did your Shin 0A shoulders break?

[do not disturb]

now its up to 7.

FTR, i haven't voted in this poll because i don't own the shin/ghost combo.

i hope the people that own the 0S and 0A are NOT voting in this poll.

[eugimon]

I'm still waiting to see pictures of the breaks.

[Vic Mancini]

I'm still waiting to see pictures of the breaks.

No kidding. Many votes, no pictures.

Waddup with that?

[Sumdumgai]

I haven't voted, since I don't have the 0A Shin. CF here.

[Mowe]

You guys just have to make us open the shoulder up and relive the pain again, don't you....as much as I don't want to rotate the shoulder ever again, here you go.

The two main stress marks (1 & 3) were there when this Shin combo Valk was pulled straight out of the box from Japan. The moment I saw these stress marks, I posted pic on the VF-0S broken thread and I had never touch this Valk again.

Stress mark 2 is something I'd never noticed before (I don't rememebr seeing it the last time...)

So, as I said before, will these shoulders break? likely not because I will not give these stress marks a chance to develop further by transforming or rotating this valk's shoulder again. I am guessing for this reason, we will never know if this Shin version has fixed the problem or not because people with the stress mark are now a lot more careful.

Maybe the question really should have been: how many Shin with stress marks are out there. And people can make up their own mind if this is a problem Valk or not.

Edited September 1, 2007 by Mowe

[do not disturb]

Mowe,

you should get crazy and check the bicep....actually don't.

you'll be even more upset when you see what it looks like in there.

Edited September 1, 2007 by do not disturb

[Mowe]

I know what is happening with the bicep already, and it was shown on my very first original post to the old VF-0 shoulder problem report. This time, I had no guts to disturb it any further. Thanks for the warning though.

Mowe,

you should get crazy and check the bicep....actually don't.

you'll be even more upset when you see what it looks like in there.

Edited September 1, 2007 by Mowe

[eugimon]

gah. thanks for the pics mowe, how about the rest of you guys who voted yes, post up those pics. let's email these to yamato and find out what can be done.

[miriya]

you should definitely check. the rubber ring yamato uses to create friction can have a lot of excess flashing on it, causing stress. the bicep that popped on my cf 0a had this problem and one of the replacement arms I got also had the same problem.

OK people, I just had to check. So I did check. I checked the shoulders and the biceps. I just had to know for sure.

So, what I did find was one, very minor stress mark on the left shoulder which is very small. I am posting images here.

The other shoulder was perfect and both biceps were perfect.

No stress marks on those and no cracks or anything unusual looking.

So, although I did find one minor stress mark (and yes, I did loosen that shoulder a bit because of it), I still retain my original vote of no because my shoulders did not break. And it is not a big enough stress mark for me to consider it a future break.

I am still very happy with this toy(collectors artwork figure or other proper term - I am still on the fence with this issue sqidd - I get your point but am not sure what I want to call these yet. They are pieces of art and they are low production for collectors and not meant to be thrown around like GI Joe but I do indeed play with them even though they do spend much time on display. Does the term "designer toys" fit here? I am not a huge fan of that phrase either. They are not models because I did not glue them together and paint them and they are more durable than models but less durable than a cabbage patch doll. Anyway, it does not bother me whatever people call these. I know some people would call them expensive pieces of plastic crap that should be spent on feeding the starving people all over the world and stopping genocide in darfur, and I do not completely disagree with that, guilty me, guilty me, guilty me, but anyway, I enjoy them as beautiful works of art and brilliant design and engineering and I play with them too. IMO.)

Disassembly Dork: I must tell you though that I am a total moron and I stripped one of the screws!!! I know that it was entirely my fault but I wanted to be gentle with the thing and thought it was turning but then realized that I was not applying enough pressure and that I had nearly stripped most of the screw off. Luckily I was able to just barely fit it back on after taking it off and checking for stress marks and or cracks breaks . That is the last time I open this bird up (hopefully).

Overall, I am glad that I checked so that I know. I am glad that I own this Shoji Kawamori design masterpiece.

[Scream Man]

Ok, see mine has that mark too. but i have transformed this thing close to 25 times now, and it hasnt changed. I think thats just siomewhere that gets that stress mark (Its the exact same on both my arms in the exact same spot). Im certainly not worried about it.

So all you y'yes' voters, have you just been yessing these stress marks?

[miriya]

Hopefully not. The question was if they broke.

[eugimon]

Ok, see mine has that mark too. but i have transformed this thing close to 25 times now, and it hasnt changed. I think thats just siomewhere that gets that stress mark (Its the exact same on both my arms in the exact same spot). Im certainly not worried about it.

So all you y'yes' voters, have you just been yessing these stress marks?

I can accept stres marks. As long as we don't get the same sort of cracks and shattering as before.

[Mowe]

At best, this thread will prove that no shoulders are broken but a number of reported stress marks. This should still helps people to make their decision if hey thave yet brought a Shin Combo.

Would I have brought one knowing these stress mark? Definitely not. Would you?

By the way, Roy's blues' pic on Post 6 shows stress mark a bit worst than mine. You guys should take a look.

Edited September 2, 2007 by Mowe

[sidearmsalpha]

sorry for the dark/blurry pics, i forgot last night and had to rush it this morning.

the red paint marks indicate the points that were broken upon opening it.

note on the far leftside, i had to glue that entire support piece down(light grey) because that part(darker plastic) was completely in pieces.

i krazy glued the broken pieces together best i could, let it dry, sanded it down, cleaned it, applied some more krazy glue, then sanded it down again.

also, when you put the 2 halves together, its not a clean fit. these also requried some sanding(i used 400 grit) to make the 2 parts seamless. same goes for the shoulders halves and the groves that connect the shoulders to the biceps.

i wish i had a pic of the original O ring in the bicep section to show you guys. the ones pictured have been trimmed down quite bit.

i really should've taken progress pics when i was doing the repairs but i hope this helps.

Are the O rings necessary or will the forearms be very loose without them? Any recommendations on how to separate the elbow collars on the VF-0S?

[Scream Man]

up to 8 now...

more common than i thought, though specifics on most are still lacking.

[eugimon]

without the rubber rings, the bicep swivel will be the same as the 1st release 0s bicep swivel... very loose.

if you have a CF0a and aren't inclined to pay for the replacement arms, I say live with the loose shoulders and take out the rubber.. if you already bought the replacement arms, check anyways to see if there is any excess material (flashing) causing extra pressure.

[eugimon]

up to 8 now...

more common than i thought, though specifics on most are still lacking.

yeah, I really wish people would post up details. I want to know if they're reporting stress marks, or full on cracks and breaks.

[Mr March]

Well, to be brutally honest, if there's even the hint of something weakening, that's enough to keep me away. Like I've said, I'm not interested in purchasing the thing if it's still a fundamentally flawed design. I also know there are users here voting in the polls that don't have a VF-0A Shin with broken shoulders but have stress marks and/or are not transforming it at all to avoid breakage. That's certainly not what I want out of the toy. I don't play with my Yammies and they are display pieces at best, but I handle them very carefully and I transform them at least once every few months. If the VF-0A Shin can't even handle proper care and a half dozen transformations a year, I want no part of it.

[Sumdumgai]

Pics guys, pics! Pics are worth a lot, especially on these kinds of things. At least give us descriptions of what's gone wrong to make you vote "shoulder broke".

[eugimon]

Well, to be brutally honest, if there's even the hint of something weakening, that's enough to keep me away. Like I've said, I'm not interested in purchasing the thing if it's still a fundamentally flawed design. I also know there are users here voting in the polls that don't have a VF-0A Shin with broken shoulders but have stress marks and/or are not transforming it at all to avoid breakage. That's certainly not what I want out of the toy. I don't play with my Yammies and they are display pieces at best, but I handle them very carefully and I transform them at least once every few months. If the VF-0A Shin can't even handle proper care and a half dozen transformations a year, I want no part of it.

That's a totally understandable reaction. And one I'm inclined to follow. If we were looking at a fail rate (where failure = stress marks) in the low single digits, I could chock that up to manufacturing flubs or user error... but at 30%, that just tells me that either yamato didn't put the new materials in the shoulders or the chemical reaction bit was only part of the problem and the underlying design problem remains.

In any event, I dunno now if I would ever get another vf-0 toy unless yamato significantly improves this part.

And oh yeah, compensates me for the fraking replacment arms I spent money on.

[Sumdumgai]

I have a question for 0A Shin owners. Are the shoulders still glued together so you have to pop the arm on or off that ball joint?

[miriya]

what do you mean? Sorry if it is self explanatory but I do not understand. What would that look like?

[Sumdumgai]

When you take off the outer shoulder covering you can see the two dark grey plastic parts where the shoulder breakages occur. On the 0A CF even if you unscrew the two screws the two halves do not seperate, because they're glued together. You might be able to tell by looking for glue seepage at the seam line between the two halves of the shoulder. Otherwise you'd have to take the chance of unscrewing and trying to pull (I won't ask anyone to do that, especially with the chance that you could aggravate the shoulder).

[miriya]

Ok, now I understand what you mean but why would I want to check that? Is there any benefit for my valk?

[eugimon]

Ok, now I understand what you mean but why would I want to check that? Is there any benefit for my valk?

well, with the 0s arms, the halves were glued together before being assembled on the shoulder mount, causing stress when the workers forced the ball into the socket. IF thats the case with the 0a arms, it could explain the stress marks.

[miriya]

That totally make sense. It would explain why so many people have stress marks even if they do not have breaks. Again. I only have one tiny stress mark and no breaks and am really happy with my shin. I am of course sorry for all of you that do have breaks as that really sucks. I knew about the possibility when I finally decided to get mine that these issues may be manifest on my valk but I took the chances. After I saw Swoosh's photos I just had to have it!

[sidearmsalpha]

So, what it sounds like is that no one has tried to separate the shoulder halves on the VF-0A CF? Just loosened the screws? I have one that has a shoulder that had a big chunk break out of it, so it's pretty useless now, so I'm going to remove the screws and see if the halves just come apart, or if they really are glued together.

[Sumdumgai]

Well, the reason I was asking about the shoulders being glued on the 0A Shin, is because I have a 0A CF with broken shoulders (chunks missing) and the two halves are glued together. That makes fixing them a little more difficult, because I'm either going to have to glue the bits back on and risk gluing the arm to the ball joint, or glue the shoulder parts together, then pop them back on and quite possibly re-breaking or re-aggravating the damaged areas.

So I was just wondering if the workers at the factory stopped gluing the shoulders together on the 0A Shin, since if the shoulders do get damaged they'll be that much easier to repair if they're not glued.

[Mowe]

For those interested to know if the Shin Combo's bicep is glued. The answer is no (see Arrow 1). I really wanted to open that bicep up like DnD does, but I am too afraid if I unscrew the bicep, the bicep plastic will break (see Arrow 2), it is already not looking good.

Also, notice these gaps, they are the result of me loosening up the screws on the shoulder and the bicep. It prevent possible stress mark development, but the side effect is I have a very loose armed valk...so I can't win either way....

Edited September 4, 2007 by Mowe

[RYO]

I'm too depressed and mad to take pics of the broken shoulder. Tried to transform it only once from valk mode and very gently at that, then "CRACK"! I hadn't even known about the shoulder problem beforehand, as I have not logged here for a long time. At first, I was thinking, was it my fault? I have 3 Yammies and transformed them from time-to-time, where did I go wrong? And then I logon here and find out that VF-0 valks have problems, and that it wasn't my fault at all...Crap Yamato, I ain't buying another valkyrie until I know they have cleaned up their act!

[Mowe]

Just to clarify the purpose of this thread: we want to know problems with the Shin Combo VF-0A only, because we have already confirmed that VF-0A Cannon is problem prone already. We just want to know if the Shin Combo VF-0A has the same problem.

RYO, is your a combo?

[RYO]

RYO, is your a combo?

Err, isn't that redundant question, its the poll title after all? Anyway, yes its a Shin VF-0A combo, otherwise I wouldn't have voted on this poll.

[Mowe]

Woo!! You mean we actually have a broken Shin?? Please sent pic when you feel better, this would stop all the guessing.

I don't mean to trivialize your post, but some people mentioned that they voted with their non-Shin VF-0.

Err, isn't that redundant question, its the poll title after all? Anyway, yes its a Shin VF-0A combo, otherwise I wouldn't have voted on this poll.

[do not disturb]

without the rubber rings, the bicep swivel will be the same as the 1st release 0s bicep swivel... very loose.

if you have a CF0a and aren't inclined to pay for the replacement arms, I say live with the loose shoulders and take out the rubber.. if you already bought the replacement arms, check anyways to see if there is any excess material (flashing) causing extra pressure.

actually, i put my CF-0A back together without the O rings and the tension was still good enough to hold a pose.

only thing is, its plastic on plastic so its eventually going to get loose, but as of right now they're holding up just fine without them.

[eugimon]

actually, i put my CF-0A back together without the O rings and the tension was still good enough to hold a pose.

only thing is, its plastic on plastic so its eventually going to get loose, but as of right now they're holding up just fine without them.

really? I tried it on mine and they were useless. Oh well, I guess it makes sense since some 0s owners had bicep swivels that were fine and some of us had loose ones. *shrug*