Star Wars: Force Unleased

[Warmaker]

Having a Star Wars game without Jedi is a little like having a western without cowboys. Or jidaigeki without samurai.

And we still don't know what that whole Star Destroyer thing was about.

Just as you've repeated your statement from elsewhere, I'll repeat mine again:

There's more to Star Wars than Lightsabers and the Force.

The Jedi are but one aspect of Star Wars that make the franchise what it is. But Lucasarts has been heavily leaning on that single angle for years ever since Episode I came out. "Empire At War" was finally a Star Wars game that wasn't practically centered on the Force.

Back onto the subject of increasingly overpowered Force abilities. Next thing you know you'll have someone sucking the life out of people on an entire planet by using the Force, killing them all. Oh wait, they did that already with Darth Nihillus in KoTOR II.

Wonder what they're going to do next to surpass the ridiculousness of that.

[eugimon]

Using the force to wipe out planets actually makes sense the way the Force is conecptualized.. it binds everything together, so why couldn't some one use it to wipe out whole populations, or even planets? It seems far more reasonable to me than the death star, actually.

[JsARCLIGHT]

I think the point of contention "so powerful one man can destroy worlds" IMHO is more an issue of device driven storytelling that it's ability to "actually happen" in the story world. You don't see that kind of power in the movies because it would be boring... what "conflict" and "tension" would there be knowing that Luke, Vader or Obi Wan could simply "win" by wiping out the entire enemy fleet in one sweep of their hand? Where would the adventure, action and drama be if the rebellion vanished in a blink of the Palpatine's eye? or the entire Death Star, or even the entire empire, vanishing if Luke simply "wills" it to be gone?

It has always been my assumption that crazy "unseen" super force powers are usually not used because of the story problems they create, not because they "can't exist". Yoda lifting an X-Wing is a story element just as much as it is a "force power", its main "point" was to show Yoda possessed a ton of power in his small, old body... and what better way to do that than to have him lift a fighter a hundred times his size? The problem with using that as a story element is in some people's eyes it becomes a Pandora's box... once one character does something it's assumed everyone else of the same "skill level" can and will have the ability to do the same thing at will. Just like with Palpatine and the lightning... you see one Sith throw a few lightning bolts and all of a sudden every Sith is supposed to be able to do it.

Heck, "back in the day" before the prequels I always thought that Yoda would not even need to "fight" people. I always assumed he was "so powerful" that he wouldn't even need a lightsaber... that his "power" in his prime was so vast that he could win one on one "physical fights" without even fighting, which when you think about it would be the pure function of the light side of the force: to achieve peaceful ends without fighting. I always saw lightsabers as a "knight" weapon, a physical device to aid those who were not yet "masters" of the force... used because their skill was not yet good enough to fight without it's help. Creating a sort of "pecking order" of Star Wars weaponry just like real life... for trained killers the list goes Rifle, pistol, knife and finally bare hands. For force users it went blaster, lightsaber then finally pure force. For Yoda, being the only "master" other than the Emperor that we see in the original movies, is it not much of an assumption at that time to think that they transcended the use of mere weapons in their "fights"?

But then the prequels come out and pretty much mess up all that... they show us that Jedi, even master Jedi, are nothing more than glorified mystical fliptacular ninjas with cellular irregularities that grant them their magical powers. I blame the new movies for taking all the "mysticism" out of the force and replacing it with a bunch of chop-socky ju-jitsu, special effects lightning and gravity flipping parlor tricks which breed the feeling that the use of the force is so limited to only martial engagements and the occasional claravoiance or telekinesis. Then when you have someone show a force ability so vast and incredible people just say "nope... impossible". To that degree I believe it's not "impossible" as much as it is a "story based limitation"... if someone found a way to rectify crazy building moving, planet killing, universe warping force powers into a storyline that was not shallow and goofy or that ended the second the main character "won" by simply thinking about it then good on them.

[007-vf1]

For me this whole unleashed thing makes some sense.

If there exist the special chosen one that can rule above all other sith/jedi then it makes sense they can expotentialy increase their power given they go through a mutation or some sort of "magical" enhancement like an over hormonal midiclorianized breakfast...?

yeah this new jedi are bit over the top but if someone can lift an x-wing with it's own concentration why can't someone eventually stop a planet from orbiting..??

I guess we'll have to wait and see where all this summes up to be...

[Mog]

Meh, I'm more intrigued by the action figures than the game itself.

Besides, haven't the creators themselves said the theme of the game is "Using the Force kick someone's ass" (or words to that effect)?

[Smiley424]

This game looks great, just in stretching the high definition envelope if nothing else. Course, I've always liked Jedi/Sith and think they're fundamental to the game?

Star Destroyer? "The ability to destroy a planet is insignificant next to the power of the Force." Some of the novels had Luke's Jedi Academy pushing out multiple Star Destroyers beyond their system IIRC... I never took it that The Emperor and Vader didn't have such power, but that they were more discrete with it's use, at least for the more grandiose stuff. Or those that saw such things "forgot" it (or died soon after witnessing it), or they somewhat in the know anyway (the Emperor's stooges/advisors, Royal Guard, Hands, etc).

It was a group of Jedi (about 8 or so I think) that accomplished that feat of pushing about 12 or so ISDs out of the system. But in that instance they were on top of the stone temple on Yavin 4, which were built by Exar Kun to harness or channel the Force and the Jedi focused their power through Dorsk 81, who died after accomplishing the task.

That being said, I always thought that it was a matter of concentration or lack of distractions. In the video, the character seems to by fully engrossed in the act of bringing down the star destroyer. This I find plausible because he is channeling all his power into doing that. Now if he was doing that while also fighting off stormtroopers at the same time, I would have a problem with that.

JsARCLIGHT, I totally agree with your statement.

[wwwmwww]

And I have to agree. Stopping a ISD? Nope. No friggin way. I dont care what anyone says. If I didnt see Yoda, Vader, Palpy, or anyone else do something similar or near it, it can't happen.

Maybe this apprentice is familiar with the engine room on an ISD and all he did was use the force to flip the off switch. Gravity could have done all the rest of the work. In that sense Yoda LIFTING an X-Wing would have been harder.

Just a thought...

Carl

[mister_e]

In my opinion, this game is just an example of putting a stronger emphasis on gameplay and fun-factor and not worrying about the"reality" of the universe that is set in. Let's face it, for every hard-core SW fan out there that wants a game featuring non-Jedi, there are probably 100 people who would much rather be a Jedi. This game is just catering to that larger/broader audience. Just my opinion, of course. All that said, it looks like it might be a lot of fun

[eugimon]

In my opinion, this game is just an example of putting a stronger emphasis on gameplay and fun-factor and not worrying about the"reality" of the universe that is set in. Let's face it, for every hard-core SW fan out there that wants a game featuring non-Jedi, there are probably 100 people who would much rather be a Jedi. This game is just catering to that larger/broader audience. Just my opinion, of course. All that said, it looks like it might be a lot of fun

Well said.

[Duke Togo]

Really, I don't like the EU much at all. I'm a movies guy, and that's what I judge everything else off of. However, it doesn't mean I can't enjoy chopping the hell out of various life forms with a lightsaber. Whether its Jedi Outcast/Academy or KotOR, those Jedi bring me back every time. New games with lightsabers and lots of Force powers? Totally hot. Not for PC, not interested.

[CoryHolmes]

In my opinion, this game is just an example of putting a stronger emphasis on gameplay and fun-factor and not worrying about the"reality" of the universe that is set in. Let's face it, for every hard-core SW fan out there that wants a game featuring non-Jedi, there are probably 100 people who would much rather be a Jedi. This game is just catering to that larger/broader audience. Just my opinion, of course. All that said, it looks like it might be a lot of fun

You speak the truth. And for all my battying about Jedi-oriented games, whenever I'm in an RPG group that's playing Star Wars I call first dibs on the Jedi Go figure

And this game does look to be a great deal of fun, but it's already got one massive, glaring error. No James Earl Jones. No JEJ = Not a good Darth Vader.

Edited July 16, 2007 by CoryHolmes

[LePoseur]

I always saw lightsabers as a "knight" weapon, a physical device to aid those who were not yet "masters" of the force... used because their skill was not yet good enough to fight without it's help.

There must have been a lot of this going around, as I entertained the same thoughts while Star Wars still occupied my thoughts in the early 80's. At the very least I assumed that Yoda and Palpatine had reached the level where they didn't need to carry a personal weapon since if confronted by someone with one they could be expected to disarm them without effort, and in the case of old Palpy at least turn it against the owner. Of course that could have been from watching too many martial arts exploitation films on TV at the same age. But I was definitely down with the division between the knights of the order and the masters.

While it didn't rape my childhood at all, I just was a bit disappointed that my childhood spun adventures in Star Wars land seemed to hold together better for me (of course there's a bias though ) than the story George finally settled on. Oh well though, that's life.

[Sundown]

While it didn't rape my childhood at all, I just was a bit disappointed that my childhood spun adventures in Star Wars land seemed to hold together better for me (of course there's a bias though ) than the story George finally settled on. Oh well though, that's life.

You're not alone. I'd always gotten the impression that Jedi masters had outgrown the usefulness of lightsabers as well, as they could channel the force and use it directly as a weapon, most exemplified by the force lightning trick.

[eugimon]

use a light saber, kenobi did, master, he was. Vader, a master as well, used a lighter saber, he did. <- my yoda impersonation.

[Kurisama]

Although i can't say too much - as dumb (i think) as it looks, the ISD getting force-crashed has been completely OK'd by Mr.Lucas. On an up note - in game looks cool, and the concept art is top notch. It plays much like a God of War, but in the SW universe.

[CoryHolmes]

Although i can't say too much - as dumb (i think) as it looks, the ISD getting force-crashed has been completely OK'd by Mr.Lucas. On an up note - in game looks cool, and the concept art is top notch. It plays much like a God of War, but in the SW universe.

How do you know what it plays like? Nothing about gameplay has been released.

[Knight26]

Adding some fuel to the fire, looks like lucasarts used this sci-fi meshes member's ISD Model for the ISD in the cutscene.

[eugimon]

wow. that would really suck if it's the case.

kinda explains why that ISD looks so different from all the other models in the trailer though.

[Ishimaru]

Wow that sucks, the dude can make some serious money off of Lucasarts if they did do that.

I'm seeing fired employees in the future.

[Kurisama]

How do you know what it plays like? Nothing about gameplay has been released.

All i'm going to say is that i'm close to the source. :-D But in regards to the ISD rip off thingie, i heard that it (the intro cutscene) was done by a seperate company than the game developer, but i'm not 100% sure as i'm not involved with that project.

[Knight26]

Well if you read the linked thread there really is nothing he can do about it, and he really doesn't want any money at this point, just some recognition for his work, a line in the credits would be enough.

[Warmaker]

Adding some fuel to the fire, looks like lucasarts used this sci-fi meshes member's ISD Model for the ISD in the cutscene.

It's unfortunate.

Not only a lack of creativity from Lucasarts these days, but a lack of technical ability.

[one_klump]

I also dig the reverse saber grip, but it must have been really dangerous to practice lol

I don't really have a problem with the uber force powers, but I do have an issue how they will be controlled with a controller.

[CoryHolmes]

I don't mind the reverse grip, it's kinda nifty. But I draw the line at some of the more absurd ieterations they're using in this game, like light-tonfas. No, no, no. That strikes me as fan-wanking and I don't want it.

[Smiley424]

Yeah, I don't know about those tonfas. I don't care who you are, if hit with enought force, those are gonna slice into your forearms, how useful is that? I can accept staff type sabers and would even like to see something akin to eskrima stick sabers but tonfas? Please

[CoryHolmes]

Yeah, I don't know about those tonfas. I don't care who you are, if hit with enought force, those are gonna slice into your forearms, how useful is that? I can accept staff type sabers and would even like to see something akin to eskrima stick sabers but tonfas? Please

For me, it's more a matter of principle. The staff-type is a somewhat logical extension of the idea. But what's next? Light nunchuks? Light sais?

[Jolly Rogers]

Dunno if this has been posted yet:

http://www.hellblazer.net/2007/07/23/recursion-shot-first/

[eugimon]

HAHAHAHA. lucas, what a sense of humor.

[Smiley424]

Nice. Seems like people on that page can't believe it, but considering he owns all things Star Wars, it makes sense that he would have any official star wars t-shirt or other apparel.

[Warmaker]

Nice

[mikeszekely]

I gotta wonder... where's all the discussion been? The demo came out a few days ago, and I just played it. You know a game is good when killing people with a lightsaber or Force lightning are the boring ways. It's all about the Force Grip. Learning to use it well takes a little practice, but the demo mission starts you in a hallway with tons of stuff to grab and nothing more threatening than a few gonk and astromech droids.

As you start to get used to it, the fun starts. Grab a guy, throw him at his friends. Grab a box, throw it at a guy. Grab a guy, launch him off the platform. Grab a guy, throw him at a TIE. Grab a TIE, throw it at a guy. There's enough different things in the environments, people, crates, equipment, hunks of the wall, metal supports, people, etc, that it never really felt old.

At one point, you encounter an AT-ST. My first reaction was, "Oh crap." After playing a ton of Battlefront, I was instinctively leery of going up against an AT-ST without rockets or vehicle of my own, but hey, Starkiller's tougher than that. I threw a few Stormtroopers at it, then ran up to it while it was reeling from the blows. A God of War style button-press sequence came up that had Starkiller slice the AT-ST in half.

Star Wars games have been pretty hit or miss. For every Battlefront or KOTOR we get we also get a Masters of Teras Kasi or an Episode III, so I'd been pretty indifferent about Force Unleashed before. But after playing the demo, the game's gone straight to the top of my Must Buy list.

Oh, and I heard the game's canon. And not EU canon, but Lucas-blessed movie canon. Can anyone confirm that?

[eugimon]

I thought the demo was just okay. It just felt way too much like a technology demo, the gameplay mechanics just didn't feel that polished to me.

[Warmaker]

I never had been impressed by TFU at any point in time, so I bypassed it. There are only 2 things that I'd like to see come back in glory as far as Star Wars video gaming goes:

1) A good RPG / MMORPG set in the SW universe. It's been years since KotOR came out, and KotOR II (from a different company) was ambitious but disastrous. SWG?... nah. A dramatic thread of disappointment in itself. Bioware's SW MMORPG I'm hoping comes out right.

2) A good SW space combat game. Not the forcibly limited, little "bubble arenas" of the Rogue Squadron / Rogue Leader games. No rail shooters. I'm talking about space combat games like they used to have in the 90s. Stuff like the X-Wing series and Freespace 2.

[Keith]

I gotta wonder... where's all the discussion been? The demo came out a few days ago, and I just played it. You know a game is good when killing people with a lightsaber or Force lightning are the boring ways. It's all about the Force Grip. Learning to use it well takes a little practice, but the demo mission starts you in a hallway with tons of stuff to grab and nothing more threatening than a few gonk and astromech droids.

As you start to get used to it, the fun starts. Grab a guy, throw him at his friends. Grab a box, throw it at a guy. Grab a guy, launch him off the platform. Grab a guy, throw him at a TIE. Grab a TIE, throw it at a guy. There's enough different things in the environments, people, crates, equipment, hunks of the wall, metal supports, people, etc, that it never really felt old.

At one point, you encounter an AT-ST. My first reaction was, "Oh crap." After playing a ton of Battlefront, I was instinctively leery of going up against an AT-ST without rockets or vehicle of my own, but hey, Starkiller's tougher than that. I threw a few Stormtroopers at it, then ran up to it while it was reeling from the blows. A God of War style button-press sequence came up that had Starkiller slice the AT-ST in half.

Star Wars games have been pretty hit or miss. For every Battlefront or KOTOR we get we also get a Masters of Teras Kasi or an Episode III, so I'd been pretty indifferent about Force Unleashed before. But after playing the demo, the game's gone straight to the top of my Must Buy list.

Oh, and I heard the game's canon. And not EU canon, but Lucas-blessed movie canon. Can anyone confirm that?

I totally agree. I had little interest in this game before playing the demo. Now I'm all geared up to snag it. I just wish slicing into storm troopers/rebels chopped them up like it did slicing into droids. Maybe the full game will have a more body part flying friendl option.

[Duke Togo]

I threw a few Stormtroopers at it

That there is comedy.

I've been waiting for what, 4 years since the last Jedi Knight game, to be able to play another game like this. For me, hurling force powers and chopping up guys with a lightsaber just never gets old.