Just finished Macross 7 light spoilers

[bzdup]

Yes, I too have the similar disappointments, aka, unresolved issues like Mylene's love story, lack of any realism, no Hikaru!!!. But the most intriguing idea in Macross 7 was that Nekki Basara was Hikaru and Minmay's LOVECHILD!!! It would explain [finally] his piloting skills as well as his singing prowess. The plot in M7 was just SO slow that the series really turns into an episodic type story. I really wish the Macross people would wake up and finish the story the right way. Or at least let the Robotech people have a shot at it. Let's face it: had they done "the Sentinels" [for robotech] or did a real continuation with Hikaru/Misa/Minmay people would have laughed at Macross 7. But due to my yearning to have an end to the story, I found Macross 7 acceptable.

Embarassing confession: the music actually grew on me!!! I'm still dying to see a Hikaru based continuation. Never going to happen though!!! Oh and one more thing about the Nekki Basara comment: isn't there a PICTURE with Hikaru and Nekki? He does look an awful lot like HIkaru, and he's a pacifist as well. So, great piloting skills, great singing prowess, pacificst, and looks like HIkaru. I thought it would be revealed in the story for sure. Also, it would explain why Max tolerates Nekki going into flight all the time during battle scenes, or at least, why they chose Nekki to be the pilot of the VF19.

In the end Macross 7 doesn't touch the original Macross' storyline, and most surprisingly the animation wasn't up to par with a 20+ year old animation. I mean, the end of the original Macross series is one of themost powerful stories, I've ever seen. Animation or not. It's too bad that the Macross people won't just go with what works and keep on trying to reconstruct a new version of it from new parts. AKA Macross Plus, Zero, and 7. IMO< none of htem are that good.

Edited July 28, 2008 by bzdup

[The White Comet]

I think you might be looking a little too much into the Hikaru/Minmay lovechild gag. It was put in there for a chuckle but meant nothing more than that. I was surprised they gave any throwback at all to the original series.

Captain Max doesnt just tolerate Basara going into battle, hes the one that authorized the entire experiment.

I disagree with you about the Sentinels being better than Macross 7. Nothing of Robotech can touch anything Macross and should not even be spoken of in the same sentence.

I dont understand why people want to see more of the original characters. Really, what would they have done in their later lives that would have topped or even equaled the story from the original series? The writers knew what they were doing when they ended the show the way they did.

[Gubaba]

Wait a year or two, and then watch it again; you might like it more.

At least, that's what happened to me.

And Hikaru was in it, kind of...at least, Bobby (the guy who was going to play Hikaru in the "Lynn Minmay Story" was played by the same voice actor who played Hikaru.

And I would never, ever, ever want to see what "the Robotech people" would do with Macross 7. The very idea gives me hives.

[dreamweaver13]

hehe, you had me until you suggested to let the robotech people have a shot at it. granted, macross 7 is not my favorite in the franchise, but i would take it anyday over whatever HG has to offer.

who ever said that the story isn't finished? It's only HG that refuses to let go of the H/M/M triangle. probably because they can't think of anything original at all. face it, if they did something Robotech without any reference to the macross characters, they wouldn't even know where to begin.

and there was a sentinels series. at least the start. and i don't know about everyone else, but GAWD was that awful.

[d3v]

Macross 7 exists to remind us that no matter what we want to believe, Macross for the most part isn't a serious mecha show.

[Nexx Stalker]

Macross 7 exists to remind us that no matter what we want to believe, Macross for the most part isn't a serious mecha show.

Macross 7 exists to remind us that, no matter what, we want to believe.

Edited July 28, 2008 by Nexx Stalker

[Duke Togo]

[polidread]

Duke Togo's new avy making an appearance in this thread ... lightens the entire thread up considerably !

[Duke Togo]

Stage fright, go away, this is my big day...

[polidread]

i fricking take my previous post back ! XD

[dreamweaver13]

Stage fright, go away, this is my big day...

God is not in his heaven, all is not right with the world...

[bzdup]

Yes, I too have the similar disappointments, aka, unresolved issues like Mylene's love story, lack of any realism, no Hikaru!!!. But the most intriguing idea in Macross 7 was that Nekki Basara was Hikaru and Minmay's LOVECHILD!!! It would explain [finally] his piloting skills as well as his singing prowess. The plot in M7 was just SO slow that the series really turns into an episodic type story. I really wish the Macross people would wake up and finish the story the right way. Or at least let the Robotech people have a shot at it. Let's face it: had they done "the Sentinels" [for robotech] or did a real continuation with Hikaru/Misa/Minmay people would have laughed at Macross 7. But due to my yearning to have an end to the story, I found Macross 7 acceptable.

Embarassing confession: the music actually grew on me!!! I'm still dying to see a Hikaru based continuation. Never going to happen though!!! Oh and one more thing about the Nekki Basara comment: isn't there a PICTURE with Hikaru and Nekki? He does look an awful lot like HIkaru, and he's a pacifist as well. So, great piloting skills, great singing prowess, pacificst, and looks like HIkaru. I thought it would be revealed in the story for sure. Also, it would explain why Max tolerates Nekki going into flight all the time during battle scenes, or at least, why they chose Nekki to be the pilot of the VF19.

In the end Macross 7 doesn't touch the original Macross' storyline, and most surprisingly the animation wasn't up to par with a 20+ year old animation. I mean, the end of the original Macross series is one of themost powerful stories, I've ever seen. Animation or not. It's too bad that the Macross people won't just go with what works and keep on trying to reconstruct a new version of it from new parts. AKA Macross Plus, Zero, and 7. IMO< none of htem are that good.

I dunno. I really liked the Robotech series. Then again I was like 12 when it ended!!! What other anime do you recommend? I never really got into anything else since I live in California and only what is available via cable tv.

[bzdup]

Wait a year or two, and then watch it again; you might like it more.

At least, that's what happened to me.

And Hikaru was in it, kind of...at least, Bobby (the guy who was going to play Hikaru in the "Lynn Minmay Story" was played by the same voice actor who played Hikaru.

And I would never, ever, ever want to see what "the Robotech people" would do with Macross 7. The very idea gives me hives.

But the Robothech people have done something without the macross characters, aka, Southern Cross, and the Invid series, and now more recently the Shadow Chronicles, which isn't terrible, at least I don't think so. I mean, for me, I do thing there could have been a very interesting story in both the macross ending, aka the Megaroad and space colonization thing, as well as the Robotech Series, finding the Robotech Masters. Both Robotech and Macross have begun/completed continuation stories with Shadow Chronicles, and Macross 7/Frontier respectively. But both skipped a generation. I dunno. Still want to know what happens to the original Macross Characters. From my experience with Japanese culture, I don't seeing them bending to the audience's desires as much as an American series would.

I'm rewatching Macross Zero now. And I think I may end up liking it more than Plus and Seven. I mean Roy Fokker RULES.

[Gubaba]

But the Robothech people have done something without the macross characters, aka, Southern Cross, and the Invid series, and now more recently the Shadow Chronicles, which isn't terrible, at least I don't think so. I mean, for me, I do thing there could have been a very interesting story in both the macross ending, aka the Megaroad and space colonization thing, as well as the Robotech Series, finding the Robotech Masters. Both Robotech and Macross have begun/completed continuation stories with Shadow Chronicles, and Macross 7/Frontier respectively. But both skipped a generation. I dunno. Still want to know what happens to the original Macross Characters. From my experience with Japanese culture, I don't seeing them bending to the audience's desires as much as an American series would.

I'm rewatching Macross Zero now. And I think I may end up liking it more than Plus and Seven. I mean Roy Fokker RULES.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I can't watch Robotech anymore...I start wincing at the dialogue and the voice acting and the music and I have to turn it off...even if it's just a youtube clip. Shadow Chronicles, I watched on youtube, and didn't like. In the interest of restraint, I'll just leave it at that.

And then there's Harmony Gold's more recent cutthroat business pratcies, but that's been rehashed elsewhere.

But that's not the real problem...my impression (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is that the real problem is that M7 didn't answer the questions you wanted answered, and perhaps the creators of Robotech could turn it into something you like more. A while back, there were a number of people here wanting a Macross Zero movie for exactly the same reason...they wanted it to "fix the ending." Needless to say, that didn't happen. And, I suspect, if there HAD been a Zero movie, the ending would have remained more or less the same.

If you're disappointed in M7, that's understandable. If you want more about Hikaru, Misa, and Minmay, that's also understandable. But I think you'll have to go into the realm of fan-fiction to scratch those particular itches. Kawamori could always change his mind, I suppose, but I'm not holding my breath, and I don't think anyone else should, either.

[d3v]

Whenever I see the Shadow Chronicles on STAR Movies, I keep wondering why the mecha seems to move as if they had sticks up their @$$es.

[RedWolf]

Besides M7 wasn't about the original trio.

We did get original characters like Max, Millia and Exsedol.

Max, Millia and Mylene forming the family triangle.

Two male and one female triangle like Basara, Gamlin and Mylene wasn't much about romance but whether the two guys can make a bond of friendship. Much like Isamu and Guld.

That also happened with Basara, Sivil and Gigil.

[bzdup]

Besides M7 wasn't about the original trio.

We did get original characters like Max, Millia and Exsedol.

Max, Millia and Mylene forming the family triangle.

Two male and one female triangle like Basara, Gamlin and Mylene wasn't much about romance but whether the two guys can make a bond of friendship. Much like Isamu and Guld.

That also happened with Basara, Sivil and Gigil.

What I don't like AT ALL about the love triangles you mentioned, is that in my opinion, they are unnatural and almost forced as a lackluster attempt to capture the magic of the original Macross series. I think most people who watched and loved the original Macross series would say that more or less, the central and most powerful story is the love triangle between Hikaru, Misa, and Minmay. The battle between the Zentraedi and the UN Spacy folks is the perfect backdrop to that love triangle. The bittersweet ending with Hikaru leaving Minmay for Misa and his duty is really touching, with the tear drop at the end with the picture book and memories closing. I'm guessing that was Minmay? It's all very bittersweet and touching. Most importantly, that story has an authentic and believable feel to it. It seems more natural and human.

Whereas in Macross Plus, the love triangle seems to be contrived, and completely forced to attempt what happened naturally in the original series. In Macross 7, I honestly don't even think the writers knew what they were doing and just happened to make a bunch of love triangles.

[bzdup]

I can't speak for anyone else, but I can't watch Robotech anymore...I start wincing at the dialogue and the voice acting and the music and I have to turn it off...even if it's just a youtube clip. Shadow Chronicles, I watched on youtube, and didn't like. In the interest of restraint, I'll just leave it at that.

And then there's Harmony Gold's more recent cutthroat business pratcies, but that's been rehashed elsewhere.

But that's not the real problem...my impression (and please correct me if I'm wrong) is that the real problem is that M7 didn't answer the questions you wanted answered, and perhaps the creators of Robotech could turn it into something you like more. A while back, there were a number of people here wanting a Macross Zero movie for exactly the same reason...they wanted it to "fix the ending." Needless to say, that didn't happen. And, I suspect, if there HAD been a Zero movie, the ending would have remained more or less the same.

If you're disappointed in M7, that's understandable. If you want more about Hikaru, Misa, and Minmay, that's also understandable. But I think you'll have to go into the realm of fan-fiction to scratch those particular itches. Kawamori could always change his mind, I suppose, but I'm not holding my breath, and I don't think anyone else should, either.

Yes. And that may be a cultural thing.... the whole leaving questions unanswered. I jsut don't know. In american screen writing, almost 100% of the time, the questions are answered, [or like the Sopranos, purposely avoided!!!} Again, I posted this in another post, I really feel that the Macross folks just ran out of ideas and keep trying to recreate the Macross magic with a forumlaic approach, like love triangles, unanswered questions, etc... Seven doesn't answer any of the questions it presents. The original series, doesn't really answer the questions you want either!!!

[Reflex Point]

I grew up with Robotech as well and am still fond it. Shadow Chronicles, on the otherhand, was quite disappointing to me. It wasn't gawddamn awful, but for the 4 years that it took to be completed, I was expecting way more. Way more than a half-hour rehash of Reflex Point, an entire universe of women with DD breast implants and men with pect/crotch implants (equal opportunity I suppose), and mecha that look and move like plastic. Again not completely awful... but not good enough for me to buy, rent, or download. The only comfort I had in viewing it was hearing some of the original voice actors. But that's just my opinion. I digress though.

As much as many people don't like Macross 7, I didn't think it was that bad. Same with Zero. Have you watched any of Frontier? IMO it's the best since DYRL in terms of animation, character development, mecha action sequences, music, everything overall.

[dreamweaver13]

Yes. And that may be a cultural thing.... the whole leaving questions unanswered. I jsut don't know. In american screen writing, almost 100% of the time, the questions are answered, [or like the Sopranos, purposely avoided!!!} Again, I posted this in another post, I really feel that the Macross folks just ran out of ideas and keep trying to recreate the Macross magic with a forumlaic approach, like love triangles, unanswered questions, etc... Seven doesn't answer any of the questions it presents. The original series, doesn't really answer the questions you want either!!!

formulaic? Ran out of ideas? um... if they did, they would just have used the same characters all over again, which they had every legal right to do. which is basically what robotech tried to do with its sentinels. you're confusing macross for your robotech.

who says the macross 7, plus or anything other than that was meant to be a sequel to SDFM? I, for one, have much respect for a franchise who did not decide to rest on its laurels and just use the same characters over and over again in the same setting until the audience got tired of them. props to the franchise for trying out new threats, storylines and characters with each installment.

and what, pray tell, is the unanswered question left at the end of SDFM? I mean, what more closure do you need?

don't get me wrong. i love my Triangler as much as the next guy, but i wouldn't judge other independent macross series on the basis of whether or not it continued the luvy-duv story of Hikaru Misa and Minmei.

[Shun]

What I don't like AT ALL about the love triangles you mentioned, is that in my opinion, they are unnatural and almost forced as a lackluster attempt to capture the magic of the original Macross series.

...

Whereas in Macross Plus, the love triangle seems to be contrived, and completely forced to attempt what happened naturally in the original series. In Macross 7, I honestly don't even think the writers knew what they were doing and just happened to make a bunch of love triangles.

whaaa?

u want a repeat of the original macross? how many times?

that's the problem. creativity. why would u think they want to keep making other triangles that are similar to the first series? Even the 2 girls 1 guy triangle in Frontier is different in that both girls are singers.

I dont see how the M+ triangle is contrived - IMO such a situation is very possible. the triangle in M7 isn't as "strong" and that is also another new approach.

As for RipoffTech, please. I hope they never lay their hands or even lay an eye on it. we have enough of troubles from it.

Go make your own cartoons and designs.

[Gubaba]

What I don't like AT ALL about the love triangles you mentioned, is that in my opinion, they are unnatural and almost forced as a lackluster attempt to capture the magic of the original Macross series. I think most people who watched and loved the original Macross series would say that more or less, the central and most powerful story is the love triangle between Hikaru, Misa, and Minmay. The battle between the Zentraedi and the UN Spacy folks is the perfect backdrop to that love triangle. The bittersweet ending with Hikaru leaving Minmay for Misa and his duty is really touching, with the tear drop at the end with the picture book and memories closing. I'm guessing that was Minmay? It's all very bittersweet and touching. Most importantly, that story has an authentic and believable feel to it. It seems more natural and human.

Whereas in Macross Plus, the love triangle seems to be contrived, and completely forced to attempt what happened naturally in the original series. In Macross 7, I honestly don't even think the writers knew what they were doing and just happened to make a bunch of love triangles.

Different strokes, I guess...I iked the Plus triangle; the Basara/Mylene/Gamlin triangle seemed nonexistant to me, though...except in Mylene's head. I think the big difference is that the love triangle in SDFM quietly crept up on most viewers unexpectedly, and that's not true of the sequels.

Yes. And that may be a cultural thing.... the whole leaving questions unanswered. I jsut don't know. In american screen writing, almost 100% of the time, the questions are answered, [or like the Sopranos, purposely avoided!!!} Again, I posted this in another post, I really feel that the Macross folks just ran out of ideas and keep trying to recreate the Macross magic with a forumlaic approach, like love triangles, unanswered questions, etc... Seven doesn't answer any of the questions it presents. The original series, doesn't really answer the questions you want either!!!

Much as I'm leery of making huge cultural generalizations, you may have a point there. I remember reading an interview with Neil Gaiman about adapting Princess Mononoke, and he said that when most Japanese viewers see something ambiguous and confusing, their main thought is, "I didn't understand that...I should see it again!" Whereas most western viewers would think, "I didn't understand that...so it must be bad."

But then, look at the attack on the Gainax office after the last episode of Evangelion aired...

However, I completely disagree with your view of the Macross sequels being formulaic. Yes, they all have music. yes, they all have love triangles. But each one has been done in such a different way. No one would mistake the Isamu/Myung/Guld relationship for the Misa/Hikaru/Minmay one, and that's true for all of them (although let's be honest...wouldn't Zero have been more interesting if Mao had attacked and tried to rape Shin in a fit of blind rage...? ).

[d3v]

But what would Macross be without the love triangle. Just another mecha show? *ugh*

Macross was always meant to be a light hearted romance that just happened to have mecha in it with the conflict from the love triangle just as central as the conflict with whatever enemy they're facing at the moment.

Edited July 29, 2008 by d3v

[Final Vegeta]

But what would Macross be without the love triangle. Just another mecha show? *ugh*

Macross was always meant to be a light hearted romance that just happened to have mecha in it with the conflict from the love triangle just as central as the conflict with whatever enemy they're facing at the moment.

Generically in anime some power escalation occur on all sides of the conflict. Nowadays though I think that if you resolve the climax simply by having one side becoming stronger, than you are doing a lousy job. It is something that could be done in old anime, but after years of evolution of storytelling a 1 dimensional approach to the climax doesn't feel very realistic. Kawamori's transversal solutions are one thing that put him a notch above the rest.

FV

[bzdup]

formulaic? Ran out of ideas? um... if they did, they would just have used the same characters all over again, which they had every legal right to do. which is basically what robotech tried to do with its sentinels. you're confusing macross for your robotech.

who says the macross 7, plus or anything other than that was meant to be a sequel to SDFM? I, for one, have much respect for a franchise who did not decide to rest on its laurels and just use the same characters over and over again in the same setting until the audience got tired of them. props to the franchise for trying out new threats, storylines and characters with each installment.

and what, pray tell, is the unanswered question left at the end of SDFM? I mean, what more closure do you need?

don't get me wrong. i love my Triangler as much as the next guy, but i wouldn't judge other independent macross series on the basis of whether or not it continued the luvy-duv story of Hikaru Misa and Minmei.

New characters. Yes. New settings yes. Same old formulas? Yes. Want to do something truly different? How about writing a series that doesn't revolve around a love triangle? Look, Macross Plus is terribly forced with their love triangle, and in Macross 7 it doesn't even make sense. It's just not very subtle, elegant, or even believable! In my opinion. What answers are left unanswered in the original series? What about WHAT HAPPENS ON THEIR MISSION TO COLONIZE SPACE? for one...

[Gubaba]

New characters. Yes. New settings yes. Same old formulas? Yes. Want to do something truly different? How about writing a series that doesn't revolve around a love triangle? Look, Macross Plus is terribly forced with their love triangle, and in Macross 7 it doesn't even make sense. It's just not very subtle, elegant, or even believable! In my opinion. What answers are left unanswered in the original series? What about WHAT HAPPENS ON THEIR MISSION TO COLONIZE SPACE? for one...

Do you realize what you just said...? The three things that are set in stone as Macross are: music, transforming robots, and love triangles.

If you had a Macross series without some kind of Valkyrie, would it be Macross?

Well, neither would a Macross series without a love triangle.

As for what happens to their mission to colonize space...well, it was obviously successful, since space seems colonized in Plus, 7, and Frontier...

[d3v]

New characters. Yes. New settings yes. Same old formulas? Yes. Want to do something truly different? How about writing a series that doesn't revolve around a love triangle? Look, Macross Plus is terribly forced with their love triangle, and in Macross 7 it doesn't even make sense. It's just not very subtle, elegant, or even believable! In my opinion. What answers are left unanswered in the original series? What about WHAT HAPPENS ON THEIR MISSION TO COLONIZE SPACE? for one...

In other words, you want Gundam with variable fighters.

[Morpheus]

New characters. Yes. New settings yes. Same old formulas? Yes. Want to do something truly different? How about writing a series that doesn't revolve around a love triangle? Look, Macross Plus is terribly forced with their love triangle, and in Macross 7 it doesn't even make sense. It's just not very subtle, elegant, or even believable! In my opinion. What answers are left unanswered in the original series? What about WHAT HAPPENS ON THEIR MISSION TO COLONIZE SPACE? for one...

Macross without love triangle is like watching Gundam without colony drop. Its always exciting when that happen and fan love to speculate how the love triangle resolved. If you want Macross with no love story, try playing the game (VFX-and VFX-2), it got solid mecha action and story.

[d3v]

IMO, when describing the essence of Macross, it was Misa who put it succinctly in the end of DYRL, after answering Claudia's question about the song she translated for Minmei to sing, she quietly adds "off course, it was a love song."

[dreamweaver13]

New characters. Yes. New settings yes. Same old formulas? Yes. Want to do something truly different? How about writing a series that doesn't revolve around a love triangle? Look, Macross Plus is terribly forced with their love triangle, and in Macross 7 it doesn't even make sense. It's just not very subtle, elegant, or even believable! In my opinion. What answers are left unanswered in the original series? What about WHAT HAPPENS ON THEIR MISSION TO COLONIZE SPACE? for one...

ok, now I have no idea where you're coming from anymore. This all started because you whined about the Macross franchise not continuing the story of the ultimate love triangle Hikaru Misa and Minmei (even making a comment later on about how it's still the best one ever). You were so desperate to continue this love triangle/story that you even sugested that the Robotech people should take a crack at it (oh, the horror! )

And now you're razzing the macross franchise for putting a love triangle in each of its stories?

Make up your mind.

Look, 29 posts down the line, and your reviews of Macross Plus and Macross 7 have all been exclusively about their respective love triangles. Nothing about anything else, the mecha, the story, the songs, nothing. you have this fixation of evaluating the worth of each installation based solely on the way it compares to the original love triangle. If that's your thing, then that's your thing. But I don't understand you all of a sudden turning your logic 180deg around and demanding that Macross stop with these love triangles. is this just to win an argument? just doesn't make sense.

ummm... both the series and DYRL ended with Hikaru and Misa hooking up, and Minmei acknowledging the two's relationship. you even specified it: closing the photo album on the story.

The "mission to colonize space", as you put it, was a mere cliffnote. it's not even a part of the series or the movie. it's more like an epilogue at the end of those american movies that you speak of. "X and Y lived happily ever after going into space so on and so forth...". It's not a significant plot point in the series and the movie.

Once again, i think you're confusing RT and Macross in the sense that it's only in RT where that "mission to colonize space" was given so much significance. I don't know... you might just be projecting a robotech concept into the Macross universe.

Actually, right now, I'm grateful because you seem like the perfect sample of what I was talking about in the "Megaroad" thread I started.

Edited July 30, 2008 by dreamweaver13

[Tochiro]

Woah now, I think the original poster has gotten a little confused about what he was originally trying to say.

I agree with everyone else here that Mecha, Music and Love Triangles are what make any Macross title go round. They arent rehashes, they are the cornerstones of the series.

The way I read the original post however is that the original poster seems to be frustrated by the lack of over-reaching continuity.

I far prefer Macross to Robotech, although I grew up with Robotech, but I can see where the frustration is coming from.

By butchering several series, Robotech had the luxury of making this huge saga where the tales of the original characters were continued far beyond the original source material.

Macross, on the other hand, has never been like that. Each new iteration has been more or less self-contained but refers to a backdrop that is seldom expanded on. Its true that throughout 7 and now Frontier, the writers have put in this vague plot device of a colonization fleet. But why is this necessary? How long does it need to continue? Does the viewer ever SEE any new worlds or people being left on them? No, not really (although in Frontier there is a partly surveyed planet involved in the story, until.....).

I can see how, being a fan of Macross over Robotech, but having grown up with the later, one could be rather....disgruntled by the lack of tangible continuity and purpose when it comes to story.

Frontier is SUCH a good reboot for the franchise though. Its doing really well here so I hope a second season, OVA or theatrical release gets made at some point!

[kanedaestes]

I was a huge Robotech fan growing up, and it will always have a place in my heart for leading me to Macross and other things in my life but; but I am also aware of the limits that Robotech has. HG was never that inventive or creative and did fuel all their stories off the works of other people and shows. Macross has always pressed forward and trying newer things, and going into different directions. Back in the day when all i knew was Robotech my friends and all laid down the basic laws laid within that show, transforming mechs, music, and love triangles. Now to say you want to get rid of those then the show is no longer Macross, and even barely Robotech because if I remember correctly every part of Robotech had those elements too so you basically want to do away with the things that make the show great from both ends. Jus thought i would point that out for ya

[Xeros]

In other words, you want Gundam with variable fighters.

Bingo!!!

[Tobi54]

I grew up with Robotech as well and am still fond it. Shadow Chronicles, on the otherhand, was quite disappointing to me. It wasn't gawddamn awful, but for the 4 years that it took to be completed, I was expecting way more. Way more than a half-hour rehash of Reflex Point, an entire universe of women with DD breast implants and men with pect/crotch implants (equal opportunity I suppose), and mecha that look and move like plastic. Again not completely awful... but not good enough for me to buy, rent, or download. The only comfort I had in viewing it was hearing some of the original voice actors. But that's just my opinion. I digress though.

As much as many people don't like Macross 7, I didn't think it was that bad. Same with Zero. Have you watched any of Frontier? IMO it's the best since DYRL in terms of animation, character development, mecha action sequences, music, everything overall.

I thought it was awful, the only thing worth salvaging from it was the music, the GC animation was so stiff it made me gag, they tried to hide it by spinning the camera around lol, I haven't seen Macross 7, and I'm not really interested in it, I just cant buy the whole pilot with a guitar concept, I agree completely about DYRL and Frontier though, Zero was good in it's own right, what it lacks in characters and story, makes up in animation, IMO they set a benchmark for dogfight choreography that hasn't been matched yet.

[Nexx Stalker]

pilot with a guitar

I disagree, best concept ever conceived by japanese animation - EVER!

Dynamite!