Transformer Super Thread 6

[Fit For Natalie]

I have zero broken Macross toys.

Sorry, was a joke, based upon observation of comments made on this forum about first-run Yamato products breaking, and Yamato fixing it later with repaints instead of trying to iron out problems in the first place.

I've kind of lost my passion for Transformers - I think the Armada/Energon/Cybertron lines sucked the joy out of it for me... the Movie was the last time I was actually happy with Transformers - but ultimately I've thrown myself back upon nostalgia and retain only by boxed G1 reissues (both Commemorative and TFC) and a plethora of boxed BW II, BW Neo and BW Takara reissues (BWReborn Primal and Megs too:) ) ...

Animated has me mildly happier than the Kiddie Trilogy - at least I think it does...

But all in all, I guess I really find it annoying that the property is revamped rather than continued all the time...

Another way to put this: I can't remember when the last time I bought a Transformer was....

VFTF1

I thought the Cybertron toys were quite excellent. Classics toys are largely based on Cybertron's design principals (lacking a main gimmick, of course) and asthetics.

Revamping is Transformers' way of surviving in a relatively voltatile market of swinging children's tastes, despite it being one of the mainstays of American boys toys. But mainly it's a way of constantly making money - you can't sell the same exact characters to kids too many times, so they ditch continuities to start anew and flog all new versions of classic trademarks.

Plus, Hasbro was always very dissapointed with how Takara and WE'VE handled the Unicron Trilogy. One would think the three series would have been less of a mess had American writers handled it. The three toylines did pretty well, though, in fact Armada was one of the most successful TF lines they ever had, so it must have appealed to children, and really, that's the single most important thing ever in Transformers, that kids like it. Us adults are just along for the ride, and that's fine by me.

Edited December 25, 2007 by Fit For Natalie

[promethuem5]

I've realized that the Transformers I actually like and want to collect are the Masterpieces, and G1 toys as well... I'd like to have a complete set of '84 and '85, and the main Movie characters. The modern stuff is just too soul-less and kid-toy-like. They're well made toys and all, but I just don't have any use for them.

[Fit For Natalie]

What do you mean by souless?

I mean G1 toys lack character in their designs as they were never designed as characters. What gave them character and soul is fictional characterisation. So frankly, the fault is not because modern Transformers toys are 'souless' (if anything, Transformers are made with soul and character infused into their design, look at Animated Bulkhead), but of poorer modern fiction, particularly the Unicron Trilogy with it's obvious Japanese kids cartoon 'HEY KIDS BUY THIS TOY NOW!' stock footage.

Also, if you are mainly concerned with the TF era you grew up with, then it's possible it's because of your nostalgia for them, because you watched the show or read the comics, or because they're the Optimus Prime you looked up to as a child or the Bumblebee who was your friend. In the same way, kids of the Armada era see Hot Shot as their best buddy (he was VERY popular with kids despite the hatred older fans had for him), and no doubt how kids of the 2007 Movie era will see Bumblebee.

It's all a matter of perspective, I say.

Edited December 25, 2007 by Fit For Natalie

[promethuem5]

See, I'm funny like that too.... I'm only 18, so the best I can claim is that I managed to see the tail-end of G2...

By soul-less, I mean that new TF toys just don't seem as inventive or amazing to me... G1s and such just get me all excited with that wonderful chrome and die-cast parts and less than stellar articulation... plus I enjoy the aesthetic more of the G1 toys... all realistic colors and real cars and planes and such... at least until the movie...

[eriku]

you can't sell the same exact characters to kids too many times...

[secretary voice]

Conference call for FFN. Several characters would like to dispute your claim, including Bert, Ernie, Big Bird, Elmo, Kermit the Frog, Miss Piggy, Fozzie Bear, Yoda, Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Chewbacca, a Stormtrooper, Scooby Do, Snoopy and Charlie Brown, Mickey Mouse, Minnie Mouse, Donald Duck, Bugs Bunny, Wyle-E-Cyote, Daffy Duck, all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Pikachu, Snorlax, Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Wolverine, The Incredible Hulk and Funshine Bear. Press #33 to join the meeting. [/secretary voice]

[Tober]

My return to the TF collecting was because of BT-01. A brilliant redefinition of the G1 charactrers, although that line as well as Alternators has had it's ups and downs. I also started collecting the MP series and have been happy with it so far. So kudos and props to HasTak for them. I think Cybertron gave us some good toys but the only ones I have on display are the legends figures because that's all I need to capture those characters - my few supreme and leader calss figures are now owned by my mate's children as I'm a firm believer that toys are to be played with, not stored MISB - my prerogative. I thought that the Classics line were good and had character, but I never saw a reason to collect it myself. Some of the 6" Titanium line looked good too. The only movie toy I have is BB08 because it is brilliant - an actual advancement in terms of use of the automorph gimmik - difinative proof that Hasbro can deliver when given an appropriate timeframe to develop a toy.

It is however the Yamato Macross stuff that almost never gets removed from my modest display areas. My only real disappointment with that line is that it is mostly limited to the Valkyries.

BTW - is there a term for toys that are aimed at adult collectors such as Binaltechs, Masterpieces and Yamato $200+ Fragile series? I always feel like a regressive geek referring to them as "toys"

[JB0]

See, I'm funny like that too.... I'm only 18, so the best I can claim is that I managed to see the tail-end of G2...

By soul-less, I mean that new TF toys just don't seem as inventive or amazing to me... G1s and such just get me all excited with that wonderful chrome and die-cast parts and less than stellar articulation... plus I enjoy the aesthetic more of the G1 toys... all realistic colors and real cars and planes and such... at least until the movie...

That's the funny thing....

As a kid, I loved Transformers... but even as a kid I was wondering where the joints were.

Now?

I like the aesthetic of the G1 toys, but I just can't stand them. They're unposable bricks for the most part, and several have serious proportion issues.

I've found Cybertron, Classics, and Alternators to all have highly appealing toys(I wasn't looking during Armada and Energon). Classics is the most consistently appealing.

Surprisingly, Cybertron outdoes Alternators in my book. Though I have some adorable cross-series fights on my shelf(Cybertron Unicron ripping a pair of Alternators apart is my favorite, really. It's a remarkably posable toy, though that backpack makes him seriously back-heavy.)

Masterpiece.... is 3 toys and 2 repaints. Of which I own one.

But MP Prime poses very well. One of the few Transformers I have that doesn't look absurdly stiff with the legs straight.

Alternators and Masterpiece are G1 on crack.

Cybertron and Classics are the toys I dreamed of as a kid.

Edited December 25, 2007 by JB0

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

BTW - is there a term for toys that are aimed at adult collectors such as Binaltechs, Masterpieces and Yamato $200+ Fragile series? I always feel like a regressive geek referring to them as "toys" unsure.gif

Collectors items.

As a kid, I loved Transformers... but even as a kid I was wondering where the joints were

Same here. To this day Laser Rod Prime remains one of my favorite Optimus Primes. First it was the same character as G1 Prime but upgraded. Second, he was fully articulated.

[secretary voice]

Conference call for FFN. Several characters would like to dispute your claim, including Bert, Ernie, Big Bird, Elmo, Kermit the Frog, Miss Piggy, Fozzie Bear, Yoda, Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Chewbacca, a Stormtrooper, Scooby Do, Snoopy and Charlie Brown, Mickey Mouse, Minnie Mouse, Donald Duck, Bugs Bunny, Wyle-E-Cyote, Daffy Duck, all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Pikachu, Snorlax, Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Wolverine, The Incredible Hulk and Funshine Bear. Press #33 to join the meeting. [/secretary voice]

You forgot Storm Shadow, and Snake Eyes

The modern stuff is just too soul-less and kid-toy-like.

Thats where you see the difference between mass market toys, and collectors items aimed at adults produced in much smaller quantities.

Sorry, was a joke, based upon observation of comments made on this forum about first-run Yamato products breaking, and Yamato fixing it later with repaints instead of trying to iron out problems in the first place.

There are some recent toys like the first run VF-0S and the VF-0A's which have the arm breakages, but aside that, the fragility of yamato valkyries is almost always highly exaggerated. It doesn't help that there are so many paranoid collectors who think their 1/48 VF-1 is like a model kit and only meant for display, and have heart attack moments when transforming it. The truth is, it is more durable than nearly all of the transformer alternators, yet easier to transform.

Cybertron Unicron ripping a pair of Alternators apart is my favorite, really. It's a remarkably posable toy, though that backpack makes him seriously back-heavy.)

That is one awesome toy. I like his background.

Cybertron had some great figures, including Optimus Prime, who is one of my favorite mainline Primes. I honestly think Cybertron Prime is too overlooked. He has many nonobstrusive gimmicks, is huge in regular robot mode, and has a very stable super mode(especially compared to RID Omega Prime, who I've always thought was one of the most overrated combinations).

[Fit For Natalie]

[secretary voice]

Conference call for FFN. Several characters would like to dispute your claim, including Bert, Ernie, Big Bird, Elmo, Kermit the Frog, Miss Piggy, Fozzie Bear, Yoda, Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Chewbacca, a Stormtrooper, Scooby Do, Snoopy and Charlie Brown, Mickey Mouse, Minnie Mouse, Donald Duck, Bugs Bunny, Wyle-E-Cyote, Daffy Duck, all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Pikachu, Snorlax, Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Wolverine, The Incredible Hulk and Funshine Bear. Press #33 to join the meeting. [/secretary voice]

That's Hasbro's rationale for Transformers, not mine. I suspect it has to do with Transformers characters being comparatively expensive toys than those lines, are are released semi-regularly, so it's easier for them to foist $50 Optimus Prime on people if he's drastically different looking from the last one.

[JB0]

Cybertron had some great figures, including Optimus Prime, who is one of my favorite mainline Primes. I honestly think Cybertron Prime is too overlooked. He has many nonobstrusive gimmicks, is huge in regular robot mode, and has a very stable super mode(especially compared to RID Omega Prime, who I've always thought was one of the most overrated combinations).

Yeah. Cybertron's leader-class Prime is actually near Masterpiece Prime in my "fun-factor" rating.

MP has the nostalgia edge, and heavy metal content, but Cybertron's is pretty slick.

[kensei]

[secretary voice]

Conference call for FFN. Several characters would like to dispute your claim, including Bert, Ernie, Big Bird, Elmo, Kermit the Frog, Miss Piggy, Fozzie Bear, Yoda, Darth Vader, Luke Skywalker, Han Solo, Chewbacca, a Stormtrooper, Scooby Do, Snoopy and Charlie Brown, Mickey Mouse, Minnie Mouse, Donald Duck, Bugs Bunny, Wyle-E-Cyote, Daffy Duck, all four Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Pikachu, Snorlax, Batman, Spiderman, Superman, Wolverine, The Incredible Hulk and Funshine Bear. Press #33 to join the meeting. [/secretary voice]

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Yeah. Cybertron's leader-class Prime is actually near Masterpiece Prime in my "fun-factor" rating.

MP has the nostalgia edge, and heavy metal content, but Cybertron's is pretty slick.

Cybertron Prime surprised the hell out of me. I had no idea he would have good heft, and be remarkably solid and stable. I dig the Mazinger homage in super mode. I also like using the open mouth mode when in regular robot mode, so it gives me something different to see when I put him in his super mode(where I use the battle mask). Articulation is excellent too. The futuristic g1 motif is awesome on it, it just works better on him than on other g1 influenced Prime renditions(sans MP). I like him better than Fire Convoy(also one of my favs).

[kensei]

Yep that was a good toy that one. I still got it, albeit packed away. He's great fun.

[promethuem5]

Classics was a great line... it's just a shame it was considered a filler line by Hasbro when it was my fav. line since Alternators started.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Classics was a great line... it's just a shame it was considered a filler line by Hasbro when it was my fav. line since Alternators started.

Its coming back in fall.

[kensei]

Its coming back in fall.

Any more new prototypes? All I saw was the supposed Jazz. To be honest, the Classics are cool for a month or so, but they take a serious backstep when I get my new 1/60 scale VF stuff.

Edited December 25, 2007 by kensei

[promethuem5]

There haven't been any pics that I know of, but plenty of rumours and news saying we're getting Prowl (I'm super excited), another triple-changer, and a tank character... there's more but I forget what.

And, for the record, Fire Convoy is for some reason my second or third favorite Prime toy ever... it and the three Autobot Car figs from Car-Robots/RID was what got me back into Transformers after the slump at the end of Beast-Wars and the waste of time that was Beast Machines.

Edited December 25, 2007 by promethuem5

[Tober]

Jazz was mentioned as one of the characters that Hasbro want to include but nothing beyond that. Maybe you're thinking of the concept line art for Animated Jazz.

The only concept pics for Classics 2 (now Universe) I remember seeing are Sunstreaker, Sideswipe and Octane. There was Cosmos as well but he's been canned.

Prowl and a new mold for Ultra Magnus have been confirmed.

[Alpha OTS]

A new mold for Classics Ultra Magnus was confirmed? First I heard of that, and surprising since there's an Ultra Magnus in Animated(cartoon at least).

Japanese Classics Megatron revealed:

http://www.tfw2005.com/boards/showthread.php?t=160965

Not digging the chrome at all.

[promethuem5]

I think it looks stellar... why don't you like the chrome? G1 Megs is covered in chrome...

[Alpha OTS]

I think it looks stellar... why don't you like the chrome? G1 Megs is covered in chrome...

Chrome flakes and it tends to look KO-ish. I'd prefer they use the default gray for the chest or a silver paint like Titanium WW Megatron uses.

[Tober]

A new mold for Classics Ultra Magnus was confirmed? First I heard of that, and surprising since there's an Ultra Magnus in Animated(cartoon at least).

The new mold for UM that isn't a repaint is for Animated, not Classics. Sorry about that - serves me right for double-checking against Wikipedia

[kensei]

Chrome flakes and it tends to look KO-ish. I'd prefer they use the default gray for the chest or a silver paint like Titanium WW Megatron uses.

Way better than the clown colours they chose for the other one. I'm getting this one.

[mikeszekely]

Way better than the clown colours they chose for the other one. I'm getting this one.

Agree, but what I want to know is why we didn't get that one in the first place. There's plenty of safety orange on it still... you're really telling me that every other Classics toy was colored very similarly to their original G1 selves except Megatron? (OK, and Astrotrain, but I like him in white.)

[protogarland]

Forgive me if this question is asked before....

One of my x-mas gifts this year was the Hasbro Transformers Optimus Prime from the craptacular Michael Bay directed movie. How the HELL do you transform that thing?!?! I grew up with G1 Transformers in the 80's and they were NEVER that complicated. Hell, even the Yamato 1/48ths aren't this complicated.

I find it funny how the box says that the transformers are for ages 5 and up. Seriously, 5 year olds are able to transform these things?!?! I must be getting old.

If anyone knows how to do this or can send me to someplace that has more detailed instructions than the minimalist manual, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks.

Cheers!

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Agree, but what I want to know is why we didn't get that one in the first place. There's plenty of safety orange on it still... you're really telling me that every other Classics toy was colored very similarly to their original G1 selves except Megatron? (OK, and Astrotrain, but I like him in white.)

US safety laws.

The new mold for UM that isn't a repaint is for Animated, not Classics. Sorry about that - serves me right for double-checking against Wikipedia

I don't think its ever been stated specifically which line he would fall under, just that there would be an Ultra Magnus that wouldn't be a repaint of Prime. I am skeptical of wikipedia.

[Tober]

Forgive me if this question is asked before....

One of my x-mas gifts this year was the Hasbro Transformers Optimus Prime from the craptacular Michael Bay directed movie. How the HELL do you transform that thing?!?! I grew up with G1 Transformers in the 80's and they were NEVER that complicated. Hell, even the Yamato 1/48ths aren't this complicated.

I find it funny how the box says that the transformers are for ages 5 and up. Seriously, 5 year olds are able to transform these things?!?! I must be getting old.

If anyone knows how to do this or can send me to someplace that has more detailed instructions than the minimalist manual, I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks.

Cheers!

Voyager or Leader class? I don't own either but YouTube would be the first place I would try looking.

I don't think its ever been stated specifically which line he would fall under, just that there would be an Ultra Magnus that wouldn't be a repaint of Prime. I am skeptical of wikipedia.

His line art for Animated has surfaced.

.

[David Hingtgen]

Hasbro instructions just suck. (I think Yamato's do too, but at least they use angled photos, and not perspective-less CAD lines)

I'm waiting for the chrome repaint of Prime to buy one, or I'd help.

[protogarland]

Voyager or Leader class? I don't own either but YouTube would be the first place I would try looking.

His line art for Animated has surfaced.

.

It is this one: http://www.walmart.com/catalog/product.do?product_id=5892752

[Tober]

That would be the Leader class toy then.

This is the first vid I came across on YouTube and it looks good for transformation information from vehicle to robot - I guess you will basically have to reverse it to get him into truck mode.

From about 3:20 onwards.

edit: Actually

is better.

.

Edited December 26, 2007 by Tober

[JB0]

US safety laws.

Only some states. They were just making sure they had all the bases covered, so they could sell it anywhere in the US.

[protogarland]

That would be the Leader class toy then.

This is the first vid I came across on YouTube and it looks good for transformation information from vehicle to robot - I guess you will basically have to reverse it to get him into truck mode.

From about 3:20 onwards.

edit: Actually

is better.

.

Cool. Thanks for the link.

[Alpha OTS]

Only some states. They were just making sure they had all the bases covered, so they could sell it anywhere in the US.

I think they did pretty good considering. It's pretty obvious they worked in Galvatron colors to do it too, which I think is pretty clever. It could have been much worse.

I'll definitely buy the Japanese Classics Megs because it's closer to a G1 color scheme than the U.S. release was, but I'm still dissappointed that they used chrome instead of silver paint. It looks like they're working chrome into all of the figures. Prime's front grill looks like chrome, and Grimlock has a large splash of it too.

[Vermillion21]

Yeah, I'll probably pickup Japanese Classics Megatron too, if I can get it at a decent price.

[JB0]

I think they did pretty good considering. It's pretty obvious they worked in Galvatron colors to do it too, which I think is pretty clever. It could have been much worse.

Yeah. Megs came out a lot better than I expected, too.

I'll definitely buy the Japanese Classics Megs because it's closer to a G1 color scheme than the U.S. release was, but I'm still dissappointed that they used chrome instead of silver paint. It looks like they're working chrome into all of the figures. Prime's front grill looks like chrome, and Grimlock has a large splash of it too.

I love chrome.

This makes me want the whole damn J Classics line.

Fortunately, I don't do a lot of internet shopping. My wallet may yet survive.

...

Or I may make a habit of 'net shopping, and my wallet will descend into previously unseen depths of emptiness.