Could Sharon Apple have used SA tech to hypnotize Earth?

[RedWolf]

Something occurred to me while watching Macross Plus again.

We know that the Protodevlin uses mind control systems to control humans and Zentradi.

The Protodevlin being the creators of the Supervision Army. The Macross was formerly a Supervision Army ship.

Even with Earth rebuilding it the SA left a booby trap system with it's main gun.

It is assumed with lights and sound the AI Sharon Apple was able to control the populace.

But what if there is more to that? What if Sharon used a SA system embeded in the Macross to control the populace?

We know that there are recall systems for errant Zentradi, compelling them to obey. Vrlithwai used this once on Quamzin for disobeying his orders.

Say the Protodevlin modified this system and had it become standard in every Supervision Army ship.

I can also see the Vajra, if they are creations of the Protoculture, being controled with a similar but fold wave/string based system.

[Sumdumgai]

Interesting theory.

[Gubaba]

We know that there are recall systems for errant Zentradi, compelling them to obey. Vrlithwai used this once on Quamzin for disobeying his orders.

No, IIRC, Breetai used it on Khyron...Vrlitwhai just sent a message to Quamzin, who (surprisingly) obeyed.

Other than that...I like your theory.

Well, mostly I like the idea of hypnotized Sharon Apple fans embarking on a centuries-long mission of galactic conquest...

[Morpheus]

Sharon concert utilize light shows and music manipulated such way that it directly manipulated human brainwaves. This is indicated in Eden during the press conference that such technique could be consider as narcotics (putting human/zentran into trance/addiction). I think the extent of the brain manipulation is limited by the crew during normal concert, however during Earth concert Sharon has gain full sentience and took control MBS (Macross Broadcast System) which mean it got total control of Macross City and the defense system. By using the tool she put the entire Earth population on trance by her music and light/holographic show.

But still this doesn't explain how she control the guards to attack Myung and control the tentacles...I mean cables which captured Myung.

[Gubaba]

But still this doesn't explain how she control the guards to attack Myung and control the tentacles...I mean cables which captured Myung.

That always kind of bothered me, too...

[mike_s_6]

The cables are easier to guess - perhaps they have robotic mechanisms in them and Sharon just hacked them. The guards though... don't know

[Kelsain]

It also begs the question of how the Protodevlin controlled their guys. Was it that much different from what Myung and Marje were up to? Maybe the SA and Megaroad 13 crew were more susceptible to that kind of brainwashing after being partially drained of spiritia? I got the impression that it was something similar, since Sharon hypnotised Isamu, then Myung was able to snap him out of it with her song. Just like Basara. It seems like they snuck in a few aspects of M7 into M+ to add some consistency between the two.

I always figured the recall signal from Bye Bye Mars was calling the regulds back against their pilots wishes. Never thought about it being a control signal for the Zentraedi themselves...

Finally, the prehensile cables used by Sharon were not new to Macross. Whenever we saw the SDFM transform, these cables and wires would fly out and attach to things. It's just 30 years of progression that allows them to be smaller. We also see them used earlier in the M+ OVA when Sharon hooks up to the concert hall.

[Duke Togo]

Sharon Apple clearly had an effect on people before she got anywhere near Earth.

[sucker4meltrans]

it is possible. the macross is huge and i bet even by the time of the sharon apple incident they didn't know every square inch of it. i also bet during the reconstruction all the systems were repaired even if they didn't know what it did.

random macross crew member 1 "hey bob what does this thing over here do?"

bob "who cares just plug it back in and then close the door to it"

Edited August 6, 2008 by sucker4meltrans

[Knight26]

In the OVA is it shown earlier on that SHaron can manipulate the cables, more then likely it is a form of muscle fiber embedded in the cable sheath that allowed the computer a limited form of autonamy from the beginning.

[Duke Togo]

it is possible. the macross is huge and i bet even by the time of the sharon apple incident they didn't know every square inch of it. i also bet during the reconstruction all the systems were repaired even if they didn't know what it did.

Except we've seen another Macross class vessel in Frontier. I am assuming if they built a second one they have full working knowledge of the original.

But, once again, Sharon Apple had an effect on people before she got anywhere near Earth.

[VF-25 Messiah]

Been a while since I saw Plus, but, I always assumed Sharon always used some kind of trance inducing hypno stuff even for her regular concerts. All for the purpose off "showing the audience a good time" and be a commercial success really. You notice the audience in the concert in ep 2, who are probably used to it, more or less instantly enter some happy trance, while Isamu, who's at his first time at a Sharon concert is looking at them weirdly. Though later, even he begins to act more "Wow, this is pretty trippy stuff".

At first I thought it was tied to those ticket/bracelet things they get when they enter concert hall, but since not everyone who got hypnotized at Sharon's last concert on earth had them (did anyone even?) I guess they were mostly just used for 'measuring the excitement level' of the audience. So I guess she was doing it on her own so to say. Perhaps when she got that bio-chip and became her 'own' this ability intensfied?

[Kronnang Dunn]

Something occurred to me while watching Macross Plus again.

We know that the Protodevlin uses mind control systems to control humans and Zentradi.

The Protodevlin being the creators of the Supervision Army. The Macross was formerly a Supervision Army ship.

Even with Earth rebuilding it the SA left a booby trap system with it's main gun.

It is assumed with lights and sound the AI Sharon Apple was able to control the populace.

But what if there is more to that? What if Sharon used a SA system embeded in the Macross to control the populace?

We know that there are recall systems for errant Zentradi, compelling them to obey. Vrlithwai used this once on Quamzin for disobeying his orders.

Say the Protodevlin modified this system and had it become standard in every Supervision Army ship.

I can also see the Vajra, if they are creations of the Protoculture, being controled with a similar but fold wave/string based system.

I believe that maybe that's what Grace and her cohorts really want...

Edited August 6, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn

[Zinjo]

Except we've seen another Macross class vessel in Frontier. I am assuming if they built a second one they have full working knowledge of the original.

But, once again, Sharon Apple had an effect on people before she got anywhere near Earth.

Possibly, however we don't know if they used the Macross as the design basis or the Megalord, since we didn't see the Global very closely.

The Megalord used the same superstructure design and main gun, but then it began to diverge from the original.

The idea of embedded software is a possibility since the Macross was of alien origin and dispite how much humanity rebuilt her, when she launched they still didn't fully understand many of her systems. The Booby Trap code and how to navigate a fold are the first examples we saw of humanity's ignorance of the ship.

Is there other hidden code in the systems? Possibly.

[dreamweaver13]

Is there other hidden code in the systems? Possibly.

Yes, there is. it's a love signal. If you stand a couple of meters away from the Macross at approximately 45deg either to the left or right, your love triangle will finally be resolved. (i.e. Hikaru&Misa, Myung&Isamu).

[Duke Togo]

Except she already had an effect on people before she got anywhere near the Macross. This is all very fanfiction-ish.

[dreamweaver13]

Any chance Sharon Apple was Fairy 1?

Just a thought., throwing it out there.

How does it work with the timeline?

Edited August 8, 2008 by dreamweaver13

[RedWolf]

Any chance Sharon Apple was Fairy 1?

Just a thought., throwing it out there.

How does it work with the timeline?

2040- Macross Plus

2045-46 -Macross 7 -

2047- Macross Dynamite 7/ 117th fleet Grace, Mao and Ranshe working together on V-type virus.

2048 - Loss of the 117th fleet, Ozma adopts Ranka bringing her to Frontier.

2059- Macross Frontier

[dreamweaver13]

2040- Macross Plus

2045-46 -Macross 7 -

2047- Macross Dynamite 7/ 117th fleet Grace, Mao and Ranshe working together on V-type virus.

2048 - Loss of the 117th fleet, Ozma adopts Ranka bringing her to Frontier.

2059- Macross Frontier

yup, guess not.

[JB0]

No, IIRC, Breetai used it on Khyron...Vrlitwhai just sent a message to Quamzin, who (surprisingly) obeyed.

They discuss that in the show, actually.

Kamjin may be a deranged, self-important, insubordinate, ally-killing lunatic, but he's not (completely) stupid. He makes sure his back is covered before he does anything. He obeys his orders to the letter, while completely ignoring the intent. Or he arranges it so there's a plausable excuse.

Like that scene where he's ordered to fire across the Macross' bow. It's set up so it looks like the gunner just screwed up his aim. Then he has the poor guy killed in a "technical malfunction" so he can't confirm he was acting under orders.

Everyone KNOWS what happened, but they can't PROVE anything.

It's likely why he was left in charge of his forces, despite being enough of a problem to be pulled off combat duty. No one could PROVE anything, but everyone KNEW he was a loose cannon. So they stuck him on patrol duty to keep him out of trouble until Britai got stupid and called him in.

Same situation applies here.

Britai knows Kamjin will have a suspiciously convenient bout of communication interference if he leaves any room for doubt.

He intentionally uses the most obnoxiously visible system at his disposal, to make absolutely sure there's no question about if he heard it or what it meant.

And Kamjin curses Britai for throwing a wrench into his standard operating procedure before ordering the retreat.He's enjoying his little standoff, but he knows better to stick around in PROVABLE defiance of direct orders.