Down to brass tacks. . .

[do not disturb]

we asked about these shoulders and it took quite a while to get a response and an incorrect response at that.

we asked about why we're being charged for replacement parts that should be free, which he still hasn't gotten back to us about.

hes totally 100% down with yamato at this point and as much as he wants to keep things real here, hes not going to give up his relationship with them by telling us the whole truth when they requested him not to. and who can blame him? he gets to see all the new stuff they put out, and he doesn't pay for the productuion samples he receives. so if you see it from that perspective, hes got a lot to lose if he doesn't play it their way, and thats why i feel the way i do.

none of this is fact, just my conspiracy theory of why we were kept in the dark for weeks on something we've been wondering about for months, only to find out weeks after the release that the shin/ghost combo is a lemon like the 0S and the previous 0A.

not to mention the still unresolved issue of why we're being charged $30+ for 4 tiny pieces of plastic? yeah yeah yeah, they included the entire assembly.....that no one even needs.

[nightmareB4macross]

we asked about these shoulders and it took quite a while to get a response and an incorrect response at that.

we asked about why we're being charged for replacement parts that should be free, which he still hasn't gotten back to us about.

hes totally 100% down with yamato at this point and as much as he wants to keep things real here, hes not going to give up his relationship with them by telling us the whole truth when they requested him not to. and who can blame him? he gets to see all the new stuff they put out, and he doesn't pay for the productuion samples he receives. so if you see it from that perspective, hes got a lot to lose if he doesn't play it their way, and thats why i feel the way i do.

none of this is fact, just my conspiracy theory of why we were kept in the dark for weeks on something we've been wondering about for months, only to find out weeks after the release that the shin/ghost combo is a lemon like the 0S and the previous 0A.

not to mention the still unresolved issue of why we're being charged $30+ for 4 tiny pieces of plastic? yeah yeah yeah, they included the entire assembly.....that no one even needs.

I don't know why, but you actually get the whole arm and not just the replacement parts for the shoulder. Could be the reason for the the $30.00 charge.

[Dante74]

Some people's VF-0S elbow joints broke, I don't think they will complain about getting the whole arm instead of just the shoulder.

[Beware of Blast]

I think it's sufficient that we direct our ultimate grivances on Yamato and the people that run it alone. However, Yamato's general flippant attitude toward their customers and their unchanging, ever over-bloated sense of self worth (ie: their quality vs their pricing) isn't helping anyone - particularly for individual non-insiders. So, it's no wonder they will eventually be tagged as guilty by association.

Subsequent glowing reviews that ignore and downplay the obvious, nagging issues that ought to be addressed immediately after the first release; but is not (read: NEVER), doesn't help Yamato's position nor their customers.

But don't be too hard on Graham, this site is nothing without his vast knowledge on Macross toys and firearms.

It's better to be focussed on Yamato and the dumbarses that run it though.

[Beware of Blast]

Some people's VF-0S elbow joints broke, I don't think they will complain about getting the whole arm instead of just the shoulder.

It's not the whole arm, but the entire approach taken to resolve the matter - the having to pay $30 shipped and the time that is wasted, when this whole endeavor should have been handled and paid for by Yamato themselves.

And yeah, the whole arm instead of just the shoulders, complaint... it's like the rope of your bullock cart that broke - and Yamato sends you a cow tied to it and you have to pay for the entire shipping. What's stupid is that the original cow that came with the broken rope in your possesion isn't even strangled - yet. It's a lotta bollocks coming for them as far as Yamato is concerned.

[Graham]

Contrary to popular belief, I'm not in contact with Yamato daily. There are times when I might get several phone calls or emails from them in a week, then other frequent dry spells when I don't get any calls or email replies from them for several weeks in a row.

Although I have the office and cell phone numbers for my contacts, I don't like to abuse the privilage by bugging them incessantly with phone calls. Instead I usually email them and if they are free to give me info, they will call.

Also, they are very busy people. I'm also pretty busy. And as much as I wish it did, my entire life does not revolve around Macrossworld or Yamato toys. Unfortunately, the days where I had a job that let me spend long hours working on Macrossworld updates are long gone.

And 'do not disturb', your post #98 on the previous page is pushing the limit of what I will tolerate.

Graham

[eugimon]

Hey Graham, thanks for the posts and for the information. I think the problem here is that we're hearing one thing from you, and then when things actually start, what information we get is pretty different then what was told us.

I'm not saying you, or yamato should be at our beck and call... but for many people, putting down a hundred or several hundred dollars on our hobby, only to find that the merchandise to be either defective or poorly designed and then to find that there's little support for us... well, it makes people angry and angry people say stupid things. Especially when weeks go by and we don't hear any news.

Anyways, thanks again.

[DARKWIND]

Just cool your jets. . .

I started this thread to see if any other members were having the same issues with the newer toys.

Not to be a witch hunt or flame session at the owner of the website who just happens to get the inside dope on most things Yamato plans.

Who knows they might have screwed Graham over last minute and chose to go with ABS.

Or, (dare I say it) the almighty POM idea wasn't all it was cracked up to be.

So far as I can recall he never seemed to try pull a fast one on us before, so why start now especially on an item as hotly debated as this.

I don't really see the benefit of knowingly passing bad info to members on a site that he pays for and enjoys as much as rest of us here do.

Also, I have yet to see Yamato put up a sales banner/link to garner/weasle our hard earned dollars out of our pockets.

Sure he may give good previews/reviews for their toys, but that is because he does get to see them sort of in the making.

What comes out of the factory for the final result is anyone's ball game.

Name one member here who would not want to be in his shoes, be it with Yamato, Bandai, Hasegawa, Hasbro, Takara, Takatoku or any other company that could produce good versions of these Macross toys.

You too would be stoked to have the inside scoop and be pissed if it look like you were being BS'd in front of fellow fans that you respected and respected you.

The choice is yours to buy or boycott. . .

But don't try and light a fire under his shorts cause he didn't give an answer quickly or tell you what you wanted to hear.

Just stay on topic and leave the flames at the door. . .

Edited June 26, 2007 by DARKWIND

[jenius]

none of this is fact, just my conspiracy theory of why we were kept in the dark for weeks on something we've been wondering about for months, only to find out weeks after the release that the shin/ghost combo is a lemon like the 0S and the previous 0A.

Man, I'm with you 90% of the time but I think you're out ahead of yourself this time (as conspiracy theorists are apt to occasionally be). He is a conveyor of information and takes the roll of the messenger. You are the man willing to kill the messenger and even going so far as to be angry with him when there is no message to convey. I have almost no free time these days but when I do I like to contribute to my own Macross/RT site in the hopes that it will help people out. Graham puts my tiniest of tiny contributions to shame. If you don't believe him, or if you disagree with him, then simple patience will reward you with answers from others and in that time you'll probably see the price of the product drop any way. Now is a good time to simmer.

[Mowe]

I am not happy about my VF-0A combo but I don't think it is fair to accuse any MW members for mis-lead info. Graham is not a Yamato staff, he only told us what he heard, so I don’t think we can blame him for Yamato’s problem.

Had I been more cautious, I should have wait for reviews, instead of pre-ordering. Now that I have learnt my lesson, I will never pre-order Yamato Valks again. I am pretty sure many people have hold back pre-ordering of the SV-51 and if Yamato doesn’t raise its game, they will eventually dig themselves a hole.

[Omni Existence]

we asked about these shoulders and it took quite a while to get a response and an incorrect response at that.

we asked about why we're being charged for replacement parts that should be free, which he still hasn't gotten back to us about.

hes totally 100% down with yamato at this point and as much as he wants to keep things real here, hes not going to give up his relationship with them by telling us the whole truth when they requested him not to. and who can blame him? he gets to see all the new stuff they put out, and he doesn't pay for the productuion samples he receives. so if you see it from that perspective, hes got a lot to lose if he doesn't play it their way, and thats why i feel the way i do.

none of this is fact, just my conspiracy theory of why we were kept in the dark for weeks on something we've been wondering about for months, only to find out weeks after the release that the shin/ghost combo is a lemon like the 0S and the previous 0A.

not to mention the still unresolved issue of why we're being charged $30+ for 4 tiny pieces of plastic? yeah yeah yeah, they included the entire assembly.....that no one even needs.

Give the man a break.

Graham doesn't owe the lot of us anything, yet he's providing us awesome service with whatever information he can squeeze from Yamato, and he's been doing it for years. To even insinuate that he's just screwing with us at the behest of Yamato, is waaaaaay out of line.

You owe the man an apology.

If you feel you're being screwed by Yamato, don't buy their stuff, or boycott them even. It's an old addage around here, but it's the most logical.

[kensei]

Amen...that wasn't cool.

[do not disturb]

graham and others,

sorry that i tend to be blunt and straight forward but i don't like beating around the bush. i've always been an accuse first ask questions later kind of guy so it shouldn't be anything new to anyone here. sometimes i feel i have to be the d!ck because i feel people don't want to or are afraid to speak up because they'll get hated on by the rest of the board. i don't care for all that madness and just call things the way i see it. my opinion was based in the information i was provided and/or not provided, its as simple as that. sorry i can't make a "safe/PC" post, thats just not my style.

anyway, eugimon pretty much stated how i feel without my insuations...

Hey Graham, thanks for the posts and for the information. I think the problem here is that we're hearing one thing from you, and then when things actually start, what information we get is pretty different then what was told us.

I'm not saying you, or yamato should be at our beck and call... but for many people, putting down a hundred or several hundred dollars on our hobby, only to find that the merchandise to be either defective or poorly designed and then to find that there's little support for us... well, it makes people angry and angry people say stupid things. Especially when weeks go by and we don't hear any news.

Anyways, thanks again.

[ruskiiVFaussie]

Well confirmation on the Shin set is high priority for me.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

Some people's VF-0S elbow joints broke, I don't think they will complain about getting the whole arm instead of just the shoulder.

And now recently one of our member's VF-0 had a busted bicep/elbow on his replacement VF-0S POM arms.

[Roy's Blues]

A little history before the rant.

I bought and resold a cannon fodder VF-0A, due to the weak shoulder issue.

I received my Shin combo from the great store Lost and Found Toys yesterday.

It has been transformed from aircraft to robot once.

First pic is the left arm. Second pic is the right arm.

No that white spot is not camera flash glare

both arms. stress marks.

I'm gonna keep it and just loosen the shoulders, apply some clear nail polish, but I am starting to rethink my Ivanoff pre-order

edited for ms paint app.

Edited July 18, 2007 by Roy's Blues

[ruskiiVFaussie]

Can someone please tell me if i unscew the arms (problem area) will

this negate/reduce the possibility of the crackage people have had with previous

release VF-0s?? I loosened mine after one transformation cycle, but i gotta know is this a sure fire method?

Edited June 27, 2007 by ruskiiVFaussie

[Chet]

It appears to alleviate the problem for the most part. Of course, then your Battroid will never be able to raise its arms for long.

These problems have convinced me to pass on the VF-0A Shin and Ghost as well. Will wait until these issues are satisfactorily resolved or the toy's price is slashed SUBSTANTIALLY.

[ruskiiVFaussie]

It appears to alleviate the problem for the most part. Of course, then your Battroid will never be able to raise its arms for long.

These problems have convinced me to pass on the VF-0A Shin and Ghost as well. Will wait until these issues are satisfactorily resolved or the toy's price is slashed SUBSTANTIALLY.

I will have another look at it today, i believe there is only one screw that i needed to loosen, and well

i loosened the other one too, bah i'll come back with pics. Confusing.

[Vermillion21]

Been away from the MW boards for a long time ...

And after reading this thread & the older one on the VF-0S & VF-0A shoulder problems ... wow. I am thankful that I didn't have enough money to buy either model (instead, I kinda caught the Transformer bug for the last year).

I was thinking of getting the Shin combo, but I think I'll pass or wait a little longer.

Sorry to hear about all these breakages guys ... but thanks for sharing.

[Valkyrie addict]

that's it!! I'm ditching toys and moving to models!!

hmmm...glad I ran out of money before I preordered this, hahaha!! kidding

anyway!, let me get this straight, for most of you guys, the toy is pretty tight, nothing loose or weak, only problem is the shoulder showing stress marks due to possibly overtighten screws?? that's it... maybe we should just wait a while longer to see if it's just a stress mark that can hold or if it will eventually break...

like the YF-19 neck hinge thingy, everyone has stress marks but only one member has broken it... let's not jump into conclusion so quickly

[Beware of Blast]

anyway!, let me get this straight, for most of you guys, the toy is pretty tight, nothing loose or weak, only problem is the shoulder showing stress marks due to possibly overtighten screws?? that's it... maybe we should just wait a while longer to see if it's just a stress mark that can hold or if it will eventually break...

You can't possibly over tighten the screws - this will damage the plastic treads. The stressmarks and breakages are due WEAK plastic.

like the YF-19 neck hinge thingy, everyone has stress marks but only one member has broken it... let's not jump into conclusion so quickly

No only one member. If you follow any 1/60 YF19 threads, you'll see for yourself this ain't no jumping to conclusions.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

that's it!! I'm ditching toys and moving to models!!

hmmm...glad I ran out of money before I preordered this, hahaha!! kidding

anyway!, let me get this straight, for most of you guys, the toy is pretty tight, nothing loose or weak, only problem is the shoulder showing stress marks due to possibly overtighten screws?? that's it... maybe we should just wait a while longer to see if it's just a stress mark that can hold or if it will eventually break...

like the YF-19 neck hinge thingy, everyone has stress marks but only one member has broken it... let's not jump into conclusion so quickly

Nope. Long story short, all current VF-0 releases have ABS shoulder pieces. Due to chemical reactions between the plastic, and/or the shape of the ball joint, or construction techniques in the factory that weaken them, it seems inevitable that the pieces will have develop stress marks and possibly break. This has happened with many of our members.

A few members recieved the replacement VF-0S arms from hlj.com with POM shoulders in place of ABS. Stress marks have still developed, and one member who tried taking a pic had a bicep/elbow joint destroyed.

It might be inevitable. The only way to avoid this is to never transform your VF-0 and just stare at it. Bear in mind some of the VF-0's that broke were handled by members here who are very careful with their toys.

So the conclusion is that something wrong is still going on and the problem has yet to be fixed. It has just been band aided.

[Beware of Blast]

So the conclusion is that something wrong is still going on and the problem has yet to be fixed. It has just been band aided.

I like to see Yamato band aided.

[PsYcHoDyNaMiX]

Just a little off topic, but since you guys were talking about the YF-19 hinge joints... I replied to the current YF-19 mod thread with this:

http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...mp;#entry495886

EDIT***

If this is one of the major problems then I think this can seriously be band aided by Yamato as a very simple QC issue.

Edited June 27, 2007 by PsYcHoDyNaMiX

[Vic Mancini]

Can someone please tell me if i unscew the arms (problem area) will

this negate/reduce the possibility of the crackage people have had with previous

release VF-0s?? I loosened mine after one transformation cycle, but i gotta know is this a sure fire method?

How is anyone supposed to answer that? Nobody knows what method will be a 100% sure fix. If you're worried about your shoulders, (which you seem to be), and you think loosening screws will help, then go for it and hope for the best. Nobody can guarantee anything at this point. The severity of the problem hasn't even been accurately assesed, and even if it was, nobody has had enough time to properly test any of the solutions to see if they will withstand the test of time.

Ask this question again in about a year.

[Mowe]

The best thing to do right now is just leave the toy alone and admire it from a distant. I am positively sure it is not a good idea to rotate the shoulder (the ball joint) too much. I also think slightly loosen the screws (shoulder and elbow) would ease off the stress.

[ghostryder]

Someone might want to try loosening the screws, and also replacing/adding to that dinky little piece of black rubber inside the shoulder so there is some friction to hold the damn arm up in gerwalk/battroid mode. That way, the friction won't cause stress on the weak part of the socket assembly.

Of course, I would only do this if I could remove the arm from the ball after loosening the screws. Forcing the arm off might cause more cracks.

[Matt Random]

I finally mustered the courage to open my Shin 0A. A careful examination has shown that I have a prestressed 0A. One shoulder has a stress mark on it. I'm not too worried since it doesn't look like it will get any worse and I did loosen the screws just to be safe. It does seem to me that the ball of the joint isn't perfectly round since I can feel varying resistance as I move the arm. I also noticed a stress mark just forward of the air brake. This probably happened when the airbrake panel was pushed into place.

The transformation went OK although I had a heck of a time getting the part of the swing bar near the legs to bend 90 degrees in order to fit into the nose. The tip given a few posts back of pushing the shoulders out by going through the back panel is a great idea.

Overall, the Shin 0A seems like a bit of a step back compared to the CF 0A. The paint is sloppy. The white on the landing gear bay doors bled to the outside surface. There is a gap in the gray piece that wraps around the right bicep. There are very large mold sprue marks on the fingers. I also had a heck of a time getting the part of the swing bar near the legs to bend 90 degrees to fit into the nose. On the positive side, this is the first Zero I've gotten where the backpack thruster slider is nice and snug.

I'm thankful that I don't have any major problems and I can live with the small problems.

Edited June 27, 2007 by Matt Random

[miriya]

A few members recieved the replacement VF-0S arms from hlj.com with POM shoulders in place of ABS. Stress marks have still developed, and one member who tried taking a pic had a bicep/elbow joint destroyed.

I looked on the hlj site and could not find the vf-0s replacements. Do you know how we can get these from them? I already ordered a fv-0a Shin with booster and it should be here this weekend. I will check for stress marks and will post images to this thread in either case but in anticipating bad shoulders I am wondering how to get those POM replacement parts. Thanks.

[Vermillion21]

Here's hoping the QC issues are resolved for the 2nd edition reissue of the VF-0S.

[PsYcHoDyNaMiX]

Okay... Even thought I was aware of the current problems plaguing the VF-0 line I decided to splurge and the get the VF-0S and the VF-0A Shin (w/ ghost) along with a seperate ghost for the VF-0S from HLJ. I was planning on opening the VF-0S and play with it aware of the problems (shoulders) for both valks, I figure ehh what the hell anyways I'll order the extra arms and what not.

I was planning on keeping the VF-0A Shin (w/ ghost) in the box untouched, but unfortunately the shipping box was poorly packed and some how the shin's box was damaged beyond belief. Blah.. wth I thought, so I opened it as well.

So I ended up opening both and decided to make it an objective to check out the shoulders on the VF-0S first. With the MW forums being down I contemplated for a day on how to transform them and disassemble them (thinking that the first transformation to Gerwalk could cause a large amount of stress marks). I took extra caution on transforming the VF-0S to Gerwalk and as soon as the shoulder screws were exposed enough to get the screw driver in I dove in with it.

Of course I was already aware of the problems and I wasn't too upset when I saw the stress marks on both the left and right shoulders of the VF-0S. One of the arms had more stress marks on the top screwed part of the shoulder and the other arm had stress marks more towards the bottom screw. I ended up loosening all the screws on both shoulders including the shoulder cover. I somehow believe the shoulder cover also played a small role in the stress marks. I reassembled them and started typing up the email for the replacement parts. I didnt bother posting pics for it since you've all seend similar cases. But the following seems pretty new to me...

Whoever assembled the VF-0S mustve gone totally glue happy on the head because there was so much glue on the head that the head couldn't telescope out off the neck. I had to literally disassemble the fuselage to unscrew the head and yank on the head with enough force to free it from the excess glue. Ontop of the neck issue there was also the green visor issue. The visor was miss aligned so poorly that it seemed as if the factory worked decided to heave extra glue onto it to have it stay in place. There is literally a gap between the green visor and the head unit. I ended up including a replacement head on the email list of replacement parts. Lets just see if HLJ can pull through on this one. If not then I'll send them these pictures... (see pics below)

The excess glue settled in the neck that you see was cleaned up a bit with my exacto knife. There was originally alot more. I was already scraping away with the blade when I realized I should've taken pictures.

As for the VF-0A everything turned out fine with the shoulders. There were no stress marks on the shoulders what so ever. They were extremely tight compared to the VF-0S, in other words they could've held up the gunpod and maybe more. They were so tight I decided to loosen them for precautionary measures. And yes the shoulders seem to be tighter at certain angles when posed. I'm just surprised that the VF-0A Shin survived a reck like this (see pics below):

The left chest piece you see floating around in the clear packaging was there when I opened the viewable flap (before the clear packaging was removed from the already smashed box). I already figured that piece could easily be placed back into position and if it didn't stay I could always throw a little epoxy or glue on it. IMO... The VF-0A Shin seemed alot more sturdier in some points compared to the VF-0S (legs, shoulders, ankles, etc.).

FYI... Since the VF-0S had the shoulder cracks I'm definitely going to assume that the version of the VF-0S that I have is still the first production run. Although the backpack hinge problem that Graham stated about the VF-0S having as opposed to the VF-0A Shin; my VF-0S didn't seem to have that problem at all. The backpack for the VF-0S was just as flush the VF-0A Shin.

***EDIT***

Oh BTW whoever probably handled the box at customs or the postal office must've seen the box labeled as Yamato and probably had some hidden feelings for them. The result is as the following picture... (see below)

Edited July 3, 2007 by PsYcHoDyNaMiX

[recon]

Really feel for you man! Those idiots at yamato, i really wonder what are they doing, allowing such shoddy stuff to pass QC inspections.

Edited July 3, 2007 by recon

[Mowe]

Woo!!! That is some rough handling. Feel for you.

[PsYcHoDyNaMiX]

Hmm... I just noticed something on the ghost that came with the shin. The rivets that hold the wheels in on the rear landing gear were riveted down so much that the wheels don't spin. Has anyone noticed this yet?