Dante74 Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Though the VF-1 was inspired by the F/A-18 and F-111, the VF-25 takes even more inspiration and influence from those 2 designs. Add vertical stab placement similar to the YF-19, similar nose/LERXes to the SV-51, and this plane ends up looking like a YF-23 with swing wings in a way(towards the back). I like the design. Less VF-1 similarities than the VF-0 and it looks like its a fast one. It would be interesting if it wasn't the valkyrie used a lot towards the end(what if the main character's gets trashed and he gets a new valk?). Already I am excited at Bandai making a Soulspec VF-25, or Yamato making a 1/60 one for under $100. I have a feeling this is not the only new valk we will see. Can't wait to see more of the 17. Wasn't the VF-1 inspired by the F-14? Has anyone seen the good old UN Spacy Kite logo anywhere in this trailer btw? I haven't.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RDClip Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 or Yamato making a 1/60 one for under $100. I'm sorry, but that dream died for me when i moved from the old 1/60s to 1/48. Now a few of my thoughts... I think that battroid-ish hand thing is prolly some kind of training device for learning prcision movements. As we see in the trailer, the protagonist is holding a paper airplane with a similar looking hand. My thoughts were that he was training precise movement with the arm via folding the airplane (anyone remember the scene in patlabor where Noa was making a cat's cradle with her ingram?) I got the impression that the VF-17-ish fighter was the standard issue valk of the era as opposed to a special forces VF. We see much more of it than the VF-25 and it some of them get beat up pretty bad. Just reminded me of the VF-11s in M7. Just because the bad guys look like bugs, doesnt really mean that we wont have some relatable bad guys. They could very well go the route of BSG and Space: AaB and have organic craft that are piloted by humanoids. Or they could be sort of like organic robots remotely controlled by some someone far away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Keith Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I don't know if anyone noticed this, I actually noticed it a while ago but was too lazy to get a screen cap, but since I saw someone else posted the same image you can notice the patch on the arm also says '25', do that Sempai looking dude, in the back there's also a dude with a flight jacket with the same '25' patch on the arm, so I think the VF-25 is more of an elite valkyrie rather than a student one That could just as easily refer to them being the 25th fighting somethingerother squad. It's not necessarily directly tied to their fighter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Wasn't the VF-1 inspired by the F-14? Has anyone seen the good old UN Spacy Kite logo anywhere in this trailer btw? I haven't.. Possibly on the wing of the VF-25 that is white with purple trim. Graham 10777156tj9.bmp 12452306dx6.bmp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Heh, I'm wondering if perhaps the VF-25 is also an older model, used just by the flight school for training students and not actually a frontline fighter. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eugimon Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Heh, I'm wondering if perhaps the VF-25 is also an older model, used just by the flight school for training students and not actually a frontline fighter. Graham if only I had one of those image manipulation programs you see on shows like CSI. I could just hit the "reduce noise" macro and we would have a clear image. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacrossCN Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Maybe there are more info in these Magazine~~~ ^^ http://www.satelight.co.jp/2007/11/11_2.html Animage, Dec. issue 【アニメージュ12月号】(徳間書店/11月10日発行） 『シリーズ集大成の最新作 マクロス・フロンティア始動！』 「マクロスＦ」紹介 Animdia, Dec. issue 【アニメディア12月号】(学研/11月10日発行） 『マクロスの新シリーズがついに本格始動！』 「マクロスＦ」紹介 【NEWTYPE 12月号】(角川書店/11月10日発行）(done) 『新天地に向かって』 「マクロスＦ」紹介 BTW, I find this video from Satelight Digital Dept. I remember early blog have text description but there is no video. Is it Satelight unpublicized Video? Daddy and Mommy of Macross F~~~ The last mystery person is SK???? HAHAHAHA <link removed> Edited November 13, 2007 by azrael Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 All of Macrossworld should be IN this thread right now. I thought we were in the Youtube comments - where are you?! As long as there's decent fights I can overlook the fear of getting Yellow Belmont part 2. I don't necessarily like all the things about how the CGI-normal animation and all that work out, but I kinda like the small stuff like the blonde woman with the classic UN Spacy uniform and such. But let's not try to go over 2 min of video for 6 months. I hope we get a year-long run, but not if the story gets watered-down for it. And I think the aircraft upgrades make sense - in wartime you need newer stuff to keep up with changes and needs. With peacetime they're less based upon technology and what you think you need to take out the other guy. Hey it could be worse - my platform hasn't gotten and upgrade FOR ABOUT 50 FRICKIN' YEARS!!! Another note of interest - I heard Banpresto just got bought out by Bandai-Namco. They're the ones I've seen in the opening of alot of the Macross games, so I'm thinking with Bandai's better US distrubutors we could have a good chance of getting Frontier in at least game-form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yellowlightman Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Another note of interest - I heard Banpresto just got bought out by Bandai-Namco. They're the ones I've seen in the opening of alot of the Macross games, so I'm thinking with Bandai's better US distrubutors we could have a good chance of getting Frontier in at least game-form. Banpresto is a subdivision of Bandai... so I'm not sure how such a buy out would be possible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Banpresto is a subdivision of Bandai... so I'm not sure how such a buy out would be possible. Well it's merged or something I dunno. Maybe they just give the money to themselves? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UN Spacy Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Why did you post the link to the old Aquarion OVA commercial? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kensei Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Well I was hoping for the beautiful Miyatake designs myself, but I am glad that the 2D animation is up to todays standards, and that it is not too weird in style. Just right to me. I really can't wait for it to start. First ep is still due in December right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsain Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) I've been looking at the VF-17ish fighter some more, and it looks to have some features from the VF-22. The wing sweep is very similar, as is the nose. Perhaps this is General Galaxy building upon previous success, like Shinsei making the VF-11 off the general template of the VF-1. Maybe it's like the VF-23 or something... Also noticed that they're keeping some of the ships from before: We of course have the Megaroad making an appearance, the New Macross off in the distance, but I just spotted a Maizuru carrier as well. There are also a couple of silhouettes that look fairly Zentraedian. edit: forgot pics... Edited November 13, 2007 by Kelsain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I just picked up the December 2007 issues of Animedia and Animage magazines. Unfortunately, there is only a quarter of a page article on Macross Frontier in both magazines. Below is the scan of the Animedia article. The Animage scan will follow in a few minutes. Of interest is the name given for the new VF-17 is 'VF-171'. Not sure if this is a typo or not. If it is correct, it would be the first Valk with a three digit number designation. Also, looking at the pic of the fighter mode white and purple VF-25 (5th pic down on the left), it looks like the marking on the left wing may not be the UN Spacy Kite. I'm wondering if perhaps Big West are not using the kite, to try to get around the licensing issue and market the series outside of Japan? We can but hope. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kelsain Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Also, looking at the pic of the fighter mode white and purple VF-25 (5th pic down on the left), it looks like the marking on the left wing may not be the UN Spacy Kite. I'm wondering if perhaps Big West are not using the kite, to try to get around the licensing issue and market the series outside of Japan? We can but hope. Graham Perhaps they've gone to the Project Nova logo. Just sheer speculation... If they've done away with it, I'll really miss the kite. It was something that tied the whole series together, no matter how disparate the designs became. Looking at it again, though, that article loses A LOT of detail to the line screen, so I'm not giving up hope. Edited November 13, 2007 by Kelsain Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 And here's the scan from the December issue of Animage. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Isamu test pilot Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Heh, I'm wondering if perhaps the VF-25 is also an older model, used just by the flight school for training students and not actually a frontline fighter. Graham I think the VF-25 is the main fighter in both fleets, I remember that in M7 the VF-17, VF-19 all types and the VF-22 were only use by elite pilots or squadrons... BTW, is it confirmed that in the story there are 2 fleets, the Galaxy and the Frontier? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Graham Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 My observation was in no way a slight against anyone, least of all the CG artists working on a Macross production and I resent the implication. Personally, after years of seeing the VF-1 Battroid converted into both numerous plastic and CG models, I would think the physical limitations of a static 3D model trying to duplicate the dynamic proportions of the Valkyrie line art would be more than apparent. Nonetheless, in my opinion one interpretation of the nature of the "VF-17" changes seen in the Macross Frontier trailer is as good as another at this point. No offence intended, it's just that that particular theory out of all the theories posted so far, about the VF-17 not being able to transition from 2D lineart to 3D CG without significant changes, just struck me as being highly unlikely and I felt I needed to comment on it. Heck as long ago as 1999, Gonzo did a perfectly accurate to lineart CG VF-17D fighter in the VF-X2 opening movie. If it could be done in 1999, it sure as heck can be done today. Please understand where I'm coming from. I've been studying the VF-17 (and other M7 & M+ mecha) intensely since 1994 (13 years now) and collecting every scrap of lineart published in magazines and art books. So any design changes no matter how small are very noticable to me. The changes on the new VF-171* (*Animedia Dec 07 designation) are pretty major, so much so that even from a cursory examination of the new pics, it was obvious to me that this is an all new variant with as much (or perhaps more) physical difference as say between the YF-19 and VF-19Kai. Graham Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lonewolf Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 The fighter and gerwalk modes on the VF-25 are really nice, but somehow, the battrois mode isn't growing on me. The DYRL Hikaru paint scheme is really nice though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Unfortunately, Dynamite was pretty specific about the "Fire Bombers Final Concert" thing, so I doubt they'll pop up...well Maybe Basara, I don't see how Kawamori could resist at least a cameo there. And yes, I know a lot of you hate him, whatever, let it go. We wish you would... As for the space monsters, it may very well be a gunbuster like "you've spread out too far, you're a disease, we're going to kill you" type deal. It could be the final evolution of the AFOS's defense program, or something completely unrelated. I'm leaning towards a PC relation though, as the SA shouldn't even remotely be a major player anymore, and Zero left far too much setup to just drop the subject entirely. I find it amusing that an essentially dead civilization has more chance of being an antagonist than an active army still fighting the billions of Zentreadi in the Galaxy.... However, since they are being very enigmatic about the enemy in this show, time will tell... Is it just me or does the forward fuselage really seem like a SV-51? Actually I see the VF-25 resembles the F-18 with swing wings more than the SV-51, IMO. Colony fleets doesn't need expensive fighters for what would be 90%-survey missions. Look at M7. They only had VF-11s and a squad of VF-17s. It wasn't until nearly 5 months into combat with the Varauta that the VF-19 showed itself, and more than 10 months until they got a VF-22. Macross 5 only had mostly VF-11s, VA-14s (and probably VF-14s and I won't count the VAB-2 since they probably only had a handful just in case). From the article, it sounds like this particular fleet has been uneventful until we see them now. So did they even have a need for VF-19s/VF-22s? Probably not. Well a fleet that size would probably have the plans and the capability to build any "special forces" fighters on an as needed basis. As you said the M7 fleet didn't have 19's and 22's until they were needed. So it is logical to conclude the Frontier fleet would be able to do the same. As far as the 17 goes, I seriously doubt the 17 is still in service, since the service life of a VF is shorter than that of modern day conventional fighters. However that doesn't mean a derivative fighter wasn't developed, like a "VF-27". One could argue that the VF-19 was a derivative fighter of the VF-9 Cutlass... In terms of the lack of internal palettes on the "27" (for want of a better designation) makes more sense to me than the other way around. It is a space fighter! The VF-17 was a wedge shaped aircraft in the tradition of making fighters appear like a "flock of birds on radar"... Not a common thing in space.... The energy discharge during transformation and even the energy arc over the "VF-27" tell me that they may have acheived an omni-directional barrier system for their space craft. Granted that's pure speculation, however it is keeping within the established universe... IAD's picture of the "VF-27" Just wondering what the yellow and black markings are that appear on the VF-25's nose and left wing (see attached pics). This is the first time we have seen these type of markings on a VF. My theory is it may denote some type of new system. Graham At the very least, I’m hoping the new gunpod will be a rail gun. You would think that by the 2070s’ the technology would be advanced enough to move away from traditional chemical propellant for the gunpod ammo. Omni-directional barrier system perhaps? I agree Graham, I think a Railgun pod is way overdue... Way too many posts to sift through... Edited November 13, 2007 by Zinjo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VFTF1 Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Here's my take on the VF-25: 1) It has the nose of the SV-51 2) It has the wings and exhaust vents of the VF1 3)It has the tail fins of the YF-19 4)It has the rear booster "bumps" of the YF-21 I like the design. Very happy that they didn't just go and build a totally looney out-of-the-ball-park new valk like they kind of did in Macross7... This is in my taste. Looks like this'll be really cool VFTF1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
striderhiryu Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 My opinion on the VF-171 is that perhaps is an overall upgrade from the basic VF-17, just like how in real world the USAF hornet was upgraded into the superhornet. The shape is almost the same but the differences are there (like larger flex, redesigned air intakes, etc.). Also, as for the enemies in the show i wonder what motive do they have to attack humans, are they somehow tied to the AFOS?. do they also sence the Kaduns? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Of interest is the name given for the new VF-17 is 'VF-171'. Not sure if this is a typo or not. If it is correct, it would be the first Valk with a three digit number designation. Also, looking at the pic of the fighter mode white and purple VF-25 (5th pic down on the left), it looks like the marking on the left wing may not be the UN Spacy Kite. I'm wondering if perhaps Big West are not using the kite, to try to get around the licensing issue and market the series outside of Japan? We can but hope. Graham LOL, if reason for the logo change is true, the irony is too funny!!! HG changed the SDFM Kite to avoid legal issues with BigWest on SC... Though considering how national flags evolve over the years, it is surprising that the UNG Kite never did (until now perhaps) no matter how many colonies were established by humanity over the years... If the new stealth like fighter is a VF-171, then it would be a direct derivative of the 17 along with the same numbering convention as the F-117 that the VF-17 was based on... Kinda cool that... Edited November 13, 2007 by Zinjo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dobber Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I am completley ashamed of myself....1 for my horrible spelling and 2) because I have completely neglected this thread for too long and I've missed soooo much. Well, at least I finally made it. Trailer looked cool, I'm really liking the VF-25 too. Graham I hope you are correct and this could be marketed elsewhere. Looking forward to seeing this series!! Chris Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Project Phoenix Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 The renumbering of the VF-17 to VF-171 could be a move similar to the Mil helicopter company when they introduced the civilian or export version of their Mi-17 helicopter to overseas customers. I remembered it very clearly cuz my dad was on involved in the purchasing of the civilian variant which was then renumbered to Mi-171 to denote it being non-Russian use model. I still have the t-shirt to prove it. Again, it's all speculation at this point. the VF-171 could be an upgraded type of some sort, a local militia variant or a wholly redesigned valk altogether. In any case, I'd love to see more of it. Anyone looking forward to the newer Destroid designs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
azrael Posted November 13, 2007 Author Share Posted November 13, 2007 Graham I think it's best to wait and see on the VF-171* designation. As more info comes out, we should get a yes or no about it. I'll just mark it with an asterisk until then. Perhaps the whole insignia issue relates to fleet or squadron markings. Maybe it's a private school or civil defense forces, not related to the UN military. BTW, is it confirmed that in the story there are 2 fleets, the Galaxy and the Frontier? The series will focus on just 1 fleet, F (Frontier). *Animedia Dec 07 designation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sumdumgai Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Who is to say that there will be new destroids. M7 didn't have any destroids other than the vintage ones from Space War I, and the transformable police... thing... I guess it's possible, if unlikely, that they had destroids in use but we never saw them throughout M7. I'm just as excited about the VF-171* as I am about the VF-25. Maybe more so even, since the VF-17 has really grown on me a lot. Thanks for those scans Graham! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 Graham No problems and thank you. I wanted to make certain sure my comments on the nature of differences in line art versus real 3D model were coming across clearly and benign. So far I'm loving every bit of the mechanical design shown in Macross Frontier, changes and all I'm not sure if I'm as familiar with the VF-17 as yourself, but I'd be interested in seeing a faithful CG conversion of it. In particular, I've always felt some rather dynamic changes occured in the legs of the VF-17 line art from Fighter to Heavy Battroid mode. The schematics from my TIAS Books seem to suggest a rather diverging proportion. But as always, who knows if the schematics are correct either (though they do match the Kawamori scale diagrams you gave me). But they do seem rather noticeable just going by eye. Plus, as your line of reasoning suggests, there is always the possibility that the VF-17 line art in particular can convert to CG much better and more faithfully than the VF-1 ever will. I'm really curious what the total catalogue of changes to the VF-17 are and the nature of the VF-171. It has to be some kind of advanced variant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr March Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 I'm just as excited about the VF-171* as I am about the VF-25. Maybe more so even, since the VF-17 has really grown on me a lot. Did my website help with your growing VF-17 appreciation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zinjo Posted November 13, 2007 Share Posted November 13, 2007 (edited) Who is to say that there will be new destroids. M7 didn't have any destroids other than the vintage ones from Space War I, and the transformable police... thing... I guess it's possible, if unlikely, that they had destroids in use but we never saw them throughout M7. Tough to say. The Destroids may only be deployed in Military fleets as opposed to emigration fleets. Why would an exploratory mission require heavy mecha ground forces? I'd personally expect them to be deployed with the Marine forces of Spacy not a predominately civilian fleet. Now Miyataki designed the SDFM destroids and Takakura Takeshi could easily design new ones (having worked on Nadesico, Appleseed, and the like), but the story really doesn't seem geared in that direction. I'm just as excited about the VF-171* as I am about the VF-25. Maybe more so even, since the VF-17 has really grown on me a lot. Thanks for those scans Graham! The VF-171* is a curiosity and I'll reserve judgement until we get a better look at one in the coming months... As for CG vs Cell animation of mecha, the animators are still heavily reliant on the computer generating the movements and too often the result is a predictably smooth transformation bewraying that a computer animated the sequence. In some respects, they could take their cues from Hollywood FX houses and how they animate their CG sequences. I am currently watching "Flag" and as beautiful as the cell animation is, the CG still obviously stands out because it is so "perfectly moves" so to speak.... Edited November 13, 2007 by Zinjo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MacrossCN Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 (edited) And here's the scan from the December issue of Animage. Graham VF-171~~~~~~~~~~~~ HAHA Thanks Graham San~~~ Only wait MBS 25th Sepcial program release MF new video. Edited November 14, 2007 by kresphy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Valkyrie addict Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 I don't like the blue hair main character, too gay for me... what happened to the rugged Roy type hero man? all this modern emo crap...I hope they'd redo him a little as in... CUT HIS DAMN HAIR OFF, YOU'RE IN THE MILITARY Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s001 Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Well if you think for a sec Max looks a bit gay in SDFM too and he's still the coolest character of the show, not gay at all. I mean, he's Miria's blue demon Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sketchley Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Of interest is the name given for the new VF-17 is 'VF-171'. Not sure if this is a typo or not. If it is correct, it would be the first Valk with a three digit number designation. FYI, it's captioned as 新型バルキリー VF-171. In English: the latest style [design, model] Valkyrie. As for the VF-25, the caption reads 可変戦闘機：バルキリーの最新鋭機。 In English: State of the the art Valkyrie variable fighter. Expecting [expectation] to be drawn in the recent 3DCG. As time permits, I'm also nearing the completetion of the 2nd article in the Newtype December issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GGemini Posted November 14, 2007 Share Posted November 14, 2007 Thanks Graham San~~~ Only wait MBS 25th Sepcial program release MF new video. Has the air date been set for this MBS Special? It will be nice if it is like the "Macross: Fastest Liftoff" and they not only show the series but also the new toys Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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