Mass Effect

[mikeszekely]

All the little details the writers stuck in the games are really starting to amaze me. They really create a sense of a living, breathing universe. I mean, when I was on the Citadel in Mass Effect 2, I hit that blue advertisement box. The ad I got was for an all-Elcor production of Hamlet. The ad was amusing, but when I finished ME2 I decided to go back and replay the first game to make a Paragon Shepard. As I'm running around completing Citadel quests, what should I hear on the news during an elevator ride but an announcement that one Kitt was going to put together an all-Elcor production of Hamlet.

Something else I didn't realize was that Nassana Dantius,

the Asari that Thane was hired to kill on Illium

, had a minor role in the first game as well. She's sitting in the bar by the Embassy, and IIRC she gives you a side quest at some point.

[eugimon]

All the little details the writers stuck in the games are really starting to amaze me. They really create a sense of a living, breathing universe. I mean, when I was on the Citadel in Mass Effect 2, I hit that blue advertisement box. The ad I got was for an all-Elcor production of Hamlet. The ad was amusing, but when I finished ME2 I decided to go back and replay the first game to make a Paragon Shepard. As I'm running around completing Citadel quests, what should I hear on the news during an elevator ride but an announcement that one Kitt was going to put together an all-Elcor production of Hamlet.

Something else I didn't realize was that Nassana Dantius, the Asari that Thane was hired to kill on Illium, had a minor role in the first game as well. She's sitting in the bar by the Embassy, and IIRC she gives you a side quest at some point.

yeah, ME2 is FILLED with stuff from the first game. The conversation between tali and garrus as you wander around the citadel is hilarious as well

[mikeszekely]

Found this tidbit, you can gain the three Dr Pepper DLC items for nothing:

Thanks, works fine.

[David Hingtgen]

Mike---you're missing out on a lot of the references I'd say. There's zillions of references---darn near everything mentioned on ME 2's Citadel and Illium, is straight from ME 1's Citadel (mainly elevator radio ads). I *loved* that the Hamlet production had actually happened, as I'd heard it proposed a zillion times playing ME 1.

As for Nassana in ME 1---she'll give you the quest if you haven't already encountered it already by the half-way point. (most of the time she gave it to me, only once did I stumble upon the right planet). It's the biggest of the "minor" quests IMHO. Up there with Helena Blake's. Which actually seems to be an issue---a lot of people are saying that ME 2 is importing data wrong for some of the "large sidequests", and that the results of Helena Blake's quest and the whole asari consort section, are wrong. It seems to kind of ignore what you did. (that seems true at least for the consort---a message I heard on the Citadel seemed very out-of-character, but if it doesn't "count" what you did for her on ME 1, then it makes perfect sense). A lot of reports of Conrad Verner "mis-remembering" your first encounter, too. Which may actually screw up what happens with him in ME 2, as it may make a paragon solution impossible since the game seems to default that you were a renegade.

Anyways---I just heard that on the 2nd run of an ME 2 character (new game+) you don't get to pick a weapon specialization again? That'd suck, as I'd like to get the AR this time around.

[eugimon]

The Helena Blake thing was right for me. As for the consort thing, you just stopped the leak, you didn't stop people from talking about it.

[Duke Togo]

Indeed, but I imagine if you go Paragon for both games

You'll rally cured Krogan, Rachni, The Geth and many other powerful races to your cause. By going Renegade and putting humanity ahead of everyone you could very well be alone when it comes time to fight Reapers in ME3

If you chose the neutral option in ME1 (focus on Sovereign), the alien council is reformed, but with a human at the head of it. There are so many ways you can go. I fully expect ME3 to have 3 endings: Paragon win, Renegade win, and Reaper domination. After seeing what they did in ME2, I have to believe they'll have an ending with the Reapers winning.

I wonder if you make those choices to restore/rebuild/help those alien races, but also take those renegade chances to grab all the tech you can, what you end up with?

[David Hingtgen]

The Helena Blake thing was right for me. As for the consort thing, you just stopped the leak, you didn't stop people from talking about it.

Yes, but for Helena Blake, a lot of people are reporting

they killed her in ME 1, yet she's alive and well in ME 2. (killing her is actually the Paragon choice)

PS--it seems confirmed that you can't pick again (or pick a different weapon) in new game+. Which sucks, as I think the vast majority of people would like to at least have the OPTION to try something new. I really don't think a shotgun's going to be all that useful on insanity.

[mikeszekely]

Mike---you're missing out on a lot of the references I'd say. There's zillions of references---darn near everything mentioned on ME 2's Citadel and Illium, is straight from ME 1's Citadel (mainly elevator radio ads). I *loved* that the Hamlet production had actually happened, as I'd heard it proposed a zillion times playing ME 1.

Probably. Even though I bought the PC version and sold my Xbox version, I never replayed the first ME until now. So, I haven't actually played Mass Effect since it first came out. I'm sure there's a ton of stuff I forgot, but since I played through ME2 as a renegade I figure I play through the first as a Paragon, then replay the second as a Paragon with the ME1 save some time before ME3.

[Duke Togo]

Mass Effect 1 Saves

http://www.annakie.com/me/home.htm

[David Hingtgen]

Ok, quarian discussion and likely effects of ME 2 on ME 3 in that regard:

Ok, I told them to retake the homeworld, and killed the heretic geth. What you choose to do with the geth will almost certainly affect whatever you told the quarians to do, but I'm wondering if any combination of suggestions is "good". Say they do retake the homeworld---it's not the heretics that are occupying it but rather the main geth, so they won't be unopposed. And they'd have to dismantle the fleet to rebuild infrastructure etc. I'm betting ME 3 is like 6 months after ME 2, not years and years, but who knows. Regardless, even a very successful quarian campaign would leave them in a bad position to help fight off reapers.

But---assuming they keep exploring, and soon find a new world to colonize---same issues. No infrastructure, have to dismantle the fleet, etc.

The only option that seems to "keep them ready for a reaper invasion" is to "maintain the status quo"----which didn't really seem to come up as an option. Also, if you've read the books---you know the quarians simply can't keep the fleet going much longer as-is, they need a planet.

Of course---if the geth are simply "caretakers" like Legion claims and live mainly on space stations---why not let the quarians have their homeworld back? Geth don't seem to particularly want/need it, and they've actually kept to themselves, as only the heretics seem to have come out from behind the veil.

As for heretic geth specifically---I didn't really see the point in re-programming them. The renegade option IMHO should have been "reprogram them to be slaves to the humans" or something to help fight the reapers. Or give them to the quarians, to bolster their army to retake the homeworld. Simply "making them like other geth again" as a paragon option seemed kinda pointless/risky. And the actual renegade option of "just kill 'em all" was wasteful.

[kaiotheforsaken]

Personally David

I think the Quarians, or the majority at least aren't looking to reconcile with the Geth. I imagine they'd jump in and begin an attack fairly quickly. I also imagine the Geth would take them apart. While unaffected Geth don't seem hostile, they will certainly defend themselves. The impression I got from what Shepard and a few others said was that a war to retake the homeworld has potentially race ending implications for the Quarians. It seemed like way to big a risk to me. I know at least one Quarian, I believe Kal Reegar, said that their normal soldiers have nothing but the most basic of equipment and that gear more appropriate for that kind of fighting is in short supply. There is still not much love lost for Quarians in council space.

On the flip side, if they did retake their homeworld then the Geth are devastated and you lose them as an ally against the Reapers. I think I said this before, but a Renegade Shepard in ME3 will probably have very few friends to count on in terms of other races.

[David Hingtgen]

Regarding the experiments:

I just had a thought---I protected Tali and didn't mention her dad's experiments. But right after I got an email from one of the admirals hinting at what they'd found on the lab ship (and mentioning how they weren't going to share it with the humans since Shepard didn't tell them). Perhaps the quarians will use that info/weapon/whatever to beat the geth easily? Maybe if you're a renegade AND you hate Tali, you get her exiled and have the quarians mount a retaking operation---but with the help of her dad's work, and the admirals aren't pissed at you for hiding things--so they'll join in against the reapers?

On a side note, I had saved right before Tali found her dad, so I played out the scene both ways---but I only saved the one where Shep didn't comfort her and she really broke down and got ticked at her dad---I actually hope it'll pay off and in ME 3 I can have a bitter, antagonistic Tali---kind of like what happened to Liara. Angry Liara sucks, but an angry Tali would rock

Also, there is the whole issue with Haestrom's sun changing much faster than it should--that can't be a "throw-away" issue.

PS---the DLC mentioned earlier? It's right. That pic is the character select pic, it's already in the PC version's data etc.

[mikeszekely]

Well, in regards to Quarians and Geth,

when I broke up the fight between Legion and Tali, I took Tali's side since I was courting her and told Legion to stop transmitting information about the Flotilla to the rest of the Geth. Legion complied for the sake of focusing on the mission, but he did say something about the Geth eventually getting even with the Quarians. It seems to me that, while the non-heretic Geth are ok with the idea of peaceful coexistence with organics, they do still have some hostility towards the Quarians. This makes it unlikely that the Geth would allow any kind of peaceful resettlement by the Quarians.

[David Hingtgen]

I did the same, but I don't remember a "getting even" comment. Then again, I read that scene/outcome will often result in loss of loyalty for him, but it didn't for mine---maybe my Shep was influential enough to change it?

[mikeszekely]

I did the same, but I don't remember a "getting even" comment. Then again, I read that scene/outcome will often result in loss of loyalty for him, but it didn't for mine---maybe my Shep was influential enough to change it?

I don't remember the exact phrasing, but it was definitely hostile. It resulted in a loss of loyalty for me, but

I went back later and told Legion that I was lying because Tali was too emotional to deal with rationally on the matter, and it was easier to tell her what she wanted to hear. After that explanation, Legion was loyal again.

From what I've read, it is possible to handle the situation in a way that neither will drop in loyalty.

Edited February 5, 2010 by mikeszekely

[eugimon]

Did you take tali with you on Legion's loyalty mission?

[mikeszekely]

Did you take tali with you on Legion's loyalty mission?

I think so, but I don't remember for sure. Her and Legion have special abilities that work really well against Geth.

I know that for most of the game, I took Mordin with me. His tech powers were way better than any tech powers in the first game, and mostly better than the biotic powers in the game (throw was pretty useful, but I digress). The only times he really came up short were against shielded or armored enemies, like Geth.

My third man would vary. Sometimes Garrus, sometimes Miranda, sometimes Tali.

[David Hingtgen]

I took Tali for Legion's loyalty mission--figured it'd be a learning experience for her. Nevermind the fact that she's the also best anti-geth character in all of ME. (AI hacking and shield drain, hello)

[eugimon]

Her dialog during the ethical choice portion of the mission is pretty interesting in light of the Quarian's relationship to the Geth. makes me wonder if

sending the Quarians to war against the Geth

is the "wrong" choice.

[David Hingtgen]

My guess is it is. I'll do the opposite with my Paragon.

[Duke Togo]

I am the only one who took Legion on Tali's mission?

[mikeszekely]

I am the only one who took Legion on Tali's mission?

Maybe. I didn't have Legion before Tali's loyalty mission. I'm not sure if it's always the case, but it seems like you have to do one of the second set of recruiting missions before the Illusive Man

tells you about the derelict Reaper

. Tali was one of my favorites in the first game, so I went for that mission first. Then it seems like the second set will ask you to do their loyalty mission if you complete any single mission after recruiting them. One side-mission later, I was doing Tali's loyalty mission.

[David Hingtgen]

Yup. I think a lot of people went after Tali first, as she was a "known" character and we'd been waiting to get her. I'll get Legion as early as possible next time.

[bluemax151]

Static Dr. Pepper codes? lol figures I just finally found some of the right 20ozs today. Incidentally, I found them at Target but when you redeem the points on the Dr. Pepper site it claims to be a 7-11 exclusive.

I think David's right about the information being messed up on import sometimes. When I met Conrad Verner in ME2 he accused me of putting a gun in his face in ME1 something I don't remember ever doing.

about Tali&Legion

I never took them on my team at the same time because their skills overlap but at "one point" I got them to cooperate with no problems. They seemed pretty understanding of each other's situations. From his actions it seems Legion

is developing into a full AI something that may put him at odds within the Geth itself since he's allowed to operate almost completely independently. I mean he already displays body language and a respect for the PC.

[CoryHolmes]

About the geth and Tali:

I might be mis-remembering this, but I remember Legion talking about how the geth were hoping to understand the actions the quarians took during the "Morning War". Could it be that, while they're preserving the original quarian homeworld they're actually waiting for their creators to open a dialog and communicate with them as equals and not as property? The true geth (non-heretic variety) seemed rather peaceful and just want to find their own future, so perhaps if the quarians did talk to them as equals, the geth might be pursuaded to help them rebuild their homeworld. Or maybe that's what they're waiting for, to repair the ecosystem from the damage caused during the Morning War and then present it as a present to their creators?

EDIT: one more thing, people. There are no capitalized species names other than the Protheans! (and, retroactivally, the Reapers). It's "geth" and "asari" and "elcor"! [/soapbox]

Edited February 5, 2010 by CoryHolmes

[bluemax151]

Took me a bit to find a screenshot but am I the only person that noticed this?

or the Apocalypse Now reference? It's like always there but I don't think anyone has mentioned it. Has to be intentional given the actor.

[CoryHolmes]

What reference? I couldn't enjoy Apocalypse Now and turned it off.

[David Hingtgen]

Cory---you'll note I never capitalize quarian etc. I was actually expecting someone to call me out on it, so it could be explained without preaching/getting on a soapbox.

But Prothean is capitalized? Doesn't that go against the rule?

[David Hingtgen]

I don't remember the exact phrasing, but it was definitely hostile. It resulted in a loss of loyalty for me, but

I went back later and told Legion that I was lying because Tali was too emotional to deal with rationally on the matter, and it was easier to tell her what she wanted to hear. After that explanation, Legion was loyal again.

I think that happened to me, too. I just didn't recall that little follow-up moment (happens when you play multi-hour stretches vs small chunks), and must not have checked loyalty often enough to see it go down then up again.

Though for me, I justify it by saying (to myself) THAT too was a lie, as I'd never have Shep lie to Tali.

[CoryHolmes]

Cory---you'll note I never capitalize quarian etc. I was actually expecting someone to call me out on it, so it could be explained without preaching/getting on a soapbox.

But Prothean is capitalized? Doesn't that go against the rule?

Well, consider yourself called. Paged by Yeoman Kelly, even

Actually, it's because of the Protheans that the rule is there. As far as galactic society is concerned, the Protheans are responsible for the mass relays, the Citadel, and therefore all the advanced technology that makes modern life possible. It's due to reverence and recognition of their enormous contributions that all other species' names are treated as regular nouns and not given a capitalized honourific.

[bluemax151]

What reference? I couldn't enjoy Apocalypse Now and turned it off.

Couldn't enjoy? Oh wow... maybe it's because I grew up watching war movies with my pops my opinion is a bit different.

Anyway, there's technically two I think but the Illusive man is one huge constant Apocalypse Now reference.

[David Hingtgen]

It's due to reverence and recognition of their enormous contributions that all other species' names are treated as regular nouns and not given a capitalized honourific.

Is that from Karpyshyn's blog or something? I don't recall seeing that in the books nor on the Bioware boards, though I haven't read Revelations in a while.

[CoryHolmes]

Is that from Karpyshyn's blog or something? I don't recall seeing that in the books nor on the Bioware boards, though I haven't read Revelations in a while.

Uh... it's from a... something-or-other. Not a blog, but I think it may have been in Revelations. I just checked the ME Wiki and there's no mention of it in there, but the spelling convention is there: Protheans are capitalized; humans, geth, hanar are not.

[bluemax151]

From meforums.bioware.com

We capitalize Prothean for the same reason we capitalize God. It is a sign of respect and fear.

http://meforums.bioware.com/viewtopic.html...4&forum=104

I want to say it's mentioned in ME1 but think about it we don't capitalize "human(s)" do we?

[Duke Togo]

Taking Legion to the Flotilla gets a rather large response. And not just a few lines, and not just some throw away dialog. Bioware did it right, and as you'd expect if you were to bring him there.

Fair warning, the more quests you do before going through the relay, the greater the chance you have at having

Normany crew members die in the pods on the Collector base.

I do not recommend doing this on your "main" save.