Keith Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I don't think yuri shoujo is part of his interests. Yuri should be a part of everyone's interests, but regardless, nee-san incredibly common in anime. Quote
wolfx Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Yuri should be a part of everyone's interests, but regardless, nee-san incredibly common in anime. Not many ppl here watch anime outside of macross. Just like not many ppl in naruto forums watch other anime outside naruto. Quote
RichterX Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 You guys do watch more anime than just Macross right?? what is this anime thing you are talking about? Quote
Keith Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 what is this anime thing you are talking about? It involves magic flying bicycles, and huge bouncing tits. Quote
dreamweaver13 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 what is this anime thing you are talking about? Dunno myself. i just keep hearing the word as if it will explain everything, and the meaning of life twice over. maybe it's a fashion thing. just give me my daily dose of my macross cartoons everyday! seriously now- i don't think nee-san is as commonly used as "sempai", in a non-blood related sense. whenever i hear "nee-san" in an anime, i assume it's because they're sisters, unless the series shows otherwise. maybe it's some kind of pixie sisterhood between klan and nene, but certainly i think it's more than a synonym to "sempai". so i wouldn't go as far as dismissing anyone who makes an assumption about "nee-san" as someone who doesn't watch anime. Quote
wolfx Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) seriously now- i don't think nee-san is as commonly used as "sempai", in a non-blood related sense. whenever i hear "nee-san" in an anime, i assume it's because they're sisters, unless the series shows otherwise. maybe it's some kind of pixie sisterhood between klan and nene, but certainly i think it's more than a synonym to "sempai". so i wouldn't go as far as dismissing anyone who makes an assumption about "nee-san" as someone who doesn't watch anime. In an asian society, we respect our elders by referring to them by honorifics and not by their name. If I know someone is slightly older than me and we are quite close, i'll call him big brother/sister. If the person is considerably older, I'll call them uncle or aunt. In Japan its abit more specific by having the word "sempai" which refers to any general person that is more experienced than you in any particular activity. School, work, yakuza, etc. I didn't realise that the concept will be so alien to non-asians though. Interesting. Benkyo benkyo! PS: As for shoujo yuri....lol...ironically Redwolf is right that everyone is everyone's "sister" in a shoujo yuri anime. "Sachiko nee-sama!" Edited September 23, 2008 by wolfx Quote
DeeBot Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Really? Because I hear it all the time. Anyway, I just realized... the final episode (which is #25), of the series commemorating the 25th anniversary of Macross, is being broadcast on September 25, at 25:25. That's just insane. Maybe there's a 26th episode, but they're not counting it to make the numerology work. Quote
yaiba Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 In Japan its abit more specific by having the word "sempai" which refers to any general person that is more experienced than you in any particular activity. School, work, yakuza, etc. Actually the yakuza would probably use "aniki" (older brother) rather than "sempai", but otherwise I agree. Quote
Kronnang Dunn Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I didn't realise that the concept will be so alien to non-asians though. Interesting. Benkyo benkyo! Actually I had thought of a similar use like sempai... But I was kinda surprised to hear it on this episode (I just forgot Nene used it before). Thx for the info... Quote
d3v Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) PS: As for shoujo yuri....lol...ironically Redwolf is right that everyone is everyone's "sister" in a shoujo yuri anime. "Sachiko nee-sama!" As if AltoxSheryl wasn't yuri enough... wait you mean to say that hime-sama is a guy?? Edited September 23, 2008 by d3v Quote
wolfx Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Actually I had thought of a similar use like sempai... But I was kinda surprised to hear it on this episode (I just forgot Nene used it before). Thx for the info... Well the 1s time she used it it felt really moe. Seeing Nene hiding behind a loli-klan "Klan-nee-sama" was pure <3 Quote
sketchley Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Woah... this is truly deep. Is there any significance to September? Other than 8 days later being October 3rd, the airdate of the first episode of SDF:M. Really? Because I hear it all the time. Anyway, I just realized... the final episode (which is #25), of the series commemorating the 25th anniversary of Macross, is being broadcast on September 25, at 25:25. That's just insane. Maybe there's a 26th episode, but they're not counting it to make the numerology work. Quote
DreamTheFuture Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Woah... this is truly deep. Is there any significance to September? Other than 8 days later being October 3rd, the airdate of the first episode of SDF:M. Yakku de culture!!! Quote
Kronnang Dunn Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) I wonder if the speech gave by burning Grace about "the blood of both Ranshe and Mao initiating the destruction between both species..." meant that she killed both Ranshe and Mao or that she started the attack on the 117th fleet using Ranka and causing their deaths in the process...? Edited September 23, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn Quote
Final Vegeta Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Bah, that's because Alto poor piloting skill, look at Gamlin, he took a CF VF-11 and he beat the crap out of Varauta. That's still an unfair comparison. Beating a VF-27 with a VF-171EX would be like beating a VF-22 with a VF-11. Let's have some thrust to weight ratio (courtesy of Mr. March) to compare: VF-11C Thunderbolt (empty) = 6.33 Fz-109A Elgerzorene (empty) = 8.4 Fz-109F Elgerzorene (empty) = 8.33 VF-17S Nightmare (empty) = 10.04 (the VF-171EX should be a bit better than this) VF-27 (empty) = 46.48 FV Quote
mike_s_6 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 These are my wishes for the final episode, which is already so near: 1. Alto must make a definitive choice between Ranka and Sheryl. 2. The revelation as to why Grace, Leon, and/or Briler want to have a fold network must be so grand I'll fall off my seat. Quote
Kronnang Dunn Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 2. The revelation as to why Grace, Leon, and/or Briler want to have a fold network must be so grand I'll fall off my seat. I thought it was already made known that Bilrer wants to connect the Galaxy using the fold quartz, while Grace and Leon want to become supreme ruler of the Galaxy... Quote
VF-25S Full Armour Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 VF-27 (empty) = 46.48 FV For comparison, an F-22 has a T/W ratio of 1.09 at full fuel load. With such insane power, the VF-27 can literally tow a fully loaded 747 in fighter mode and still outrun AND out accelerate the supposedly best air superiority fighter humanity currently has at the moment. Power, UNLIMITED POWER!!!!!! Quote
mike_s_6 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I thought it was already made known that Bilrer wants to connect the Galaxy using the fold quartz, ... But for what reason? Just to connect everyone? I'm ready for disappointment if that was it in a nutshell. I've accepted galaxy domination as the prime mover for Grace and perhaps Leon, but that in itself feels like a cliched motive, so I'm still looking forward to finding out who exactly Briler wants to communicate with to make a spectacular ending. Quote
VF-25 Messiah Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 But for what reason? Just to connect everyone? I'm ready for disappointment if that was it in a nutshell. I've accepted galaxy domination as the prime mover for Grace and perhaps Leon, but that in itself feels like a cliched motive, so I'm still looking forward to finding out who exactly Briler wants to communicate with to make a spectacular ending. I'm thinking who Bilrer wants to meet is of a highly personal nature, thus low on the 'grand' scale. And what's disappointing about his dream to connect the galaxy? Galaxy conquest is higher on motive list for Leon than it is for Grace, who is more into the whole mad scientist way of changing the world, beating the protoculture by doing something they couldn't and being proven 'right'. Quote
mike_s_6 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) I'm thinking who Bilrer wants to meet is of a highly personal nature, thus low on the 'grand' scale. And what's disappointing about his dream to connect the galaxy? Galaxy conquest is higher on motive list for Leon than it is for Grace, who is more into the whole mad scientist way of changing the world, beating the protoculture by doing something they couldn't and being proven 'right'. That's it, actually, I don't find it fulfilling or enlightening to have enemies whose motive is just to rule the world. Or is a mad scientist. There has to be something else, because these are already beaten down themes. That's why I have hopes that there is something stunning about Birler's dreams, because it's not everyday that we find someone who wants to connect everyone with the hopes of communicating with this yet-unknown 'someone'. Aside from that, I still hope that Leon and Grace still have something else to reveal in the story than being someone who wants to dominate the world, and someone who's just mad (although I feel Leon is a lost cause). Or perhaps I just expect more, or something different. Here's to more revelations in the final episode. Edited September 23, 2008 by mike_s_6 Quote
DeeBot Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I thought it was already made known that Bilrer wants to connect the Galaxy using the fold quartz, while Grace and Leon want to become supreme ruler of the Galaxy... I doubt Leon's doing it for the same reason Grace is. He probably doesn't know all the details about the real potential of the Vajra. I think his ambition more lies along destroying the Vajra, settling the fleet, and becoming a big hero, thereby catapulting his political career to a galaxy-wide scale, burning of the Reichstag-style. It really doesn't matter what his motivation is, though, because whatever he wants, he's not going to get even close. Bilrer's motivation is still a bit mysterious. He says it's about transportation... but he's not exactly the most forthcoming guy. We definitely know what Grace is up to, though her motivation isn't as simple as mere galactic domination. It's the way she wants to dominate the galaxy. She doesn't just want to forge a single empire (as Leon probably wants), but she wants to merge all the sentient species of the galaxy into a single mind. It'd almost be admirable if it weren't also completely murderous. Galaxy may have slightly different goals than Grace (they probably don't want Grace as the central goddess in the system any more than anybody else does); I'm sure we'll find out in the final episode if there's any conflict between them. I agree that Grace and Leon don't exactly have the most original ambitions (although it's notable that nobody's succeeded yet), but I don't think a story needs original motivations to be interesting. Quite the opposite, in fact; novelty for the sake of novelty is poor storytelling. The villainous factions have familiar objectives we can identify with. It's all about the execution, though. And it's not like we want either of them to win, right? Riiight? Personally, if the final episode is going to have any unexpected revelations (and I'm sure it will), I'd rather they be focused on the good guys, and maybe Bilrer (whose alignment I'm still unsure about). Macross Frontier doesn't have to close with a grand message to still be a good show. I wonder if there's going to be a "Yakk Deculture!" version of the final, though. I wouldn't be surprised if they ended up with some footage that they don't have time for in the broadcast edition. Or maybe there'll be bonus episodes or something on the BD. Anyone know what's airing the week after Frontier? I'm wondering if it's definitely not Frontier-related. Quote
info600 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) I thought it was already made known that Bilrer wants to connect the Galaxy using the fold quartz[/b]... and i thought he has another motive of wanting to see someone via the fold quatz (thats from the comments of Omni's ep.24 summary @ RandomCuriosity) another thing, didn't Bilrer wants to connect Galaxies? Edited September 23, 2008 by info600 Quote
Kronnang Dunn Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) I doubt Leon's doing it for the same reason Grace is. He probably doesn't know all the details about the real potential of the Vajra. I think his ambition more lies along destroying the Vajra, settling the fleet, and becoming a big hero, thereby catapulting his political career to a galaxy-wide scale, burning of the Reichstag-style. Don't think so. The assassins Leon sent after Grace told her his last message in a previous episode... and If I remember correctly it was something like "The Galaxy can only have one ruler...", to which Grace responded "Is true..." or something like it. It seemed to me that he knew more by that message. And NUNS isn't in control of the galaxy. Leon is practically already the leader of it with no political adversaries left to stop his absolute control of Frontier. So far the principal objectives of the main players seem to be something like this: 1) Grace: Unite the whole galaxy under her command by using the Vajra fold network and prove that humanity is bigger than the Protoculture by achieving what they couldn't do in 500,000 years. 2) Leon: Dominate the whole galaxy using the Vajra Network for his dictatorial purposes or simply to destroy them completely to allow NUNS expansion in the whole galaxy. 3) Bilrer: Connect the whole galaxy by developing a perfect fold transportation system using the fold quartz from the Vajra. Edited September 23, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn Quote
DreamTheFuture Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Earlier I saw post of the Birdman! Remember it left earth only...50 years ago.... and Vajra... vajra vajra vajra just seem to come out of no where in our galaxy! And they are also a protoculture product.... so I can only imagine the Bird Man is behind the creation of Vajra... who ever named them is very interesting. The name is used for a reason. If you actually look up Vajra, it is the buddhist related godly thunder... easily put. But if you look further into the meaning the thunder is not enough to reach enlightenment. The bell and the vajra combined will achieve enlightenment. The bell signifies sound, which in this case Ranka's singing. Together the bell sound is Buddha's speech in teaching of the dharma. So in a interesting way the song also matches. Do you remember love... More on the Birdman... we actually saw its eye on Galia 4 when a strong jamming signal brought done alto's valk on its way home with ranka... but nothing after that... which could mean the core of Vajra is the bird man, which do make sense because of the bio-mechanoid structure... but ... didn't the battle quarter blow away the main vajra during the attack? hmmmm which... grace may have already knew relating to grace.... what ship is that her conscience on? Seems that her cyborg body can be controlled through folds,,,, but to me she seems not be alone... in one episode the endind credits showed this ship and had two or three people talking to each other with only voices... i think one a young girl? one elderly man and the other i don't know... who are they? they didn't sound evil at all... more plain and interested... if i remember correctly , they were talking about alto... and what they think about him,,, which makes me think one of the voice was Briller. relating ranka... for those who think ranka is related to Sheryl or Mao... I don't think so.... ranka is part zentradi! The hair? The fang? Her mother , Ranshe Mei, had green hair also...which shows zentradi traits. records show that ranshe gave birth to ranka ... also not knowingly passing the same vajra virus. relating sheryl... very interesting character... supposed granddaughter of Dr Mao Nome. then you wonder what was she doing on the streets on galaxy fleet? which is also wierd... i thought homeless don't exist on these colonies? She did mention the ear rings were the only thing from her mom... which turn out to be true with the photograph... beyond that brings me to Nome name. Sara Nome was a priestess on Mayan,,, her voice had powers.... and seems as though Mao shared the same...Some thing about the original protoculture blood. then Sheryl must too... You think just may be !.... Sheryl might sing a protoculture song of life? Maybe something she learned from her mom or grandmother just like Ranka learned the aimo song? BTW.... the battle frontier was rambling how her song is not working with the vajra.... one of the main key to her little fold strength was not only the virus but also the ear ring... that she put on Alto... no wonder her songs don't work somewhat eh? beyond that... she was singing her older songs right? I thought the folds were detected in her new songs? the one she sang for charity...... the feeling is different... the animators made sure to make this point by adding comments of the quarter crew about her new comeback while ranka left for ai-kuns homeworld Quote
DreamTheFuture Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I'm thinking who Bilrer wants to meet is of a highly personal nature, thus low on the 'grand' scale. And what's disappointing about his dream to connect the galaxy? Galaxy conquest is higher on motive list for Leon than it is for Grace, who is more into the whole mad scientist way of changing the world, beating the protoculture by doing something they couldn't and being proven 'right'. judging from his age..... he wants to meet..... Lyn Min-Mei !!! LoL Quote
Valkyrie addict Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 damn, I had a terrible nightmare... like Frontier was like on a desert planning how to finally destroy the Vajra, Grace managed to join the Vajra collective but then turn out that the Vajra had all this planned and needed a human to join so they could evolve and then turned into the Invid they killed Grace and destroyed Frontier and went to Earth to kill everything and cue the beginning story of Mospeada and I was like... WTF!!! NO WAY!!! and at the end were the "see you next deculture" splash, there was a pic of a valkyrie and WWII plane with the word... "Psych, sorry fans - Kawamori" and the promise for a second season... and I just HAD to wake up... eeek Quote
Radd Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 Earlier I saw post of the Birdman! Remember it left earth only...50 years ago.... and Vajra... vajra vajra vajra just seem to come out of no where in our galaxy! And they are also a protoculture product.... What makes you think the Vajra are a product of the Protoculture? Sure, there's some hints in that they have similar markings to the Mayan markings we saw in Zero, but on the other hand we also had a narration stating that neither the Protoculture, nor any race descended from the Protoculture or their works, had managed to get around the limitations of fold technology. The Vajra clearly have. The last time I brought that up, someone did chime in with assurance that the narration had not been mistranslated. Still, translation is a tricky business, while technically correct the way in which it was translated may not be the meaning that was intended, so there's wiggle room for debate as to the origin of the Vajra. I'm inclined to believe that there is enough to suggest a relation to the Bird Man, and so the Protoculture. However, if that is not stated, definitively and without question, by the end of the final episode, then it would appear to me that this link was not something the writer intended, and therefore lead me to believe that there is no connection and any aesthetic similarities are either coincidence, the same designers working on the projects (or just Kawamori himself), or intended as a nod to Zero, without the intent of being an outright story connection. Also, no, it's pretty clear that command ships have their own Queen-like entities, and there is a main Queen on the planet seen in the last couple episodes. They also established that multiple nodes in a fold network would be more powerful than the typical nodes, and the core node would have ultimate power over the rest. A hierarchy. Regarding Sheryl's homelessness, no we've never been lead to believe that there is no homelessness on the colony ships. In Macross 7 we see an entire slum area. Also, any song she sings emits fold waves. This is a byproduct of her late-stage V-type infection. The comments about Sheryl's singing had more to do with her attitude and personality, which had evolved over the course of the series. Quote
Final Vegeta Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 1) Grace: Unite the whole galaxy under her command by using the Vajra fold network and prove that humanity is bigger than the Protoculture by achieving what they couldn't do in 500,000 years. It seems to be more than that. The central node can observe the thoughts of all humanity. It's not excluded that, since implants are forced on people, they have a secretly built-in slave mode. Another innovation is that a consciousness can be downloaded in another body, thus making humans virtually immortal. This would spread the diffusion of cyborg bodies. Even the Protoculture didn't go that far. 3) Bilrer: Connect the whole galaxy by developing a perfect fold transportation system using the fold quartz from the Vajra. It must be mentioned that he made a name in the transport business, so he would also have an economic gain Aside from this though there seems to be something more. From the way things are going, I wouldn't be surprised if he is the father of Ranshe . By the way Kronnang Dunn, the avatar that suited you best so far was the guy from the Macross Zero commercial FV Quote
cyde01 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I wonder if the speech gave by burning Grace about "the blood of both Ranshe and Mao initiating the destruction between both species..." meant that she killed both Ranshe and Mao or that she started the attack on the 117th fleet using Ranka and causing their deaths in the process...? she is talking not about blood in the literal sense but bloodlines, as in ranka (the daughter of ranshe) and sheryl (granddaughter of mao). Quote
yaiba Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 I wonder if the speech gave by burning Grace about "the blood of both Ranshe and Mao initiating the destruction between both species..." meant that she killed both Ranshe and Mao or that she started the attack on the 117th fleet using Ranka and causing their deaths in the process...? she is talking not about blood in the literal sense but bloodlines, as in ranka (the daughter of ranshe) and sheryl (granddaughter of mao). More interesting would be what she meant by "both species". Did she mean humans and vajra, or humans and zentraedi? Quote
VF-25 Messiah Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 (edited) More interesting would be what she meant by "both species". Did she mean humans and vajra, or humans and zentraedi? Except she doesn't use the word 'species' in that scene at all, I believe. Edited September 23, 2008 by VF-25 Messiah Quote
dreamweaver13 Posted September 23, 2008 Posted September 23, 2008 That's it, actually, I don't find it fulfilling or enlightening to have enemies whose motive is just to rule the world. Or is a mad scientist. There has to be something else, because these are already beaten down themes. That's why I have hopes that there is something stunning about Birler's dreams, because it's not everyday that we find someone who wants to connect everyone with the hopes of communicating with this yet-unknown 'someone'. Aside from that, I still hope that Leon and Grace still have something else to reveal in the story than being someone who wants to dominate the world, and someone who's just mad (although I feel Leon is a lost cause). Or perhaps I just expect more, or something different. Here's to more revelations in the final episode. I share your high hopes for Bilrer's final reveal. (his economic reason has already been revealed, but his "sentimental" reason remains a mystery.) on the other hand, i think the series has already revealed grace's true purpose (basically, world domination via fold network and/or surpassing protoculture). but then again, if she turns out to be the last remnant of protoculture... (hehe, how's that for a surprise reveal?) As for leon... well, i have the impression that he's already happy where he is. president of the frontier and of whatever plant it colonizes. remember, he plans to kill the mother queen, thus making the fold network entirely useless. so, i'm guessing he has not interest in grace's angle of things. Quote
Isamu Starkiller Posted September 24, 2008 Posted September 24, 2008 Time....must....go....faster! Can we skip wednesday and go straight to Thursday 9/25? Quote
RedWolf Posted September 24, 2008 Posted September 24, 2008 As for leon... well, i have the impression that he's already happy where he is. president of the frontier and of whatever plant it colonizes. remember, he plans to kill the mother queen, thus making the fold network entirely useless. so, i'm guessing he has not interest in grace's angle of things. Actually Leon's plan is kill the Vajra, steal the fold quartz, and build an army to dominate the galaxy. The Varuta colony of Megaroad 13 when the Protodevlin took over came into war production that built a fleet of 77,000 ships. Imagine the would be manufacturing capability of a planet bound Frontier. Leon wont stop at being merely a president of a colony. That is he didn't want to contact Earth. They'll investigate everything and find his conspiracy. Quote
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