Macross Frontier Episode 1 Talkback Thread *READ 1st Post*

[Mark Nguyen]

oh yeah, of all the scenes they had to cut out?? couldn't they cut out the silly double transformation from Ozma's VF-25, is it really neccessary!?

Ask Kawamori. In the first episode of Macross Zero, he did the same thing for Roy's first transformation, first taking a VERY long time showing the transformation from several different angles, then showing it at real speed to show just how much was involved in transforming a fighter. I think it worked just fine here, albeit in reverse. Really though, it's a fairly common anime technique to repeat the same action multiple times to emphasize its coolness.

Mark

Edited April 4, 2008 by Mark Nguyen

[Gubaba]

For my part, I'll take a few lower polygon shots over the horrors of AnimeFriend in SDFM any day.

You took the words right out of my mouth. If there's knife fight coming up in MF, it's guaranteed to look better than Max and Millia's...

[Aegis!]

What a bunch of ******* !!! They cut Isamu's hand gesture !!! And where are the VF-171 in all that !?!?!? Graham can always complain about Gundam 00, but at least Gundam 00 does not have a poo editing like the that. With that kind of poo, Macross will be always light years behind Gundam. Macross Frontier will be another Macross Zero : A WASTE !!!

I know we shouldn't feed them, but...C'mon ! it seems trolling has come to an all-time low now.

No, it's raw. But my old Mac with old VLC refuses to accept that 264 is the wave of the future, and simply won't play it.

I'm assuming I can't be the only one here unable to play the Q-R version, so I figured it's debut in another format was worth a mention.

Patience, patience...fansubs should be arriving in a few days. Shinsen Subs got their Deculture version out three days after it aired.

Shouldn't this week subs come a little bit faster? considering the dialogue is almost the same as the Deculture Edition it's as if they already have 90% of the work done. I don't see why they're taking this long to release the subs.

Anyway, as much as I'm exited about this new series and the prospect of the storyline I'm still uneasy about the shoujo-looking character designs, I certailny would think it twice before showing this series to my friends, and so far (for the first time in my life) Kawamori mecha designs are not really doing it for me this time around, particularly the VF-25 Full Armor (doesn't compliment the 25's design at all, not even in battroid), after the YF-19/21 from M+ the VF-25 just looks unjustifiably archaic-looking.

In the other hand, I'm really liking the whole cast, the space colony setting and specially the new enemies, so I'm really looking forward to Ep.2

[akt_m]

I guess the VF-25 looks archaic because kawamori wanted it to resemble a lot the VF-1. Just look at the new macross ship, resembles the old SDF-1 doesn't it?? Maybe Kawamori just want to release it internationally and at the same time tell all the robowtech fans "look this is the original thing forget about the garbage you know".

[DJ Loe Kee]

sorry i got spoiled by other animes that get subbed fast.

yea, naruto and bleach has me spoiled too. i keep checkin' shinsen subs website for updates every few hours. but on the other side of the equation, i used to follow death note weekly and it took animanda about a week or two (or 3 weeks) to sub death note. kuro-hana were the speed subbers and i really didn't like their subs. but they have improved the translation accuracy when the subbed the death note special.

anyways, back on topic. i was hopin' to watch naruto first (deep story, little action), then bleach (not so deep story but alot of action) followed by macross frontier (deep story and lots of action hopefully) this weekend. looks like it will be next weekend instead.

it's cool tho'. i hate waitin' for weekly anime and i need to go back to not watchin' a show for 2-4 months and then havin' a marathon. but it seems that macross f is only 13 episodes so i guess i should follow it week by week like i did with death note and quit watchin' bleach and naruto for awhile...

This is the first series that I've followed in real time...how fast is fast?

naruto and bleach get subbed the next day. death note took a couple of days (kuro-hana's speed subs) but you had to wait 2-3 weeks for animanda to sub death note. kuro-han's translation accuracy of the death note special was MUCH IMPROVED over the accuracy of the series. but they did take 4-6 months (or more???) to sub the special.

Edited April 5, 2008 by DJ Loe Kee

[Gubaba]

ZOMFG!!!! I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY CUT OUT SHERYL MURMURING "STRAWBERRY PIE"!!! I THOUGHT THIS WAS GOING TO BE AWESOME BUT NOW IT'S CLEARLY THE WORST WASTE OF ANIMATION SINCE YAMATO 2520!!!!

Nah, it was fine. Sure, some of the space battle got cut, but I liked the added Sheryl bits, especially when she made it look like Alto knocking her off the glacier was all part of the act.

She's kind of a shrew. I like that.

In some ways I liked it better than the Deculture Edition, in some ways I didn't. Probably throwing everything together for the DVD would be the best course.

Whatever, I'm already fired up for the next episode.

[DJ Loe Kee]

^looks like i can't read this thread anymore. i don't watch raws...

[Mr March]

ZOMFG!!!! I CAN'T BELIEVE THEY CUT OUT SHERYL MURMURING "STRAWBERRY PIE"!!! I THOUGHT THIS WAS GOING TO BE AWESOME BUT NOW IT'S CLEARLY THE WORST WASTE OF ANIMATION SINCE YAMATO 2520!!!!

"Small edits! SMALL EDITS!"

:lol:

[drum001]

Can anyone tell me how I can view this episode smoothly? I'm thinking I need something in order to view x264 encoded files?? I'm kind of new at the torrent thang, so please forgive my ignorance. I'm on a MAC if that makes a difference. I'm currently getting the DIVX version just in case...

Thanks...

[Sketch]

Can anyone tell me how I can view this episode smoothly? I'm thinking I need something in order to view x264 encoded files?? I'm kind of new at the torrent thang, so please forgive my ignorance. I'm on a MAC if that makes a difference. I'm currently getting the DIVX version just in case...

Thanks...

Works just fine for me in VLC (my work computer is a mac)

[Max_Jenius]

Ok, so Ive just watched the broadcast version and I have to agree with alot of others. I love the new stuff they added in, but I hate the pacing and the edits. It makes some of the scenes not make sense and the story doesnt seem as fleshed out as much as it was in the DE version. I am still looking forward to episode 2 and hope it is more in line with what we saw back in December.

Edited April 5, 2008 by Max_Jenius

[MisaForever]

Ok, I've now watched it as well and................... well, it wasn't great. Like a lot of you, it seemed too fast and things just didn't get explained. While I appreciate the longer concert scene, it didn't really WOW me or anything and I wish they'd kept in what they had from the Deculture version. I'm hoping that future episodes will not be as quickly paced and will explain why things are happening.

[Renato]

Like many, I didn't like that they took out the cool synchronized song/battle choreography, but I preferred this version's scene backstage, where they explain first off that Alto & gang are part of the stage show. When I watched the DE I was confused, thinking "what corkscrew? Why is he flying around in the dome?" That needed a bit more clarification. On the other hand, the DE opened with a long wide shot of all the ships in the fleet, and the welcoming radio transmission to Sheryl's flight, which kind of also welcomed the viewer into the Frontier world... That's gone now so you're kind of just thrown in there.

Overall still very good, though. I didn't like the opening or ending, give me the adrenaline-pumping Seventh Moon or Dynamite Explosion any day.

FIRE!!!

[Duke Togo]

On the other hand, the DE opened with a long wide shot of all the ships in the fleet, and the welcoming radio transmission to Sheryl's flight, which kind of also welcomed the viewer into the Frontier world... That's gone now so you're kind of just thrown in there.

I really felt the same thing, there. Its such a great moment in the DE, and they totally blew it.

[MisaForever]

Ok. I've now watched the Broadcast version and then the Deculture version again and I will honestly say that the Deculture version IS the perfect version. The added scenes in the BV do not make up for what they removed from the DV and I am 100% sure that the music was intended for the DV as it worked PERFECTLY. There is magic in the Deculture version that sends shivers down my spine each time I watch it and I got none of that from the Broadcast version. Just my opinion but I'll stick with the nice DV.

[Mercurial Morpheus]

I've only watched bits from the RAW so I can't comment much. I liked the old opening narration better. Namely the music just made it epic, and agree that the intro was nice. It also showed a softer side to Sheryl. The extended concert was nice, though the old one was really nicely edited. The new sets up Alto and Sheryl a bit ore though.

I'll post more thoughts once a subbed version is out. For all you fansub newbys, a sub for a show like this usually hitys a day or two after a raw comes out. A good sub usually hits about three to five days after a good raw comes out.

[Graham]

I think it was inevitable that the shorter broadcast verson would suffer in comparison to the longer Deculture version.

Many of us have seen the Deculture version multiple time since last December (I've watched it close to 20 times now), so any cuts and changes are going to be very noticable.

As others ahave mentioned I also agree that the pacing and editing felt off. But again, I think that this may be beacuse we are too used to the Deculture edition.

One area where I think the broadcast version actually improved over the Deculture version is in the extra concert footage of Alto and gang's flight routine. In the Deculture version, it never seemed very clear what they were actually being hired to do.

It looks like the TV series is going to follow the manga more closely.

The main thing I didn't like about the broadcast version was that they cut the Ghost footage and some of the VF-171 batttle scenes. The Ghost footage, IMO really helped build up the tension and the feel that the enemy is a substantial threat to the fleet.

Anyway, I'm not going to judge the series harshly just based on the first episode. I'm going to reserve judgement from the second episode onwards, when we start seeing what is virgin material.

Graham

[Graham]

Okay, how about these? (EDIT: okay, have to fix these...stupid borders...fixed!)

Interesting. Those pics clearly show 3 hardpoints on the VF-25's wing.

Graham

[Mr March]

The VF-171 was once again utilizing underwing ordnance, I don't see why the VF-25 wouldn't. According to the entry on the Macross Compendium/Wiki, Kawamori specifically designed the VF-25 to abandon passive stealth, so it makes sense it may use hardpoints again.

[Alex]

Saw the tv broadcast of episode one lastnight. The original was far better. I'm sure they cut the Isamu-homage scene, for example.

[Graham]

The VF-171 was once again utilizing underwing ordnance, I don't see why the VF-25 wouldn't. According to the entry on the Macross Compendium/Wiki, Kawamori specifically designed the VF-25 to abandon passive stealth, so it makes sense it may use hardpoints again.

Actually, what the compendium says is:

"the VF-25 is a deliberate attempt to move away from the silhouettes of current real-world fighters, which are dominated by an emphasis on (passive) stealth"

The way I read that is it doesn't definitevely say one way or another whether the VF-25 does or does not have passive (or active) stealth. It just says that Kawamori wanted to move away from the silhouettes (shape) of current real-world fighters that use passive stealth, such as the YF-22/F-22, YF-23, F-35 etc.

I think it can be inferred though that passive stealth, e.g. stealth through shaping and RAM is out. However, there is still the possibility that the VF-25 may employ an active stealth system, like on the YF-19/21. At the moment, we just don't know until Kawamori choses to release full specs.

Graham

[Graham]

Grabbed the pic with the Konig Monster.

Graham

[Renato]

Grabbed the pic with the Konig Monster.

Graham

When did they show that?? During the opening?

Oh yeah, I also found it interesting that the preview for episode 2 is totally different to the one we saw a few months ago. I wonder if there were scenes which they changed around to show in other, later episodes.

[cyde01]

i suck at the internet.

i downloaded the file but the audio won't play in sync. i have divx, kazaa lite codec pack, quicktime, but it still doesn't play properly. is my comp just too old? *cries*

Edited April 5, 2008 by cyde01

[RichterX]

Just watch episode one, i loved the extended concert scene. The intro song is growing on me, don't quite like the ending song...

I started laughing cause they actually included the Nyan Nyan commercial.

[Keith]

Just watched the intro & ending on youtube, and I actually really like the intro. Mind you it's not as dynamic as either of Aquarion's intro's, but it's still good. Can't wait to catch the actual first episode, though I may have to wait until the series hits the DVD fansub distro circuit, as I don't trust bit torrent as far as I can throw it.

[Keith]

Just watch episode one, i loved the extended concert scene. The intro song is growing on me, don't quite like the ending song...

I started laughing cause they actually included the Nyan Nyan commercial.

The ending song just seems sparse, not enough super awesome Kanno influence.

[Graham]

When did they show that?? During the opening?

Yeah, in the opening, tight before the shot of the 3 bridge bunnies IIRC. It's really quick though. Blink and you'll miss it. In fact, if another member hadn't mentioned it was there, I probably would have missed it too.

As it was, I had to slow the opening down to quarter speed to catch it.

Graham

[Sketch]

Just watched the intro & ending on youtube, and I actually really like the intro. Mind you it's not as dynamic as either of Aquarion's intro's, but it's still good. Can't wait to catch the actual first episode, though I may have to wait until the series hits the DVD fansub distro circuit, as I don't trust bit torrent as far as I can throw it.

Even in the most litigious of countries, people downloading and seeding fansubs don't ever have charges laid against them.

[madeyoulook]

That earring in the ED must be of great significance since I think it plays a role in the manga if my memory serves me right.

[Zinjo]

Would it possible for someone to make this into a nice, sharp, wallpaper image?

http://www.schuapu.cn/uploadme/me/macross/.../ep/01/1002.jpg

Would love to, but that damn subtitling is getting in the way. I got a great screenshot of the VF-25 and Battle 25 without any text, but nothing clean with all three main characters in front of that shot...

I don't miss the teasing of Alto on the shool roof and the editing of some scenes are definitely choppy. I still liked the simultaneous concert and VF-171 battle scenes.

I think the episode could be perfect if both were edited together with solely the story in mind. Much of the deculture edition really worked, however the boiled down version of "First Contact" also had it's strong points as well.

[l_e_m]

Perhaps, this is just me, but I preferred the music and how it was placed in the TV special.

The music doesn't establish the mood like it did before, and it's taking a lot a way from what's going on screen.

It could be the torrent, but the episode seemed a bit off.

Edited April 5, 2008 by l_e_m

[Mr March]

Actually, what the compendium says is:

The way I read that is it doesn't definitevely say one way or another whether the VF-25 does or does not have passive (or active) stealth. It just says that Kawamori wanted to move away from the silhouettes (shape) of current real-world fighters that use passive stealth, such as the YF-22/F-22, YF-23, F-35 etc.

I think it can be inferred though that passive stealth, e.g. stealth through shaping and RAM is out. However, there is still the possibility that the VF-25 may employ an active stealth system, like on the YF-19/21. At the moment, we just don't know until Kawamori choses to release full specs.

Graham

Oh yeah, you're right. I'd tend to agree that I think passive stealth is out, but I suppose we can't dismiss the possibility just yet.

[chrono]

Chronocidal is correct, this is a series that is on a budget, no matter how impressive that budget may be for an anime.

Yep he's correct that it's on a budget and a weekly series.

However that near stopped Enterprise, TNG, Babylon 5, Aeon Kid(US title), and most major shows from using a high poly model or multi-LOD models to get great quality within budget. The whole "1 model" system never worked (except for physical models) and shows the inexperience that anime makers have with 3D. It is their inexperience because nearly every major professional package can make LOD's with ease and it's a simple matter of picking the LOD for the shot.

But we'll see how ep 2 is. Can't wait to see the Loli Zentraedi.

Edited April 5, 2008 by chrono

[Sergorn]

However that near stopped Enterprise, TNG, Babylon 5, Aeon Kid(US title), and most major shows from using a high poly model or multi-LOD models to get great quality within budget.

You really shouldn't compare an anime series with a live action TV-show though..... it's very different in term of how it's done and budgeted

Personally I don't see what's the problem some people have with some 3D models. Overall Macross Frontier is *highly* impressive - and I couldn't name a single anime TV Series that offers such quality in term of 3D and how it blends with traditional animation (eek... it's even more impressive than some OAVs and movies...)

-Sergorn

Edited April 5, 2008 by Sergorn