" is now considered "cliched" and "stereotypical" among all but the most hardcore of fanboys. That said, with the exception of a few characters and subplots, MF fails to innovate its genre in the way that its original predecessor did. Maybe I was expecting too much after rewatching all of the older series, but though it is spectacular in many areas, MF doesn't bring much to the table that we haven't seen before.

Following up on the previous point, MF contains copious fanservice, a phenomenon that was most definitely not present in SDF Macross. I suppose it was unavoidable in this day and age, but I always felt that Macross was somewhat above this. It's not so bad that it detracts from the actual show, which can't be said for some other anime.

What is up with that POS VF-171(EX)? So you're telling me that the standard N.U.N.S. fighter nearly two decades after the YF-19 was chosen is inferior to the VF-17 special forces fighter, which in turn was inferior to the VF-19 that was to be adopted as the main variable fighter of the fleet? Even after its makeshift upgrades, the VF-171EX isn't even a close match for the VF-25 or a determined Vajra, much less a terrible horde of V-9 Ghosts.

What happened to the SDF-2 Megaroad fleet? This is one of those questions that will never be answered, but after rewatching DYRL and Flashback 2012, I want to know more than ever. They even had the nerve to bait us with the SDF-3 Global (before we knew the name, of course) and Birla's fold quartz ring! ARRGGGH.

---

Overall, Macross Frontier has its share of problems here and there, but then again, so did SDF Macross. SDF Macross and its movie spinoff are still classics, but Macross Frontier is a worthy successor to the universe in my book. I'm looking forward to the movie, and I can't wait to see what they do for the 50th anniversary. In conclusion, I leave you with this lovely picture...

Edited December 5, 2008 by mewarmo990

[promethuem5]

Holy F-all... I just finished finally watching MacF... stared last night and got about halfway, finished it up today. I voted for a perfect 10, and honestly, I loved it. Mac+ is probably still my favorite in the series for its design and characters, but honestly, MacF blows everything else away. I'm usually not a big fan of the music and love side of it, but MacF handled it all so well, and the music was actually really good and I enjoyed it alot! The CGI for the mecha was fantastic, and I didn't find it a distracting difference at all. The action was well choreographed and had the frenetic balls to the walls aspect that Mac0 only sometimes delivered on. I loved the nods to previous series in the franchise, and really liked how the characters were similar to alot of the archetypes setup in SDF:Mac without being cookie-cutter copies, and I loved it. I say: bring on the toys! I'd also love to get an SMS jacket like Ozma wears... that'd be sweEt.

Edited December 14, 2008 by promethuem5

[Gubaba]

I'd also love to get an SMS jacket like Ozma wears... that'd be sweat.

Sweaty jacket...ewwww....

(Actually, I think that you can buy an SMS jacket...but it's pretty damn expensive.)

[promethuem5]

Good catch... noone wants a sweaty jacket. HLJ doesn't have any SMS jacket listed, so I've no idea... it'd probably be easier to buy the patch and do it myself with a nice jacket I know fits that I buy here.

[Gubaba]

Good catch... noone wants a sweaty jacket. HLJ doesn't have any SMS jacket listed, so I've no idea... it'd probably be easier to buy the patch and do it myself with a nice jacket I know fits that I buy here.

I was sure there was one...I may be confusing it with something else, though.

[promethuem5]

I edited out the typo, no worries. I needed a new all-weather jacket today and got it in black... I'm debating buying the patches from HLJ, but the dollar to yen sucks right now and they're backordered on the SMS patch... I'm trying to see if anyone can find me the three patches here like at Frank and Sons or something... I need one of each patch, SMS, Mac25, and the Skull Squadron... I probably won't bother to add the red trim to the jacket tho.

[VFTF1]

Boo hoo...sniff...sniff...

My friends on my local general anime fanboard all hate Macross Frontier - and what's worse - mainly for the reasons I love it. They like the action sequences but are upset that instead of squashing all the bugs the bugs actually turn out to be ok kind of folks and everyone lives happily ever after thanks to the power of song.... they complain that too much time was spent on the love trianlge and not enough time killing people, and they don't like Ranka (and not in the same way as peple here playfully debate whos' songs are better - because they don't like any of the songs) ....

Boo hooo ... sure is lonely apparently being the only person in a country of 40 million that actually like Macross Frontier ... all the more reason why it's cool to have this forum

Pete

[Gubaba]

...they don't like Ranka (and not in the same way as peple here playfully debate whos' songs are better - because they don't like any of the songs) ....

I dunno...a lot of the Ranka hate here certainly wasn't playful at all. One member in particular seemed to make it his business to personally insult anyone who didn't hate Ranka. Thankfully he hasn't shown up since the series ended, since he hated the ending so much.

And hey! I'm no longer at the Sharon Apple concert. Too bad, really. Being a Macross II Surivivor isn't nearly as much fun.

[Xeros]

And hey! I'm no longer at the Sharon Apple concert. Too bad, really. Being a Macross II Surivivor isn't nearly as much fun.

So, now you are in a parallel universe? xD

Boo hoo...sniff...sniff... sad.gif

My friends on my local general anime fanboard all hate Macross Frontier - and what's worse - mainly for the reasons I love it. They like the action sequences but are upset that instead of squashing all the bugs the bugs actually turn out to be ok kind of folks and everyone lives happily ever after thanks to the power of song.... they complain that too much time was spent on the love trianlge and not enough time killing people, and they don't like Ranka (and not in the same way as peple here playfully debate whos' songs are better - because they don't like any of the songs) ....

Boo hooo sad.gif ... sure is lonely apparently being the only person in a country of 40 million that actually like Macross Frontier ... all the more reason why it's cool to have this forum smile.gif

Pete

I have to ask, the guys of your local fanboard are teens? if the answer is yes I wouldn't be surprised

Edited December 20, 2008 by Xeros

[Killer Robot]

I have to ask, the guys of your local fanboard are teens? if the answer is yes I wouldn't be surprised

And probably never seen any Macross before. Macross is always the series where the day is won by the power of song and big guns. If anything, Frontier was unusual for not having a character constantly saying he hates soldiers, the military, and fighting.

[VFTF1]

I have to ask, the guys of your local fanboard are teens? if the answer is yes I wouldn't be surprised

Nope. They are younger than me - but all in their 20s (I'm almost thirty)... So that's what makes it sadder still...

And probably never seen any Macross before. Macross is always the series where the day is won by the power of song and big guns. If anything, Frontier was unusual for not having a character constantly saying he hates soldiers, the military, and fighting.

Nope... sadly they've seen all the previous Macross series and movies. In fact, they seem to be "Macross Plus Fanatics" - if you can believe such a thing exists; and claim that Frontier was bad because it wasn't as cool as Plus. It's very hard to argue with them, because they set up this view whereby SDFM/DYRL/PLUS = awesome and then Frontier/7 = poo poo.

And then over and over I get remarks like "we need to have a Macross series that shows us what happened to Megaroad-1 and tells the further story of Hikaru, Misa and the others"

Naturally as usual I'm making a big deal out of nothing - since it's just other people's opinions, but still - I find it interesting that this view exists and is so hard to penetrate.

But also, they are kind of inconsistent in their views. For example - they say that the animation in Frontier is lifeless and has no soul (the "has no soul" part is then explained to mean "CGI!") ... but then in the next sentence they are capable of writing that they LOVED the CGI renderings of the Macross Frontier and the Macross Galaxy... but they still hated the CGI battles... ??? I find it difficult to concieve of how you can love the CGI renderings of the fleet ships and then hate the battles of which 99% take place...around and often with the fleet ships...

Then I get things like "Frontier characters are just copies of Roy, Hikaru etc etc" which are easily dismissed with facts (that argument was attempted on these boards as well) - BUT I also get the following lines: "The only good character is Klan Klan because she's like Millia." Sooooo...all of the other characters are bad because they're just copies of past characters...but Klan Klan is awesome because...she's a copy of a past character

Like I said - obviously different people will have different opinions, and it's happened on this board too - but I was just surprised at the fact that EVERYBODY on my local board, other than me, had basically the above view...

and it made me wanna cry and come running to Macross World for comfort

Pete

[Radd]

Boo hoo...sniff...sniff...

My friends on my local general anime fanboard all hate Macross Frontier - and what's worse - mainly for the reasons I love it.

I can relate. My friends aren't limited to just violent action anime, there's actually quite a variety of tastes, but almost all the shows I love, all my friends (at least those local to me right now) seem to hate them. They do seem into Frontier, though, which is great. Most of them actually don't like anime with giant robots. Oddly enough, most of them thought Plus was just "alright", but really got into Zero. I can't even watch shows like Gao Gai Gar or Gaint Robo with them. Most of them dislike Leiji Matsumoto stuff, too. It's pretty frustrating when trying to find anime we can all enjoy.

[VFTF1]

Well - friends not liking anime that you like is one thing, but my girlfriend had a hissy fit when she saw that I had Ranka as my cell phone background (now of course I have my girlfriend) and when I had Ranka as my laptop wallpaper (now I have EVA-01).

Strangely enough, she was content when I had Hikaru embracing Misa as my laptop wallpaper because "they look like us" (her words).

But Ranka makes her rage with jealousy It's actually quite amusing.

She was also jealous of my Tohsaka Rhin Revoltech figure

Pete

[blacklotus]

Well - friends not liking anime that you like is one thing, but my girlfriend had a hissy fit when she saw that I had Ranka as my cell phone background (now of course I have my girlfriend) and when I had Ranka as my laptop wallpaper (now I have EVA-01).

Strangely enough, she was content when I had Hikaru embracing Misa as my laptop wallpaper because "they look like us" (her words).

But Ranka makes her rage with jealousy It's actually quite amusing.

She was also jealous of my Tohsaka Rhin Revoltech figure

Pete

Reminds me of a close friend in a similar kind of situation. He had Saber (from Fate/Stay Night) as a wallpaper and background art and also as a 'Sorry. I'm not available now. Please leave a msg after the beep tone' answering service. Her girlfriend gave him a ultimatum: Either get rid of them or find another GF.

Well, he's married to her now. But his only hobby now is to take care of his daughter.

And no, he has no more anime in his life. But he is permitted to watch the Disney Channel's High School Musicals though.

[NSJ23]

Just finished the series this weekend and loved it! i gave it a 9/10 on the poll, will give it a 2nd run through after X-mas. best Macross sequel since plus IMO and i know not everyone likes plus but it's my favorite.

Loved all the charters except for Luca

Klan changing from amazon to tiny child looking was classic

poor Michael

Alto kicked ass

Macross Quarter Bandai please make a toy of this i don't care what size it is

[Gubaba]

Macross Quarter Bandai please make a toy of this i don't care what size it is

Don't worry...they're making one.

[azrael]

Don't worry...they're making one.

*cough* http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?showtopic=28006 */cough*

[VFTF1]

Reminds me of a close friend in a similar kind of situation. He had Saber (from Fate/Stay Night) as a wallpaper and background art and also as a 'Sorry. I'm not available now. Please leave a msg after the beep tone' answering service. Her girlfriend gave him a ultimatum: Either get rid of them or find another GF.

Well, he's married to her now. But his only hobby now is to take care of his daughter. happy.gif

And no, he has no more anime in his life. But he is permitted to watch the Disney Channel's High School Musicals though. wacko.gif

That is terrible. I would get a divorce. After reading that I'm gonna stop complaining

My ex-girlfriend once told me that she wanted me to sell my collection to buy her a wedding dress.

Guess what happened to her?

My current girlfriend offered to take me to a Woody Allen concert for Christmas, and I told her that I would rather she came with me to a comics store and got me some Gundam manga, or maybe a neato figure or something and she said ok

So...she's not that bad - actually I think she rocks all things considered The jealousy was cute - and it's not like she told me to stop collecting or something. Besides; she wore a hat like Sheryl's (she's also blond - albeit dark blond) and had me take her picture and put that on my cell phone as wallpaper So - she's quite playful about it... I wonder sometimes if the reasons she was so aghast at the Ranka wallpaper was because she - being blond - could stand me liking Sheryl (another blond) but Ranka was so "different" that it scared her? Same with Tohsaka Rhin (brunette after all).

I dunno In any event - hopefully one day I'll get a chance to show her Macross Frontier. For now, I've pretty much convinced her to give NGE a chance - we'll see how much that works.

Pete

[DWN013]

I don't remember seeing this in any of the discussions on here when ep 25 came out, but anyone noticed this before? When battle frontier swoops in and daedalus punches battle galaxy, it friggin chops galaxy in half. For a half second you can see the top move away from the bottom.

[DeX-kun]

I don't remember seeing this in any of the discussions on here when ep 25 came out, but anyone noticed this before? When battle frontier swoops in and daedalus punches battle galaxy, it friggin chops galaxy in half. For a half second you can see the top move away from the bottom.

Well it just goes to show you the true power of Battle Frontier lol, still the whole series pretty much had amazing animations and CG.

[ron5864]

Now that I look back at the series, the number 25 came up more than its fair share in the show. Here are some examples:

VF-25

25 Episodes

Alto died 25 times in the flight simulator

Number 25 on the SMS jackets

Macross Frontier 25th Migration Fleet

There might be more, but that's what I caught so far.

[Gubaba]

Now that I look back at the series, the number 25 came up more than its fair share in the show. Here are some examples:

VF-25

25 Episodes

Alto died 25 times in the flight simulator

Number 25 on the SMS jackets

Macross Frontier 25th Migration Fleet

There might be more, but that's what I caught so far.

Macross Quarter

Ranka being a quarter Zentradi

Fold Quartz

[DeX-kun]

Macross Quarter

Ranka being a quarter Zentradi

Fold Quartz

lmao, now that you mention these I just realized that. Wow thanks for catching that because I didn't see it that way until now lol.

[Gubaba]

lmao, now that you mention these I just realized that. Wow thanks for catching that because I didn't see it that way until now lol.

Yeah...I didn't catch Fold Quartz until I say it written in Japanese; and then for some reason it leapt out at me.

[fadeout]

Just finished it. Cetainly didn't knock my socks off, but as something from the Macross franchise, I couldn't rightly expect more. It's actually kind of an achievement that it stayed so close the "classic" formula without seeming too shallow or uninspired. But that may just be because I haven't actually seen a Macross show in ages.

But anyway, I do have to give creedence to complaints about all the schoolyard shojou mellodrama. I mean, a little of that is ok, but really, this could have been a shojou romance in later episodes, if it wasn't for the tearful confrontations being interrupted by giant murderous bugs. I was also impressed initially that characters actually seemed to behave like real human beings instead of cutouts and supermen. When the Vajra got into the city for the first time, not only did people obviously die, but Ranka and Alto responded to it with more than just passing shock. However, this eroded later, everyone prettymuch hit the same notes with every single interaction. And in the end we got a hammered-into-the-dirt coexistance with nature message that apparently Japan just cannot get enough of. Although it was a nice touch not to reveal who Alto ultimately went for (I vote threesome).... Rant over, oh and hi new forum.

[Valkyrie addict]

I don't remember seeing this in any of the discussions on here when ep 25 came out, but anyone noticed this before? When battle frontier swoops in and daedalus punches battle galaxy, it friggin chops galaxy in half. For a half second you can see the top move away from the bottom.

hey there, nice catch there, I checked it out, and Battle Frontier has some sort of energy field that actually slashes Battle Galaxy instead of punching it.... nice

and also when Alto and Brera are charging together at the queen, it's barely noticeable but Brera totally owns a second CF VF-27

[Final Vegeta]

But anyway, I do have to give creedence to complaints about all the schoolyard shojou mellodrama. I mean, a little of that is ok, but really, this could have been a shojou romance in later episodes, if it wasn't for the tearful confrontations being interrupted by giant murderous bugs.

Frankly, it bugs me a lot that people don't really know what they are talking about when they use the word "shojo" (maybe you come from 4chan?). Most famous school life anime are either from shonen magazines (for boys) or seinen magazines (for adult males) or even from eroge (for males). Just check the demographic of a title with Wikipedia and you'll be surprised.

Trust me on this one: heterosexual love without incest -> most likely for male audience. This is why the characters of Gundam 00 are aimed at a girl audience for example, the homosexual relationship between Lockon and Tieria dominates all other possible ships.

I was also impressed initially that characters actually seemed to behave like real human beings instead of cutouts and supermen. When the Vajra got into the city for the first time, not only did people obviously die, but Ranka and Alto responded to it with more than just passing shock. However, this eroded later, everyone prettymuch hit the same notes with every single interaction.

Maybe they got accustomed to? Even in SDF Macross Hikaru was shocked when he first confronted a Zentradi face to face, but then he pull himself together for the rest of the anime. I think the anime was focused instead of showing attrition in the surrounding world.

And in the end we got a hammered-into-the-dirt coexistance with nature message that apparently Japan just cannot get enough of.

You are misunderstanding even this one. There is a conflict between two styles of communication, one based on the belly (emotions), the other based on the head (thoughts). In Japanese there is a word, haragei (belly art), which means "comunication without words or gestures". If you watch anime, you should have found many cases where victory is achieved through co-ordinated team playing. In the final episode of MF all good guys are essentially doing team playing, like the Vajra were doing from the start. The opposite is Grace's implant network, which forces people together without the need for feelings of bond.

FV

[sketchley]

(...) And in the end we got a hammered-into-the-dirt coexistance with nature message that apparently Japan just cannot get enough of. (...)

Where is this fallacy coming from? Why don't you come and see what it's really like here.

(...) There is a conflict between two styles of communication, one based on the belly (emotions), the other based on the head (thoughts). In Japanese there is a word, haragei (belly art), which means "comunication without words or gestures". If you watch anime, you should have found many cases where victory is achieved through co-ordinated team playing. In the final episode of MF all good guys are essentially doing team playing, like the Vajra were doing from the start. The opposite is Grace's implant network, which forces people together without the need for feelings of bond.

Good summary.