The Miclone process

[lord_breetai]

Okay so I've got some questions about Zentraedi, regular humans and the miclone process. Macross 7 established that to miclonize or not to miclonize was strictly a matter of personal preference but I really wonder about some things.

In Macross 7 we're told that it's merely a matter of personal choice and up to the individual. And Frontier shows that as well; the Fairy Squadron will miclonize when they want to go to the general areas of the ship or Macronize when they are on duty or want to go to the Zentraedi areas.

If Do You Remember Love can be believed an ordinary human can macronize.

So do some people have miclone chambers in their homes? or are there miclonization centers on planets and on ships that accommodate them? Is it only open for Zentraedi? Zentraedi and their spouses? Obviously partial Zentrans and Meltrans are allowed, like Emilia. Every human being?

If you are convicted of a violent crime can you be be banned from Macronizing? put on probation?

If you miclonize then eat a meal and then macronize again, will you still be full?

I don't think any of these questions have cannon answers, I'm just wondering.

[RichterX]

Zolans can be also macronized from Dynamite 7 and all Macronized Zentraedi (probably also humans) are banned on Earth

[Mr March]

...and all Macronized Zentraedi (probably also humans) are banned on Earth

Always wondered what became of that law. I would think that after 50 years that law would have been rescinded. I just can't see them getting away with denial of Zentradi rights once the Zentradi became integrated into society to the level they have been. By now the government must be filled with Zentradi and half/quarter mixes. But who knows, old laws sometimes die hard

[Kronnang Dunn]

I believe it also must have something to do with the amount of resources available. U see... Is very logical to think that a full grown Zentradi will consume waaay more resources than a micloned one. So, I really found the decision of banning macronization from the reconstructing/post-holocaust Earth to be sound & right for the times...

Maybe that is also a factor when enabling miclonization to an individual in the colonization fleets. Since Macross Frontier is such a big self-sufficient colony rich of vital resources no wonder there are macronized Zentradi communities there...

Edited May 18, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn

[Gui]

I believe it also must have something to do with the amount of resources available. U see... Is very logical to think that a full grown Zentradi will consume waaay more resources than a micloned one. [...]

What about salary then? If they consume more, they're supposed to have more money for this: if not, is this a way to reduce the desire for macronization from the average people and therefore the risks of having a maclone running amok? This may explain why we see maclones piloting Q-Rea instead of standard human mechas: they obviously get more money for military tasks, all the more as they can use zentran stuff which power cannot be underestimated

On the other hand, we saw some 'cow boys' in one ep.: being giant, maclones are also stronger and can work more and then get better wages than the normal working class. Is this enough to live a good life or is 'maclone' synonym for 'poor' in the civilian life?

[lord_breetai]

What about salary then? If they consume more, they're supposed to have more money for this: if not, is this a way to reduce the desire for macronization from the average people and therefore the risks of having a maclone running amok? This may explain why we see maclones piloting Q-Rea instead of standard human mechas: they obviously get more money for military tasks, all the more as they can use zentran stuff which power cannot be underestimated

On the other hand, we saw some 'cow boys' in one ep.: being giant, maclones are also stronger and can work more and then get better wages than the normal working class. Is this enough to live a good life or is 'maclone' synonym for 'poor' in the civilian life?

That really had me wondering too... But they'd probably be able to miclonize when they go on vacation and have a real nice time.

Imagine a Zentraedi working at the equivalent of a refinery for two months as a maclone getting paid big books, then taking a month off as a Miclone, probably enjoy yourself very much during the downtime.

But there was some nice stuff in that mall, so it dosn't seem the maclones of Frontier are badly off.

[wolfx]

Like i said in the ep 4 thread, the economics of Macronised zentraedi doesn't make sense. A pair of shoes cost like a million or more going by the price tag on ep 4.

Probably only rich/noble Zentraedi are able to afford being macloned, and not everybody gets this priviledge. Otherwise the economics won't work.

[Gubaba]

Like i said in the ep 4 thread, the economics of Macronised zentraedi doesn't make sense. A pair of shoes cost like a million or more going by the price tag on ep 4.

Probably only rich/noble Zentraedi are able to afford being macloned, and not everybody gets this priviledge. Otherwise the economics won't work.

But a million WHAT? Dollars? Credits? Space Euros?

Really, I'm surprised there were any macloned Zentradi walking around the mall at all...if micronization is such a simple process these days, it would make sense for farmers (or construction workers, or any kind of touch manual labor) to maclonize on their way to work and miclonize when the whistle blows.

But does it really have to make sense? The mall was fun and looked pretty cool, which I think was the point...

[azrael]

But a million WHAT? Dollars? Credits? Space Euros?

Really, I'm surprised there were any macloned Zentradi walking around the mall at all...if micronization is such a simple process these days, it would make sense for farmers (or construction workers, or any kind of touch manual labor) to maclonize on their way to work and miclonize when the whistle blows.

But does it really have to make sense? The mall was fun and looked pretty cool, which I think was the point...

1) We don't know what the currency in Macross has been. 2) The economics of Macross has never really been touched upon.

[LordDremen]

But a million WHAT? Dollars? Credits? Space Euros?

Really, I'm surprised there were any macloned Zentradi walking around the mall at all...if micronization is such a simple process these days, it would make sense for farmers (or construction workers, or any kind of touch manual labor) to maclonize on their way to work and miclonize when the whistle blows.

But does it really have to make sense? The mall was fun and looked pretty cool, which I think was the point...

I thought that many of the food problems were cured with cloning and farm worlds, that cloning stoppage for humans most likely was not ended for live stock and plant life.

Edited May 18, 2008 by LordDremen

[Gubaba]

1) We don't know what the currency in Macross has been. 2) The economics of Macross has never really been touched upon.

My point exactly A million Macross Francs may not be all that much...I suppose if I really felt strongly about the issue, I could revisit the M7 scene where someone buys the Fire Bomber CD (or Mylene buys the newspaper) for comparison. But I don't, so I won't.

I thought that many of the food problems were cured with cloning and farm worlds, that cloning stoppage for humans most likely was not ended for live stock and plant life.

Good point. But it doesn't change the fact that a Macloned Zentradi would be spending A LOT more on food that a Micloned one would.

"KIDS! It's dinner time! Get washed up and miclonized!"

[lord_breetai]

My point exactly A million Macross Francs may not be all that much...I suppose if I really felt strongly about the issue, I could revisit the M7 scene where someone buys the Fire Bomber CD (or Mylene buys the newspaper) for comparison. But I don't, so I won't.

Good point. But it doesn't change the fact that a Macloned Zentradi would be spending A LOT more on food that a Micloned one would.

"KIDS! It's dinner time! Get washed up and miclonized!"

I'll check those out when I get my laptop back (that's where I have all my m7 episodes if no one else gets too it). Anyway if the galaxy has gone through some kind of revolution/civil war since then, it doesn't necessarily stand to say that the currency is the same or hasn't gone through hyper inflation since then, especially since these larger colonies are more like countries and might have their own mints and currency. (though maybe it's just like different euros, in different countries all worth the same but with some kind of nationalism on them).

Anyway first thing we see Sheyrl playing with is a plate, so they do eat as Maclones. But yeah, no wonder the Fairy Squad perfers to go to NyanNyan for a bite, going to the Zentraedi food court might cost a weeks pay.

Since someone brought up cloning livestock, are hippo cows the result of genetic engineering? Maybe not having enough cow DNA on the SDF-1 to fully replicate the species (maybe all they had in the end was Kakizaki's left over Teriyaki stake ) and they filled in the gaps using Hippo DNA? (like the frog dna used in the Jurassic Park movies, I know it doesn't make much sense). Or are they an alien life form, that just happens to look like a hippo cow and produces delicious dairy products?

Edited May 18, 2008 by lord_breetai

[Beltane70]

Maybe they can macronize livestock. Who knows?

[Roy Focker]

Always wondered what became of that law. I would think that after 50 years that law would have been rescinded. I just can't see them getting away with denial of Zentradi rights once the Zentradi became integrated into society to the level they have been. By now the government must be filled with Zentradi and half/quarter mixes. But who knows, old laws sometimes die hard

Ever see sport fans riot in the streets after their team wins? Now Imagine full size Zentradi having a victory riot in Macross City.

[Mr March]

LOL True, but then again, Zentradi football fans will be everywhere. No colony would be safe from World (Galaxy?) Cup insanity!

Edited May 19, 2008 by Mr March

[JB0]

Maybe they can macronize livestock. Who knows?

It would explain the giant chicken leg that Kamjin was eating in the original series.

[lord_breetai]

LOL True, but then again, Zentradi football fans will be everywhere. No colony would be safe from World (Galaxy?) Cup insanity!

So then you gotta have swat Zentraedi to contain the Zentraedi hockey riot.

[taksraven]

Always wondered what became of that law. I would think that after 50 years that law would have been rescinded. I just can't see them getting away with denial of Zentradi rights once the Zentradi became integrated into society to the level they have been. By now the government must be filled with Zentradi and half/quarter mixes. But who knows, old laws sometimes die hard

The vision that Macross Frontier shows is that the future, at least on the colony ships, seems to be pretty prejudice free. Its hard to believe that humanity would so easily give up such a bad habit.

Taksraven

[taksraven]

2) The economics of Macross has never really been touched upon.

Thank god. Economics as a whole is pretty much ignored in SF in general. Except for "Trade disputes and federations" in a rather crappy set of prequels which demonstrated successfully why economics should be ignored.

(It was brought up in Hitch-Hikers Guide, I guess, but only so Douglas Adams could take the piss out of it.)

Taksraven

[Gubaba]

(It was brought up in Hitch-Hikers Guide, I guess, but only so Douglas Adams could take the piss out of it.)

Taksraven

Well, yeah...but IIRC, it was proven that there IS no economy, since the universe has no imports, no exports, and no population...and anyone you may meet is simply a product of your deranged imagination.

[Gui]

'There is no economy, Neo'

[Roy Focker]

Okay Macross TV show that the enlarge or shrink Zentradi when they are naked. Might have to do with the Terminator rule of Organic matter only.

Say a giant Zentradi swallows a giant sized coin. It is a trick he does. Normally passes right through him a day later. For some reason he forgets to make a BM before jumping in the sizing chamber. When he shrinks wouldn't that coin rip his micronized body right in half!

[d3v]

LOL True, but then again, Zentradi football fans will be everywhere. No colony would be safe from World (Galaxy?) Cup insanity!

Maybe they should have impelmented such a thing immediately after the war. Might have even stopped Kamjin from rebelling (for some reason, I can easily see him as a football hooligan).

As for the riots, they can probably have a squad of these handy.

Either that, or most of them would be micloned anyway once they realize that it takes alot more booze to get smashed when your 20 feet high.

Edited May 19, 2008 by d3v

[lord_breetai]

Okay Macross TV show that the enlarge or shrink Zentradi when they are naked. Might have to do with the Terminator rule of Organic matter only.

Say a giant Zentradi swallows a giant sized coin. It is a trick he does. Normally passes right through him a day later. For some reason he forgets to make a BM before jumping in the sizing chamber. When he shrinks wouldn't that coin rip his micronized body right in half!

Depends on how the miclone process works, a lot of people speculate that the body is recreated or recloned on a smaller scale, then the coin would probably jsut drop out of the bigger body...

on the other hand if it works on the Termie principle... it seems metal can come back as long as it's got fleshy wrapping around it... after all Termies are metal.

[JB0]

Depends on how the miclone process works, a lot of people speculate that the body is recreated or recloned on a smaller scale, then the coin would probably jsut drop out of the bigger body...

It IS implied by the term.

[junior]

The vision that Macross Frontier shows is that the future, at least on the colony ships, seems to be pretty prejudice free.

Maybe, maybe not. According to Sheryl, Galaxy doesn't have any full-size Zentraedi. The reason for this is never explained. It's possible that it's a size issue (i.e. there aren't any wide open spaces like the ones that Frontier has, so they don't want any full-size Zentraedi). It could be a prejudice issue. Or it could be something else entirely.

[d3v]

Maybe, maybe not. According to Sheryl, Galaxy doesn't have any full-size Zentraedi. The reason for this is never explained. It's possible that it's a size issue (i.e. there aren't any wide open spaces like the ones that Frontier has, so they don't want any full-size Zentraedi). It could be a prejudice issue. Or it could be something else entirely.

Wasn't Galaxy launched from New Eden? I don't recall any full sized Zentraedi in Mac Plus either.

[Gubaba]

Wasn't Galaxy launched from New Eden? I don't recall any full sized Zentraedi in Mac Plus either.

...or in 7, except for Exsedol (and Emilia, but she wasn't with the fleet).

[lord_breetai]

...or in 7, except for Exsedol (and Emilia, but she wasn't with the fleet).

There was the Breetai and Kamjin actors too for the "Lynn Minmay Story"

[junior]

Wasn't Galaxy launched from New Eden? I don't recall any full sized Zentraedi in Mac Plus either.

Given how short Macross Plus was, though, there wouldn't have really been any reason to include them if there were some on New Eden. You don't really want full-size zentraedi mixing with miclones except in very controlled circumstances (like the mall in Frontier episode 5, which has special areas for miclone-sized visitors). Otherwise you risk unfortunate accidents ("Oops! I didn't see you there!"). So unless you want a short thirty second sequence where Isamu takes Lucy on a date to the Zentraedi mall, you're probably not going to see them.

[Gubaba]

There was the Breetai and Kamjin actors too for the "Lynn Minmay Story"

Right...I forgot about them...

[d3v]

Given how short Macross Plus was, though, there wouldn't have really been any reason to include them if there were some on New Eden. You don't really want full-size zentraedi mixing with miclones except in very controlled circumstances (like the mall in Frontier episode 5, which has special areas for miclone-sized visitors). Otherwise you risk unfortunate accidents ("Oops! I didn't see you there!"). So unless you want a short thirty second sequence where Isamu takes Lucy on a date to the Zentraedi mall, you're probably not going to see them.

Good point there.

Right now, the only other reason I can think up of is the size of Macross Galaxy (if what we're shown in ep. 7 is it), maybe the ships launched from New Eden aren't as friendly to Zentraedi as the more traditional clamshell type Macross ships.

[RichterX]

Always wondered what became of that law. I would think that after 50 years that law would have been rescinded. I just can't see them getting away with denial of Zentradi rights once the Zentradi became integrated into society to the level they have been. By now the government must be filled with Zentradi and half/quarter mixes. But who knows, old laws sometimes die hard

Taken from the Macross Compendium Chronology Page

2030

November

Armed revolt by the giant Zentradi living on Earth. The Second Defensive Battle of Macross City. Hereafter, giant Zentradi are prohibited from living on Earth.

So it might the restriction might still be around. I had to look up exactly were i read that giant Zentradi were banned from Earth.

[Alex]

I'm more concerned with what they do with the left over matter when a person is reconstituted in the Miclone process.

[Morpheus]

I'm more concerned with what they do with the left over matter when a person is reconstituted in the Miclone process.

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