The Miclone process

[lord_breetai]

I'm more concerned with what they do with the left over matter when a person is reconstituted in the Miclone process.

Break it down to be reused when someone needs to reverse it? Law of Conservation, it has to to come from somewhere!

[Mr March]

Taken from the Macross Compendium Chronology Page

2030

November

Armed revolt by the giant Zentradi living on Earth. The Second Defensive Battle of Macross City. Hereafter, giant Zentradi are prohibited from living on Earth.

So it might the restriction might still be around. I had to look up exactly were i read that giant Zentradi were banned from Earth.

Ah, so more like only 30 years. I suppose it could still be in effect all this time. Too bad for the big fellas, though, who really wants to live on Earth anymore anyway?

[J.T. Silversmith]

Greeting, I have been lurking here for years, but this will be my first post here. With all this cool Macross Frontier stuff, I thought I would finally sign up. As far as the miclone process goes, it would seem to make sense that the extra "mass" would be stored in some way to be used to change you back. I wonder if the recycling system used on the Frontier is based on a similar technology? IIRC both use a fluid imersion to dissolve and reconstitute matter. Seems very similar to me. I also have wondered about how long the whole process takes. From the old cartoon I'd guess it took some time, perhaps as long as several days, though in Frontier, I'd have to guess a couple of hours was about the longest it could take. Still knowing it would take 2 or 3 hours to "change" would probably keep you from "going miclone" except for special circumstances, like a Sheryl Nome concert or a "work party" to celebrate a new recruit passing flight training.

As I've been writing i think it would make a lot of sense to link the recycling and micronization/macronization systems together. It would also explain where the extra mass to Macronize a human like Max in DYRL would come from. Just don't think about it too hard... Imagine a human getting macronized to meet their (boy/girl)friends parents for the first time, and suddenly realizing 95% of your body is recycled garbage(or worse).

The other thing I've wondered about is what happens to a Zentradi with cybernetics or implants? Perhaps that is why the Bdolza looked so "gloopey" in DYRL, it is biomechanical, or made from organic components ,to still be able to micronize.

[Drahken]

I'm starting to think for those who do frequent body changes they just store them and transfer the brain back and forth. It would be a huge waste of resources to constantly be growing, breaking down and rebuilding new bodies(no matter how efficient of biological recycling systems they use). Not to mention all the potential replication errors that could happen.

Edited May 22, 2008 by Drahken

[Mr March]

Greeting, this will be my first post here.

You don't say *chortle* Seriously, welcome to the boards J.T.! It's great to see Frontier bringing in the fans.

Looking closely at the micloning process, it doesn't appear quite so slow in my opinion. In the original series, you can see the process after watching for less than a minute. When Hikaru and Misa were taking pictures of the miclone chambers, they could actually see the conversion process happening before their eyes and they were only there but for a few moments. Granted, Macross Frontier might be fudging the time frames a little, but I don't think it's as much a stretch as some think. Especially since we've never been told exactly how long it takes AND it's been over 50 years since SDF Macross; micloning technology may have come a long way

I suspect that the micloning chambers probably have something to do with super dimension energy. Nearly all OverTechnology is based upon super dimension energy, from Reaction Engines and Weapons, to Space Fold drives, to energy cannons and energy barriers to fold communications and cross-dimensional radar. Nearly every aspect of OT uses super dimension energy or space, so I bet the miclone chambers do so as well. They could use super dimension energy/space to add or subtract the mass needed to grow/shrink. Like a energy converting soup that can be shaped according to whatever requirements are needed. Remember, the Protoculture was well known for really advanced biotechnology and created super dimension organs that harvested super dimension energy for their organic "Evil" series Zentradi bio-weapons.

As for implants, they could be removed and replacements could be designed to suit the final size. It shouldn't be all that hard, especially since micloning is a process that I would think is far more difficult to achieve by comparison.

[lord_breetai]

As for implants, they could be removed and replacements could be designed to suit the final size. It shouldn't be all that hard, especially since micloning is a process that I would think is far more difficult to achieve by comparison.

It's hard to do in the Robotech universe... they took away my cool faceplate and gave me a bucked to wear.

[Mechinyun]

What happened ultimately to bretai? Was it explained? I forgot

[RichterX]

What happened ultimately to bretai? Was it explained? I forgot

He was appointed Commader of the UN Spacy in 2016 after that nothing is mentioned. If he is still around he might still be doing political and military work.

[d3v]

He was appointed Commader of the UN Spacy in 2016 after that nothing is mentioned. If he is still around he might still be doing political and military work.

Maybe he retired and joined his old pal Exsedol in some tropical planet that Mac 7 colonized where they spend their days in the sun, looking at girls in bikinis.

[Kronnang Dunn]

What happened ultimately to bretai?

Is Vrlitwhai Kridanik...

He was appointed Commader of the UN Spacy in 2016 like it was said before. His Nupetiet Vergnitz Command Ship was lost with the Megaroad 01 in 2016 near the center of the galaxy. However, he wasn't in command of the ship at the time (lucky him!).

Too bad... it was a nice ship!!!

I found another reason to ban macronization...

Macronized Zentradi organic waste disposal costs...

(as seen in the original Macross... Chapter 11 - Aired 12/19/1982)

Edited May 27, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn

[Mr March]

It's hard to do in the Robotech universe... they took away my cool faceplate and gave me a bucked to wear.

LOL Thank gawd for Macross; Britai still looks as badass as ever in the Macross Frontier opening

[Gubaba]

Is Vrlitwhai Kridanik...

He was appointed Commader of the UN Spacy in 2016 like it was said before. His Nupetiet Vergnitz Command Ship was lost with the Megaroad 01 in 2016 near the center of the galaxy. However, he wasn't in command of the ship at the time (lucky him!).

Too bad... it was a nice ship!!!

I found another reason to ban macronization...

Macronized Zentradi organic waste disposal costs...

(as seen in the original Macross... Chapter 11 - Aired 12/19/1982)

Are you kidding? That's Bandini Mountain, man...

[lord_breetai]

Is Vrlitwhai Kridanik...

I found another reason to ban macronization...

Macronized Zentradi organic waste disposal costs...

(as seen in the original Macross... Chapter 11 - Aired 12/19/1982)

I'm sorry I refuse that spelling, just cause it's embarassing not to know how yo romanize your own name.

And why do you think so many Zentradie become farmers? they don't have to buy fertalizer.

[d3v]

Ep. 9 should have a few answers in terms of access to macro/miclonization.

On the topic of Zent "waste products" I've been wondering what happens to such items when one gets micloned. Does it all get micloned as well, or does the process simply eliminate it for you?

Edited May 30, 2008 by d3v

[Mr March]

I'm sure the micloning chambers act as an evacuation of sorts

[s001]

And they're public?!!! guacala!!!

[JB0]

Ep. 9 should have a few answers in terms of access to macro/miclonization.

On the topic of Zent "waste products" I've been wondering what happens to such items when one gets micloned. Does it all get micloned as well, or does the process simply eliminate it for you?

"So, Millia, you want to be a miclone?"

"Yeah, there's this human pilot that's totally hot, I mean that nearly shot me down. I'm gonna sex him up, I mean knife him to death."

"Whatever. Here's a laxative."

"Beg pard?"

"You've got turds in you larger than a miclone. You're not going anywhere until you take a good long dump."

[Gubaba]

If Protoculture science can make computers which still work after being underwater for tens of thousands of years, rocks that can float when sung to, and floors that can identify mixed human/Zentradi blood, I'm sure they could've come up with a way to deal with Zentradi poopies.

Can we please move on now...?

[JB0]

If Protoculture science can make computers which still work after being underwater for tens of thousands of years, rocks that can float when sung to, and floors that can identify mixed human/Zentradi blood, I'm sure they could've come up with a way to deal with Zentradi poopies.

Can we please move on now...?

NEVER!

[d3v]

"So, Millia, you want to be a miclone?"

"Yeah, there's this human pilot that's totally hot, I mean that nearly shot me down. I'm gonna sex him up, I mean knife him to death."

"Whatever. Here's a laxative."

"Beg pard?"

"You've got turds in you larger than a miclone. You're not going anywhere until you take a good long dump."

Well if she's in a rush, there's always the other option of cleaning out the gut, the one that starts with an e.

Edited June 1, 2008 by d3v

[RichterX]

ha,ha,ha poop jokes, are we really that low now?

So going back into topic, can the chamber macronize, micronize all organic material? Klan left her bandana hair thing on and it was macronize with her, if it was some kind of organic fiber I guess it would work, probably that is one of the reasons why the implants and other things that the Zentran are using in DYRL? were changed from mechanical to organic looking.

Edited June 2, 2008 by RichterX

[wolfx]

The miclonisation tubes still seem too magical for me. I mean its like disappear from small tube and reappear in big tube...wow how convenient. Lets do this to our cows and it can feed the whole colony for aeons.

[Morpheus]

The miclonisation tubes still seem too magical for me. I mean its like disappear from small tube and reappear in big tube...wow how convenient. Lets do this to our cows and it can feed the whole colony for aeons.

I prefer micloning the Vajra (it is an organic being after all), then I have my own 1/60 Vajra that could turn other Yamato 1/60 into scrap of plastic

[lord_breetai]

The miclonisation tubes still seem too magical for me. I mean its like disappear from small tube and reappear in big tube...wow how convenient. Lets do this to our cows and it can feed the whole colony for aeons.

it's like many 80s toys that way... I think it's all sleight of hand.

[Gui]

ha,ha,ha poop jokes, are we really that low now?

Well, some of us were as low as joking about the boobs of some valks in M7, so I guess it's more or less recurrent

So going back into topic, can the chamber macronize, micronize all organic material? Klan left her bandana hair thing on and it was macronize with her, if it was some kind of organic fiber I guess it would work, probably that is one of the reasons why the implants and other things that the Zentran are using in DYRL? were changed from mechanical to organic looking.

Honnestly, I don't think the chamber can macronize/micronize anything at will: it'd be too much nice to be true frankly, and scientifically impossible basically. Zentrans and Meltrans have been 'built' giant and, obviously, able to be micronized in chambers, we can see it in the show so there's no need to question this part; humans being 'built' onto the same basis, they can also be macronized/micronized, as expected. On another hand, if the hippocows look like genetically modified organisms, there's no official infos if their size can be changed through the use of a chamber

Concerning Klan's bandana, I'd say she has two of them: one for her in macronized size, and another for her in micronized size. Looks like the most simple this way: after all, we clearly saw in SDF that zentrans are naked when in the chamber...

Concerning the implants, it's more debatable. Maybe they're some sort of biomechanical material, built to be macronized and micronized at will, yes. Or maybe the chamber simply destroys these devices and rebuilt them at the desired size with some sort of nanotechnology or Star Trek-like molecular manipulation like we can see in TNG. Again, the example of Klan clearly shows that a macronized being can look different in its micronized state, so we can assume that the process implies some modifications, at least in certain cases

[d3v]

The miclonisation tubes still seem too magical for me. I mean its like disappear from small tube and reappear in big tube...wow how convenient. Lets do this to our cows and it can feed the whole colony for aeons.

Now how did that Arthur C. Clarke quote go, the one about technology being advanced enough that it would seem like magic?

Edited June 4, 2008 by d3v

[Alex]

I think it was "any sufficiently advanced technology would be indistinguishable from anime magic"

He was also the first to propose the possibility of certain Macross fans being in a Geo-synchronous orbit around Nanase's breasts.

[Gubaba]

I think it was "any sufficiently advanced technology would be indistinguishable from anime magic"

He was also the first to propose the possibility of certain Macross fans being in a Geo-synchronous orbit around Nanase's breasts.

That's one orbit I'd like to see decay! SPLASHDOWN! *rimshot*

[JB0]

ha,ha,ha poop jokes, are we really that low now?

Doorknobs.

That's all I have to say. We could be going a lot lower.

Concerning Klan's bandana, I'd say she has two of them: one for her in macronized size, and another for her in micronized size. Looks like the most simple this way: after all, we clearly saw in SDF that zentrans are naked when in the chamber...

And they wound up having to improvise clothing too.

Though I suppose the argument COULD have been that a zentradi uniform would stand out... they seemed unfamiliar enough with espionage operations that I don't think it really factored in.

Concerning the implants, it's more debatable. Maybe they're some sort of biomechanical material, built to be macronized and micronized at will, yes. Or maybe the chamber simply destroys these devices and rebuilt them at the desired size with some sort of nanotechnology or Star Trek-like molecular manipulation like we can see in TNG. Again, the example of Klan clearly shows that a macronized being can look different in its micronized state, so we can assume that the process implies some modifications, at least in certain cases

Also possible they have resized implants manufactured in advance. Or that they just avoid size-change on anyone with implants.

Poor Britai, doomed to tower over everyone else FOREVER.

...

Eh, I'm sure he'll get over it. They'd probably make him wear a bucket if they micloned him anyways.

[d3v]

I just remembered that Zolan's can use macronization as well!

[Gubaba]

Doorknobs.

That's all I have to say. We could be going a lot lower.

I'm not about to touch that...

(The doorknob, that is...)

[Gui]

[...]

And they wound up having to improvise clothing too.

[...]

Also possible they have resized implants manufactured in advance. [...]

If they have resized implants manufactured in advance, I don't see any problems with having resized clothing as well...

Also, we saw in DYRL? that they stole some domestic items from the SDF-1: they may have stolen some clothes too, or taken the clothes of miclones dead during a fight after having taken them back to their ships

But this doesn't concern Klan anyway: living onto a civilian colony, she obviously has access to miclone clothes

[wolfx]

Maybe that bandana is an appendage to Klan....like Ranka's moving hair.....

She even has the bandana when she was younger so it makes sense.

[JB0]

If they have resized implants manufactured in advance, I don't see any problems with having resized clothing as well...

But are there any known instances of micloned zentradi with implants?

As far as I know, Britai's the only known zentradi with implants. And we don't talk about Buckethead.

...

Well, we talk about it, but only to mock it.

Also, we saw in DYRL? that they stole some domestic items from the SDF-1: they may have stolen some clothes too, or taken the clothes of miclones dead during a fight after having taken them back to their ships

That happened in the series too. The spies stole clothes shortly after infiltration. I was under the impression that the spoils in DYRL's opening scene were from the return of the spies.

As far as infiltration costumes go... burlap sacks probably rank below anything other than outright nudity and full zentradi dress uniform.

Particularly as the zentradi had already seen human attire in their PIRACY of the Macross' TV broadcasts, and should've been able to adapt their uniforms.

But this doesn't concern Klan anyway: living onto a civilian colony, she obviously has access to miclone clothes

And TWO identical headbands(well, as identical as they can be while being wildly different sizes)!

Edit: Or not. Maybe I should make sure I've seen the current Frontier before I get in these discussions.

And, of course, she has problems anyways since her body type is significantly different between sizes.

Edited June 3, 2008 by JB0

[Mr March]

If I had to guess, the bandana is just part of the character design; the artists include it even while Klan is inside the micloning chamber as a visual cue for the audience (for easy recognition).