About the Macross Chronicles

[sketchley]

* VF-17 Nightmare

Goody!

* The Zentradi Attack [Will this be the first History "B" Sheet...?]

Hmm... good question, especially as the sheets focus on the first attack, and none of the subsequent ones. Though, I'm thinking it could possibly be about a later Zentraedi vs Zentraedi, or even Zentraedi vs Mac7 attack. But that's remote, IMHO.

Technology Sheet

* Natural Resurrection Plan [???]

Probably the back-up plan for the Human Seeding plan. (The infamous "Plan B".)

* Bender Toys

??!?!?

[edwin3060]

Sweet! VF-11B would be nice, coming before the release of the toy in April. Would the Natural Resurrection plan be referring to the cloning that went on to repopulate the human race?

[azrael]

Yes, that's 3 issues so far with no VF-1.

And we're spending an entire Timeline sheet on the Chirstmas episode?

[Mr March]

VF-11B Thunderbolt and the VF-17 Nightmare in one issue! Yahoo

[Morpheus]

Natural resurrection plan? Could it be mass cloning or mass necromancy?

[VF-25 Messiah]

Though I have not seen the original japanese, but perhaps its meant to say "Nature restoration plan" or something similiar? Ie, restoring the earth's ecosystem. Of course, I seem to recall that the ship that Kamjin repaired had crashed in some thriving jungle, so that was perhaps never so much of an issue... but Hikaru was reacting to seeing flowers in that one episode...

[Gubaba]

Though I have not seen the original japanese, but perhaps its meant to say "Nature restoration plan" or something similiar? Ie, restoring the earth's ecosystem. Of course, I seem to recall that the ship that Kamjin repaired had crashed in some thriving jungle, so that was perhaps never so much of an issue... but Hikaru was reacting to seeing flowers in that one episode...

You're probably right...I always think of Tostuzen as being "naturally," but it CAN refer to "nature," right?

[josue]

You're probably right...I always think of Tostuzen as being "naturally," but it CAN refer to "nature," right?

Actually totsuzen 突然　means suddenly not nature.

[Gubaba]

Actually totsuzen 突然　means suddenly not nature.

Sorry, I was thinking of...what is it..."Jizen"? Anyway, it's 自然.

And the whole thing: 自然再生計画.

I admit that I tend to do the Chronicles contents pretty mch the moment I wake up on Wednesday mornings, and I try to do them quickly, so sometimes I'm a little off, either due to fuzzy brain, or simply not wanting to bother to check my kanji dictionary.

On reflection, I assume that it is indeed referring to "nature reclamation," but that seems like a strange thing to have a Technology Sheet for.

[sketchley]

Not necessarily. It shows that they have the technology, how it's used, and how badly scortched the Earth is. So, in a roundabout way, we may get a better understanding of the 2050's era and beyond Earth.

[VF-25 Messiah]

Sorry, I was thinking of...what is it..."Jizen"? Anyway, it's 自然.

And the whole thing: 自然再生計画.

I admit that I tend to do the Chronicles contents pretty mch the moment I wake up on Wednesday mornings, and I try to do them quickly, so sometimes I'm a little off, either due to fuzzy brain, or simply not wanting to bother to check my kanji dictionary.

On reflection, I assume that it is indeed referring to "nature reclamation," but that seems like a strange thing to have a Technology Sheet for.

It's "shizen"

Anyway, seems my hunch was right, woot.

[Gubaba]

In Issue 20:

Mechanic Sheet

* YF-19 [w00t!]

* CVN-99 Asuka II

* Destroid [Just "Destroid"...? Destroid WHAT? Phalanx, Defender, Cheyenne? Work?]

* Macross Frontier Vehicles

Character Sheet

* Isamu Dyson

* Macross 7 Media People

* Varauta Soldiers

Timeline Sheet

* The Defense of Macross City

History Sheet

* City 7 Wandering

World Guide Sheet

* Inside the Macross

Song Sheet

* TRY AGAIN / LIGHT THE LIGHT

Goods Sheet

* Visual Media Blu-Ray/DVD

[Mr March]

The YF-21 was a nice spread, so the YF-19 should be really good too.

[sketchley]

(...)

* Destroid [Just "Destroid"...? Destroid WHAT? Phalanx, Defender, Cheyenne? Work?](...)

Could be referring to one of the pre-Tomahawk MBR-04 Mk VI variants that is called, "destroid". Could this be an Earth Trekker??? Our first not-appeared-in-an-anime stats sheet?????

[MDP310]

Could be referring to one of the pre-Tomahawk MBR-04 Mk VI variants that is called, "destroid". Could this be an Earth Trekker??? Our first not-appeared-in-an-anime stats sheet?????

Maybe it's about the Destroids in general.

[Gubaba]

Maybe it's about the Destroids in general.

Well...considering that they've already done the Tomahawk and the Monster, that seems unlikely...unless it's, like, Macross Zero or Frontier Destroids or something. Frontier's were relatively unexciting, and probably could be joined together on a single sheet.

[Seto Kaiba]

Well...considering that they've already done the Tomahawk and the Monster, that seems unlikely...unless it's, like, Macross Zero or Frontier Destroids or something. Frontier's were relatively unexciting, and probably could be joined together on a single sheet.

Maybe, since they're showing such little love for Macross II, they've decided to cram all five destroids from the OVA onto a single mecha sheet.

[Gubaba]

Maybe, since they're showing such little love for Macross II, they've decided to cram all five destroids from the OVA onto a single mecha sheet.

Always the optimist, eh, Seto?

[sketchley]

I doubt the Cheyenne and Cheyenne II would get short shift.

Seto does have a good point. However, if it's anything like the other two pages published to date that have been on multiple vehicles, it'll be a first page cover, followed by only two (2) of the vehicles in question - making it a 4 (2 double sided) page presentation in total.

[sketchley]

Well, I'll be. "Destroid" does indeed appear to be the "Cheyenne II". The YF-19 also appears to be the cover piece/foldout sheet.

Re: iss 19

VF-11B: lineart for the bayonnet equipped 30 mm 6 barrel gunpod for the win!

VF-17: is the "C" sheet for the M7 version: front are the Super Parts, reverse is the transformation

Prometheus: what? No fighters/vehicles stats? On a B sheet? Nice that the deck weapons are clearly IDed.

No gallery sheet, but a fold out SDF-1 goods sheet!?!

Ozuma Lee: complete with pineapple cake!

Zentraedi attack (attack the Zentraedi?) has a wicked awesome Daedalus punch illo for the win!

The deer next to the Guraji (Glaug) on the nature reclamation tech sheet is awesome - even though it looks like it's floating in midair...

... and the postcards that everyone wins (who mails in) for the 11-19 mail-in look pretty sweet!

[Seto Kaiba]

Blech... it turned out to be the Cheyenne II... the most nonsensical and pointless destroid of all.

I know they're trying to spread the good stuff out so they can cover ~50 issues, but it'd be nice if the Macross II stuff didn't always feel like filler, or an afterthought, when they've run out of stuff from Macross 7 to show us.

[azrael]

I know they're trying to spread the good stuff out so they can cover ~50 issues, but it'd be nice if the Macross II stuff didn't always feel like filler, or an afterthought, when they've run out of stuff from Macross 7 to show us.

As long as they focus on some of the other stuff besides the VF-1, I ain't complaining.

[Morpheus]

Wow, now I need to find a way to get my hand on Chronicles now.

Any new information on the VF-11 page?

[Graham]

Blech... it turned out to be the Cheyenne II... the most nonsensical and pointless destroid of all.

What's wrong with the Cheyene II, it's a great looking destroid IMO.

Graham

[Seto Kaiba]

What's wrong with the Cheyene II, it's a great looking destroid IMO.

The design doesn't thrill me, but my problem with it is continuity based... (Why is a destroid not seen after 2008 suddenly showing up in 2059 with only minor cosmetic alterations? It'd be like having the U.S. Army suddenly deciding to re-adopt the M4 Sherman)

[RedWolf]

The design doesn't thrill me, but my problem with it is continuity based... (Why is a destroid not seen after 2008 suddenly showing up in 2059 with only minor cosmetic alterations? It'd be like having the U.S. Army suddenly deciding to re-adopt the M4 Sherman)

Well considering most destroids are being either antiques, ground forces or rebels are still operational, its like using a good idea again.

Presumably all Cheyene I were destroyed in Space War 1.

I think the Cheyene II and its civilian version are Frontier's equivalent of the local Patroids of Macross 7.

[Killer Robot]

The design doesn't thrill me, but my problem with it is continuity based... (Why is a destroid not seen after 2008 suddenly showing up in 2059 with only minor cosmetic alterations? It'd be like having the U.S. Army suddenly deciding to re-adopt the M4 Sherman)

Given what destroids do, they might well be a sort of weapon that doesn't need totally reinvented every generation: aerodynamics, weight, and maneuverability aren't the big deal they are with VFs, after all. A Cheyenne II being basically the same frame with 50 years of upgrades to its weapons, armor, and component systems wouldn't really be stranger than the differences between the currently produced C-130J and the Hercules models made back in the 1950s.

[sketchley]

Well considering most destroids are being either antiques, ground forces or rebels are still operational, its like using a good idea again.

Presumably all Cheyene I were destroyed in Space War 1.

I think the Cheyene II and its civilian version are Frontier's equivalent of the local Patroids of Macross 7.

Who said anything about Destroids being antiques? I've glanced at the pages regarding those mecha, and the impression I am left with is that they are still being manufactured and used.

I think it's simply just the producers/writers wanting to go for something new/visually different from what has gone before. For example, in MF, even though the Galaxy Fleet is a New Macross class fleet, yet we are never shown the city section. Why's that? To keep from confusing the viewers (are we looking at the good guys or the bad guys???) Just as Kawamori has stated that there are fleets using the VF-19 and that there are Zentraedi ships in the Frontier Fleet, it's equally likely that the Galaxy fleet is composed of Uraga, Northampton and Maizura class ships, in addition to the green and orange ones it's portrayed as.

Therefore, it may be a case that the Cheyenne type destroid never stopped being used - or (and I'm leaning this way) that it was put on the back burner prior to SWI as the UN Spacy felt that the "classic" destroids needed to be prioritized, and only later were returned to frontline duty post SWI and reconstruction.

[RedWolf]

Who said anything about Destroids being antiques?

The ones in Macross 7 and the Monster being blown up by Isamu certainly are.

UN Spacy has a WTF pension plan. At least Millia got to keep her VF-1J... till Gamlin took it out for a ride.

Anyway NUNG ground forces and rebel groups mutually use Destroids.

But it more likely rebel groups using surplus ones.

[Seto Kaiba]

Who said anything about Destroids being antiques?

It's certainly implied in Macross Plus and Macross 7.

By 2038, civilians were in possession of SW1-era destroids, and many had been converted for construction work, as evidenced by Macross 7.

In 2040, New Edwards AFB was using 'em for target practice, as evidenced by Macross Plus.

If they're using the newer SW1 destroids for target practice and selling the spares to civilians, it certainly doesn't look promising for the Cheyenne I, and makes it all the more illogical that the oldest known design (which never appears in the intervening time) would become the sole surviving destroid class by 2059.

Still... I got my hopes up again for nothing. Wish the guys writing Chronicle would toss the Macross II fans a bone and cover ONE of U.N. Spacy mecha from the OVA already...

Edited April 3, 2009 by Seto Kaiba

[Mr March]

Destroids certainly seemed to be reduced in deployment during the Macross Plus-Macross 7 eras. This doesn't mean they were abandoned totally (perhaps that's a bad word to use), but it's clear that mecha in the late 2030s and through the 2040s either consisted of variable mecha or police patrol robots (see Macross 7) with not much in between.

Having said that, we can look at the Destroids as a whole and speculate without too much guesswork as to why the Cheyenne II was adopted in the 2050s.

A) One most obvious reason that explains the Cheyenne I and II is the question of security: the events surrounding the Island of Mayan were classified for 50 years, an information ban which may have extended to include the VF-0 and the Destroid Cheyenne. As the events of Macross Zero became known in the Macross Frontier era, perhaps the Cheyenne become known as well, either at the same time or years earlier. Perhaps the release of classified mechanical designs in the 2050s could have been a reason why classified documents of the Mayan Island events began to surface.

B) The variable fighters seemed to replace most instances where Destroids were used, possibly due to the limited versatility/mobility of the Destroid designs. As one of the most versatile and mobile Destroids we've seen in Macross, the Cheyenne would make an excellent baseline from which to see a renaissance for a new, highly mobile Destroid. This logic seems to follow the adoption and deployment of the VB-6 Konig Monster as well, which is one of the most mobile Destroids ever fielded.

So the adaptation of a new Cheyenne-style Destroid is easy to explain, given the circumstances.

Personally, I've come to see the Destroids as a stop-gap measure, given events of the sequels. The VF-1 Valkyries were described as costing some 20 times that of a Destroid. In the face of a possible invasion by giant alien forces, the UN government might have found it prudent to manufacture far greater numbers of Destroids because they were cheaper and faster to build. This would allow the UN Forces to field many times more Anti-Giant Weapons against a possible alien invasion that the UN policy makers were assuming could occur at any moment. Indeed, the SDF-1 Macross initially only housed 212 VF-1 Valkyries, while in contrast they fielded nearly three times as many Destroids (587). So Destroids made economic and logistical sense prior to SWI.

After Space War I, and the acquisition of the Factory Satellite, both the need and incentive to mass manufacture Destroids instead of variable fighters likely became mute points. Indeed, the next variable fighter, the VF-4 Lightning III, saw a production run of some 8,245 craft. Those kind of early production runs in the 2010s and 2020s give way to much greater numbers of variable craft in the 2030s and 2040s, times in which colony fleets with several thousand variable combat craft (fighters & attack craft) were common in a single fleet.

[azrael]

Destroids certainly seemed to be reduced in deployment during the Macross Plus-Macross 7 eras. This doesn't mean they were abandoned totally (perhaps that's a bad word to use), but it's clear that mecha in the late 2030s and through the 2040s either consisted of variable mecha or police patrol robots (see Macross 7) with not much in between.

....*snip for being too long*

You could have summed it up for Destroids as something simpler, mobile anti-aircraft.

[edwin3060]

The design doesn't thrill me, but my problem with it is continuity based... (Why is a destroid not seen after 2008 suddenly showing up in 2059 with only minor cosmetic alterations? It'd be like having the U.S. Army suddenly deciding to re-adopt the M4 Sherman)

It bothers me as well-- IMO the Cheyenne I probably lead to the Tomahawk Destroid (based on common features) but replaced the Gatlings with more powerful particle guns--- and now they are going back to Gatlings with the Cheyenne II? That's like going back to use sticks and stones after the invention of rifles and machine guns.

[sketchley]

Where is it stated that gatling guns are less powerful than particle beam cannons? Ignoring the recharge/engine requirements, the gatling guns are a lot more versatile, and a lot more compact.

Anyhow, let's wait for the sheet to come out, as the Destroid/Cheyenne II has BOTH gattling guns and (particle?) beam cannons on the arms.

[edwin3060]

Where is it stated that gatling guns are less powerful than particle beam cannons? Ignoring the recharge/engine requirements, the gatling guns are a lot more versatile, and a lot more compact.

Anyhow, let's wait for the sheet to come out, as the Destroid/Cheyenne II has BOTH gattling guns and (particle?) beam cannons on the arms.

Well they went from gatlings to particle beams from the Cheyenne to the Tomahawk, so that was just a conjecture-- no argument about versatility though, especially in MF given that gatlings can be outfitted with MDE warheads.

I thought the weapon underslung on the gatlings for the Cheyenne II were flamethrowers? This is from the episode where they were burning the Varja infestation out of the City Frontier.