The state of anime

[Mr March]

I'm a film geek, so I'm confident enough in my film choices that I usually don't have to worry about my two scenarios listed above. It's the average consumer that suffers bad film more than a discriminating fan like myself, with all humility.

Personally, I've never understood the attraction with downloading anime/film. To me, it's always been a last resort, like eBay; something you do when there is no other option. I find downloading slow, aggravating and ultimately very low-quality. I don't want to watch some poorly ripped video that's been compressed gawd knows how many times, especially after it's taken me the better part of a week just to download the damn thing. One of the reasons I love DVD is because its high quality and I'd rather pay to watch a decent DVD of a good anime/film.

And the whole "free" thing is just a bunch of crap. If a movie/anime looks so bad you wouldn't pay to see it, why the hell are you even bothering to download it? The vast majority of everything is crap, indeed, but there is so much product even the quality minority represents more film/anime than one can watch in a lifetime. There's no way I'm going to waste time downloading garbage just because it's free. I wouldn't watch it anyway! In fact, you couldn't pay me to watch that trash!

Don't people get excited over stuff anymore? Take Five Star Stories for example, something I'm just starting to get into. I've been reading through gearsonline for the last month and I'm so excited, I have to have more of this series. I purchased the first manga just the other day and I'm currently hunting down the DVD. But that's like anything, whether FSS, Gundam, Patlabor or Macross. When I get into something I really like, a downloaded video isn't going to do. I want the DVD special edition, boxed set, dozen-disc uber-version with all the bells and whistles. I want imported soundtracks and official manga in bright, pretty colors with a bow on top. I want a highly detailed action figure of my favorite characters and mecha with 100 points of articulation I'll never use. Hell, I'd buy UN Spacy printed toilet paper if only they'd sell it

Oh alright, I wouldn't, but you get my point

Perhaps it's a generational thing and it's people younger than myself that will behave differently. But even those younger friends of mine who are notorious downloaders (I even have one of those hoarders with meter high DVD stacks in his closet) are also just as notorious retail whores like myself. As I said, I think it's the reduction in sales for garbage entertainment that is noticeable. I can understand concern, but the only way you're going to sell disposable entertainment is if it's fast and easy, like downloads are (supposedly, guess they must be childproof; explains why I have so much trouble).

[JB0]

They've dealt with that little loophole in the DMCA (nasty little piece of work that is).

A. It's not a loophole.

B. They didn't, except in the untested case of "owning a PC is illegal because it can be used to break copy protection."

I've actually read the DMCA. Every self-contradictory paragraph of it.

[Gunbuster]

A. It's not a loophole.

B. They didn't, except in the untested case of "owning a PC is illegal because it can be used to break copy protection."

I've actually read the DMCA. Every self-contradictory paragraph of it.

LOL! yea, even the music division of Sony has the same take "Copying" music you own is "stealing"

"Gabriel asked if it was wrong for consumers to make copies of music which they have purchased, even just one copy. Pariser replied, "When an individual makes a copy of a song for himself, I suppose we can say he stole a song." Making "a copy" of a purchased song is just "a nice way of saying 'steals just one copy'," she said."

Pariser is Sony BMG's chief anti-piracy lawyer

and Sony other division (Eletronics) include software with MiniDisc units to rip music from CDs ;;

[Max Jenius]

I guess you never heard the term "illegal distribution"?

If I'm not making a profit and sharing with other interested parties, I could care less. Why should it be illegal to give something away that was free in the first place?

Just because something is illegal, doesn't make it wrong. (the reverse also applies, but it irrelevant in this case)

Edited December 6, 2007 by Max Jenius

[sketchley]

Duh, it was never free in the first place.

If a man gives you a fruit that he stole from a farmer for free, you are party to crime, no?

[chrono]

A. It's not a loophole.

B. They didn't, except in the untested case of "owning a PC is illegal because it can be used to break copy protection."

I've actually read the DMCA. Every self-contradictory paragraph of it.

So have I. They state that any machine produced without built-in Copyright protection can be considered illegal. Which is one of the main reasons why so many protection schemes are being hatched.

[Max Jenius]

Duh, it was never free in the first place.

If a man gives you a fruit that he stole from a farmer for free, you are party to crime, no?

If he gives me an extra fruit he got for me while they were giving it out for free every week, no crime has been comitted. Duhhhh Television broadcasts are for all intents and purposes free, if someone makes a recording and shares it I see no wrong in that.

[chrono]

If he gives me an extra fruit he got for me while they were giving it out for free every week, no crime has been comitted. Duhhhh Television broadcasts are for all intents and purposes free, if someone makes a recording and shares it I see no wrong in that.

That only works if he didn't steal it to begin with! But he did so it's the crime of receiving stolen goods. DURH!!!!

Your VP only remotely holds up when you are only handing out your recordings a few times to family and friends (locally in a small city or town), and then aren't being copy'ed again. But your VP completely fails when it comes to dl's from the Internet, because then you are copying copy's! Also you are copying copy's of material that is not broadcast in your area. And even if it IS in your area you are still copying a copy unless it's from an official release site which would make it legal. Otherwise you are receiving stolen goods.

[bandit29]

If he gives me an extra fruit he got for me while they were giving it out for free every week, no crime has been comitted. Duhhhh Television broadcasts are for all intents and purposes free, if someone makes a recording and shares it I see no wrong in that.

Yes, you don't see anything wrong. While personally I agree with you, the law states otherwise.

[Max Jenius]

That only works if he didn't steal it to begin with! But he did so it's the crime of receiving stolen goods. DURH!!!!

Your VP only remotely holds up when you are only handing out your recordings a few times to family and friends (locally in a small city or town), and then aren't being copy'ed again. But your VP completely fails when it comes to dl's from the Internet, because then you are copying copy's! Also you are copying copy's of material that is not broadcast in your area. And even if it IS in your area you are still copying a copy unless it's from an official release site which would make it legal. Otherwise you are receiving stolen goods.

When did people steal when recording off their TV? If he's hosting it, he's still sharing it just the same... just using a different media. You can say "that's illegal!" all you want, but it's a silly law that's hardly enforced. If I like something, I'll buy the official release but there's no reason I should have to wait an extra year to two years to check out a show people in other parts of the world get to see for free. The companies can whine about it all they want, but last I checked the customer knows what they want best.

[fernarias]

My two cents.

For those of you saying that fans should be patient and just wait for the shows to be released how about this argument. Would you buy a car from Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Subaru, etc. if you knew that it was a two to three year old model from Japan? Would you buy electronics or computers from Japan that are three years old? No you would not. It's strange that a country that whole economy is focused on exports cannot do the same with it's entertainment media (anime, drama and movies) during a time when they have become very popular around the world.

My solution:

Japanese production studios produce subbed versions in English, French, German, Chinese, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Russian (about 90% of the world speaks these languages and it's higher if you include these languages as a second language) at the same time the shows are in production. NHK, Fuji TV, TBS, NBS, etc. buy spots on satellite stations around the world that would get their product 100% world saturation(of course I mean 100% saturation of accessible markets and economically viable markets, most likely you would want to focus on N. & S. America, Europe, Middle East, South East Asia, Australia as your main markets). When the shows are release in Japan they are also release via satellite. The companies make their money for production from the sale of subscription and from commercials run during programming (the commercial are region and country dependent so that viewers will see commercials for products available in their area). This will be the first showing. All DVDs and like media sold in Japan will be region zero and available with same subs for export. Popular shows can then be licensed for dubbing in their respective markets and released on mainstream media bringing in a second source of revenue. DVDs and like media of Dubs will be another source of income. Down the road you would focus on downloads when someone figures out a way to make money (subscription service seems the most likely or free with commercials that are tailored to your profile, i.e. targeted marketing).

Would this work? Well even if the shows got a 1 or 2 share rating in the US market it would bring in more revenue then the productions companies are making for licensing (as stated in the article). Even more if you accounted for reruns and alternative time slots. Consumers who refuse to watch subs would also benefit since only high rated shows would be dubbed. These shows in turn would bring in more revenue since a high rating is already assured. Now this would not stop downloads but it would end fansubs since they would not have a legitimate reason to exist. This would not be a perfect system but it would most definitely exploit all of the current revenue streams for video and film media.

Finally, I think this model should be implemented for all other countries, for all media. I know that I would like to have a choice in watching programming from Britain, France, Italy, Spain, Germany, etc. Exactly what I thought would happen when the 500 channels of television were announce way back when.

F.

[Warmaker]

If the companies can't make an official release over here in time, i.e. taking a Godawful 3-5 years, or not at all, then screw them.

The fan community will take care of themselves like they have in the past.

[uminoken]

The President of Bandai Visual USA, gave a brief response to the initial editorial in his blog:

"I received more comments on my blog last week. Thank you for giving me a lot of viewpoints about the market. I appreciate it.

Last week, Mr. Justin Sevakis posted a very interesting editorial on AnimeNewsNetwork.com. I'm guessing some of you have already read it. There are a lot of points that we, meaning both the people in the industry and the fans as well, need to seriously consider. His editorial starts with the issue of piracy in anime distribution. I do not want argue about the good or bad in regards to watching anime on YouTube or downloading them on BitTorrent. Some of it is illegal, of course, but the important point is what he mentioned at the end -- what the industry can do now to save the anime market in the US. I am not sure how critical the industry's crisis is, however I agree with Mr. Sevakis' point of view that the industry needs to change. Bandai Visual USA has been considering what kind of revolution the market needs, and came to some conclusion on the following points.

One was upgrading the quality of everything around the package including the technical side of the image itself and printing quality. Japanese licensors have been told that the US fans don't care about the quality at all, and licensees would cut the costs in order to match the demand on cheap pricing. I KNOW CHEAPER is BETTER. But if the quality is unsatisfactory, isn't the cheap price still expensive?

Next was on distribution. Since the anime market is far smaller than the general DVD market or TV distribution market, we cannot use the same distribution channels as the ones that the major Hollywood studios or TV networks use. We have to change the distribution system to suit an extremely niche market.

Third is the lead-in time for new shows to arrive in the US market. We noticed that the delay in introducing new shows in the US frustrated the US anime fans a lot. I believe this is why fansubs have been rising in popularity in the US.

Well, Bandai Visual USA could solve the first quality issue. For the second issue, although it was not our intention, we had to change it to sell mostly through our own internet distribution, as you know. If we can cut the sales-cost by selling most of our products through direct distribution, we may reduce the prices as fans wish. (So, let's buy our products through dot-anime, PLEASE!) And Bandai Visual Japan and Bandai Visual USA are seriously considering on releasing some of the new shows simultaneously with Japan as the solution for the third issue. Next Spring you may be able to see some of the brand new shows on dot-anime.

All the above is what I have been saying at conventions and interviews. And I am glad to hear some people having the same ideas. Even in Japan, some people started to say that it's time to change the anime business. (See ANIMEANIME! site if you can read Japanese)

Again, putting high prices is NOT our intention. Since the market is small and we wish to have fans watch our shows in good quality, we need to put some higher prices compared to traditional US anime products. If you like one of our titles, please tell your friends about how you love it."

[Necron_99]

If the companies can't make an official release over here in time, i.e. taking a Godawful 3-5 years, or not at all, then screw them.

The fan community will take care of themselves like they have in the past.

QFT!

[sketchley]

My two cents.

For those of you saying that fans should be patient and just wait for the shows to be released how about this argument. Would you buy a car from Toyota, Nissan, Honda, Subaru, etc. if you knew that it was a two to three year old model from Japan? Would you buy electronics or computers from Japan that are three years old? No you would not. It's strange that a country that whole economy is focused on exports cannot do the same with it's entertainment media (anime, drama and movies) during a time when they have become very popular around the world.

Again, if you are to make comparisons, do it with like products.

For your information, there are many, many car and consumer electronics (I would say many and most) made in Japan ONLY for the Japanese audience. There are many car and consumer electronics made by Japanese companies (not necessarily manufactured in Japan) tailor made for the export market.

Example: the last 4 mobile phones I purchased have menus in both Japanese and English. My MP3 player is the same. Do any of the personal electronics that you have purchased from a Japanese company have menus in both Japanese and English? Or is it English and Spanish only? Or even English only?

Rant about flawed arguements aside, have a look at how domestic shows in your country are exported to Japan. How many shows are simutaneously broadcast? How many shows take years to come? How many shows never come? Case in point: CSI Miami just started two months ago. How long has that show been airing in North America?

Lastly, you are arguing that the entire world must have homogeneus entertainment. I, for one, do not want that, as my mores and whims differ from, oh, 99.999999% of the rest of the population of Earth. (And that still leaves about 6,700 (give or take a hundred) that have exactly the same mores and whims as I.)

[Mr March]

Some more relevant news for this discussion, courtesy of ANN:

http://www.animenewsnetwork.com/convention...icv2/whitepaper

The first annual ICv2 Conference on Anime and Manga began with Milton Griepp, the president of the ICv2 retailer information website, presenting a white paper on the current state of the Japanese popular culture industry in the United States. Over the last several years, his company has been collecting statistics about trends affecting anime and manga in America, and has published some of the figures in the Guides to Anime and Manga for retailers, which it annually publishes. This is the first time, however, that these figures have been released to a general audience.

Before introducing the statistical portion of the paper, Griep went over the history of Japanese comics and animation in North America — from the first anime of the 1960s, through such turning points as the proliferation of VHS releases of anime in the late 1990s, Tokyopop's 2002 introduction of "authentic manga," the increase in the number of manga publishers, and finally, the expansion of anime-related games, action figures, apparel, and collectibles.

According to ICv2 research, the market for manga in the United States stood at US$200 million last year, up from US$175 million in 2005 and US$135 million in 2004. In 2002, when ICv2 first began to assemble these figures, the same market was estimated at US$60 million, which jumped to US$100 million the next year.

For the same period, sales of anime DVDs (not box office takes of anime shown in theaters or any revenue from the broadcast of anime on television) actually decreased from US$550 million in 2003 to US$400 million for last year. Sell-through numbers for other years were US$450 million in 2005 and US$500 million in 2004 and 2002.

The trend for the number of anime DVDs released in America per year has followed a similar pattern. This figure rose from 439 in 2001 to 562 (2002), 727 (2003), and 733 (2004), before it crested at 756 in 2005. The next year, it dropped to 617, and for 2007, is estimated at somewhat over five hundred. The effect of Geneon withdrawing from the market was a factor in the decrease, but only one, along with overall consolidation in the industry and reduction of output.

Griepp noted, though, that sales figures for home versions of anime released in theaters have not been following the dynamics of the rest of the anime market, and are actually quite healthy. Similarly, for anime on television, there were five channels that aired a total of 18 anime series in 2002, compared to 11 channels and 38 separate titles this year.

On the manga side of the industry, the pattern has been radically different. ICv2 projects that 1,468 individual volumes of manga will be released by the close of this year, and American manga companies are expecting to publish 1,731 manga volumes in 2008. This number has grown from 1,088 in 2005 and 1,208 last year. Of the manga or manga-style comics published in English, in the first 11 months of the year, 1,086 (82%) originated in Japan, 146 (11%) in Korea, and 88 (7%) in the US or elsewhere in the world. At the same time, the amount of shelf space available for manga at retailers has began to slow down. Potentially, in ICV2's estimation, this will contribute to a situation where some manga will only be distributed via direct sale, bypassing bookstores entirely.

As both the industry and fans look to 2008, Griepp offered some of his thoughts on the immediate future of Japanese popular culture products in America. In his words, anime is now facing a "best and worst of times" kind of situation. Market penetration is excellent, and there are more licensed products being sold for different properties than ever before, but the market for DVD sales is steadily declining. This decline is driven by a contradiction, as fans demand the kind of season-set pricing that is now commonplace for American television series, but the inherent costs of licensing, producing, and dubbing anime make this difficult. How to compete with online downloads of fansubs remains a major question for the industry, and declining sales across the home entertainment market mean that American anime companies often cannot afford to engage in experiments that may not be successful. Griepp also criticized Japanese anime production companies for continuing to insist on pricing many licenses without taking into account the actual potential of these series in the current U.S. environment.

The biggest question that Griepp thinks is currently facing the industry has to do with whether the core of American anime fans will disappear. He does not think so, at least not in the short run, but nonetheless, the current business model of selling anime is being challenged, and will have to change.

The manga market is still expanding. The biggest issue that will have to dealt with is whether manga published in the United States can continue to attract readers in different demographics. He particularly noted the efforts that some of the publishers are now launching to attract adult customers.

At this point, Griepp introduced the next panel, which turned into a spirited discussion between such industry hard-hitters as 4Kids president Al Kahn, FUNimation Entertainment CEO Gen Fukunaga, and ANN's own Chris Macdonald, on how toy, game, videogame, and anime companies can best work to attract the "otaku generation."

[Warmaker]

It doesn't surprise me that manga is doing well. I see the large section in stores like Barnes & Noble with a bunch of people browsing or reading manga in those ailes. IMO, just as busy in the manga aisles as the periodicals section. I'm figuring it'll settle down a bit, but should still do ok. I'm happy these days to get manga from a major chain like Barnes & Noble than searching high and low through specific shops for them like I did in the 90s, pursuing titles like Appleseed, GitS, Gunsmith Cats, etc. The selection these days is immense compared to back then.

And I still remember my good friend's comments about manga back in the mid 90s: "Why are you paying for a comic that hasn't even been colored?"

I'm still paying for it and following it. My old faithful line, Blade of the Immortal, is still alive and kickin'! I'd done the same with Kosuke Fujishima's AMG. I love how his artwork progressed, but we're really stretching that storyline these days

[azrael]

Again, if you are to make comparisons, do it with like products.

For your information, there are many, many car and consumer electronics (I would say many and most) made in Japan ONLY for the Japanese audience. There are many car and consumer electronics made by Japanese companies (not necessarily manufactured in Japan) tailor made for the export market. *snip*

Lastly, you are arguing that the entire world must have homogeneus entertainment. I, for one, do not want that, as my mores and whims differ from, oh, 99.999999% of the rest of the population of Earth. (And that still leaves about 6,700 (give or take a hundred) that have exactly the same mores and whims as I.)

sketchley, one thing to keep in mind is, many people don't get this. I have noted this on another forum where this discussion is going on. Some things that work for American culture doesn't work for Asian culture(s) and vice versa. Having multiple languages on media or a device is great, but it will find little use if the target consumer can't understand those other languages. Do the Japanese have any use for French, German, Chinese, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Russian? Probably not. Many shows on the Japanese airwaves are not originally intended for these audiences. Why do I want to broadcast an Indian show to South Africans? Or a Russian show to Brazilians? Satellite TV is designed for viewers, outside of their country of origin, to watch programming in their native language and watch programming that relates to them, not for everybody to watch.

Power Rangers is adapted for the US audience from its Sentai origins because the mannerisms and many other things would just fly over the kids' heads, including the Japanese dialog. In that instance, many people would just stop watching because they don't understand.

Concerning the 2 industry replies:

Again, they mention some blame is placed on the Japanese licensors. The amount they pay for licenses has to be offset and ventures into other distribution venues are too risky.

[chrono]

When did people steal when recording off their TV? If he's hosting it, he's still sharing it just the same... just using a different media. You can say "that's illegal!" all you want, but it's a silly law that's hardly enforced.

Your argument is ONLY valid if your recordings don't step out the door or transferred to the computer and then hosted on the Internet, and then it fails because it's become the typical 'entitlement' one. You may feel that it's a silly law, but it doesn't mean that it's to be ignored. It's like complaining about getting a ticket for jay-walking in front of a cop driving down the street!

-----

@Mr March, That's a neat article, but it doesn't really get into the specifics of the debate that would valid some things. The increase of fan-subbers during those years(sure it's a floating number and somewhat difficult to find), new season licensed and older animes licensed, prices charged, and fans ratings per anime genre.

But at least they didn't have the mega drop that manga did! I do wish that they would stop doom saying the situation though. Yes it's hard out there, but it doesn't mean the end!

[sketchley]

For the same period, sales of anime DVDs (not box office takes of anime shown in theaters or any revenue from the broadcast of anime on television) actually decreased from US$550 million in 2003 to US$400 million for last year. Sell-through numbers for other years were US$450 million in 2005 and US$500 million in 2004 and 2002.

Going by this information, http://www.hackingnetflix.com/2006/12/dvd_sales_expec.html , the total DVD sales were 23.4 to 23.6 billion USD expected for this year and next year. I'm not sure if this is only within the USA, or includes nearby areas such as Canada. (Though, it is about half of the total world sales, which I found at a couple of sites, mentioned to be at 50 billion USD in 2009.)

Anime in North America is definitely niche. Niche generally means pricy.

Nevertheless, there are some good points in the last few articles, and it looks like the concensious that we are getting is:

in general, piracy (fansubbing), though promoting some anime sales in a few limited cases, is illegal.

the (USA) distributors need to rethink their business strategy

Japanese production companies probably should reconsider their licensing fee structure.

anime fans should get satellites to view anime as they are aired in Japan

Azrael, part of me would like to debate further on languages other than Japanese and English and their availability/use in Japan, but as your point is supporting the point I was trying to make, doing so would only dilute things further.

[Duke Togo]

This decline is driven by a contradiction, as fans demand the kind of season-set pricing that is now commonplace for American television series, but the inherent costs of licensing, producing, and dubbing anime make this difficult.

Maybe they should stop dubbing...

[Warmaker]

Maybe they should stop dubbing...

Yeah. Subtitles I think would be just much faster for releases. Besides, I've always been a subtitled fan over dubbed.

[sketchley]

I agree. It's faster, cheaper (don't have to hire a bunch of actors nor rent time in a studio), and the audience is less likely to complain about acting - which is entirely subjective, as the Japanese voice actors may or may not be skilled in the first place.

[Duke Togo]

I agree. It's faster, cheaper (don't have to hire a bunch of actors nor rent time in a studio), and the audience is less likely to complain about acting - which is entirely subjective, as the Japanese voice actors may or may not be skilled in the first place.

True, but the english voice actors almost always put out a sub-par performance.

[azrael]

But then we get to the argument, why do I want to read subtitles when I'm watching something? Which leads us to the dub/sub debate, which isn't the point.

The decline in DVD sales has been coming since the rise of digital distribution. The same happened to CDs when digital distribution bursted on the scene. The computer is coming in as a multimedia platform. What once was a tool, is now coming into the living room and a one-stop gaming machine, recording device, media player, etc. Whether or not the industry realizes this is something I can't say.

[Warmaker]

The media does know about the importance of computers for daily life has increased. Tons of houses have 1, compared to say, 12-15 years ago. It's just they've been trying to fight the new technology and advancements. The record industry is a great example of it, treating the 'net like it's the apocalypse. Someone brought up earlier in this thread how Hollywood viewed the then-new dilemna of people recording shows on VHS being illegal decades ago.

Some seem to view the 'net and recording devices (CD/DVD burners, or whatever you can store the files on) as their kryptonite.

Screw 'em all to hell. It's a ship I would like to witness sinking.

Edited December 8, 2007 by Warmaker

[Roy Focker]

as fans demand the kind of season-set pricing that is now commonplace for American television series, but the inherent costs of licensing, producing, and dubbing anime make this difficult. How to compete with online downloads of fansubs remains a major question for the industry, and declining sales across the home entertainment market mean that American anime companies often cannot afford to engage in experiments that may not be successful

Highlighted the parts I found interesting.

Notice he includes Dudding cost and then talks about competing with online fansubs.

Isn't that a problem right there? Maybe people aren't waiting for dubs before they obtain anime. The fact that fansubs can get out fast and be of fair quality says that the standard model is to slow. If American anime companies dropped dub versions couldn't they compete at a faster pace? Yes there are some people (I call them retarded) who prefer dubs but you only need dubs for kiddie friendly anime. If people are downloading fansubs then they'll buy anime without dubs. I wonder if making sure there is a dub is more to support VO actors then it is to serve the buyer. If your a VO actor their isn't much work for you. Big celebrities are doing all the big budget CGI films. You gotta make due without a big movie star name and get steady work from anime dubs. If American Anime Companies cut down on dubs. It would decrease the time anime gets to you and put a bunch of no talents hacks in the poor house. They'll rather keep the status quo and support their own then to give the customer what they want.

[azrael]

The media does know about the importance of computers for daily life has increased. Tons of houses have 1, compared to say, 12-15 years ago. It's just they've been trying to fight the new technology and advancements.

Whether or not the know wasn't my point. They do know. The problem is do they understand the impact it has. They need to think more than just DVDs/BluRay/HD-DVD. No one format really stands out.

[yellowlightman]

Or maybe just save the dubs for a later release.

Do a cheaper subtitled-only release a few months after the show airs in Japan, and you'd have a product that people might actually want to buy instead of downloading the fansub.

[sketchley]

If I remember correctly (tried looking for figures but couldn't find any in a limited search), dubs outsell subs. However, I fully agree that dubs are not needed in all cases. Looking at it from the Japanese entertainment market - a few shows are imported from overseas (Korea, Taiwan, USA, etc.). The vast majority of those, which are broadcast on TV, are subbed only. There are even cases of movies, which are usually broadcast with both a Japanese and original language soundtrack, being broadcast only in the native language with Japanese subtitles. In other cases, I have seen the main language dubbed into Japanese, with any secondary languages not dubbed, the original dub retained, and subtitles added. (CSI: Miami - all the English is dubbed into Japanese, the Spanish is not, and subtitled instead. Which leads for a bit of jarring voice changes for the actors!)

So what's my point? I agree that companies should make subs available moreoften and quicker than dubs. But having said that, my stance on instant availability remains unchanged. For those arguing that releases should be concurrent, let's take a look at Kissdum. By rights that should have been a sure-fire hit. However, after 3 or 4 episodes, it all fell off a cliff into a deep abyss. Now, if an English distributor had invested heavily in the series, they would have lost big. Is the cautious approach of anime importers not validated by that?

[Max Jenius]

I'd buy anime if it were simply subbed and cheap. I don't care much for extras so...

[chrono]

Or maybe just save the dubs for a later release.

Kinda like how they are now?

But seriously though. Unless you are already a fan of anime, a lack of dubs would definitely continue the revenue drops because you would see fewer people buying buying localized anime versions and even then DL's would be hard pressed to WANT to change because it's "Free!".

Besides a company already brought that up at a CON and it WILDLY backfired on the company's President. Who was very embarrassed by it.

[Duke Togo]

I'd buy anime if it were simply subbed and cheap. I don't care much for extras so...

QFT, and I'd wager a majority of us would as well. If this seems obvious to most of us, how come they don't get it?

[chrono]

QFT, and I'd wager a majority of us would as well. If this seems obvious to most of us, how come they don't get it?

Oh the Localization company's get this. But the subs would have to nearly double in volume in order for the company's to see the same profits and the market is way to much of a niche for that to happen easily!

[Mr March]

This may make me sound like an ass, but at the risk of a little cred I'd be more than happy to see the anime market contract to the size and demand of the current foreign film market if...IF it meant faster, cheaper releases of anime internationally. I do enjoy a GOOD anime dub, but good anime dubs are so rare their overall value, all things considered, is very small. I wouldn't lament the loss of the one or two dubs I enjoy if it meant faster and cheaper availability of ALL the other anime I own.

None of the foreign film I watch is dubbed and those rare few films that are dubbed never see use of the dub track. Like foreign film, I've just gotten used to watching anime subbed and don't even miss dubs all that much anymore.