Dat Pinche Haro! Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 hmm...definately looks nice...i might end up picking up one of these kits instead of the toys...i guess it all depends on final pricing...
electric indigo Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) The surface of the display models shows the structure of the 3D printer in some pics, so I assume those are just dressed up prototypes. The final look and detail level still may change. Edited May 15, 2008 by electric indigo
klam1020 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 hmm...definately looks nice...i might end up picking up one of these kits instead of the toys...i guess it all depends on final pricing... From the picture, it seems that the final price is about 4200yan
OmegaD3k Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Just as I had feared with Bandai making Macross models/toys... The proportions are way off on that VF-25. Reminds me a lot of those Bandai VF-19 kits. Oh well. Won't stop me from getting a couple, though. :] Hopefully the toys will look better.
big F Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 ERRR!!! whats that I see.... Enemy mecha..... na cant be... Looks ok but I would be happier when I see a more close up pic. Come on Hobby Japan and Dengeki Hobby get us some pics.
LadyLuck® Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) Well, what I mean is that the 25 is perfect transformable Yup I agree the first 4 katakana says 完全変形 ---> "fully transformable" the katakana posted even works on google translate Edited May 15, 2008 by LadyLuck®
Save Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) DOH!!! I posted these in the wrong thread moving them here. Thanks to Over-Drive for getting me there and getting me in. 47th Shizuoka Hobby Show 2008 Professional Day Edited May 15, 2008 by Save
promethuem5 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 How am I not surprised. I'll keep my judgement until I see it... but I'm not holding my breath. If its going to be like the Bandai VF-1 transformable fighter, I'll be terribly disappointed. You're comparing a modern Bandai super-tech kit to an absolutely ancient variable kit... quit the doom-and-gloom exaggerations and wait for some solid information to complain about. I think the kit's looking sharp, and based on how impressed I've been with Bandai kits lately (BEST VOTOMS KIT EVER!!), this one should be pretty great. My only complaint? It'll likely be made out of ABS plastic instead of polystyrene, to increase its durability for snapper kiddies...
LadyLuck® Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Woah!!! "Save" you sure is a saver!!!! Love these pics...base on it proven that it is transformable and a lot cheaper too CAN'T WAIT
renkenjutsu Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Ahhhh.... an August or September release is definitely enough time to save up to buy all 4 variants of the VF-25 kits (hopefully they're all out by then). the prototypes looks slick, though I think the battroid looks beefier than shown in the original line arts but it might just be me. And I agree with prometheum5. Bandai's kits are evolving as they go along. In any case I foresee a massive buyout from MW'ers when it's released.
LadyLuck® Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) Well it seems bandai is getting back to be a Macross playa' once again with those upcoming Armor/FAST packs I'm going to be insane what to buy first! hmm...do you think they should do the other "valks" as well Edited May 15, 2008 by LadyLuck®
big F Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 MMM Sudenly the world is a lot shinny-er Thanks Indiana Macross
Valkyrie addict Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 nice...the rivets look aweful, althought, the Vajra looks astounding
s001 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Hey what kind of models are these? Are they like Hasegawa's or a more toy-ish type of model?
Chas Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 My only complaint? It'll likely be made out of ABS plastic instead of polystyrene, to increase its durability for snapper kiddies... Really? have they used ABS in any other kits recently? If they do that it would make any customs that require glue a whole hell of a lot more difficult. ABS glue can be difficult to work with. As far as panel and rivet details go since it is a transforming kit I can sort of understand why they are not there, I mean check out those crazy panel breaks around the shoulder area when in fighter mode! Where the hell would you put rivets? they'd look pretty odd if they were there - going in all sorts of directions. I must admit though, I'm not a big fan of transforming model kits. (at least none I've encountered so far)They just don't hold up over time. You wanna talk about weak joints! I've found that they are much sturdier, pose better and I am much happier building them as static mode models. So that means Bandai will probably get three times the amount of money from me - cus I will have to pick some of these up ^_^
renkenjutsu Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 I'd probably buy 3 of each variant and permanently pose them in the 3 different modes o.o;;;;; Probably. The scary thing is I may not the only one that thought about this
JLYC Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 much nicer than what i had expected from Bandai. The price is a bit on the steep side though. I really don't give a crap about it being able to transform. Would be cheaper probably if they just offered the option to build in either fighter, battroid, or gerwalk forms than developing a transformation mechanism- esp if they're releasing a toy line already albeit in different scale.
VFTF1 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 I really don't understand what Bandai has against Macross. They make these utterly stupendous Soul of Chogokin figures. Their Gundam models are out of this world awesome. Then WE get shafted. I'm not saying these are abominable - they're nice, they're ok - if they're going to be 1/72 and cheap and models needing paint then yeah - whoppy. But I'm holding out for some 1/60 goodness. Come on Bandai Make us happy! VFTF1
Fatalist Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Am I right in assuming that Bandai is still using wood as a basis to sculpt out their prototypes? Seems a like a couple of the close-up shots in battroid I could see the wood rings through the paint. Not complaining, just thought they'd be CAD by now. They do look awesome though. I agree with Graham that the nose in Fighter looks a little wide.
QuinJester Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 I'm astounded that people are judging these already based on the rapid prototypes; considering that rapid prototype models are for general shapes and can't render fine scribed details (and as such, those come later in the design phase). No, they aren't made of wood and honestly Bandai is probably at the forefront of model design and technology. Yes, they'll probably be a great deal more detailed than they are here, and will probably have a mix of ABS (joints/internal hinges) and styrene (exterior/details). So much unfounded vitriol. I, for one, believe that Bandai can and will produce a product that wont disappoint.
Vifam7 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 I'm astounded that people are judging these already based on the rapid prototypes; considering that rapid prototype models are for general shapes and can't render fine scribed details (and as such, those come later in the design phase). No, they aren't made of wood and honestly Bandai is probably at the forefront of model design and technology. Yes, they'll probably be a great deal more detailed than they are here, and will probably have a mix of ABS (joints/internal hinges) and styrene (exterior/details). So much unfounded vitriol. I, for one, believe that Bandai can and will produce a product that wont disappoint. Well said. Talk about some people jumping the gun!
94medition Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 The prototype is done by Stereolithography Apparatus (SLA). They created a CAD model and use the SLA machine to create a solid prototype by using laser to cure/create the model layer by layer in a pool of resin. Pretty neat if you see it in action. I would say the Battroid and mode look good. The Figther mode... Hopefully it will turn out better as they refine the model.
Noyhauser Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) I'm astounded that people are judging these already based on the rapid prototypes; considering that rapid prototype models are for general shapes and can't render fine scribed details (and as such, those come later in the design phase). No, they aren't made of wood and honestly Bandai is probably at the forefront of model design and technology. Yes, they'll probably be a great deal more detailed than they are here, and will probably have a mix of ABS (joints/internal hinges) and styrene (exterior/details). So much unfounded vitriol. I, for one, believe that Bandai can and will produce a product that wont disappoint. Actually I disagree with you. We saw the rapid prototypes back in January, these seem to be alot further down the production line than that. If they're already painting them, adding simulated decals, and you can see details that suggest this is near production. Moreover, I think most "modelers" would take great issue with your point that Bandai is at the forefront of model design and technology. Hasegawa/Tamiya/Dragon/Fine Scale probably own that distinction depending on what area/scale you're talking about. Bandai builds decent gundams, but I don't consider snap fit, thick plastic, lesser detail stuff that comes on plastic sprues, models. They sorta sit in this nether region between models and toys. And if you think this is rapid fanboyism at work, think again. I'd like to think modelers on here as professionals or craftsmen (to a certain extent more than someone who watches a couple of TV flicks and say "his hands are too small). Most of us have been building stuff for decades and can tell the difference in quality pretty quickly. Bandai has a notorious history when it comes to models, which is why alot of us are already skeptical. One of the reasons we had some hope was the presence of Hasegawa, which has been giving us high quality macross model products for the last six years. Some of us hoped that there would be enough competition to push Bandai out of their ways and towards a more realism oriented market. These photos suggest otherwise. Edited May 15, 2008 by Noyhauser
Fatalist Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 The prototype is done by Stereolithography Apparatus (SLA). They created a CAD model and use the SLA machine to create a solid prototype by using laser to cure/create the model layer by layer in a pool of resin. Pretty neat if you see it in action. I would say the Battroid and mode look good. The Figther mode... Hopefully it will turn out better as they refine the model. Ah! Gotcha. Hence the semi carved look. I mentioned wood in my previous post because I remember seeing (first hand at that) way back in the day the first prototypes of the Toycom/Yamato VF-11 at the SDCC. It was carved and built from wood. It was even commented upon back then as well that some companies will use wood as a basis for prototypes. Thats all I was assuming. I wasn't bashing Bandai. I wasn't "jumping the gun". Half the reason for these forums whether Bandai reads them or not, is to get consumer feedback. As I stated previously, I think they all look good. And honestly, I can't wait for them to finally be released.
Noyhauser Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) You're comparing a modern Bandai super-tech kit to an absolutely ancient variable kit... quit the doom-and-gloom exaggerations and wait for some solid information to complain about. Hey I can see the photos, the fighter mode has a blue canopy, you can see some of the details on the Battroid, I think that indicates this is alot closer to the production version than whats on the first page which was clearly a prototype. With the VF-1 comparison, I meant to say that with a transforming fighter its less of a model than lets say a static model. Its like the difference between the transformable SHE VF-4 and the Club M VF-4. Nice to have both, but I like the Club M first, then the SHE. I don't think you can disagree that is not a legitimate perspective. In the end I'll probably still buy two or three, build them, scribe them ect in three different modes. But I can't say I'll be happy doing it if its going to be like this. Edited May 15, 2008 by Noyhauser
QuinJester Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Ah, I see now. You're asking for increased details, like panels, rivets, that aren't necessarily depicted on-screen but could be assumed to be present due to the general design. That's more of a design decision than a failure to meet standards. Some like excessive detailing, some prefer to be as close to "on-screen" as possible. Yes, Bandai seems to be catering to this latter group in this case, but that's again a design decision. How many people would be annoyed if Bandai "made up" a bunch of techno-greeblies to fill space on the models? I'm sure there would be plenty. And not to be snarky or anything, but I'm hardly a newcomer to models. I've been building models my entire life, and I've worked with everything from aircraft kits to snap kits, balsa frame WWII planes to Harrier Jets, Gundams to Five Star Stories resin kits. While many other companies focus on individual part details and the like, Bandai is consistently ahead of the game when it comes to technology like molded color, design, markless sprue cuts, and the like, which is what I was referring to. Detail is not technology. Still, I do see what you mean and can understand why you wouldn't be happy with these offerings. We each have our own hopes when it comes to the intellectual properties we follow, and sometimes those just don't mesh with the people making them. Hopefully Hasegawa will get in on the design action with some of their own fixed-mode, high detail models, so that everyone can be happy.
Noyhauser Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 (edited) Ah, I see now. You're asking for increased details, like panels, rivets, that aren't necessarily depicted on-screen but could be assumed to be present due to the general design. That's more of a design decision than a failure to meet standards. Some like excessive detailing, some prefer to be as close to "on-screen" as possible. Yes, Bandai seems to be catering to this latter group in this case, but that's again a design decision. How many people would be annoyed if Bandai "made up" a bunch of techno-greeblies to fill space on the models? I'm sure there would be plenty. No of course not, but I think what Hase has put out is a much better "model" product both in realism and construction, than the bandai model. They were able to strike a balance on it which I think most people appreciated (though some complained it was a bit too much). And not to be snarky or anything, but I'm hardly a newcomer to models. I've been building models my entire life, and I've worked with everything from aircraft kits to snap kits, balsa frame WWII planes to Harrier Jets, Gundams to Five Star Stories resin kits. While many other companies focus on individual part details and the like, Bandai is consistently ahead of the game when it comes to technology like molded color, design, markless sprue cuts, and the like, which is what I was referring to. Detail is not technology. Sorry from the tone of your previous post it seemed as if you were coming off as the usual gundam noobie. And I agree with you that bandai has had great advances in technology, yet I think its debateable whether modeling has really profited because of it. Molded colour doesn't really interest me given I paint everything (though I did build a Gundam MKII using the no-paint method), neither does markless sprue cuts for the same reason. Now I look at what Dragon has done with its 1/35 tank line (slide moldings particularly) and I'd consider that huge advance. Maybe bandai uses it and I'm crawling up the wrong tree, I'm not sure, but thats particularly what I'm referring to. Still, I do see what you mean and can understand why you wouldn't be happy with these offerings. We each have our own hopes when it comes to the intellectual properties we follow, and sometimes those just don't mesh with the people making them. Hopefully Hasegawa will get in on the design action with some of their own fixed-mode, high detail models, so that everyone can be happy. Edited May 15, 2008 by Noyhauser
Skypoet Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Well That seems absolutely awesome! I haven't built a [non-flyable] model in 10 years and I think that I'll buy this one as soon as it gets out!!! 4200 Yen!!! That's marvelous! I was so fond of the Arii tranformable battroids as a teenager... it seems that my bedroom will have a new decoration in August or September... I absolutely can't wait to buy this one... nevermind the rivets if there aren't any... to me this model seems so perfect and so consistent with the series... oh darn I absolutely can't wait :-P
warpaint22 Posted May 15, 2008 Posted May 15, 2008 Well I agree with everybody that likes what they see so far, Bandai are doing a great job so far and these are only prototypes. As for the question of rivets I'd have to agree with Graham in the toy thread, in the year 2070 or what ever year Macross F is in who the hell would hold a fighter togeather with pop rivets? Even a lot of panel lines should be a thing of the past as I would think that if man can traverse the stars then we have better ways of attaching panels than rivets. As for trying to compare the Bandai VF-1 of the 80's to todays Badai offferings is like chalk and cheese. As for all the talk of Hasegawa this and Hasegawa that, lets not forget that Hasegawa kit's also have quite a few let downs as well, it's nice to have great detail but not when you have to sand most of it off and rescribe it, might as well just not have it and add it yourself. Tamiya make awesome models for an ex lumber company who change from cutting down trees to making models and R/C models but have gone to importing and reboxing Italeri 1/72 models. All companies have there flaws, I'd love a dollar for every time I heard someone complain about Hasegawa adding new decals to an old model and re-releasing it as a new product. As for the complaints about Bandai's snap fit method, have most people forgotten that Hasegawa Battroids are also designed to snap together so it's not 100% necessary to use glue, the fighter kits are not but the battroids are snap fit kits. As for Bandai making the models transform, well I see it as that's what the Japanese market likes, how many Hasegawa kits have been converted to transform, you see it all the time on the Japanese model forums and everytime someone posts pic's of one it's all WOW how did they do it or That's fantastic wish I had one, so I guess as stated that this forum is for consumer research (not what I thought this forum is for), but Bandai I guess is going by what they hear every time a model that has been converted to transform appears here. Well so far I very pleased at what Bandai have done for the new show and look forward to the release of these models and given the excellent Gundam models they have produced these should be awesome.
promethuem5 Posted May 16, 2008 Posted May 16, 2008 Really? have they used ABS in any other kits recently? If they do that it would make any customs that require glue a whole hell of a lot more difficult. ABS glue can be difficult to work with. The latest from the Gundam lines have been in more and more ABS, and it is a whole hell of a pain to glue...
badboy00z Posted May 16, 2008 Posted May 16, 2008 I decide whether a model is good or bad by how easy it is to put together. The skills of filling in seams, masking and gluing parts came around because the models needed it to be complete. If there was a kit out there that has perfect detail, does not need glue and hides seams perfectly, there wouldn't be the need to use those skills. I don't get why anyone would complain that they wouldn't have to. IMO it's the paint job that makes the model and anything that can make the painting process easier is welcomed. Bandai has done that with their engineering skills. Hiding seam lines so there's no need for putty, snap fitting parts so glue won't mess up the paint and making multi sectional parts so no masking is need and using ABS for durability is what other companies should do. If Bandai can make their models with Hasegawa's detail then that would be wonderful.
LadyLuck® Posted May 16, 2008 Posted May 16, 2008 (edited) IMO I will not judge the valk yet. Besides it's still a prototype, maybe painted b'coz of the event http://macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?act=...st&id=53147 Look closely, its a painted prototype you can even see the artifacts(wood like linings) of the SLA Printer. That means its not yet the final product at all, perhaps much changes will be made. Edited May 16, 2008 by LadyLuck®
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