Macross Frontier Episode 4 Talkback Thread *READ 1st Post*

[Wumzi]

I'm loving the fight sequences! So far all of them have been top notch.

But is anyone else bothered by the fact that by this episode, Alto has been in a valk only a couple of times, and yet he's flying the thing like an Ace? Show him stumble a bit at least

[Duke Togo]

The pacing of Macross F is nice and it looks pretty but I can`t get past the excessive smoothness of the CG fight sequences.

Even some episodes of Macross 7 felt more like Macross to me, simply for being hand drawn.

To truly feel like Macross the fights needs to be hand drawn imo. The character sequences in Macross F DO feel like Macross because of this imo..

So you want Macross Frontier to look like a 1980's animated TV series?

[Duke Togo]

I'm loving the fight sequences! So far all of them have been top notch.

But is anyone else bothered by the fact that by this episode, Alto has been in a valk only a couple of times, and yet he's flying the thing like an Ace? Show him stumble a bit at least

You do realize he goes to school to learn to fly these things, right?

[MilSpex]

So you want Macross Frontier to look like a 1980's animated TV series?

No, I`d like them to spend the budget to make it look like DYRL or those few episodes of SDFM where the cell count and attention to detail on certain combat scenes was higher than that of an average anime movie. CG makes everything look TOO smooth and perfect, theres no passion in the work.

[Vegas]

guys lets go back talking about episode 4 pls. no more anima spiritia or protodevlin, i dont wanna remember that horrible macross 7 series.

[Beltane70]

They're pretty startled by it, as if it had either been forbidden for them to use, or they had lost the technology long ago.

Reaction weaponry was a lost technology for the Zentraedi. According to the chronology, all of the reaction weapon production plants were destroyed over 300,000 years ago.

[Beltane70]

CG makes everything look TOO smooth and perfect, theres no passion in the work.

I disagree. How do you know that the CG artists have no passion for their work. CG still takes a lot of work to produce, and I bet that quite a few programmers/CG artists are just as passionate as the old-fashioned animators.

[Gubaba]

guys lets go back talking about episode 4 pls. no more anima spiritia or protodevlin, i dont wanna remember that horrible macross 7 series.

Ozma likes Fire Bomber...why can't you?

[Gerli]

Ozma likes Fire Bomber...why can't you?

What if he listen the song to repel/scare the Vajras?

[MisaForever]

(This is in response to a post a few pages back, sorry for the delay, I just got home )

*sigh* For those of you complaining about stuff in this series (like boobs) my point is that it's ANIME and anything goes in any anime series. Making a big deal about something that minor is not looking at the WHOLE PICTURE. The series itself is very much one of the most perfect shows I've seen in a long time and makes me want more with each episode I watch. Watch the series for the series and don't ruin the show just because something as small as a woman's chest being too big annoys you. ENJOY IT!

Edited April 26, 2008 by MisaForever

[Kronnang Dunn]

guys lets go back talking about episode 4 pls. no more anima spiritia or protodevlin, i dont wanna remember that horrible macross 7 series.

...which were such a success in Japan that paved the way for the Macross Zero OVAS & the Macross Frontier series...

[MisaForever]

So yes, this episode was full of WIN and I can't wait to see the sub!

[Graham]

Fantastic 4th episode.

Some good character development and great action.

Lots of fan service (which is nice to have ocasionally), but nothing too extreme.

Alto was damn lucky that the Zentradi cannon still worked after so long floating in space.

I wonder why Klan only fired her shoulder cannon point blank at the red bug one time. You would have thought she would have learned from Mikhail, that one shot is not often enough. If she had fired a quick second follow up shot immediately after the first she would probably have taken out the red bug.

Years ago when I went through the Glock instructors course, we were tought to keep shooting until the target is down. if you just shoot once and stop to observe the result of your shot, there is a high chance that you will end up injured or dead if your opponent is still capable of returing fire. far better to keep on firing until the opponent is no longer a threat. Hopefully, SMS will learn from these two incidents and keep shoot the red Vajra more even if at first they appear dead.

My one nitpick with the episode is that I don't think Bobby had nearly enough time to do such a a skillful a make up job on Alto. I wish my wife was that quick with her make up!

And I don't understand why some of the male MWers here are complaining about the big breasts in this episode? Are you men?

Graham

[BlueMax]

Fantastic 4th episode.

Some good character development and great action.

Lots of fan service (which is nice to have ocasionally), but nothing too extreme.

Alto was damn lucky that the Zentradi cannon still worked after so long floating in space.

I wonder why Klan only fired her shoulder cannon point blank at the red bug one time. You would have thought she would have learned from Mikhail, that one shot is not often enough. If she had fired a quick second follow up shot immediately after the first she would probably have taken out the red bug.

Years ago when I went through the Glock instructors course, we were tought to keep shooting until the target is down. if you just shoot once and stop to observe the result of your shot, there is a high chance that you will end up injured or dead if your opponent is still capable of returing fire. far better to keep on firing until the opponent is no longer a threat. Hopefully, SMS will learn from these two incidents and keep shoot the red Vajra more even if at first they appear dead.

My one nitpick with the episode is that I don't think Bobby had nearly enough time to do such a a skillful a make up job on Alto. I wish my wife was that quick with her make up!

And I don't understand why some of the male MWers here are complaining about the big breasts in this episode? Are you men?

Graham

great episode storywise, however, some of the animation could r3eally have been better. I particularly dislike the dressing room portion. and some of the contestants for miss macross f really have wierd faces!

[Chronocidal]

My guess about only firing the shoulder cannon once would be either it's high power gives it a longer recharge time, or she was just startled by it not working the first time. The shot that sent her spinning later looked like it damaged the suit as well, so she may not have been able to shoot after that.

The various weapons fired by the vajra so far have very nearly matched what humans have, at least up to reaction weapons. What I really wonder about though is the strange burst countermeasures they used in the first episode.. it was hard to see them, but they looked like a cross between chaff and a forcefield. The way Ozma was dodging, it looked like they were semi-solid objects that appeared. Also, the glowy nature of the vajra missiles reminds me a little of the weapons used by the Aphos. We have yet to see them pull any punches the way Sara was able to do (making the weapons just disappear into thin air), but it wouldn't surprise me if they have the ability to do so.

[dreamweaver13]

kyuun kyuun kyuun kyuun!! watashi no kare wa PAIROTTO.

haha, if that's all there was to this episode, i would have watched it all the same. sigh. i just love macross original.

moving on... so far i've only seen the raw. but the plot was pretty much straighforward, so i got the story and most of the dialogue anyway. unless of course a BIG reveal was given about the vajra during alto and ozma's short talk. THAt i didn't get, of course (for thos who undertand jap fluently, was there a big reveal? or just something like... "the vajra... i have to tell you now.... are very dangerous enemies! yes, alto that's all i wanted to say").

i love this episode. but as you may have hinted from my statement above, i probably would love each episode because of the heavy imprint of original macross written all over it. but of course, i wouldn't want it to be the same thing. thank GOD Ranka didn't win miss macross. if she won, that storyline would spiral into plot-recycle universe. and the entry of the klanklan (did i get it right?) character was pretty cool.

during the fight... a strong hint of eva there. shinji disobeying orders and going head on against the enemny. yup, definitely a hint. i guess it has a lot to do with that prog knife the valkyries keep using. haha.

how i wish my friends (who are watching frontier with no macross background other than mac+) could watch this series as i see it. chocful of fan service. haha.

[Kronnang Dunn]

And I don't understand why some of the male MWers here are complaining about the big breasts in this episode? Are you men?

& all the male MWers will say... "NO, WE ARE DEVO!". Sorry, I couldn't resist, hehehe...

Btw, I liked the design of Klein Klan's flight suit a lot...

how i wish my friends (who are watching frontier with no macross background other than mac+) could watch this series as i see it. chocful of fan service. haha.

Fan service... Actually that's a good thing... I read somewhere that the series are aimed toward the seinen demographic (18–30 year old male audience)... No wander it has boobs, moe & loli on it, hehehe...

Edited April 26, 2008 by Kronnang Dunn

[omg]

I just like that cannon fodder VF25s are tan colored, like the old cannon fodder VF1-As

[taksraven]

(This is in response to a post a few pages back, sorry for the delay, I just got home )

*sigh* For those of you complaining about stuff in this series (like boobs) my point is that it's ANIME and anything goes in any anime series. Making a big deal about something that minor is not looking at the WHOLE PICTURE. The series itself is very much one of the most perfect shows I've seen in a long time and makes me want more with each episode I watch. Watch the series for the series and don't ruin the show just because something as small as a woman's chest being too big annoys you. ENJOY IT!

Well, we have waited a few episodes for absolute confirmation of this but we can now say without a doubt......

[Graham]

My guess about only firing the shoulder cannon once would be either it's high power gives it a longer recharge time, or she was just startled by it not working the first time. The shot that sent her spinning later looked like it damaged the suit as well, so she may not have been able to shoot after that.

Good, point, I hadn't considered a long recharge time. I'll have to study the raw again and see if she fires the shoulder cannon earlier in the battle or not. I don't think so though. I think she was just using the arm guns or maybe the chest guns previously.

I guess there is the possibility she was startled by the lack of effect of the shot, but as I posted earlier, you would have thought that SMS would have had an after action report on the previous few days battles with the Vajra and they would have learned from Mikhail's mistake of assuming a single head shot would put down the red Vajra, and made it standard operating procedure to target the red Vajra with multiple high-powered shots.

Oh, and I'm the only one to wonder why Klan and only Klan was carrying live ordnance (at least in her missile launchers and shoulder cannon) during a training battle?

The various weapons fired by the vajra so far have very nearly matched what humans have, at least up to reaction weapons. What I really wonder about though is the strange burst countermeasures they used in the first episode.. it was hard to see them, but they looked like a cross between chaff and a forcefield. The way Ozma was dodging, it looked like they were semi-solid objects that appeared. Also, the glowy nature of the vajra missiles reminds me a little of the weapons used by the Aphos. We have yet to see them pull any punches the way Sara was able to do (making the weapons just disappear into thin air), but it wouldn't surprise me if they have the ability to do so.

I didn't get the feeling that the Vajra countermeasures were like a forcefield. To me, they looked more like an organic writhing mass of tenticles.

Graham

[Graham]

The series itself is very much one of the most perfect shows I've seen in a long time and makes me want more with each episode

Hear, Hear! I second that.

Graham

[Graham]

Action junkies be prepared for some possible cold turkey.

I hope I'm wrong, but I have a feeling based on the next episode preview shown at the end of episode 4 and also the manga that the next 1 or possibly 2 episodes are mostly going to be character driven with little to no action.

This is just my guess and I hope I'm wrong though.

Graham

[Graham]

great episode storywise, however, some of the animation could r3eally have been better. I particularly dislike the dressing room portion. and some of the contestants for miss macross f really have wierd faces!

Heh, I'm the opposite. I loved the dressing room scene and I though those girls were all really cute (where's the drooling icon when you need it).

Graham

[Graham]

MisaForever now officially has the best Avatar on Macrossworld.

Graham

[Morpheus]

Grrr, I'm still waiting/looking for alto victory pose avatar

Can anyone make me one?

[Chronocidal]

I believe I'll happily trade some action to get to see Ozma pelted with various kitchen utensils by a jealous Ranka. Love how he dodged the flying knife, only to get clobbered by a wok.

And yes, I second that avatar comment. I watched that scene about 20 times. I didn't realize it at first, but it looks like KK has the same movable hair feature as Ranka, judging by the part where she starts fuming.

Edited April 26, 2008 by Chronocidal

[Vegas]

Ozma likes Fire Bomber...why can't you?

i dunno how you can listen to them 50 times in the series over and over.

...which were such a success in Japan that paved the way for the Macross Zero OVAS & the Macross Frontier series...

it took this long for a new series? macross 7 was a meh and alot here agrees with me.

[Nexx Stalker]

macross 7 was a meh and alot here agrees with me.

And a lot don't, but that proves nothing

[BlueMax]

But I'm pretty positive Klan said that it was.

I'll watch it again tonight, and make sure, though.

Klan klan was saying after Ozuma remarked that Alto was damn lucky for a 7000 year old weapon to work, that Zentrada weapons are well crafted and won't suffer those crappy mechanical failures.

BTW, the reason why she's equipped with live ammo is because the since Pixie squadron is a reconnaissance team for the mac 25 fleet, they have to be prepared for all eventualities

Edited April 26, 2008 by BlueMax

[Renato]

I see your point (although I tend to use Miyazaki to convert non-fans...but if they're REALLY against anime, then I pull out the big guns: Grave of the Fireflies), but Macross really is an otaku series. In Japan (as I'm sure you know), if you say you like Gundam or Macross, you might as well be cosplaying as Char Aznable, carrying a hard drive full of loli hentai...ditto Evangelion, unless you just say, "Oh, I saw the new movie. It was good."

That is EXACTLY the reason I want to show Macross to people. I want to tell them how there is much more to anime than just loli hentai. Well, I'm sorry for thinking Macross had integrity and was above all of that. I enjoy reccommending movies and music to friends and then maybe if they like it we can have a good talk about it, or they might like to see or hear something similar. In this case, I can't even get started.

And since I'm in Japan, it's no use showing people Miyazaki or Fireflies cos they've all seen it.

Expecting a Macross series NOT to cater to otaku is a little unrealistic, IMHO. Something like Macross Plus can find a crossover market (as it did in the west...not sure about how it was received in Japan)...but then, as you say, it's a Shinichiro Watanabe production. Good otaku productions and good crossover productions are both equally rare, so I say we should enjoy Macross Frontier for what it is...a good otaku series, instead of wishing it were something else.

Well, I cannot enjoy it fully, since I'm obviously not the type of otaku it seems to be catering to. Again, I guess I was wrong to expect something different from the "Pretty Cure" calibre of anime.

Good action, though.

[MisaForever]

MisaForever now officially has the best Avatar on Macrossworld.

Graham

haha, thanks. Well I can't take credit for it, I just borrowed it.

[Batou]

That is EXACTLY the reason I want to show Macross to people. I want to tell them how there is much more to anime than just loli hentai. Well, I'm sorry for thinking Macross had integrity and was above all of that. I enjoy reccommending movies and music to friends and then maybe if they like it we can have a good talk about it, or they might like to see or hear something similar. In this case, I can't even get started.

For what it's worth, I've found it's never useful trying to convert people, as hard as it is to not try. I hear where you're coming from, but people either "get" this stuff, or they don't, and nothing you're going to show them will change their mind because of their own preconceptions.

I remember trying to show M0 to my younger brother a few years ago. He couldn't have cared any less losing interest about 10 minutes into ep 1, and always gave me that cockeyed look when he saw that I'd blown another $200 on a Yammie ... And he grew up with Robotech, glued to the screen, same as I was.

It's like getting annoyed at why your friends inexplicably don't like Led Zeppelin (or insert an arbitrary music group). "But listen to the the variety of their songwriting, the depth, the sophistication ... the Rain Song is a masterpiece!", you'll say. And all you're going to hear back is how immature and mysogonistic Robert Plant sounds making silly sex noises in "Whole Lotta Love".

To tell you guys the truth, I've met exactly one person in the last 10 years or so that knew anything whatsoever about Macross (though he pronounced it "Ma-CROSS", which was really wierd). If I hadn't stumbled on MW a few years ago, I'd probably be concerned for my mental health being this obsessed with an (let's face it, obscure) anime series, leaping out of my chair cheering watching a hot-off-the-press raw I can't understand, and paying heaven-only-knows-how-much so far on figures and collectibles.

At least I know I'm not the only one.

[Shun]

i pronounce it Ma-Cross too...

u guys pronounce it as MAC-cross? like macdonalds, big MAC?

マクロス Makurosu

[Project Phoenix]

For what it's worth, I've found it's never useful trying to convert people, as hard as it is to not try. I hear where you're coming from, but people either "get" this stuff, or they don't, and nothing you're going to show them will change their mind because of their own preconceptions.

I remember trying to show M0 to my younger brother a few years ago. He couldn't have cared any less losing interest about 10 minutes into ep 1, and always gave me that cockeyed look when he saw that I'd blown another $200 on a Yammie ... And he grew up with Robotech, glued to the screen, same as I was.

It's like getting annoyed at why your friends inexplicably don't like Led Zeppelin (or insert an arbitrary music group). "But listen to the the variety of their songwriting, the depth, the sophistication ... the Rain Song is a masterpiece!", you'll say. And all you're going to hear back is how immature and mysogonistic Robert Plant sounds making silly sex noises in "Whole Lotta Love".

To tell you guys the truth, I've met exactly one person in the last 10 years or so that knew anything whatsoever about Macross (though he pronounced it "Ma-CROSS", which was really wierd). If I hadn't stumbled on MW a few years ago, I'd probably be concerned for my mental health being this obsessed with an (let's face it, obscure) anime series, leaping out of my chair cheering watching a hot-off-the-press raw I can't understand, and paying heaven-only-knows-how-much so far on figures and collectibles.

At least I know I'm not the only one.

I have to agree with you there. I tired showing SDFM, M+ and M0 to one of my friend's brother and he told me that Macross is silly with all the crazy flying missiles and impossible stunts the valk pilots employ in evading them. To him, Gundam Wing was the "shiznit" with all "realistic" robot action, "cool" and "believable characters" plus an epic plot that makes all mecha anime pale in comparison. Today, he watches SEED and SEED Destiny and says the same thing about 00.

Try arguing against that.

[Shun]

I have to agree with you there. I tired showing SDFM, M+ and M0 to one of my friend's brother and he told me that Macross is silly with all the crazy flying missiles and impossible stunts the valk pilots employ in evading them. To him, Gundam Wing was the "shiznit" with all "realistic" robot action, "cool" and "believable characters" plus an epic plot that makes all mecha anime pale in comparison. Today, he watches SEED and SEED Destiny and says the same thing about 00.

Try arguing against that.

OMG not Wing?!!

Wing being "realistic".... LMAO...