Macross Frontier Episode 21 Talkback Thread *READ 1st Post*

[daeudi]

First off, If a mod wants to move this to wallpapers...Sorry

It needed cleaned up some

"I am Zentraedi, hear me roar!"

===

I have been wondering for a long time if UNS... sorry NUNS... would ever develop weaponry specifically for macronized soldiers. Looks like they are at least starting to.

Alto acted exactly the way most of us would.

Ranka has lost her damned mind, or has been turned to the point that she no longer counts as human/zent.

Based on what we have seen before (Grace just DL'ed herself into a precloned body after Gallion)

I doubt killing Leon or Grace would have any real effect. I believe that Galaxy has been taken over by this faction, and until it is destroyed, we will never be rid of them.

===

I apologize if someone already said this, but I missed it...

Anyone else feel that Frontier is being designed for US distribution? ((Sans HG fight))

The use of Cheyennes instead of old school destroids.

The change to the NUNS logo.

etc.

Plus, (and I will prob get banned for this, lol), it seems as if Frontier is SK's way of saying:

"THIS is how Robotech should have been done!"

Invid= Vajra, Fold Quartz= Protoculture, Ranka= Minmei & Ariel, etc....

Edited August 31, 2008 by daeudi

[Dio]

Plus, (and I will prob get banned for this, lol), it seems as if Frontier is SK's way of saying:

"THIS is how Robotech should have been done!"

Invid= Vajra, Fold Quartz= Protoculture, Ranka= Minmei & Ariel, etc....

I said it a while ago, actually... Kawamori's takin' it back!

http://macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?show...st&p=635142

[Gubaba]

I apologize if someone already said this, but I missed it...

Anyone else feel that Frontier is being designed for US distribution? ((Sans HG fight))

The use of Cheyennes instead of old school destroids.

The change to the NUNS logo.

etc.

Plus, (and I will prob get banned for this, lol), it seems as if Frontier is SK's way of saying:

"THIS is how Robotech should have been done!"

Invid= Vajra, Fold Quartz= Protoculture, Ranka= Minmei & Ariel, etc....

There was a lot of talk about that when the series started...most of it died down after the appearance of the Global, however...

[daeudi]

There was a lot of talk about that when the series started...most of it died down after the appearance of the Global, however...

That? That is such a heavily backlit, fuzzy image that even HG couldn't get away with a lawsuit based on it.

Its a shadow, a silhouette, its nothing.

Edited August 31, 2008 by daeudi

[DrunkenMaster2]

Remember in ep 10 they showed the "U.N. Spacy" logo, so I don't think they show it in the US.

[daeudi]

Remember in ep 10 they showed the "U.N. Spacy" logo, so I don't think they show it in the US.

Perhaps y'all are right, but I think the very few frames that would be an issue could easily be edited, or edited out.

Either way, I expect to see Frontier coming to the States in something other than bootleg.

Hopefully the toys too. [/ThreadDrift]

[Gubaba]

That? That is such a heavily backlit, fuzzy image that even HG couldn't get away with a lawsuit based on it.

Its a shadow, a silhouette, its nothing.

True. However, it's an open question what HG could get away with in a lawsuit. They own the name "Macross." Do they own the kite? Do they own the VF-1? Do they own the name U.N. Spacy? Do they own the name "Zentradi"...?

All of this is completely unknown by us at this point.

And unless there's some kind of legal challenge, it will most likely remain unknown. Which is probably how HG wants it.

I'd love to see Bandai aggressively market MacF to the US, just to see how HG responds...

To be honest, I don't think I'd want to see MacF over here as something other than Macross. While I think the show is strong enough to support itself on its own merits, it gains a lot of power from its context as the 25th Anniversary series.

Speaking of which...I'm surprised no one's mentioned any Ai-kun/Millia connection...all the people who say that "the only good Vajra is a dead Vajra"...do you also think Hikaru should've pulled a gun and shot Millia right between the eyes when Max introduced her to him...?

[magnuskn]

Boring ep. Everything that happened could have been done much quicker/cleaner. They're stalllllliiiiiingggg....

Funny, because the mayority of people I´ve talked with about the episode thought it was too rushed. ^^

[MisaForever]

Funny, because the mayority of people I´ve talked with about the episode thought it was too rushed. ^^

You're both funny because I had no problem with it what-so-ever

[magnuskn]

You're both funny because I had no problem with it what-so-ever

Eh, I also thought the pacing was off in some regards, but it worked for what it was. I won´t go into the details, I got enough shipping stuff going on on other boards.

[Clay Cliff]

Somebody noticed that Ranka's eyes color turned from red to purple in this episode?... I mean, early in this episode were red and near the end, just after Ai-kun evolved her eyes turned purple...

[David Hingtgen]

I thought I noticed that Brera's eye color seemed different. (plus his uniform)

[taksraven]

Boring ep. Everything that happened could have been done much quicker/cleaner. They're stalllllliiiiiingggg....

I would argue that it was more "Setting up" than stalling. I will admit, like others I thought that we would know more about the Vajra by now though.

Taksraven

[SkullLeaderVF-X]

I'd love to see Bandai aggressively market MacF to the US, just to see how HG responds...

To be honest, I don't think I'd want to see MacF over here as something other than Macross. While I think the show is strong enough to support itself on its own merits, it gains a lot of power from its context as the 25th Anniversary series.

The question is, if they do, can they afford all the hassle with HG, and the licencing fee for bringing MF to the US (especially how expensive everything is now-a-days). I personally would glad to pay $100's of dollers for a R1 Macross release hell I still want a R1 release of M7 and MZero (and I still hold out hope for the release of VF-X2).

[dreamweaver13]

Here's a thought to Ranka haters. In anime, usually the 1st girl the guy meets, will be the one he ends up with. And ranka is that person.

ummm... SDFM? ahem, ahem.

EDIT: oops, sorry, replied immediately upon reading, didn't notice that there were several other repliers already. oh well, by your statement, you used the word "meet", so that ain't misa (radio only).

in that sense, macross doesn't fit the anime rule (assuming such a rule is ironclad). rather, macross played with it a bit. it used that "rule" to confuse the viewer. "sure hikaru seems to have met minmay first, but if you observed VERY closely, the first interaction was with Misa on the radio. Ha! Gotcha!!"

since alto saw sheryl backstage first, let's see if this "trick" gets repeated.

Edited September 1, 2008 by dreamweaver13

[Morpheus]

ummm... SDFM? ahem, ahem.

EDIT: oops, sorry, replied immediately upon reading, didn't notice that there were several other repliers already. oh well, by your statement, you used the word "meet", so that ain't misa (radio only).

in that sense, macross doesn't fit the anime rule (assuming such a rule is ironclad). rather, macross played with it a bit. it used that "rule" to confuse the viewer. "sure hikaru seems to have met minmay first, but if you observed VERY closely, the first interaction was with Misa on the radio. Ha! Gotcha!!"

since alto saw sheryl backstage first, let's see if this "trick" gets repeated.

Wrong, Alto first love is his paperplane He always manage to made one (after pulling some paper from hammer space) when he's spending time with Sheryl or Ranka.

Alto x Paperplane ftw

[Bri]

ep 21 was great. Nice focus on the characters. Action scenes took the backseat a bit. Not much movement on the plot front yet.

Leon and grace move in to position to full fill their secret plan, but no clue about it's exact nature, and where does the SMS stand in this?

Ranka is off to meet the Varija. I guess we will now find out why the Varija are not evil and how they will help stop Grace /Leons plan. Wonder what Ranka truly is. A human with some Varija DNA mixed in? A Varija made to look human? Never understood why the singer who actually looked like Mao was not the grand daughter. Expecting family intrige and maybe a tie into to Mac zero when they explain it all.

Klan gets a chance to vent her anger and the scene in Michels cockpit was touching. Nice screen time for her and I bet she has become a favourite for the animators/writers too. Maybe a future OVA with Klan as the main character? I wouldnt mind.

Bring on ep 22.

Edited September 1, 2008 by Bri

[RichterX]

Remember in ep 10 they showed the "U.N. Spacy" logo, so I don't think they show it in the US.

Considering all the backing this serie is having from Bandai, i believe they have enough power to say to Harmony Gold " I will break you"

[grss1982]

Speaking of which...I'm surprised no one's mentioned any Ai-kun/Millia connection...all the people who say that "the only good Vajra is a dead Vajra"...do you also think Hikaru should've pulled a gun and shot Millia right between the eyes when Max introduced her to him...?

No Idea. I must admit though I never got around to watching SDFM. The only thing I got to watch were Robotech reruns (Please don't hurt me ).

[Gubaba]

ummm... SDFM? ahem, ahem.

EDIT: oops, sorry, replied immediately upon reading, didn't notice that there were several other repliers already. oh well, by your statement, you used the word "meet", so that ain't misa (radio only).

in that sense, macross doesn't fit the anime rule (assuming such a rule is ironclad). rather, macross played with it a bit. it used that "rule" to confuse the viewer. "sure hikaru seems to have met minmay first, but if you observed VERY closely, the first interaction was with Misa on the radio. Ha! Gotcha!!"

since alto saw sheryl backstage first, let's see if this "trick" gets repeated.

But it's more confusing than that, even...which EDITION of episode 1 are we talking about? Deculture, where he meets Ranka first, or broadcast, where he sees Sheryl first?

No Idea. I must admit though I never got around to watching SDFM. The only thing I got to watch were Robotech reruns (Please don't hurt me ).

Enh, it's pretty much the same in Robotech. Pretty much the only reason Hikaru comes around is because Millia's hot, which Ai-kun certainly isn't...so I guess you can't blame Alto for that.

For the record, I do understand why Alto wanted to kill Ai-kun, and i probably would have done the same in his place...but I still think, however instinctive a reaction it was, it was the wrong one to take.

[dreamweaver13]

But it's more confusing than that, even...which EDITION of episode 1 are we talking about? Deculture, where he meets Ranka first, or broadcast, where he sees Sheryl first?

Oh no, i'm foreseeing another SDFM/DYRL canon-type debate somewhere along the line later... so when is SK gonna declare that the deculture edition is merely the drama show within the actual timeline? hehe.

Enh, it's pretty much the same in Robotech. Pretty much the only reason Hikaru comes around is because Millia's hot, which Ai-kun certainly isn't...so I guess you can't blame Alto for that.

For the record, I do understand why Alto wanted to kill Ai-kun, and i probably would have done the same in his place...but I still think, however instinctive a reaction it was, it was the wrong one to take.

there's a big difference between milla and ai-kun. by the time milla came around, hikaru already had an idea about zentraedi defecting. in fact, he already knew that zentraedi are genetically identical to humans. (this point is probably brought home to the viewers by the fact that the three spies are in the very same room, chatting with the bridge bunnies). by that time, he was already desensitized to zentraedi. he coughed up the coffee more on the fact that max wants to get married, rather than the fact that she's a zentraedi.

on the other hand, alto has no reason to believe that the vajra are an intelligent species, or that they could be anything other than violent, murderous bugs. so yeah, alto's reaction was pretty much reasonable (albeit lacking in foresight), and i wouldn't feel any resentment for him if he did shoot ai-kun. (besides that, grown-up ai-kun is kinda creepy. am i the only one who feels that way?)

[Shaka_Z]

you know something... after watching the sub and reading THAT blog, that I really have to agree with Alto's 'only good bug is a dead one' reaction. like an earlier post, I have to agree that the vajra have to prove that they are more than a space-capable fire ant colony. maybe Ranka will be pivotal in this endeavour, maybe she is just being uber-self-centered emo kiddie.

I am also somewhat surprised that this hasnt been commented on before, but after the DE bomb on island 3 was detonated and the pain from the vajra washed over her (she is literally feeling the death of every vajra as it happens when in such close proximity during the song, then a huge wave of it during the DE event), Ranka says 'I'm sorry'... Alto thinks she is apologizing to him for something, but I have come to the conclusion that she is actually apologizing to the vajra she just lead to destruction - judging by her expression after Alto responds by saying 'you did well, thank you Ranka'. she has already begun to equate vajra life to human life.

[Gubaba]

there's a big difference between milla and ai-kun. by the time milla came around, hikaru already had an idea about zentraedi defecting. in fact, he already knew that zentraedi are genetically identical to humans. (this point is probably brought home to the viewers by the fact that the three spies are in the very same room, chatting with the bridge bunnies). by that time, he was already desensitized to zentraedi. he coughed up the coffee more on the fact that max wants to get married, rather than the fact that she's a zentraedi.

on the other hand, alto has no reason to believe that the vajra are an intelligent species, or that they could be anything other than violent, murderous bugs. so yeah, alto's reaction was pretty much reasonable (albeit lacking in foresight), and i wouldn't feel any resentment for him if he did shoot ai-kun. (besides that, grown-up ai-kun is kinda creepy. am i the only one who feels that way?)

Hmmm...yeah, there definitely were more cracks in the "Zentradi are iredeemably evil" argument by the time Max and Millia had their knife-fight. But ya gotta hand it to Hikaru for accepting Millia awfully quickly.

Alto has no reason to do the same, except for the fact that he should...well...be able to trust Ranka by this point...

And yes, grown-up Ai-kun is definitely not going to win any beauty contests.

[dreamweaver13]

And yes, grown-up Ai-kun is definitely not going to win any beauty contests.

Except for Ms. Universe in Futurama. hehe.

[diabloM]

definitely hate to look at this:

[wolfx]

ummm... SDFM? ahem, ahem.

EDIT: oops, sorry, replied immediately upon reading, didn't notice that there were several other repliers already. oh well, by your statement, you used the word "meet", so that ain't misa (radio only).

in that sense, macross doesn't fit the anime rule (assuming such a rule is ironclad). rather, macross played with it a bit. it used that "rule" to confuse the viewer. "sure hikaru seems to have met minmay first, but if you observed VERY closely, the first interaction was with Misa on the radio. Ha! Gotcha!!"

since alto saw sheryl backstage first, let's see if this "trick" gets repeated.

He just "saw" her but did not meet/talk to her.

In SDFM the comlink has video and audio so i guess its as good as "meeting".

[Gubaba]

definitely hate to look at this:

"Dear Lord...next time, I want a better haircut. If you do that, I promise I won't assassinate any more presidents. Really...I mean it this time."

[Morpheus]

Just saw gg sub.

So Ranka is giving up on Alto and went with Brera, did she think she lost the triangle when she saw Sheryl with Alto on the rooftop?.

Still I goes along with Alto that all Vajra must be exterminated, the reason is that they destroyed the VF-1 replica on top of Mihoshi, that's a capital crime punishable with genocide (Gamlin should also be executed for destroying Miriya VF-1, but thats on another note)

[magnuskn]

But it's more confusing than that, even...which EDITION of episode 1 are we talking about? Deculture, where he meets Ranka first, or broadcast, where he sees Sheryl first?

I think the definite answer is "Yack Deculture". Where he sees Sheryl first.

[Gubaba]

I think the definite answer is "Yack Deculture". Where he sees Sheryl first.

Ah, but Yack Deculture came out LAST...the Deculture Edition came out well before then. So he met Ranka first MONTHS before he met Sheryl first!

(And yes, I'm just screwin' with ya. )

[SkullLeaderVF-X]

Ah, but Yack Deculture came out LAST...the Deculture Edition came out well before then. So he met Ranka first MONTHS before he met Sheryl first!

(And yes, I'm just screwin' with ya. )

Gubaba you make my head hurt.

Who did he actually come in contact with first?

[Morpheus]

Gubaba you make my head hurt.

Who did he actually come in contact with first?

The paperplane off course.

[Gubaba]

Gubaba you make my head hurt.

Who did he actually come in contact with first?

Going by the broadcast/Yack Deculture versions, Sheryl walked past him before he met Ranka. But that scene wasn't in the Deculture version.

He had his first real interaction with Ranka in both versions, though.

I'm not really sure how useful this "rule" is, though...to pick the first example that comes to mind, in Urusei Yatsura, Ataru saw Shinobu WELL before he saw Lum...

[SkullLeaderVF-X]

The paperplane off course.

I lol'd

Okay who did he come in contact with 2nd?

[SkullLeaderVF-X]

Going by the broadcast/Yack Deculture versions, Sheryl walked past him before he met Ranka. But that scene wasn't in the Deculture version.

He had his first real interaction with Ranka in both versions, though.

I'm not really sure how useful this "rule" is, though...to pick the first example that comes to mind, in Urusei Yatsura, Ataru saw Shinobu WELL before he saw Lum...

Well then I guess were going to have to wait till the ending then.

Imagine they throw a curve ball at us and Alto ends up with Klan, as he tried to comfort her about Micheals death. Or he ends up with Nanase, comforting her about Ranka's departure. Where would the rule be at then?