The Transformers 2 Thread--A Michael Bay thread

[grss1982]

So uhmmmm...Michael Bay managed to get backing from the U.S. military again?

Lets see now...I see AH-64 Apache and some UH-60 Blackhawks....anything else I'm missing? An Aircraft Carrier perhaps?

[azrael]

An Aircraft Carrier perhaps?

Didn't they mention that in web clip.....

[taksraven]

I just want to see Megan Fox out of her skimpy jeans.

Ugh, have you seen her tats, eeewwwww.

Taksraven

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Audi R8.....BARRICADE?!

[kaiotheforsaken]

Seems weird to switch it up since he was missing from the final battle in the first one, so he was assumed alive. Still I suppose if Bumblebee can swap his form on the fly anyone could. I like the car, so as long as it and its bot mode get some decent screen time I wont mind.

[big F]

Looks like Barricade to me.

As long as they all get more screen time I'm O.K. Maybe some of the ultra close up shaky cam thing could be dispensed with. althouth thats what Mr Bay is all about. I don't mind the slow it down watch it from several angels thing he does.

Although whats with the name "Revenge of the Fallen" Who does he think he is George Lucas.

Maybe thats how Hasbro are gonna get the Starwars TF line to fit in.

Edited January 19, 2009 by big F

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

TF2 Arcee component Edited January 21, 2009 by Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0

[RavenHawk]

TF2 Arcee component

It looks like a fairly complete even mix of a Suzuki B-King and a Yamaha V-Max...

Which is perfect for my tastes. I love it.

[CoryHolmes]

I'd rather have Devistator as the first combiner for the movies...

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I'd rather have Devistator as the first combiner for the movies...

1st piece/component?

There is a $99 combiner already in the Target computer system too.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

TF2 Robo-Q toys

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

TF2: Starscream, more images!

Human Alliance:" Bumblebee W/Articulated Sam Mini-Figure!

TF1 Movie Starscream toy vs TF2 Starscream toy:

Edited January 25, 2009 by Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0

[taksraven]

Man, people whined about Beast Wars when it came out (not me, I loved it), but this movie series really sucks and is insulting.

Taksraven

[Fit For Natalie]

Insulting to who?

[VFTF1]

Insulting to who?

Oh, don't pick fights with Taks I know what he means (I think).

Best thing instead of rehashing the "OMG WHAT IS THIS!?" era of dissilussionment that visited many TF fan boards back in 07, I think we just need to accept that for various reasons - this is what the Movie designs and toys and characters look like.

I enjoyed the first film for what it was, and appreciate the nods to G1, particularly Peter Cullen. I will likely enjoy this next film.

Do I think it's as cool as G1? No. Do I think it's as cool as Beast Wars? No. Do I think it's better then another season of Energon/Cybertron/Armada: YES.

Do I want to buy the toys? No.

Am I happy that other than the Movie line, we have Masterpiece, Encore and Animated? Yes.

I think there's no point in getting into a hissy fit about it either way. I mean - HasTak are pretty good about diversifying this brand so everyone finds what they love in the mythology for themselves and can ignore the other stuff.

Pointing out opinions and differences is cool - but no need to call people on their views: the pie is big - everyone can enjoy their own piece

Pete

[taksraven]

Oh, don't pick fights with Taks I know what he means (I think).

Pointing out opinions and differences is cool - but no need to call people on their views: the pie is big - everyone can enjoy their own piece

Pete

Yes and no. I couldn't really care about how canonical the movie series is, but what I *really* miss that they managed to get right with a show like Beast Wars was the quality of the writing.

I think that the movie (esp the characters) was underwritten and weak. Yes, I know that is all we are likely to get from Bruckheimer and Bay, but I still think that a great opportunity was missed, especially with the budget they had.

Taksraven

[big F]

I think that the movie (esp the characters) was underwritten and weak. Yes, I know that is all we are likely to get from Bruckheimer and Bay, but I still think that a great opportunity was missed, especially with the budget they had.

Thats basically what I thought. I have most of Bay and Bruckheimers films and the style they give is all there, but the could have done more with the script. after all most of the people who saw it weather 9 years old or 35 are into one thing "robots" so an inteligent script would not have been miss-understood by them.

That and the shaky cam rediculously close close ups things and you'd have an outstanding film.

Much in the same way that Jurassic Park broke the mold on CGI tech but at the same time just threw the existing story in the trash Transformers has done the same. They both did well at the box office and both spawned sequels.

[CoryHolmes]

they managed to get right with a show like Beast Wars was the quality of the writing.

To be honest, though, Beast Wars had the time to develop the characters and their own individual quirks as well as advancing the plot. I'm a huge BW fan, but you have to rememeber that TV series' just have more time than movies.

That and the shaky cam rediculously close close ups things and you'd have an outstanding film.

And yet people praise BSG for just that reason... [/bSG anti-fanism]

[taksraven]

To be honest, though, Beast Wars had the time to develop the characters and their own individual quirks as well as advancing the plot. I'm a huge BW fan, but you have to rememeber that TV series' just have more time than movies.

What do you mean? A lot of films have an extremely long time between initial development and actual production. I was reading the other day how Wall-E was first proposed back in '93. And if you want to make a good film you take the time.

(actually, a lot of films are overwritten as well, how many movies have we heard of going through umpteen billion scripts before shooting begins, and often the writing process continues while a film is still being shot......)

Taksraven

(IMO, Waspinator RULED Beast Wars, followed by Dinobot MkI, then Rattrap. That show was so funny but serious at the same time, the perfect formula)

[RavenHawk]

What do you mean? A lot of films have an extremely long time between initial development and actual production. I was reading the other day how Wall-E was first proposed back in '93. And if you want to make a good film you take the time.

(actually, a lot of films are overwritten as well, how many movies have we heard of going through umpteen billion scripts before shooting begins, and often the writing process continues while a film is still being shot......)

Taksraven

(IMO, Waspinator RULED Beast Wars, followed by Dinobot MkI, then Rattrap. That show was so funny but serious at the same time, the perfect formula)

Beast Wars really didn't do much for me, though I loved Beast Machines (I suspect I'm in the minority on this one). Cheetor RULED! Wish Transtech had come out, with that version of Cheetor. Well, at least we get to see it a little in the Trnasformers Club comics.

[taksraven]

Beast Wars really didn't do much for me, though I loved Beast Machines (I suspect I'm in the minority on this one). Cheetor RULED! Wish Transtech had come out, with that version of Cheetor. Well, at least we get to see it a little in the Trnasformers Club comics.

You probably are in the minority with Beast Machines, but each to their own. Its just a pity that it had to be the end of the traditional TF continuity and there has been no effort since then to revive it.

(Just for the record, the Beast Wars writing team was dropped for Beast Machines as far as I know and that got a lot of people pissed off. I've watched some but I found it rather dull.)

Taksraven

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I definitely agree that the movie could have been written better. There was more than enough time to kill the corny hacker subplot of TF1. It wasn't a neccessary subplot. I did enjoy TF1, I thought it was a great movie, but it wasn't perfect. The small things add up. I'm not talking about how it differs from G1, to be honest, I didn't even care about that aspect as time went on, as the movie is a different continuity just like all the other TF series we have had these past years.

I didn't mind some of the comedy, Bernie Mac's part was funny, and some of the other jokes, but I also detested the forced comedy in the scene where the Autobots hide from Sam's parents, around his house.

I do hope that this new movie has more focus on the robots, less useless/corny jokes, and also, more focused camera work. Bay broke the 180 rule and tended to go back and forth in many shots, and that annoys me. I hope that this time around, the corniness of the jokes doesn't tarnish the seriousness of the movie.

[CoryHolmes]

What do you mean? A lot of films have an extremely long time between initial development and actual production. I was reading the other day how Wall-E was first proposed back in '93. And if you want to make a good film you take the time.

By that I meant "screen time". Beast Wars had three seasons of 52 half-hour episodes, giving it a rough total of 26 hours with which to introduce characters, plots, etc. The Baymovie had 143 minutes, or two and a half hours with which to do the same.

Not that I'm defending the movie as a masterpiece of anything other than boom, bang, and esplod-a-lot, but it's a bit unfair to compare it to a longer TV series.

[VFTF1]

There was more than enough time to kill the corny hacker subplot of TF1

See - almost everyone can agree that TF the Movie could have been "written better" - but then, when a concrete proposal of what to cut comes up - my reaction is:

What!? No way:) The corny hacker subplot might have been pointless, but the corny hacker was priceless. Get of my Granma's carpet! My granma don't like no police on her carpet! AHHH!! (crash! smash through the window) "I'M JUST A COUSIN!" "She did! She did! Don't talk to me CRIMINAL!" "I ate ALL THE DONHUTS!"

Just thinking about it puts a smile on my face - and to tell the truth - this kind of movie needs to have stuff like that. Honestly, what I feared the most is that it would be like the Dreamwave comic - which was just sooo full of pathos. Ooooo look! BIG robots - and not silly robots but really HEAVY AND BIG ones and we're going to launch nuclear missiles and quote the Movie with lines about the end being now and so forth and so on...

I dunno - I agree, the Movie could have been written better - but how? What would you have changed? Me? Heck - the only thing I would have changed is HOW they got to the city.

I think getting the TFs into the city was a must - to feature a city battle.

But instead of "Autobots - let's take the Allspark into the City and then have a helicopter piloted by humans recover it - because -you know - not only will we endanger a city full of people, but the Decepticons can't fly - and Starscream is too slow and will never catch up with that helicopter - so the allspark will be in safe hands - like th city"...

We should have had something like this: The Autobots decide to HIDE the Allspark in the city USING their ability to transform and blend in.

Assuming that there would be some way to mask its' signal - this might be plausible.

Another possibility would be that the humans evacuate the Allspark from the Hoover dam (not trusting the Autobots enough to give it to Optimus Prime/Bumblebee - they insist on flying it out in a helicopter). Starscream intercepts the helicopter and shoots it down OVER THE CITY.

It crashes into the city thereby drawing both factions into the city for a battle. The Autobots decide to finish the Decepticons in the city, so Sam is given the task of taking the Allspark to another helicopter which will (hopefully) fly it out.

I dunno - a million different possibilities to get to the city battle - this is something I would have fixed.

But the hacker? He's soo funny

Pete

[taksraven]

By that I meant "screen time". Beast Wars had three seasons of 52 half-hour episodes, giving it a rough total of 26 hours with which to introduce characters, plots, etc. The Baymovie had 143 minutes, or two and a half hours with which to do the same.

Not that I'm defending the movie as a masterpiece of anything other than boom, bang, and esplod-a-lot, but it's a bit unfair to compare it to a longer TV series.

Sorry, you confused me, I thought you meant development time. Yes, what you said makes sense now.

Taksraven

[edwin3060]

Starcream is just screaming out for a SK re-design, just like his F-15 form did!

[Renato]

Bay broke the 180 rule and tended to go back and forth in many shots, and that annoys me.

Oh yeah, that was awful, awful directing. Very unprofessional. It pretty much ruined the climax of the movie: if you look at the editing of the scene in which Sam runs up and puts the cube in Megatron's chest.... He's running away from Prime, but as he lifts the cube up, he is FACING Prime, with Megatron coming up BEHIND him... So actually for a second it looks like he did in fact put the cube in Prime's chest instead of Megatron's.

Not that I can blame him, hell, I'd sacrifice myself if subjected to such bad editing/directing.

[UN_MARINE]

By that I meant "screen time". Beast Wars had three seasons of 52 half-hour episodes, giving it a rough total of 26 hours with which to introduce characters, plots, etc. The Baymovie had 143 minutes, or two and a half hours with which to do the same.

that's not a very convincing argument for me. most pilot episodes run for an hour or less & they still manage to give considerably more character development than the 2-hour movie.

even the Oddparents 15 minute pilot gave us more characterization. actually, pick any episode.

terrible writing. that's all there is to it.

that's what caused all the plot-holes, "Ebay", camera work, forced jokes, hacker subplot, sector 7 subplot,

insignificant robot dying from getting split in the gut & the city fight.

and my favorite, why would they/anybody need the glasses if they could track the allspark's energy signal in the 1st place?

Starscream didn't have the glasses, but he found Megs. and Megs knows where the allspark is since he's been in cold storage right next to it.

what are the glasses for again? oh right. it ties in the badly written teenager lead. ok, so this one has an excuse

...they could have done the army thing, alien robot thing, then gone straight to the sector 7 thing, then to Hoover dam & the city fight.

see? no hackers!

[Fit For Natalie]

Yes, I know that is all we are likely to get from Bruckheimer and Bay, but I still think that a great opportunity was missed, especially with the budget they had.

Taksraven

Jerry Bruckheimer had nothing to do with this movie.

Regarding the budget, from what I heard, $150 mil is considered to be relatively low budget for an effects-driven film. ILM must have cut a deal given this was a Dreamworks Spielberg-backed film, and indeed, what we saw in terms of robot CG was most likely all that they could afford.

and my favorite, why would they/anybody need the glasses if they could track the allspark's energy signal in the 1st place?

Starscream didn't have the glasses, but he found Megs. and Megs knows where the allspark is since he's been in cold storage right next to it.

what are the glasses for again? oh right. it ties in the badly written teenager lead. ok, so this one has an excuse

Banachek: President Hoover had the dam built around it. Four football fields thick of concrete, a perfect way to hide its energy from being detected by anyone or any alien species on the outside.

Starscream didn't magically divine the location of Megatron and the All Spark. Right after Banachek's exposition, Frenzy finds the All Spark and contacts Starscream. The Cube was never moved. Megatron tracked it as it fell on Earth, and himself crashed into the Artic circle. Megatron inscribed the coordinates of the Cube onto the glasses when he was briefly reactivated by Archibald Witwicky.

[taksraven]

Jerry Bruckheimer had nothing to do with this movie.

Meh. Bruckheimer, Bay, ghost of Don Simpson, its all the same to me....

Taksraven

[VFTF1]

Regarding the budget, from what I heard, $150 mil is considered to be relatively low budget for an effects-driven film. ILM must have cut a deal given this was a Dreamworks Spielberg-backed film, and indeed, what we saw in terms of robot CG was most likely all that they could afford.

This is actually very possible. Considering that the effects in this film were revolutionary- perhaps it made sense for ILM to charge less and use a Spielberg film as a great advertisement for their own advanced abilities in the field of FX?

All guess work of course.

As for the plot - I think Mikheala and Giant Robots were basically supposed to make you forget there was one

Pete

[taksraven]

As for the plot - I think Mikheala and Giant Robots were basically supposed to make you forget there was one

Pete

I think you meant to say there wasn't one.

Taksraven

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I dunno - I agree, the Movie could have been written better - but how? What would you have changed? Me? Heck - the only thing I would have changed is HOW they got to the city.

By eliminating the BS(useless humor, don't get me wrong, I loved some of the humorous aspects but hated some of them too, the grandma part you mentioned was funny but other parts like the autobots trying to hide in a neighborhood, Prime saying "my bad"), focusing on better camera work, focusing more on the robots(good god this is a movie about them right?, and more.

Not that I'm defending the movie as a masterpiece of anything other than boom, bang, and esplod-a-lot, but it's a bit unfair to compare it to a longer TV series.

You guys are arguing over different things. You are arguing about character development, the other is arguing about the serious tone of the movie being diminished by writing which would have been better considering the big budget and time taken. Yes you cannot expect more character development in a movie than in a TV series, but yes the movie could have been written much better.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Human Alliance Bumblebee; out of box!

[VFTF1]

With all this talk about the past movie and toys -- returning to the subjecto of the new movie: are we allowed to post semi-spoilers that have been announced on other sites? Or are we supposed to maintain this as spoiler free?

I just wanted to give my thoughts about the 40+ Transformers that are supposedly going to be in this film and say that I think that sounds awesome! Also, I hope thatthe news about Starscream being more G1 like means that not only will he get lots of character development, but that the movie in general will focus on the Transformers and things from their point of view and not so much on the "humans awe struck at meeting robots on Earth" angle which was of course necesary in the first film and finally I wonder what Bay's idea of a scene that "the fans are gonna love" means? Probably something very much out of the movie? Something iconic? The Touch playing in the background? What could he possibly imagine that "the fans will love?"

Just wondering.

Pete

Edited January 28, 2009 by VFTF1