Bandai 1/72 Scale Macross Frontier Plastic Models

[anime52k8]

Snapped a pix for illustration on how awful I did around the intake...beware lucky you, who hasn't yet got there, or who successfully did it!!

let me guess, you tried to move the decal after you used the decal softener? decal softener's basically melts the decal, that's how it works and what it's supposed to do, but it makes the decals fragile as hell when they're drying.

one thing to note, when you put a decal down and apply the softener the decal may start to wrinkle or pucker, DO NOT TOUCH THE DECAL. it's perfectly normal for the decal to do this, and 95% of the time it will settle out once it dries. if you touch it now, the decal will rip

[anime52k8]

[wolfx]

Here's a more pics of mine, this time in Gerwalk mode.

You can actually get a reasonable 'A' stance with this kit.

I used the stickers on mine instead of the decals.

I'm regretting not painting the underside of the nose sensors blue when I was building it. Too late now.

Still have to paint Alto.

Graham

Hey......the stickers actually look decent!! I probably should've used stickers if they look almost the same. Only drawback is they won't conform to the surface as well as decals but meh. Considering i screwed up alot with the decals, i just might tear off the red/black stripes and replace them with stickers before i apply the top coat. Now i'm just worried if the colours will match. Did you have to trim the stickers, Graham?

[Hikuro]

I'll be using the stickers, as I've said a thousand times here, I can't stand the decals, they always screw up for me.

I just finished washing any grease or dust on the parts...so tomorrow when I get home from work I'll start on the little details for painting and then start assembling the parts.

By the way, are there decals/stickers for the tail fins? I noticed it's all molded black so I'm hoping everyones not going and painting the damn thing and that there are either pieces or decal/stickers to place on those areas cause that's gonna be a bitch for me to paint.

[Graham]

Most of the stickers have no border, so no trimming is needed. The only stickers that I've found do need a bit of trimming are the small '007' and 'SMS' that go on the shoulders. If you don't trim them, they overlap the red and black shoulder sticker. Of couse you can just stick the 'SMS' & '007' on first, before the red and black sticker, which is what I should have done, so that the red and black sticker overlaps the edges of the 'SMS' & '007', which is what I should have done.

The stickers are for the most part excellent. Very thin and adhere well. As mentioned, no border. Applying them can be tricky. You obviously need to take care to get then in the correct position first time as you do not want to be pulling them off and repositioning them too many times, or they will lose their stickiness.

The only stickers that have given me a problem are the two small red diamonds on the sides of the LERX, they don't adhere well due to the sharpe chine and small size of the stickers and also the red sticker that goes near the muzzle of the gunpod. This also doesn't want to stay stuck.

Oh, on the stickers for the tail fins, I ended up trimming of the red parts that are suppoosed to wraop around the tail spike on the top rear of the tail fins as the stickers also didn't want to stay wrapped around. Probably easier to paint that spike red.

Graham

[Graham]

By the way, are there decals/stickers for the tail fins? I noticed it's all molded black so I'm hoping everyones not going and painting the damn thing and that there are either pieces or decal/stickers to place on those areas cause that's gonna be a bitch for me to paint.

Yes, there are stickers for the tail fins, as follows: -

Sticker list per tail fin

1) 1 x white sticker for the leading edge of the tail fin.

2) 4 x white stickers for the 2 x white stripes on both side of the tail.

3) 1 x red sticker for the top and trailing edges of the tail fin. This sticker also wraps around the top rear tail spike.

As I mentioned in my post above, on my kit, the sticker didn't want to stay wrapped around the tail spike, so I just used a scaple and trimmed off that small part of the sticker, leving the tail spike bare.

Graham

[wolfx]

Oh, on the stickers for the tail fins, I ended up trimming of the red parts that are suppoosed to wraop around the tail spike on the top rear of the tail fins as the stickers also didn't want to stay wrapped around. Probably easier to paint that spike red.

Graham

I found problems with that part too with decals. I got pissed and ended up masking and painting the red on the whole fin instead of using decals or stickers.

[David Hingtgen]

I'll probably paint the spike, decal the rest of the red on the fin.

[Graham]

Anybody else having trouble getting the Gerwalk mode stand adaptor to attach?

Graham

[travis2008]

Not really complicated to assemble. If you have some experience with Gunpla (Bandai does a great job with "no glue, snap assembly, colored plastic", you would be fine (get a pair of cheap gundam plamo for experimenting like David did).

Unfortunately, it was impossible for the VF-25 to come with black, red and white parts for the "skin" (because it DOES have a real working "squeleton" for transformation and posability), so you will either have to use the stickers, the decals or paint the decorations yourself...I used decals and will talk about that later, but the thing is: be careful with curves: the decals or stickers have to conform to contours and some raised detals (air intake area, shoulders, the circle bar vernier in the wing root (or shoulder depending on mode)...I consistently screwed up on all those areas, but will use paint to conceal the cracks and missing bits of the decals. Maybe it's the decal "Mr. Mark Setter" I used, or the lack of proper procedure!

Overall, I truly enjoyed building the kit, and it was somehow rewarding to see that everything worked and could transform fine (fighter mode...flimsy as hell, we need a proper traditional model for fighter mode, preferably snap assembly and no paint required!), but decorating was demanding, at least to me, I could not get all the decals to fully comform to the intricate surfaces.

Snapped a pix for illustration on how awful I did around the intake...beware lucky you, who hasn't yet got there, or who successfully did it!!

alright, will definitely give it a try

thanks for the info

but i think it will take some time b4 my place sells the model

[Graham]

I wouldn't describe the kit as flimsy. For a model kit, it's actually pretty sturdy, but of course should still be treated with care and as a model kit, not as a toy.

I've found that it locks together very well in Battroid and Gerwalk mode. Where there are problems IMO is in fighter mode, as there are no locking tabs to lock the legs and wing gloves in place, so these tend to move out of pisition very easily when handling the kit.

Also on my kit, the wing root lasers to not want to stay in place, leving huge gaps. Still trying to determine the cause of this.

This is the first kit I have built since 2002 and it did give me a lot of satisfaction.

Graham

[Hikuro]

I just finished some painting, dried faster than expected. I got the canopy painted and bits and pieces of the model itself finished color wise....buuutttt.....I dunno I think I could of done a better job but I don't got much to make them perfect but it works.

I really wanna do a wash on this thing, cause the panel lines on this thing are just well, there's ALOT.

[anime52k8]

another question. I plan on painting one of these in a modified scheme (changing the colors of the stripes)

and I'm trying to figure out the best way to mask for paint. anyone have any good ideas as to how to go about recreating the shape of the various stripes?

(I was thinking maybe using the sticker sheet as a template or something. not sure though.

[valkyriepilot]

your good ole tamiya masking tape will get the job done for that purpose or if you wanna try masking solutions, you can also go for that one... but IMO tamiya masking tape will suffice for the straight edges of the stripes

Edited October 9, 2008 by valkyriepilot

[David Hingtgen]

Photocopy the decal sheet, then use that as your reference. If you photocopy the decals, then cut those shapes out of the paper copy--you've got a mask. Note that photocopiers usually aren't that good at doing perfect 1:1 copying, if you plan to do this, see if you can get a "calibrated" copier or something.

[regult]

let me guess, you tried to move the decal after you used the decal softener? decal softener's basically melts the decal, that's how it works and what it's supposed to do, but it makes the decals fragile as hell when they're drying.

one thing to note, when you put a decal down and apply the softener the decal may start to wrinkle or pucker, DO NOT TOUCH THE DECAL. it's perfectly normal for the decal to do this, and 95% of the time it will settle out once it dries. if you touch it now, the decal will rip

You guessed right...I didn't have to nudge decals on fuel trucks and some airplane models I did before, but on tricky contours I really had to realign the decals! I guess I should have not used the softener at all...well, too late for me, maybe next kit!

Let's recap for the sake of clarity: once you brush on the decal softener, don't even touch it, the wrinkles will vanish once dried, 95% of the time!

(but they REALLY started to wrinkle all over and it was alarming), I wanted to have the decals really well "painted" on the surface so they don't peel off during transformation and handling.

Warning: like somebody already said, the decals will still scratch and peel off in some areas (no matter how well you applied them) where stress of friction is inevitable during transformation, maybe clear coating will be the only way to protect the livery.

Edited October 9, 2008 by regult

[regult]

I wouldn't describe the kit as flimsy. For a model kit, it's actually pretty sturdy, but of course should still be treated with care and as a model kit, not as a toy.

I've found that it locks together very well in Battroid and Gerwalk mode. Where there are problems IMO is in fighter mode, as there are no locking tabs to lock the legs and wing gloves in place, so these tend to move out of pisition very easily when handling the kit.

Also on my kit, the wing root lasers to not want to stay in place, leving huge gaps. Still trying to determine the cause of this.

This is the first kit I have built since 2002 and it did give me a lot of satisfaction.

Graham

Agreed, only fighter mode is a bit hard to handle...you have a point, this is a model and not a toy. I am fine with battroid mode, it's IMO 99% line art/anime accurate and doesn't feel flimsy.

If you look carefully at the custom buiild in November's Hobby JApan (battroid full page pic), you'll notice the modeller made some pegs for the legs, I have no idea where they're atteching in fighter mode, but seems it works just like in the Yamato toys.

My wing gloves don't stay in place and the laser section also does not want to attach properly, but once you pull the legs out/upwards, the problem is partially solved (more pressure on the moving wing glove section), but looking from behind, the exhausts/feet are at an angle (NOT anime accurate)...compromises.

[Vince]

Photocopy the decal sheet, then use that as your reference. If you photocopy the decals, then cut those shapes out of the paper copy--you've got a mask. Note that photocopiers usually aren't that good at doing perfect 1:1 copying, if you plan to do this, see if you can get a "calibrated" copier or something.

I was just think maybe printing these mask on sticker sheets.

[Spitze]

Agreed, only fighter mode is a bit hard to handle...you have a point, this is a model and not a toy. I am fine with battroid mode, it's IMO 99% line art/anime accurate and doesn't feel flimsy.

If you look carefully at the custom buiild in November's Hobby JApan (battroid full page pic), you'll notice the modeller made some pegs for the legs, I have no idea where they're atteching in fighter mode, but seems it works just like in the Yamato toys.

My wing gloves don't stay in place and the laser section also does not want to attach properly, but once you pull the legs out/upwards, the problem is partially solved (more pressure on the moving wing glove section), but looking from behind, the exhausts/feet are at an angle (NOT anime accurate)...compromises.

Any other places that need pegs? Also it would be nice if someone would kindly translate the modelling tips from that Hobby Japan article. I can post the scans if no one can bring up copies.

Edited October 9, 2008 by Spitze

[wm cheng]

A question to anyone who used the decals...

In one of the pictures it shows the new SMS logo applied to the black tailfin, but it seems like the decals don't have enough opacity to read properly against the black background - is this the actual case, or is it just a bad photo?

Also some shots show on the main wings that the grey stripe actually reads through the SMS logo, is the decals that thin that it has no opacity, or is there a white decal underlay (like on the Hasegawa kits) or isn't the stripes cut out at the areas where the SMS logo is supposed to be?

Thanks,

Wm

[Hikuro]

Finished the right arm this morning, penciled in the panel lines. can't believe it took me 45 minutes to do just an arm. The stickers are a pain in the ass for that piece of shoulder armor where the 007 has the red and black border around it...that was a pain in the ass to get me to align it just enough it wouldn't annoy the piss out of me, but still not perfect.

Also, why can't there be canopy decals that go over the parts that need to be black?! I know they use to do it, and it's such a pain in the butt for me to paint it cause I don't have anything to securely grab it so I can pain without smudging or dropping it, luckily I escaped death this time and didn't ruin it.

[Spitze]

Hikuro: Just use masking tape. Also, stick the inner side of the canopy to a stick or something that you can grab onto. Use tape or blu-tack

There's this hint in a modelling handbook: For canopy frames that have two colors, one inner and one outer, just paint the inner color as the first layer and then paint on top of it, the outer layer. And there you have it.

[bullet101]

A question to anyone who used the decals...

In one of the pictures it shows the new SMS logo applied to the black tailfin, but it seems like the decals don't have enough opacity to read properly against the black background - is this the actual case, or is it just a bad photo?

Also some shots show on the main wings that the grey stripe actually reads through the SMS logo, is the decals that thin that it has no opacity, or is there a white decal underlay (like on the Hasegawa kits) or isn't the stripes cut out at the areas where the SMS logo is supposed to be?

Thanks,

Wm

Hi Wm,

I'm currently building mine right now, as i would a model kit, i.e. painting everything, future, decaling, top cote etc. The decals are very thin and in most cases lack enough opacity to stop the underlying colour from showing through. Also note that some of the moving parts fit very tightly without paint, with paint they become a real pain in the ass to get to sit right.

[wm cheng]

Hi Wm,

I'm currently building mine right now, as i would a model kit, i.e. painting everything, future, decaling, top cote etc. The decals are very thin and in most cases lack enough opacity to stop the underlying colour from showing through. Also note that some of the moving parts fit very tightly without paint, with paint they become a real pain in the ass to get to sit right.

Hmm, that sucks... thanks for the reply. Its too bad they at least didn't cut away the stripes where there will be overlaid graphics. Not only did Hasegawa provide cutouts on the stripes but they also provided white decals for underneath the graphics (kind of a belt AND suspenders approach!). I guess the only part where there's a problem is the tailfins eh? Maybe I'll have to mask it and spray it first.

I plan on building it like a model too, I will initially build this first kit to be able to transform, but I doubt that I will do so often, I'll probably just leave it in the fighter mode most of the time. I will use this kit to inform me how to build a better fighter on subsequent VF-25s and find out which parts rub the most - I hope to do a complete dry-fit build to see where all the moving parts are, maybe sand away parts that are scraping and then disassemble for painting, filling and sanding.

[regult]

Hmm, that sucks... thanks for the reply. Its too bad they at least didn't cut away the stripes where there will be overlaid graphics. Not only did Hasegawa provide cutouts on the stripes but they also provided white decals for underneath the graphics (kind of a belt AND suspenders approach!). I guess the only part where there's a problem is the tailfins eh? Maybe I'll have to mask it and spray it first.

I plan on building it like a model too, I will initially build this first kit to be able to transform, but I doubt that I will do so often, I'll probably just leave it in the fighter mode most of the time. I will use this kit to inform me how to build a better fighter on subsequent VF-25s and find out which parts rub the most - I hope to do a complete dry-fit build to see where all the moving parts are, maybe sand away parts that are scraping and then disassemble for painting, filling and sanding.

Instead of saying the tailfin SMS decal is too thin, I would say it's the pixels which are too far from each other. Same occurs with the "gray" stripes, which to me are actually darkish grey dots evenly distributed on the decal, with enough space between them to fool the eye at a distance and appear ligher gray. I did notice that all decal printings are done on top of a white "base coat" (my technical vocabulary fails here).

I already have a new nightmare with these decals: the "SMS" logo on nose area got stuck with the wing root extension during transformation, now it's probably either sliced in half or caught between two plastic parts...Jarrod clear coated the model, I wonder how's that subject enduring repreated transformations.

Edited October 9, 2008 by regult

[wm cheng]

Argh?! - Regult, are you saying the decals are screened?!! They are not spot colour, but screened like newsprint with the colours made up of little dots? Please say it isn't so!! Come on Bandai, are you a fly-by-night garage operation?!! Ok... calm down for a minute here and wait for confirmation... (I thought I'd see the last of screened decals from the AMT/monogram of the 80's)

Sorry to hear about your decal problems, can anyone here who have clear-coated the model attest to its durability after transformation?

Instead of saying the tailfin SMS decal is too thin, I would say it's the pixels which are too far from each other. Same occurs with the "gray" stripes, which to me are actually darkish grey dots evenly distributed on the decal, with enough space between them to fool the eye at a distance and appear ligher gray. I did notice that all decal printings are done on top of a white "base coat" (my technical vocabulary fails here).

I already have a new nightmare with these decals: the "SMS" logo on nose area got stuck with the wing root extension during transformation, now it's probably either sliced in half or caught between two plastic parts...Jarrod clear coated the model, I wonder how's that subject enduring repreated transformations.

[David Hingtgen]

Only the grey and blue decals are printed newspaper style. All the rest are screened. (blue=lights/sensors, which even the people who aren't painting the kit are painting those) There's only 4 grey decals if you ignore the vernier ones. (stripe on each wing, and each knee cap)

[Dio]

I'm honestly scared to start this one, and it's been sitting behind me now in the box for the last couple of days. Could you guys make me some recommendations as to how to get started, from sprue to finished model? I'm probably at about Graham's level of experience, but there are several things that I'd like to get right on this model since so much isn't done for us.

I'm quite fine structurally putting it together, trimming sprue nubs and smoothing the surface, etc.

Locating stickers properly is no trouble either.

My issues with the model are:

Panel lining - when is best to do this: on the sprue, after cutting them off, or after assembly?

Gunpod not quite the "right" color (I want that lavender).

Painting the clear parts - canopy, visor, sensors. I've never painted clear plastic before.

My other problems are, I'm in rural Texas and pretty much just have Wal Mart or a local Hobby Lobby (craft store) to obtain supplies, so this will have to be a job done with probably the worst grade of supplies available. But I want this to be done right, because to do otherwise would be a disservice to Macross.

Oh, I'm also an engineer, so if you could tell me how to work this in numerical order (flowchart!) it would be stellar

[Master Dex]

Oh, I'm also an engineer, so if you could tell me how to work this in numerical order (flowchart!) it would be stellar

Mm.. Yes.. nothing like structured organization in a numbered list or flowchart to make understanding easiest.

[Jeremy007]

as far as panel lining goes, you should do that at the end when its built. You may want to scribe the panel lines a bit deeper then they already are but its not nessicary. Once built, put a layer of clear coat on the model BEFORE you panel line...this will help the thinned enamel paint flow into the recesses much better.

Use super thinned enamel paint...about 4-5 drops of paint to about a thimbel full of thinner is a good ratio. Use a really thin tip brush and hold the model at an angle and the panel wash should flow right into the grooves. You may have to experiment with the paint to thinner ratio depending on the brand you use. Let the wash dry over night and then with enamel thinner or Zippo fluid (works very well) take a q-tip or toothpick and rub off all excess panel wash.

For the Gunpod Lavender...not sure. Im still experimenting trying to get that color right myself. I think ive come pretty close with a mix of Gunze's Mr. Color Gray Violet, Steel and Violet

For the clear parts, I dont paint them. I mask over them with Masking Sol Neo and then polish them with Tamiya super fine polish or Compound 2000 when im done. If you want to give the canopy a tinted look, you could spray a VERY LIGHT coating of Tamiya Smoke on the inside of the canopy. If you do this, do it from a bit of a distance so only a very small amount of smoke spray gets inside the canopy so it looks tinted and not painted.

I have not looked at my canopy all that close yet, im not sure if there is a seam running down the middle but if there is and you want to get rid of it, sand the canopy down with SUPER FINE (2000 grit) sandpaper and then polish with whatever finishing polish you have...Tamiya Super Fine and Top Compound 2000 work great.

As you said, you want to do this right so you may want to invest in some things if you dont already have them...Scriber, Masking liquid, polish, good cement, decal setter, superfine sandpaper...etc. You want to make sure you have everything you need before you start...you dont want to be halfway through a step and realize you need something you dont have. If you dont want to settle for the local hobby supplies and dont want to deal with overseas shipping and prices and dont mind dealing with ebay, I highly recommend ebay seller MFPilot...they have TONS of modeling supplies in stock.

Edited October 9, 2008 by Jeremy007

[electric indigo]

Argh?! - Regult, are you saying the decals are screened?!! They are not spot colour, but screened like newsprint with the colours made up of little dots? Please say it isn't so!! Come on Bandai, are you a fly-by-night garage operation?!! Ok... calm down for a minute here and wait for confirmation... (I thought I'd see the last of screened decals from the AMT/monogram of the 80's)

You can see in the HJ scans that the printing screen is visible in the grey and yellow/orange areas, like the SMS logos. Basically the same problems as the EX kits' decals. At least the grey stripes will be easy to do by painting.

[David Hingtgen]

Dio---for a paint you could find at Hobby Lobby/Wal-Mart, look for "Jade Green" from Testors. (they might simply call it Green Metal Flake now) It's a bit metallic, but also pretty good for a clear green, as Tamiya paint is not that widely available. Testors does make a clear green, but will only be found at a dedicated model shop. I would suggest getting some Jade Green, and let it SIT. Let it separate out--you'll be left with some nice clear green floating on top. I used that method for years for various things. And remember, paint the back side of the clear pieces.

For clear blue, Testors *spray can* of transparent blue is easy to find. May be overkill on small parts, but the only way I know of to get transparent blue without access to Tamiya. I'd use it on the sensors, but not the canopy---it is supposed to replicate the blue strip on car windshields, and is that "intense" and hue.

[David Hingtgen]

New post for new topic:

The outer exhaust nozzles. I'm having a heck of a time trying to figure out how/what to paint them. I basically want "the color they're molded, but metallic". Testing out metalizer over bare plastic scrap sprue isn't working so far, it's too opaque even in the lightest coat I can do that doesn't leave bare spots.

The molded color is actually quite close to olive drab. I have no idea how that'll behave when mixed with others, is it even possible to mix that? Most olive drab is very opaque and very flat, and I worry it'll kill whatever metallic I add to it.

I'm seriously considering ignoring canon color and just painting them magnesium or something. (I've already painted the inner parts of the nozzle titanium and they look awesome--but I want the outer parts to contrast, and be "properly" brownish if at all possible)

PS--anyone ever flattened a Tamiya gloss metallic? Their bronze could be decent if it wasn't so glossy---looks wet even when dry.

[Jarrod]

Sorry to hear about your decal problems, can anyone here who have clear-coated the model attest to its durability after transformation?

Clearcoating definitely helped! There were still a few little spots that I think will always wear, but it was a trememdous improvement.

PS--anyone ever flattened a Tamiya gloss metallic? Their bronze could be decent if it wasn't so glossy---looks wet even when dry.

I have...it really takes away alot of the metallic look unfortunately.

[David Hingtgen]

Surprisingly, my first mix worked really well, will probably go with it. Pollyscale "roof brown" is close to the molded color---and adding Pollyscale stainless steel results in a DULL metallic sheen---about what I wanted, and still darn close to the original color.