Morpheus Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 So I`m collecting movie props instead of SWI combat artefacts? LMAO Nope, your collecting sophisticated toys.
knoted Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Probably a little bit of anime magic vs. coolness factor vs. plot hole, considering the Zentraedi were bred to be warriors I'd say that they would be stronger than a normal human that has been macronized. Yeah, I guess that's even another discrepancy with Robotech ; where Rick's VF1 withstands a bit more from the Breetai fight...although he did indeed got punctured by those wall spikes.... So, maybe the Valkerie's chest plating / and or torso is just fairly weak.
Mr March Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Hi I'm new here Although I watched the Robotech tv series when I was a kid back in 1986, it was only recently I got to see Macross DYRL. My question is about Roy's Valkerie, when he died in DYRL. So, the Zentraedi dude drops down in his mobile battle suit and kicks the VF's head to pulp : Ok, from that height, I can understand that. Minutes later the Zentraedi's exited his battle suit and basically punches right through the VF's chest plating, then rips it off Are the VF's that weak ? If we were to compare it to human sizes, it would mean a strong man would be able to punch through an equally sized VF even more easy, than through a tin can !? I mean...respectively, the VF's chest would be weaker than the backside of my Dell laptop it's screen panel. I'm not sure, it seems as such a plothole/discrepancy, when you see Max ripping through a Zentraedi's jugular right through it's battle pod, in an earlier scene ; that would imply that the VF's outer shell is stronger.... Contradiction maybe ? Why would we compare the sequence to a normal sized man tearing apart a tin can? The analogy is in no way relevant to a full sized Zentradi throwing a punch. Speaking of which, can you imagine how devastating a punch from a full sized Zentradi would be? If a professional boxer can dish out nearly a half a ton of force with a single punch, then a 10+ ton Zentradi is dishing out somewhere between 40-50 tons per punch. Also, it might be wise to take into account that Roy's VF-1S Strike Valkyrie had it's torso blasted several times by the Nousjadeul-Ger's beam gun. This occurred before Kamjin got out of his N-Ger Battle Suit and started throwing 50-ton punches at the Battroid's chest.
anime52k8 Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Regarding the SV-51, there's cool fugly and then there is just plain fugly. The SV-51 is cool fugly; the VA-3 Invader is just plain fugly. The SV-51 looks menacing and dangerous in Battroid form; almost disturbing in an insect-like fashion. The Battroid mode of the VA-3 Invader looks like a cosmic joke; as if some engineer had the idea of building a variable fighter for their infant named Jeb. I resent that, I love the VA-3. it's such a cool design, It's a transforming A-6 god dammit! I think the battroid mode is cool, and it's probably the second coolest fighter mode after the VF-4. # VF-11MAXL: Version with FF-2099A engines identical to the VF-16's, strengthened overall structure to tolerate the engines' thrust, and redesigned modified delta wing for increased fuselage strength and aerodynamic characteristics. A limited number of these special reserve fighters exists, all manufactured to order by the pilots. # VF-11MAXL Custom: Custom version manufactured by Shinnakasu Heavy Industry and the Macross 7 Special Technologies Group with internal sound system, speaker launcher pod, and FF-2099A engines similar to the VF-16's. I really hate how they use the "identical to the VF-16's " descriptor. WHAT IS THE VF-16?!?! all we know is it has the same engines as the VF-11MAXL, wich are similar to the ones in the MAXL custom. and it's presumably beafier than the VF-11 since they needed to strengthen it in order to the engines. unless the VF-16 is like the real F-16 and has a single engine
Einherjar Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Speaking of which, can you imagine how devastating a punch from a full sized Zentradi would be? If a professional boxer can dish out nearly a half a ton of force with a single punch, then a 10+ ton Zentradi is dishing out somewhere between 40-50 tons per punch. Although it's after 50+ years of R&D, macronized Klan showed us what happens when you slap a Valkyrie in the face. The head could be shooting through space if it was a VF-1.
knoted Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Why would we compare the sequence to a normal sized man tearing apart a tin can? ...because the Zentraedi made it look like the plating was just as thin, if not, thinner and/or weaker than a tin can.... Speaking of which, can you imagine how devastating a punch from a full sized Zentradi would be? If a professional boxer can dish out nearly a half a ton of force with a single punch, then a 10+ ton Zentradi is dishing out somewhere between 40-50 tons per punch.I'm no boxing expert, so I wouldn't know the amount of Kj force a pro boxer can dish out, let alone a Zentraedi warrior. Also, it might be wise to take into account that Roy's VF-1S Strike Valkyrie had it's torso blasted several times by the Nousjadeul-Ger's beam gun. This occurred before Kamjin got out of his N-Ger Battle Suit and started throwing 50-ton punches at the Battroid's chest. Well the beam gun punctured the plating aside the pilot's seat. Then, Zentraedi dude swung one single punch at the battroid upon which a cavity appeared which he used to rip out the mid panel. Which also made clear he pretty much busted up the inner chassis enough to squash Roy flat. ...but alas...maybe it's a bit of a storyline discrepancy to cater for dramatic effect, indeed....
SkullLeaderVF-X Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 "Whoa, is that a MAXL...? Pretty hot!" You just like it because of the "booby" speakers! Another question. Since the VF-25 is probly going to be the new main variable fighter. Do we assume that the VF-27 will soon be the new special variable opps fighter, replacing the VF-22?What would become of the VF-19 and 22? It just bugs me that the VF-19 and 22 didn't seem to get anytime to shine, or for a better matter of speaking, have a long time in the spotlight like the VF-1 or VF-11. Hell even the VF-17 and 171 seem to have gotten more service time then them...... Am sorry if this is more of a rant then a question. I just loves me the 19 and 22, and hate that it's "outdated" now.
Gubaba Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 You just like it because of the "booby" speakers! Nah, I was just quoting some old comic that one of the MW members made years ago... Another question. Since the VF-25 is probly going to be the new main variable fighter. Do we assume that the VF-27 will soon be the new special variable opps fighter, replacing the VF-22?What would become of the VF-19 and 22? It just bugs me that the VF-19 and 22 didn't seem to get anytime to shine, or for a better matter of speaking, have a long time in the spotlight like the VF-1 or VF-11. Hell even the VF-17 and 171 seem to have gotten more service time then them...... Am sorry if this is more of a rant then a question. I just loves me the 19 and 22, and hate that it's "outdated" now. I don't know what happened to them (or what will happen to them) but I disagree that they didn't have any time to shine. In Mac7, Emerald Force had "normal" VF-19s, and they used them throughout the later episodes. And the VF-22 was the star of bar-none THE best battle scene in the entire series. Hell, in the Encore episodes we even get blue and red Max and Millia VF-22 tag-team action! What more could you want?
Master Dex Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 To add to the 19 and 22 thing, even if their chance to shine so to speak is limited to Macross 7 (and their prototypes use in Plus) doesn't mean they aren't being used out there. I think an earlier theory that they are used by some colony fleets and the main Earth defense fleet is more than likely the case whereas fleets like Frontier and Galaxy chose to go for other options like the cheaper 171 or cybernetically controlled ghost fighters and mysterious non variable fighters like the one from ep.5 of Frontier. Also lets remember there is very likely a VF-24 that will replace many mainstream fighters based on the YF-24, it is only Frontier Fleet's LAI that cooperated with Shinsei to create the VF-25 design from the YF-24, Galaxy did the same to make the VF-27. Also it isn't like the 19 and 22 haven't had a good service life if they are going to be replaced soon by 24s or even 25s because they were introduced to fleets by the time of 2045 and it is now close to 2060 by the time Frontier is done so that is close to 15 years of service. Just because we didn't see them used isn't because they weren't used, it is because we were seeing the stories in the Macross universe that used something else instead. I have a feeling the 19 was in great use in some places.
azrael Posted February 10, 2009 Author Posted February 10, 2009 Another question. Since the VF-25 is probly going to be the new main variable fighter. Do we assume that the VF-27 will soon be the new special variable opps fighter, replacing the VF-22?What would become of the VF-19 and 22? It just bugs me that the VF-19 and 22 didn't seem to get anytime to shine, or for a better matter of speaking, have a long time in the spotlight like the VF-1 or VF-11. Hell even the VF-17 and 171 seem to have gotten more service time then them...... Am sorry if this is more of a rant then a question. I just loves me the 19 and 22, and hate that it's "outdated" now. The VF-25 was undergoing testing. It may or may not make it to final mass production. Considering the requirements for the VF-27, I doubt it will make it into full service unless they plan on really dumbing it down. The VF-19 is still the UNAF's (or NUNAF's) main VF. That might not change since this is UNS/NUNS. The VF-22 is still the UNS Spec Ops fighter. The VF-11 had about 15 years of service by M7 and was still going. It probably wasn't replaced by the VF-171 till about 2047/2048. That's a good 17-18 years right there. The VF-1 served the UN Forces from 2008/2009 till 2020. That's almost 12 years right there. The VF-4 had a service lifetime of almost 18 years from 2012 til 2030. The VF-5000 had at least 20+ years on it. Even if it is being used more by local governments, that's still a respectable lifetime.
Mr March Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 (edited) If the VF-171 Nightmare Plus is still a viable main line fighter for deployment in 2059, there's no way the YF-19/VF-19 Excalibur and YF-21/VF-22 Sturmvogel II are outdated. The Macross Compendium specifically says the VF-171 Nightmare Plus is actually a "downgraded" version of the original VF-17 Nightmare. The VF-17 Nightmare, while superior to the VF-11 Thunderbolt, was also significantly below the capabilities of the YF-19/VF-19 Excalibur and YF-21/VF-22 Sturmvogel II. Even with upgrades made over time to extend the service life of the VF-171 Nightmare Plus, there's no way the VF-171 ever exceeded the performance capabilities of the VF-19/VF-22. Granted, variable fighters will eventually become outdated, but comparatively speaking, the YF-19/VF-19 Excalibur and YF-21/VF-22 Sturmvogel II would still be very relevant designs in the 2059 era. Obviously, the VF-25 Messiah is superior to the VF-19/VF-22 when it comes to versatility, engine design and new technologies (ISC, EX-Gear, linear actuators). However, I would bet money that the VF-19/VF-22 still outperform even the enhanced VF-171EX Nightmare Plus. Just look at the statistics for the T-W ratios for all the fighters and compare them. VF-11C Thunderbolt = 6.33 VF-17D Nightmare = 9.28 VF-19F Excalibur = 16.96 VF-22S Sturmvogel II = 13.96 VF-25F Messiah = 39.09 If the VF-171 Nightmare is a "downgraded" version of the VF-17 Nightmare meant for easier mass manufacture, then it's T-W ratio must be somewhere between the VF-11 and VF-17. Over the years, the VF-171 Nightmare Plus received improvements/modifications, so between it's introduction some time after 2047 to the events of Macross Frontier in 2059, the VF-171 may have eventually been upgraded enough to approach performance parity with the original VF-17 Nightmare. Now, if we assume the VF-171EX Nightmare Plus is an improved version of the "current" 2059 VF-171 Nightmare Plus (the Macross Compendium describes the VF-171EX as having "equipment improvements, strengthened armor, adoption of EX-Gear, enhanced engines, and MDE armaments") then it would have a T-W ratio somewhere beyond 9.28. But there is a long way to go before the VF-171EX can approach the T-W ratios of the VF-19F and the VF-22 Sturmvogel II. If I had to guess, I'd say at best the VF-171EX could perhaps MATCH the VF-19F and VF-22S in acceleration. Having said that, this is all just a bunch of fancy guessing until official statistics appear for the VF-171. Weapons, armor strength, power, and everything else would be even more questions open to interpretation. ...because the Zentraedi made it look like the plating was just as thin, if not, thinner and/or weaker than a tin can.... *snip* ...but alas...maybe it's a bit of a storyline discrepancy to cater for dramatic effect, indeed.... Which is irrelevant, since we're talking a 10 ton giant and the physics that involves. He could flatten a tank with his foot; does that mean a tank is made of tin? Of course not. There's a huge difference (pun intended) between what an 80 kg man can rend apart with his bare hands and what a 10 ton giant can rend apart with his hands. So no, IMO it's not dramatic effect at work in DYRL. There are five holes clearly shown on the torso of the VF-1S Battroid right before Kamjin punches it, including a hole right where his fist falls. If the much more powerful N-Ger Battle Suit could only damage the head of the VF-1S when diving at the Battroid with it's full strength, force and weight, then obviously the beam gun blast is what accounts for the weakened that allowed Kamjin's punch to damage the Valkyrie's chest. Simple. No need to explain away anything with dramatic discrepancy. At least, not for this particular scene. Edited February 10, 2009 by Mr March
Zinjo Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 Hi I'm new here Although I watched the Robotech tv series when I was a kid back in 1986, it was only recently I got to see Macross DYRL. My question is about Roy's Valkerie, when he died in DYRL. So, the Zentraedi dude drops down in his mobile battle suit and kicks the VF's head to pulp : Ok, from that height, I can understand that. Minutes later the Zentraedi's exited his battle suit and basically punches right through the VF's chest plating, then rips it off Are the VF's that weak ? If we were to compare it to human sizes, it would mean a strong man would be able to punch through an equally sized VF even more easy, than through a tin can !? I mean...respectively, the VF's chest would be weaker than the backside of my Dell laptop it's screen panel. I'm not sure, it seems as such a plothole/discrepancy, when you see Max ripping through a Zentraedi's jugular right through it's battle pod, in an earlier scene ; that would imply that the VF's outer shell is stronger.... Contradiction maybe ? The Valkyrie's are equipped with a form of energy converting armor that reinforced the fighter (it takes the excess energy taken from the nuclear engines and converts it into a form of armor for the fighter). Without it the fighters were not that tough. This is how Hikaru could survive flying his fighter through an overpass to rescue Minmei. One explanation is that the ECA was damaged or failed and thus left Roy's battroid much more vulnerable than it would have been with all it's systems fully operational.
Zinjo Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 OK let's put things into perspective. How many worlds are part of the UNG? How many colony fleets are still enroute thus far? The combined population of the Earth and UN colonies is likely in the billions by 2059. Now also consider other military branches besides Spacy-UNAF, UNMC, UNSF, UNN and you have a variety of branches and fleets to equip. The UNMC will not have the same requirements as the UNSpacy or the UNAF. The VF-19 may be the main fighter for the UNAF & the military arm of Spacy, yet not adopted for the colony program. The VF-171 was given that role, possibly due to financial constraints in the program. With Island Class colony vessels, it seems more feasable to task the colonial governments with developing local versions of basic designs, much like how the VF-25 was developed out of the VF-24 designs. Those customizations could then be forwarded back to the UNG for evaluation and possible incorporation into the next gen fighters. I agree with Azreal that the VF-25 may not become the next main fighter for Spacy (it is for Frontier though). The next Spacy fighter may well be a generic version of the VF-24. From a creative point of view Kawamori has established an interesting precedent. If fighter development in the Macross universe is becoming less centralized, then each colony fleet could potentially have several variants or even different derivatives of existing fighter designs.
Mr March Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 From a creative point of view Kawamori has established an interesting precedent. If fighter development in the Macross universe is becoming less centralized, then each colony fleet could potentially have several variants or even different derivatives of existing fighter designs. That's a development in Macross that I find very appealing and realistic. The colony fleets of the New United Nations Government are so autonomous, it's almost tradition alone that is actually keeping them in a united government. I suppose the few survivors of Space War I also had something to do with a strong sense of community (and perhaps even political predisposition bred through selective cloning...scary thought). But in most any other situation, the colonies and fleets would have experienced a certain degree of independence by now. So the NUNG must maintain cohesion by granting their colonies and fleets an awful lot of power and freedom to do as they wish. It would be the only way to maintain a single unified government in what is geographically a highly decentralized civilization. The decentralized NUNG could also be a big reason why the Presidency/Government of the NUNG is itself mobile. At any rate, it makes sense that while the colonies and fleets all share technology (except for those fleets that go rogue and conceive plans of universal domination...like Macross Galaxy), they will invariably make choices that best suit their own circumstances. Thus different variable fighters for different fleets with different priorities and different means (financial or otherwise) will be inevitable. Besides, I'd love to believe there are colonies and fleets out there with VF-19s and VF-22s
knoted Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 The Valkyrie's are equipped with a form of energy converting armor that reinforced the fighter (it takes the excess energy taken from the nuclear engines and converts it into a form of armor for the fighter). Without it the fighters were not that tough. This is how Hikaru could survive flying his fighter through an overpass to rescue Minmei. One explanation is that the ECA was damaged or failed and thus left Roy's battroid much more vulnerable than it would have been with all it's systems fully operational. That sounds interesting...kind of like an active armour reinforcement system. Indeed, to maintain consistency in suspension of disbelief is not an easy feat in sci fi. Different, but still similar maybe to Transformers, in the 2007 movie ; where the human sabot blasts would prevent cybertronian armour to revamp after damage.....
Zinjo Posted February 10, 2009 Posted February 10, 2009 The decentralized NUNG could also be a big reason why the Presidency/Government of the NUNG is itself mobile. Has confirmation of that yet been found? That sounds interesting...kind of like an active armour reinforcement system. Indeed, to maintain consistency in suspension of disbelief is not an easy feat in sci fi. Different, but still similar maybe to Transformers, in the 2007 movie ; where the human sabot blasts would prevent cybertronian armour to revamp after damage..... Not quite. Valks don't repair themselves. Macross Zero explains the role of ECA (aka AWAG/RA 105 SWAG energy converting armor). It essentially gives the fighter the armor strength of a tank, without the weight of physical armor.
RedWolf Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 Accirding to the later eps Leon was the fifth president of Frontier. Meaning though they are a state they are still members of the New UN.
Master Dex Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 Accirding to the later eps Leon was the fifth president of Frontier. Meaning though they are a state they are still members of the New UN. Good catch, the entire UN government would have had far more than 5 presidents by 2059 whether or not you include that scum-sucking, slimy, snake-ass Leon as a full fledged president. Of course this is assuming rules of presidencies we are used to, such as term length and number of allotted multiple terms (e.g. U.S. Presidency has 4 year terms with a 2 term limit (only broken once), not that I am basing only off U.S., just an example). In any case it seems unlikely that term lengths would be long enough or multiple terms to be plentiful enough to allow Howard Glass to only be the 4th president of the UNG. On the other hand, it could be that Leon is the 5th president of the NUNG, as it was only established sometime between 2047 (or 2051 if VF-X2 is canon) and 2059... but if the term length and term limits are to be assumed similar to real world presidencies (nothing specific) then it would seem the NUNG would not have had 4 presidents by 2059, only 1 or 2 at most. So excluding that due to unlikeliness I therefor have to agree with RedWolf that Glass was the 4th president of the Frontier colony state, Leon the 5th, and they are part of the larger NUNG which has its own presidency theoretically.
Letigre Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 Don't forget after the crew on the Quarter made it's discovery of Grace's plan, they sent a message detailing everything back to UN HQ (presumably on Earth), also lamenting that it would not only take time for the message to reach them, but as well for the Assembly there to deliberate over it and act.
Mr March Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 (edited) Has confirmation of that yet been found? Not quite. Valks don't repair themselves. Macross Zero explains the role of ECA (aka AWAG/RA 105 SWAG energy converting armor). It essentially gives the fighter the armor strength of a tank, without the weight of physical armor. It's on the Macross Compendium that Howard Glass was the big cheese of the NUNG. Regarding Energy Converting Armor, the VF-0 Phoenix had armor as strong as a tank when powered by conventional (overtuned) jet engines. When the thermonuclear reaction engines for the VF-1 come along, pumping out 650 MW of power per engine, who knows the upper limit of the armor strength. Edited February 11, 2009 by Mr March
SkullLeaderVF-X Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 I'd love to believe there are colonies and fleets out there with VF-19s and VF-22s As do I!! Thank you everyone for your input. I also am starting to think that each fleet/colony maybe will adapt there own main fighter. But I have another question. Since the fleets operate almost autonomously now. Would, lets say a new fighter is developed on earth or what not. Would the colony fleets (like Frontier, and just for the heck of it Galaxy for example) be informed on this new development (like in M7 with the 19 and 22s information being sent to be made for emerald force and for Max and Millia) to produce if they wished to, or would it be a "if you guys want to know you have to call us" sorta thing?
RedWolf Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 (edited) As do I!! Thank you everyone for your input. I also am starting to think that each fleet/colony maybe will adapt there own main fighter. But I have another question. Since the fleets operate almost autonomously now. Would, lets say a new fighter is developed on earth or what not. Would the colony fleets (like Frontier, and just for the heck of it Galaxy for example) be informed on this new development (like in M7 with the 19 and 22s information being sent to be made for emerald force and for Max and Millia) to produce if they wished to, or would it be a "if you guys want to know you have to call us" sorta thing? The YF-24 plans which is a joint development of Shinsei Industry and General Galaxy , the same rival companies which built the YF-19/VF-19 and YF-21/VF-22, were sent to colony fleets. From this Macross Frontier's LAI jointly with Shinsei Industry created the VF-25 Messiah while Macross Galaxy Variable Fighter Development Arsenal created the VF-27 Lucifer in secret. Yes those corporate seditious cyborgs are real bastards. Edited February 11, 2009 by RedWolf
Mr March Posted February 11, 2009 Posted February 11, 2009 The NUNG might be a decentralized government, but the colonies and fleets are still part of one government. So the New UN Spacy would deploy their assets wherever there is a need, whether on a colony, in deep space or on a fleet. In the case of new technology leading to new military assets, deployment would likely be based on priority and/or necessity, much like the military deploy assets today. The difference between the modern military and the New UN Spacy is most of the Colonization Fleets are completely self sufficient and able to build virtually anything that a fully industrialized colony could build, only on a smaller scale. Hence, rather than building a bunch of VF-24 Evolution variable fighters at some centralized manufacturing center on Earth or Eden and then shipping them to the colonies or fleets, the New UN Spacy simply sends the plans for the YF-24 to the colonies and fleets. Each Colony or Fleet will then decide how many, if any, VF-24 Evolution fighters they wish to build. Some other colonies or fleets will even build variants for their own needs or design new fighter classes entirely based upon the basic YF-24 Evolution model (such as the VF-25 Messiah built by the Macross Frontier Fleet and the VF-27 Lucifer, built by the Macross Galaxy Fleet).
anime52k8 Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 Hence, rather than building a bunch of VF-24 Evolution variable fighters at some centralized manufacturing center on Earth or Eden and then shipping them to the colonies or fleets, the New UN Spacy simply sends the plans for the YF-24 to the colonies and fleets. Each Colony or Fleet will then decide how many, if any, VF-24 Evolution fighters they wish to build. Some other colonies or fleets will even build variants for their own needs or design new fighter classes entirely based upon the basic YF-24 Evolution model (such as the VF-25 Messiah built by the Macross Frontier Fleet and the VF-27 Lucifer, built by the Macross Galaxy Fleet). wait just a second. when did the YF/VF-24 get a name? This is the first time I've seen it called VF-24 Evolution anywhere.
RedWolf Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 wait just a second. when did the YF/VF-24 get a name? This is the first time I've seen it called VF-24 Evolution anywhere. I think the project behind the YF-24 was called Evolution as it featured a new revolutionary magnetic based transformation system.
Master Dex Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 Hmm.. the name Evolution is news to me, maybe it was on some behind the scenes thing.. or on that YF-24 screen in ep.15.
sketchley Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 I posted the name here: http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry682258 on Nov 13 2008, and knew about it earlier than that. It's also been on the Compendium for a few weeks: http://macross.anime.net/wiki/YF-24
azrael Posted February 12, 2009 Author Posted February 12, 2009 I posted the name here: http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry682258 on Nov 13 2008, and knew about it earlier than that. It's also been on the Compendium for a few weeks: http://macross.anime.net/wiki/YF-24 Guess they didn't read my notes from the Vol. 6 liner notes either. http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=707331
Gubaba Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 Guess they didn't read my notes from the Vol. 6 liner notes either. http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&p=707331 Or my translation Chronicle's VF-25S Sheet... http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry695196
Zinjo Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 (edited) It's on the Macross Compendium that Howard Glass was the big cheese of the NUNG. I'm still not convinced since the old compendium lists the leader of the UNG as a Prime Minister, not a president. 2001 January Inauguration of Earth U.N. Government. Founding Prime Minister, Harlan J. Niven [Niiben (sic)]. It makes little sense to me that a Presidential aide would assume the Presidency over the entire NUNG, when outside of the US, the Prime Minister would take on that role if their President were to become incapacitated. The NUNS PM would likely be located elsewhere in the galaxy (planet, colony ship, etc...). Leon taking over as Administrative Director of Frontier is another matter. Edited February 12, 2009 by Zinjo
Master Dex Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 I'm still not convinced since the old compendium lists the leader of the UNG as a Prime Minister, not a president. It makes little sense to me that a Presidential aide would assume the Presidency over the entire NUNG, when outside of the US, the Prime Minister would take on that role if the President were to become incapacitated. The NUNS PM would likely be located elsewhere in the galaxy (planet, colony ship, etc...). Leon taking over as Administrative Director of Frontier is another matter. Even in the US, a presidential aid doesn't succeed a president, the vice president does. It would be an interesting government structure to have an aid be a president back up.
Zinjo Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 Even in the US, a presidential aid doesn't succeed a president, the vice president does. It would be an interesting government structure to have an aid be a president back up. I didn't mention the VP since I suspected the majority of the members on this board were aware of the US Presidential succession.
anime52k8 Posted February 12, 2009 Posted February 12, 2009 I'm still not convinced since the old compendium lists the leader of the UNG as a Prime Minister, not a president. It makes little sense to me that a Presidential aide would assume the Presidency over the entire NUNG, when outside of the US, the Prime Minister would take on that role if their President were to become incapacitated. The NUNS PM would likely be located elsewhere in the galaxy (planet, colony ship, etc...). Leon taking over as Administrative Director of Frontier is another matter. it makes even less sense that the President of the entire NUNG would be permanently on a colonization fleet on the edge of populated space, no matter how decentralized the UNG is. If Glass really was the president of everything, you'd think that the frontier would be in a BIT better contact with the rest of NUNS and the UNG. It's usually expected that the leader of a government should appear to be an active part of that government, and If I was a citizen of the UNG I would definitely not feel like the president is playing an active role in the government when he's out on the edge of space on some random colonial mission.
Master Dex Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I didn't mention the VP since I suspected the majority of the members on this board were aware of the US Presidential succession. I was more or less stating the obvious, that way there is no question.
ff95gj Posted February 13, 2009 Posted February 13, 2009 I suspect I would be sneered and splited at, but this is the best place I would get an answer: At the end of Macross Frontier, we know the Galaxy is involved. From wikipedia: "Captain Wilder reveals evidence that proves how leaders of Macross Galaxy fleet were behind Vajra attacks on Macross Frontier fleet and that Leon was conspiring with them." - Why would they join such a plot? What would these people gain by helping Grace to be the Queen of the universe? And attacking a sister colony fleet? - Why don't the Vajras attack them? The WHOLE galaxy population are implanted with the crystal thing (so the Vajra acknowledge them as friends)? - We see the Galaxy battleship (in battroid mode alright). That's the whole Galaxy fleet and no islands? If that is the case, when Frontier "defeated" it, did they kill the civilians too? Thanks all!
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