The Transformers 2 Thread--A Michael Bay thread

[sidearmsalpha]

Watched it yesterday.

I really wanted to like it more, but the comic relief was way overdone and too inappropriate many times (the RC truck-bot humping comes to mind). I didn't care at all for the twins or "ghetto-bots" is what I'm calling them. Very annoying characters. Their personalities were just too exagerrated and not how you would expect Autobots to act. I understand, from the first movie, that all the Transformers learned of Earth's cultures from the Internet, but I would hardly believe that they acted this silly before they arrived on Earth. It seems to me that, these days, Hollywood is trying too hard to appeal to every demographic. It reminds me of that cutaway in an episode of Family Guy where these two black guys are watching these two animal characters in a family movie talking in slang and one of the guys replies that "Hollywood gets us". I found myself rooting for Devastator when he sucked one of them up. I was hoping he would end up bits of scrap and that the other one would get stepped on. I can't believe the red one was able to inflict damage to Devastator from the inside. Lame. On that page, the RC truck bot humor was overdone, too, with a personality for that character that was just too uncharacteristic of a Decepticon.

And what was the point of the undercover ice cream truck mode?! Pointless! It shows that the Transformers can upgrade to better vehicles as that one did later on but choose not to?!

Sam's parents getting kidnapped also seemed pointless. I don't recall the Decepticons using them to get to Sam. Did I miss something? What was the point of having them show up later on in the movie?!

Except for the fight in the forest, the action scenes were mindless and not very well done, and I felt more grief when Prime died in the animated movie than he did here. It just wasn't as dramatic.

Watching this movie reinforced my opinion even more of how much I really hate the very alien-like designs of all the Decepticons and alot of the Autobots and how exagerrated their heads are, especially the twins, who had the lamest robot heads. Before I watched it, I was expecting to watch it more than once, but now, there's no point in watching it again.

[Fit For Natalie]

True, it's a business. But in my field we have to look at everything as a art scholar or academic viewpoint, to get the maximun out of the artists involved. Lets look at Batman. It's Batman, it's a franschise, originally made for kids like Transformers, and it's a business. Yet Nolan managed to turn it into a quality, mature storytelling and as art in the film sense, without any of the lame comical features in Transformers.

I mean "Serious Business" as in the sarcastic internet term. "Serious Business" as in taking something not so serious, such as a hobby, too seriously.

Something you should always consider about Transformers is until very recently, toys came first in Transformers, and then fiction was written around them. Transformers is unashamedly commercial, since pretty much all of its fiction exists to sell toys or to promote the brand. Essentially in Hasbro's viewpoint, the movies are there for massive brand awareness that most other toylines from other competitors cannot hope to match. It's to prove that they have the franchises and the characters to take the fight to big guns such as Batman and Spider-Man, and at least with Transformers, they've proven that.

WOW.....20% on Rotten Tomatoes. I think I'm gonna pass.

I don't see how there can be ANY redeeming qualities in this one.

It ain't that bad. Frankly, the critics are out with knives for Bay personally. I don't like Bay much, but I think the criticism over ROTF is getting really ridiculous.

And what was the point of the undercover ice cream truck mode?! Pointless! It shows that the Transformers can upgrade to better vehicles as that one did later on but choose not to?!

Because it's funny, amusing and makes for one of the greatest vehicle modes in Transformers, ever. Hasbro pretty much said they made it because it such an off-the-wall concept.

[sidearmsalpha]

What did you guys think about the Decepticons having hatchlings? I don't see why this was necessary unless this was something they came up with after the All Spark was destroyed, but since they were hatching from where the Fallen has been hiding out, it seems like this is how Decepticons are typically born?

Man, I hope they don't go with this idea in a sequel. This screams more like Aliens/Species than Transformers now. Even the Fallen bore much of a resemblance to the alien from Species. I guess I can see why there are female Transformers now.

[Chewie]

What did you guys think about the Decepticons having hatchlings? I don't see why this was necessary unless this was something they came up with after the All Spark was destroyed, but since they were hatching from where the Fallen has been hiding out, it seems like this is how Decepticons are typically born?

Man, I hope they don't go with this idea in a sequel. This screams more like Aliens/Species than Transformers now. Even the Fallen bore much of a resemblance to the alien from Species. I guess I can see why there are female Transformers now.

Beast Wars covered this with protoforms. Essentially factionless transformers that were in a state to be turned into either Autobot or Decepticon depending on who "formatted" them first.

[kaiotheforsaken]

Yup, different names for the same basic thing.

[Guest sh002]

damn some of the faces were super horrible. i'd rather have them have humanistic faces. even the typical dog face would have been better.

[peter]

I haven't seen it yet...debating whether to hand over $12 or watch the crappy Russian cam. 20% on Rotten Tomatoes? That's more than I would have given the first movie, which had way too many useless human characters...and that's what I'm hearing about this movie.

Sam's whole dialogue in the first movie was "No! No! No! No! No! No! No!"...how about in this movie?

Edited June 26, 2009 by peter

[David Hingtgen]

"It'll work, it'll work, it'll work".

Anyways---any more/good pics of "as seen on screen" Devastator? His coloring is distinctly different from most early pics and the toys. His face is mostly red, not silver, and Overload has lots of white (maybe even mostly white), not all-red.

[505thAirborne]

I was thinking of going Sunday to see this movie, But I'm getting the impression that its a dud. Do I go see it or just wait for PUBLIC ENEMIES to come out?

[taksraven]

Funny...that's EXACTLY how I felt about the first one.

Clearly, this one ain't gonna be my type of thing.

I don't understand why so many people are saying things like, "sometimes people just want to be entertained, so just turn off your brain and enjoy the movie." Why does a movie have to treat you like a hyperactive ten-year-old in order to be considered "entertaining"?

Nah, the part I find funny is when people are bagging this out because of the lack of characterisation, good dialog or storyline. Surely these deficiencies makes it exactly the same as Transformers G1.

I like TF because of the original three seasons of Beast Wars and I doubt that BW will ever be surpassed. Good action, storylines, characterisation and really funny dialog. Superior stuff. (And anybody who says "truk not munky" needs to grow a brain.)

Taksraven

[sidearmsalpha]

I'd go see Public Enemies instead. I thought the first TF movie was not great, but still good. I admit the arrival of the Autobots scene gave me goosebumps. I was hoping this would be alot better, but turned out worse. I even showed up an hour early for it. Waste of time.

[kaiotheforsaken]

I was thinking of going Sunday to see this movie, But I'm getting the impression that its a dud. Do I go see it or just wait for PUBLIC ENEMIES to come out?

You can't really base your choice to see it based on what other people say. I mean the opinions in this thread alone have been all over the place.

If you at least enjoyed the first but wanted more bot action, I'd say chance it, there has been way worse stuff out this summer. Some of us loved it (myself included) but peoples suggestions are going to be just as varied as their opinions about the movie.

[sidearmsalpha]

Beast Wars covered this with protoforms. Essentially factionless transformers that were in a state to be turned into either Autobot or Decepticon depending on who "formatted" them first.

True, but the protoforms weren't newborn offspring as the hatchlings seem to be. The protoforms had already existed as Transformers before.

[kaiotheforsaken]

Well in Beast Wars it did kinda of seem that way, though in Animated it seemed that they were basically...well baby Transformers.

I read an article on...seibertron I think it was where Bay and the writers asked the Hasbro suits where new Transformers came from and they basically looked at eachother and said, "well, we don't really know". I don't think Bay's interpretation of it is any less valid than the BW or Animated take, and it pretty much falls in line with what exists already.

[Chewie]

True, but the protoforms weren't newborn offspring as the hatchlings seem to be. The protoforms had already existed as Transformers before.

True. Still makes me wonder: if they were transformers before, why were they completely mind wiped while in what was supposed to be a form of stasis? Tigatron was a perfect example of a transformer with neither side interfering and he didn't know who Prime or Megatron any of the rest were. He turned out as a Maximal...but I guess that was just to go along with being a tree hugging hippie. Or did I forget an explanation from the show? =\

Seems (to me at least) that that could be what they were maybe trying to relay in the movie.

[505thAirborne]

You can't really base your choice to see it based on what other people say. I mean the opinions in this thread alone have been all over the place.

If you at least enjoyed the first but wanted more bot action, I'd say chance it, there has been way worse stuff out this summer. Some of us loved it (myself included) but peoples suggestions are going to be just as varied as their opinions about the movie.

Well, maybe I'll go for it. I didn't think I'd like the 1st one but I did, so what the hell, bring on part 2!!!

[Sluff]

I am convinced that the NEST team is what the GI Joe movie should be, modern soldiers with slightly advanced weapons operating covertly around the world. Why can't they scrap this train wreck coming out next month and give Josh and Tyrese the big bucks and make the GI Joe movie right?

[Roy Focker]

GIJOE is the Nest Team after the Autobots share their robotech secrets.

[David Hingtgen]

Awesome quote from a mocking review:

<<<"What is the status of the Transformers at the beginning of the film?"

The Autobots have joined the military to hunt down the Decepticons. We're told the Decepticons are "doing things," but they appear to be hiding peacefully when the Autobots show up and brutally murder them.

What?

Yeah. The Decepticons aren't apparently doing anything, then the Autobots show up, the Decepticons run for their goddamn lives, and the Autobots hunt them down.>>>

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2009/06/bonus_...faqs.php?page=1

[Mog]

Just got back from watching it. And honestly, I really wanted to like the movie.

But the movie left me too disappointed.

The human actors and the dialogue were either cringe-worthy or inappropriately laughable (though the military folk were for the most part solid).

I don't know if it's due to the design of the bots or not, but there were times where I lost track of what exactly was happening during some of the fights. I don't know if it's due to all the shiney silver kibble or not being able to always tell who's firing at who (a nice energy trail for the Transformers' projectiles/bullets might've helped a bit), but it's kinda hard to follow exactly and precisely what's going on in a lot of the fight scenes.

And I've got a nice little message to Michael Bay: PULL THE FRAKKEN CAMERA BACK!!!!!!! A few more mid-fight, wide-angle shots that last longer than a few seconds would have really helped to clear up the confusion that can happen during these scenes.

Also, I'm really not a fan of watching these Transformer fights from the far-too-low perspective of humans. We get it: they're big-ass robots that tower over us. Now can you pull the camera back, or give us a nice clear action shot from above so we can take in the full grandeur of the fights?

Man, I remember all the memorable action sequences from Dark Knight and that legendary opening scene of Nightcrawler absolutely cutting loose in X2, and I think to myself, "Why can't Transformers have a scene like that? Full of energy, gusto, and where you can clearly follow the logic of the action on-screen."

[myk]

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2009/06/bonus_...faqs.php?page=1

That whole bit is hilarious. Are those the same guys that did the "editing room script" for Episode 3? Maybe they hang out together or something, lol...

http://www.the-editing-room.com/revengeofthesith.html

Edited June 27, 2009 by myk

[kaiotheforsaken]

Saw it again with some friends tonight and liked it way better than the first.

The part between Prime's death/rebirth felt way better paced since I wasn't just wanting to see him come back

All my friends enjoyed it too, which was nice. There was definitely stuff I missed the first time that I was able to pick up on this second run through. I'll probably log another few trips at the theater before it leaves.

[dreamweaver13]

Saw it last night. LOVED it. I mean, thoroughly enjoyed, loved, got a thrill out of it. did i dumb myself for this movie? I don't even think so. Did i Bay-ize myself for this movie? well...yeah, probably.

point is, i went into the theater expecting lots of robot fighting sequences, cool sound and FX... basically, the old-school, mind-blowing, child's-eyes-bulging-out-of-its-sockets, popcorn summer flick. and i got it!

i'm not surprised that most people gave negative reviews in other movie review sites... what i'm surprised at is the vehemence, anger and angst that came with them. i think most of them forgot that the Transformers cartoon was initially made for kids of our generation. and when these kids grew up, they felt that the transformers franchise should have grown up with them. but at heart, Transformers: ROTF is still a kid's movie. and i can only imagine how much of an impact it made on the kids of this generation. me, it just felt so good to be a kid again, even for just 2 hours and 45 minutes.

[dreamweaver13]

Saw it again with some friends tonight and liked it way better than the first.

The part between Prime's death/rebirth felt way better paced since I wasn't just wanting to see him come back

All my friends enjoyed it too, which was nice. There was definitely stuff I missed the first time that I was able to pick up on this second run through. I'll probably log another few trips at the theater before it leaves.

same here. i liked it way way better than the first one. pacing's much better, and i didn't feel bored at all with this movie. it didn't feel like 2.45 hours. much of it is the better pacing. and less focus on the humor aspects. (or maybe it's simply because there's no Anthony Anderson in this one. sorry, but he really spoils any movie for me. i abhored all his parts in the first movie; they were just so out of place).

[Mog]

Awesome quote from a mocking review:

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2009/06/bonus_...faqs.php?page=1

Thanks, DH!! That link absolutely had me rolling.

[kaiotheforsaken]

I would agree, there was some comic relief but to me it felt I dunno..right. Especially the antics with Simons and Sam's parents, it was almost a requirement after the first film.

I really have an appreciation for Starscream in this one too, way more in line with how his character is normally.

The twins were more likable the second time around. I don't really subscribe to the whole "Autobots wouldn't act like that" argument I've seen on this and other boards. I mean it's an entire race of machines, much like us, there are bound to be all kinds of personality types/traits or whatnot. Yeah they are a little goofy, but

they showed some guts when helping taking on Devastator.

Prime is easily my favorite character and I really love the amount of screen time he gets.

[taksraven]

Saw it. Meh. Bring in the Beast Wars writers please. As well as some decent actors, and maybe a person who knows how to direct, and then some proper editors, etc.........

Taksraven

[Phyrox]

Awesome quote from a mocking review:

...http://www.toplessrobot.com/2009/06/bonus_...faqs.php?page=1[/url]

That sorta sums up some of the plot troubles.

Here's a question, maybe it's because I had already turned my mind off by the half-way point, but did it ever explain why

The Fallen was sitting on a nearby planet for the last 15,000-odd years doing nothing (I assume) and only waited until now, when one of the Primes is actually on Earth to start getting serious about the whole "matrix of leadership/blowing up the sun" thing? Couldn't he have spent some of that time, I dunno...looking for it? Like I said, maybe this was explained and I just wasn't paying attention to plot points anymore.

[sidearmsalpha]

The twins were more likable the second time around. I don't really subscribe to the whole "Autobots wouldn't act like that" argument I've seen on this and other boards. I mean it's an entire race of machines, much like us, there are bound to be all kinds of personality types/traits or whatnot. Yeah they are a little goofy, but

they showed some guts when helping taking on Devastator.

Yeah, I could see those two hittin' up the clubs on Cybertron. I really doubt that their personalities were as unexpected to demonstrate that Autobots come in diverse personalities. Honestly, is this what kids consider cool nowadays?! Man, I guess I really am old.

[Vepariga]

it was a good movie,but could have been shortened easily, like take out the whole college scene,it was pathetic and pulled every cliche' in the book. aside from that it was really all about primes and bumblebee's fight scenes. 3.5/5

[wolfx]

Just came back from it.

Typical. Hollywood. Trash.

And the worse thing is, all the girls i know absolutely loved it.

Was it because of the "chick-flickness" earlier in the show? I don't know.

Michael Bay's camera work NEEDS work. Srsly. There's too much confusion and difficulty telling who is shooting who or what is happening generally.

THe lines....egads....the lines are horrid.

Optimus Prime again doesn't seem to do much leading for the Autobots....AGAIN, He's just like the most powerful robot amongst them , that's all. And now he's pretty ninja too.

Jetfire....dear Lord why did they have to do that to him.

old but does he need a walking stick? And his death.....seemed pretty nonchalant. I realised robot deaths tend to be like that in this movie franchise.

Wasn't Megs supposed to be destroyed by...oh i dunno....super strong pressure at the depths of the ocean? That's the point of dumping him into the ocean right?

Scene transition was pretty badly done. One minute they were in some european hamlet, next minute they were in some forest.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Awesome quote from a mocking review:

<<<"What is the status of the Transformers at the beginning of the film?"

The Autobots have joined the military to hunt down the Decepticons. We're told the Decepticons are "doing things," but they appear to be hiding peacefully when the Autobots show up and brutally murder them.

What?

Yeah. The Decepticons aren't apparently doing anything, then the Autobots show up, the Decepticons run for their goddamn lives, and the Autobots hunt them down.>>>

http://www.toplessrobot.com/2009/06/bonus_...faqs.php?page=1

That review was HILARIOUS.

Prime is easily my favorite character and I really love the amount of screen time he gets

I love how the focus for this movie was primarily shifted to Prime and his importance. Bumblebee was great in TF1 and he is in ROTF, but most fans wanted to see more of Prime, and to see what he was capable of when he didn't have to hold back for fear of hurting innocent civilians around(like in the city in TF1). In ROTF we got our wish.

it was a good movie,but could have been shortened easily, like take out the whole college scene,it was pathetic and pulled every cliche' in the book. aside from that it was really all about primes and bumblebee's fight scenes. 3.5/5

There really should have been less time spent on the college scenes, and more on the new characters who were barely shown...hell Jetfire plays a part in the movie but it would have been great to see more of him. Definitely one of the more interesting, irate Autobots. Sideswipe was bad ass for 5 minutes and Jolt...barely did anything. Hell Devastator barely did anything.

[BlueMax]

hah.... topless robot has it totally nailed and i couldn't disagree less with his parting shot:

"I am standing directly beneath the enemy's scrotum."

[David Hingtgen]

wolfx---Jetfire rocked *because* he was old. Especially when

he ripped out his own core, to sacrifice himself to help Prime---he probably could have been repaired, but he chose to "make a difference

.

[crasis]

Okay, I've had a few days to process this. I liked it. Sort of.

The 6-year-old kid in me was floored by the amazing fight scenes and robot p0rn (NOT, mind you, the ACTUAL leg-humping robot). The entire movie plays out like a series of money shots with little-to-no foreplay. The special effects are simply the best in the business. This is pure ADD filmmaking for the YouTube age.

The "plot" is a convenient, disjointed and nearly nonexistent mess. Optimus Prime makes the movie, while the other heroes are given BRIEF glory moments (enough to encourage this 31-year-old to run out and buy toys). That's an essential problem with the film - characters are "introduced" and then simply disappear or merely flash on screen in the background later on. Yeah, we definitely get more robot dialog this time (though it's wasted on many nonessential characters), but most Transformers still feel like wallpaper.

The Twins are utterly pointless, but I think people jumping on the "racist" bandwagon have never hung out at a mall food court. These guys are misguided fools trying to emulate Earth youth culture, so having them mimic suburban wannabes doesn't seem offensive to me. In fact, it was oddly poetic when considering the audience around me at the midnight screening.

Awful toilet and sexual humor abound, though the theater was certainly in stitches. Alright, alright. I laughed quite a bit. Devastator is horribly misused, though, and the inclusion of robot testicles just shows how pathetically juvenile Bay's sense of humor is.

Yeah, yeah, it's a movie based on a toy line from the 80's. But I will adamantly defend the original 1986 film, which I would argue still holds up to this day with its entertaining story and lovable characters. Why did I collect the toys in the first place back in the 80s? Because I connected to their personalities. They are more than just "stuff that turns into stuff." Why do Bayformers cease to have identities when in vehicle mode? Why does John Turturro get more screen time than Bumblebee? Hell, why do the Twins get more moments than Bumblebee? :sigh: I would have traded in 90% of Megan Fox's breast jiggle shots for more (quality) Autobot or Decepticon emoting.

But, for me anyways, every facepalm was met with another amazing action shot. I could go on for hours about how incredible the robo eye candy is. Starscream and Megatron have some wonderful scenes together, illustrating their rivalry in a great nod to G1. Soundwave and Ravage are awesome (though they wasted Frank Welker's performance by neglecting to actually VOCODE Soundwave's voice! WTF?). Sideswipe is criminally underused after his breathtaking moment in the opening fight. Jetfire is crotchety and amusing. Hell, even Shia's Sam remains a fun, quirky character. Like that matters. Did I mention how utterly balls-out awesome Optimus Prime is in this?! The movie suffers when he's not on screen.

And, in true fanboy fashion, I will be lining up to see the film again this weekend, despite my issues with it. The IMAX version apparently has 2 MORE MINUTES of PRIME! Killing ^^^^! With blades! The 6-year-old wins.