Macross 25th Anniversary and upcoming new TV series thread

[MacrossCN]

FYI, it's captioned as 新型バルキリー VF-171.

In English: the latest style [design, model] Valkyrie.

As for the VF-25, the caption reads 可変戦闘機：バルキリーの最新鋭機。

In English: State of the the art Valkyrie variable fighter. Expecting [expectation] to be drawn in the recent 3DCG.

As time permits, I'm also nearing the completetion of the 2nd article in the Newtype December issue.

VF-25(SMS001, 007) havne't U.N. Logo, and Newtype said that:

新型バルキリー VF25

　統合軍の次期主力可変戦闘機。VF-1の流れをくむ優秀な機体だ。

so I think VF-171 is MAIN Valk in MF.

Has the air date been set for this MBS Special?

It will be nice if it is like the "Macross: Fastest Liftoff" and they not only show the series but also the new toys

This winter（今冬）

Maybe Dec.

Edited November 14, 2007 by kresphy

[Mr March]

Crap. I'll have to do a little revision to the VF-17D entry on the M3 if this is true

[Sumdumgai]

Did my website help with your growing VF-17 appreciation?

Hell yeah. The constant exposure to it over the years helped as well. Using the VF-17 in VFX2 as my evil special mission valk, beam cannon attachment! Seeing it constantly in action in M7. It's grown to be one of my favorites. And I really love the look of this VF-171*.

[Graham]

I'm not sure if I'm as familiar with the VF-17 as yourself, but I'd be interested in seeing a faithful CG conversion of it. In particular, I've always felt some rather dynamic changes occured in the legs of the VF-17 line art from Fighter to Heavy Battroid mode. The schematics from my TIAS Books seem to suggest a rather diverging proportion. But as always, who knows if the schematics are correct either (though they do match the Kawamori scale diagrams you gave me). But they do seem rather noticeable just going by eye.

I agree there is a big discrepancy in the size of the VF-17 battroid’s lower leg thickness as shown in Kawamori’s line art, versus the relative thinness (sleekness) of the fighter mode. Thicker than practical lower legs is something that Kawamori tended to draw on most of the M7 battroids.

His infamous 'thick leg' VF-22 battroid mode lineart from B-Club magazine is one of the worst examples, and completely contradicts his other VF-22 'slim leg' lineart.

Hopefully, the VF-171 when we finally see it in Battroid mode will have correctly sized lower legs.

Graham

[s001]

C'mon Graham, mecha anime is about looks too.

[Morpheus]

So we have confirmed to VF for this show, VF-171 and VF-25, which one will became the cannon fodder for the show?

But what is with this space monster thing? So the enemy in M-F is a freaking space bugs?

My only wish for this show is they put some destroid in action, more VF action and plz....no Basara-type-char which can talk with the space bugs

I can't wait for this show

[Keith]

Back to the 2 fleets thing. Mayhaps it's a combined fleet due to necessity. If the space monsters took out portions of two fleets (F/G), it may have necessitated a combination for survival. Something else interesting being that none of the scenes so far have shown much of a military escort for these fleets. The bulk of what's been shown have been colony sections. Perhaps it'll be one of those "rush the kids through flight school 'cus we're short on men" type situations.

[wolfx]

VF-171, a reference to the F-117 that the VF-17 is inspired by? A long shot probably.

[azrael]

I don't think it is a combined fleet. I doubt this "other fleet" will get much air time, period. The only mention of it is Sheryl Nome is traveling to our fleet-of-focus from another fleet. "Nearby" could mean several systems away, not hanging right near our fleet-of-focus.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

I think the VF-171 designation denotes the fact that its a training craft. Then again, I'm not even sure if it is just a trainer. I wonder how its capabilities compare to the VF-17. I just saw the trailer and the song wasn't bad. I'm glad we are getting an all new series. I miss Macross!

[Sumdumgai]

I doubt the VF-171 is a trainer, unless the dogfight scenes we saw in the trailer were virtual. Trainers have a history of not having headlasers like the VT-1, and the VF-17T.

[RDClip]

Well if you think for a sec Max looks a bit gay in SDFM too and he's still the coolest character of the show, not gay at all. I mean, he's Miria's blue demon

Agreed, most Macross mains are a bit on the wimpy side of looks. Least wimpy would probably be Isamu. But i have no problem with a Bishounin leads in anime, i'm used to it.

The only character design that kinda irritates me is Ranka (Lanka?) She looks a little too young...younger than Mylene. I really hate the whole lolicon character design for lead females.

[MEMO1DOMINION]

IN ONE OF THE IMAGES, WHAT IS THE NAME OF THE ELECTRIC STREAM CONECTING THE COCKPIT TO THE UPER TORSO DURNIG IT'S FORMATION OF BATTLOID?

DOES IT WORK THE SAME AS THE STAR WARS POD RACERS?

DON'T REMEMBER SEEING IT BEFORE ON MACROSS OR ZERO. UNLESS I MISSED IT SOMEWHERE ELSE. ANY MORE IMAGES ON OTHER VALKS?

THANX

SW PODRACER

[Chronocidal]

Hmm.. VF-25 I'm loving a lot, takes a lot of the best features from several Valks so far. Transformation really reminds me of the SV-51, with the multi-bend fuselage, and the way the wings stay on the shoulders.

Wonder if the new license will let Yamato finally make a VF-17 (sort of)?

[MacrossCN]

I doubt the VF-171 is a trainer, unless the dogfight scenes we saw in the trailer were virtual. Trainers have a history of not having headlasers like the VT-1, and the VF-17T.

・学園もの

・敵は宇宙怪獣

・次期主力可変戦闘機、VF-25 <----------NEXT period main Vlak

・現行機、VF-171 <-----------------------ACTIVE Valk, so main now!

Edited November 14, 2007 by kresphy

[Keith]

Since the legal troubles were over far more than just the U.N. Spacey kite, I doubt that's the reason for the change, if there is indeed one. The name Macross would still come up as an issue in licensing.

[Gaijin]

Finally saw the trailer...looks good!

[MangledMess]

Hmm.. VF-25 I'm loving a lot, takes a lot of the best features from several Valks so far. Transformation really reminds me of the SV-51, with the multi-bend fuselage, and the way the wings stay on the shoulders.

Wonder if the new license will let Yamato finally make a VF-17 (sort of)?

The transformation kinda reminds me of how the YF-19 transforms, due to the torso area bending. But the VF-25's transformation looks quite fragile compare to the YF-19.

So for UN Spacy, the more complicated, the more futuristic. lol.

[Graham]

I think the VF-171 designation denotes the fact that its a training craft. Then again, I'm not even sure if it is just a trainer. I wonder how its capabilities compare to the VF-17. I just saw the trailer and the song wasn't bad. I'm glad we are getting an all new series. I miss Macross!

Almost certainly NOT a trainer. All signs seem to indicate the VF-171 is the current main force Valk (AKA cannon Fodder), while the VF-25 is the new state of the art.

Graham

[Graham]

As far as the 17 goes, I seriously doubt the 17 is still in service, since the service life of a VF is shorter than that of modern day conventional fighters. However that doesn't mean a derivative fighter wasn't developed, like a "VF-27". One could argue that the VF-19 was a derivative fighter of the VF-9 Cutlass...

Actually the VF-9 was a General Galaxy product (their first ever VF), while the VF-19 was from Shinsei Industries.

Graham

[Renato]

The credits seem to show Junya Ishigaki and Takeshi Takakura as mechanical designers. No Kawamori or Miyatake?

[Graham]

from what I understand, Kawamori is the designer of the VF-25 and I guess probably the VF-171 as well. The others mecha designers are handling everything else.

Graham

[sketchley]

Back to the 2 fleets thing. Mayhaps it's a combined fleet due to necessity. If the space monsters took out portions of two fleets (F/G), it may have necessitated a combination for survival. Something else interesting being that none of the scenes so far have shown much of a military escort for these fleets. The bulk of what's been shown have been colony sections. Perhaps it'll be one of those "rush the kids through flight school 'cus we're short on men" type situations.

Look closely. The military ships are there. Someone else has already pointed out a Guantánamo Stealth Carrier. There are other small things near it, which are too big to be fighters, and what I suspect are Bolognese Stealth Frigates. Even in the opening shot, there is an Uraga Escort Battle Carrier, in silhouette of course.

Also, the logic of the schooling doesn't make sense. The series starts before any attack, with the protagonists already in school.

[Graham]

My only wish for this show is they put some destroid in action

I seriously doubt we will see any Destroids in the new series. Despite the lower cost compared with VFs, the Destroid concept seems to have been pretty much a failure and scrapped sometime after Space War I. Destroids are just too lacking in both tactical and strategic mobility to be effective, especially against an enemy force armed with VFs, or comparable hi-manauever mecha such as the Q-Rau.

The only Destroid we have seen in service after Space War I is the VB-6 Konig Monster and that is a variable type with the ability to fly by itself to and from the battlefield, which gives it a huge advanatge over the ealier Destroid Monster, which had extremely limited mobility.

Graham

[Project Phoenix]

Like kreshpy has pointed out from the articles in Japanese, the 171s are the current mainstay VFs while the 25 is the next generation valk. Since Macross F features the 25 as the main mecha star, that means it is now in full production run, way passed the prototype stage the 19 and 21 was.

Question is, how big is the 25? It looks skinny but its actual size could have been smaller due to miniaturization of components by the 2070s.

Need more pics!

[Graham]

While it's difficult to say with any great degree of certainty based just on the pics so far, but the VF-25 certianly looks long in fighter mode IMO. My gut feeling is that the VF-25 is a pretty big craft, probably similar in size to the YF-19 or VF-0.

Graham

[Zinjo]

If the 25 is the new breed of fighter, then it is fair to say that development of new fighters has been scaled back over the 20 years following Mac7.

Most likely efforts were made to refine existing fighters or upgrade (VF-171) existing fighters (or designs) with newer tech.

By 2070 there would have to be dozens of colony worlds and with at least 11 super long distance fleets out there, Spacy would be better off spending their resources on "equipping" these colonies and fleets not so much developing new fighters for pilots to play with.

Existing designs have more than likely proven themselves capable of any combat role that a fleet or world would face. With the many different types of designs available to "upgrade" the current fighter arsenal is probably very effective, in the Macross universe.

As for the VF-9 & 19, I guess I mis-spoke, I should have said, "inspired by" as opposed to "derived from". My bad...

Edited November 14, 2007 by Zinjo

[Kelsain]

Someone else has already pointed out a Guantánamo Stealth Carrier.

Oops, my bad - I used the wrong name. I haven't crack my TIA books in a while, so my memory's fuzzy. Comparing to Mr March's MMM, it looks like they've toned down the colors a little. I approve - the M7 ships were just way too blue and way too white for my taste.

[briscojr84]

Well I was hoping for the beautiful Miyatake designs myself, but I am glad that the 2D animation is up to todays standards, and that it is not too weird in style. Just right to me.

I really can't wait for it to start. First ep is still due in December right?

There is an Uraga up by her bangs.

[Mr March]

It's nice to see some of the older space ships still in service in Macross Frontier. Like I've said before, the ship design in Macross 7 was one of it's few strengths (though I suppose some would point out to me that TECHNICALLY the Guantanamo, Bolognese and Uraga are Macross Plus designs). So far I can't see any new ship designs I recongnize as military craft in the trailer. All the new ships appear to be colony ships so far.

One thing I don't think anyone has mentioned yet (please forgive me if you have and I've missed it) is the green/cyan/teal color of the VF-171* variable fighters. It appears to be an adoption of the VF-17s as they appeared in Macross Dynamite 7. Same kind of green/cyan/teal. It appears that the black colors were dropped as the mass production colors of the VF-17.

Zinjava

Yeah, this was similar to my point as well. It appears the number of Valkyries designed in the following 25 years has dropped dramatically compared to the pace of development seen in the first 38 years of UNG military history. But we haven't seen the show yet, so there could be a reason for this. Also, if that VF-171* designation is not a typo, it could mean there are far more variable fighters in between the VF-22 and the VF-25 using these new triple digit designations. Throw in some triple digits valkyries, some four digit valkyries (ala VF-5000), some differing line fighters like the VA-3 along with VF-23/VF-24 and the number of developed variable fighters could be much more reasonable.

Kelsain

I find most colors used in CG work are more subdued and washed out compared to drawn cell animation. It makes the vehicles appear more photorealistic. It works well with the look they are going for. Still, it is anime so there will be a lot of color in the CG and I think the trailer shows that. Particularly missiles and explosions and the VF-171 is quite colorful.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Almost certainly NOT a trainer. All signs seem to indicate the VF-171 is the current main force Valk (AKA cannon Fodder), while the VF-25 is the new state of the art.

Graham

Awesome, better chance of a toy being made. I hope we see a more appealing color scheme(well the current scheme on it now is bland to me).

[Zinjo]

Zinjava

Yeah, this was similar to my point as well. It appears the number of Valkyries designed in the following 25 years has dropped dramatically compared to the pace of development seen in the first 38 years of UNG military history. But we haven't seen the show yet, so there could be a reason for this. Also, if that VF-171* designation is not a typo, it could mean there are far more variable fighters in between the VF-22 and the VF-25 using these new triple digit designations. Throw in some triple digits valkyries, some four digit valkyries (ala VF-5000), some differing line fighters like the VA-3 along with VF-23/VF-24 and the number of developed variable fighters could be much more reasonable.

I was considering the same thing.

The point I was making is that "if" the development of new fighter designs has slowed, it could be due to upgrades to existing proven designs (which may be the reason for the addition of an extra digit), developing variants of those existing designs (ala F-35 Lighting II) or as you said the numbering convention is not followed as strictly as previously done for any number of reasons (such as role specific designations, like a VF/A ** fighter or VB** bomber, etc...).

Edited November 14, 2007 by Zinjo

[Mr March]

Very good point, my young Zinjawan

Gawd, I have that trailer song stuck in my head and it won't go away. My coworkers are looking at me funny when they pass me singing jibberish

[Exsedol]

Awsome, Glad to see another Misa style bridge bunny again....if she is a bridge bunny Looks like a good mix of m7 and mplus style art too.

[Sumdumgai]

Holy crap if triple digit designations are upgraded, improved versions of already proved VFs, then I'm going to start running around screaming WOOHOO at the top of my lungs if there turns out to be an upgraded VF-11.

I noticed the color of the VF-171, but hadn't remembered that the VF-17 colors were different in Dynamite 7.