SW: The Old Republic MMO

[Duke Togo]

Official launch dates for SWTOR: December 20, 2011 for North American, December 22, 2011 for Europe.

I've stumbled across this report on several sites, but figured I'd throw up the one I found on TheForce.net.

New Star Wars MMO in the works?

15:30, Apr 25th 2007 by Ben Parfitt

Reports suggest BioWare is working on Knights of the Old Republic multiplayer online title.

Widely celebrated as the best Star Wars game of recent years, rumours have emerged that RPG specialist BioWare is hard at work on an MMO version of its hugely popular Knights of the Old Republic franchise.

CVG reports that the latest edition of US games print mag EGM includes the snippet in its Rumour section. No confirmation has been forthcoming from the developer as of yet, but were the game to emerge it would almost certainly be a sure-fire contender to better LucasArts’ previous MMO outing, the troubled Star Wars Galaxies.

Knights of the Old Republic was a critical and commercial success upon its release on Xbox in 2003. Its fortunes were mirrored by an equally celebrated PC version shortly afterwards. Obsidian took over the reigns for the second instalment in 2005, which whilst failing to win over the critics was again another firm retail success.

EGM also revealed a couple of other BioWare rumours. Namely, that current PC-only title Dragon Age will also be heading to PS3, and that the as-of-yet unspecified DS game already in development at the studio will be a new instalment in the Baldur’s Gate franchise.

[Warmaker]

I've stumbled across this report on several sites, but figured I'd throw up the one I found on TheForce.net.

New Star Wars MMO in the works?

15:30, Apr 25th 2007 by Ben Parfitt

Reports suggest BioWare is working on Knights of the Old Republic multiplayer online title.

Widely celebrated as the best Star Wars game of recent years, rumours have emerged that RPG specialist BioWare is hard at work on an MMO version of its hugely popular Knights of the Old Republic franchise.

CVG reports that the latest edition of US games print mag EGM includes the snippet in its Rumour section. No confirmation has been forthcoming from the developer as of yet, but were the game to emerge it would almost certainly be a sure-fire contender to better LucasArts’ previous MMO outing, the troubled Star Wars Galaxies.

Knights of the Old Republic was a critical and commercial success upon its release on Xbox in 2003. Its fortunes were mirrored by an equally celebrated PC version shortly afterwards. Obsidian took over the reigns for the second instalment in 2005, which whilst failing to win over the critics was again another firm retail success.

EGM also revealed a couple of other BioWare rumours. Namely, that current PC-only title Dragon Age will also be heading to PS3, and that the as-of-yet unspecified DS game already in development at the studio will be a new instalment in the Baldur’s Gate franchise.

This rumor has been going around for more than a year. When I was still playing Star Wars Galaxies, us Star Wars fans contemplating leaving that abortion were trying to find a better ship to jump to. It was an interesting rumor, since KoTOR was a nice game.

If BioWare does a Star Wars MMO, I'm thinking it'll be a success, due to the weight of name it carries. But I'm not sure how the mechanics will be. I'm thinking it will be simplified like the KoTOR games were or how World of Warcraft is to cash in on the big Star Wars name recognition and old KoTOR playerbase. I hope it's not a simple minded game, especially for an MMO where countless hours are spent.

BioWare has not done any MMO games or big multiplayer games that I'm not aware of, so I'm curious to see how well they do in that regard.

[Duke Togo]

I think originally the rumor got started when Bioware announced they were working on an MMO, and everyone hoped they would see a KotOR game. As far as I know, this is the first time a major gaming mag picked up the story, and within spitting distance of the 30th Anniversary.

[Warmaker]

Yeah, the only thing we heard even back then was BioWare working on an MMO. It wasn't even known if it was to be Star Wars-based or not.

The article does bring valid points for people to believe that BioWare's MMO outing will be a Star Wars game.

- Star Wars Galaxies... shot itself in the foot, stabbed itself in the abdomen, twisting the knife through it's own intestines.

- KoTOR still carries weight in the Console and PC gaming community.

The other wary thing with KoTOR was that it was tremendously buggy, even the first one. Combine that with the delegated work to Obisidian to do KoTOR II, it's cause for some concern. But hopefully they learn from their lesson (KoTOR), Obisidian's mistakes of bugginess and incompletion (KoTOR II), and from the atrocious mistakes made by SOE with Star Wars Galaxies for MMO's.

I just pray... PRAY... that it isn't "WoW in Space."

[Duke Togo]

The original wasn't really all that buggy, atleast post-patches (which is how I played it). Bioware had nothing to do with II, outside of passing the game engine along to Obsidian. Obsidian's problem with that Microsoft and Lucasarts pushed the release date far before it was ready to go (and/or Obsidian set deadlines to get the job they could never meet).

[HoveringCheesecake]

Good God no. Give me KOTOR 3 first.

[David Hingtgen]

A MMO KOTOR would be the first MMORPG I actually play. (Assuming it's good).

[Sumdumgai]

I've seen what World of Warcrack has done to many a man, and it ain't pretty. I have yet to play a MMORPG. Not Ultima Online, not Everquest, not WoW. I refuse to start up with a Star Wars MMORPG!

[Uxi]

I liked Galaxies. I think I might have actually been partial to the twitchy combat system (I was ambivalent to the first major "Combat Upgrade" and really was hoping all along for something like Jedi Outcast/Academy), but the twin combo of the annihilation of the player-based economy and the move to the Everquest-esque Class system over the skill-based system reminiscent of WEG D6 is what drove me away.

I always thought KOTOR or NJO would have been a better period. The Ep IV/V period was great for the movies, but is horrible for an MMO where nearly everyone wants to either participate or witness a lightsaber fight. Jedi are so fundamental to Star Wars that it makes a crummy setting to base an MMO around. Either you make it so very difficult and utterly futile (any nascent Jedi should have tons and tons of stormtroopers, Inquisitors, and eventually Darth Vader himself) on them before they got to any decent level of ability or make it so that the actual setting is completely invalidated. SWG managed to trod both extremes pretty much.

You'd think they could have, at the very least, done at least test center servers in different settings to see what was more popular.

KOTOR 3 and KOTOR-era MMO would not be mutually exclusive...

[Warmaker]

The setting for SWG was fine, since very few Star Wars games even try to avoid making Jedi THE central point of the game. Alot of things killed SWG for me: the increased simplification of gameplay, killing the skillpoint system (it was awesome, I completely agree with Uxi here), killing the player-based economy in favor of loot drops while still saying Traders / Crafters were still keystones to the economy, bait & switch tactics by SOE, the awful SOE interaction with players, and the continous destruction of the Star Wars story.

What was great with the old SWG was that the focus was on the rest of the people that made the Star Wars universe.

My simple opinion: There's more to Star Wars than Lightsabers and increasingly ridiculous Force Powers (see upcoming Force Unleashed ).

There were a bunch of us that yearned to be the soldiers of the Rebellion or Empire. I loved being a Stormtrooper / Scout Trooper. At SWG's height, there were a good number of "Trooper Guilds" that focused on the soldiers for the Empire or Rebellion, especially Imperial ones since there actually were a good number that loved donning the white armors of the Empire.

A player Stormtrooper patrol through Mos Eisley or the deserts of Tatooine oozes just as much of a Star Wars feel as Luke Skywalker fighting Darth Vader.

Edited April 27, 2007 by Warmaker

[Ishimaru]

Good God no. Give me KOTOR 3 first.

I think it would be KOTOR 3 in continuation to the story, sorta like WoW but Star Wars style.

A MMO KOTOR would be the first MMORPG I actually play. (Assuming it's good).

A MMO KOTOR would be the first MMORPG that I would actually stick to.

[Duke Togo]

Being that the title would be KotOR, I am guessing we would see classes such as "Jedi Consular" or 'Sith Marauder", and not just "Jedi" or "Sith". Caster classes, DPS classes, etc, but all Light or Dark Side Force users. And, of course, they'll have to be Mandalorians!

[HoveringCheesecake]

I think they'd have a difficult time having any kind of story like the first two games if KOTOR 3 was a mmorpg.

[kalvasflam]

Oh no, not another MMO. SWG was good when it started out, but the problem is they started using the EQ model on it. Expansions and so forth. I pretty much quit once Jump to Lightspeed came out. As someone else said earlier, jedi were never essential to the game. But SOE caved to all the rabid power gamers out there.

As for KOTOR, I loved the original, the second one had a promising start, and ended in a gigantic abortion of a storyline. I am hoping they get the right people and do a good KOTOR 3, but not an MMO. The story would be difficult in that setting. And honestly Bioware should do the story.

[Duke Togo]

How would the story be difficult? You can fit all the classic class types into Force users, you've got a plentiful amount of Jedi and Sith, we have Mandalorians... what more could a Star Wars fan ask for out of an MMO?

[Duke Togo]

SWG was good when it started out

No it wasn't. It never was. It never got good reviews from the press or those who played it. Its been one long train wreck from beginning to end.

[Warmaker]

The luxury that BioWare has with the KoTOR era of the first two games is that they have alot of leeway in creativity. The EU until very recently has done little in that area.

Even with the events of KoTOR I & II in place, there's more than enough room for a good story and setting.

Since there's no Clonetroopers / Stormtroopers in a KoTOR setting, I'll have to be a Mandalorian soldier. Bounty Hunting Mandos are so cliche to me

One of the fun things from the KoTOR games was the description of Mandalorian weapons. Like how Mando's prefer overkilling, overcompensating firepower than "just-lethal-enough" weapons. The Mandalorian Ripper was a good one. It's too bad that the end-games were so focused on Jedi powers and such that the rest was simply forgotten.

[kalvasflam]

No it wasn't. It never was. It never got good reviews from the press or those who played it. Its been one long train wreck from beginning to end.

Reviews from press and players eh? Sorry, I never learned to read.

It really is just a matter of opinion there. But the year or so in game was not too bad for me. Well, at least the first six to seven months.

[HoveringCheesecake]

How would the story be difficult? You can fit all the classic class types into Force users, you've got a plentiful amount of Jedi and Sith, we have Mandalorians... what more could a Star Wars fan ask for out of an MMO?

A story like the original two KOTOR games? I don't think so. That wouldn't transfer over to a mmo.

[Chewie]

I'll wait to comment on this until there is definite news about it.

Went through my hoping phase after this popped up the first time last year after Bioware moved in down the street from SOE and after SWG got NGpwned.

[Warmaker]

NGPwned Never heard of that "revamp" referred in that way!

[JsARCLIGHT]

I was a big fan of KoTOR 1, but KoTOR 2 did a LOT to ruin my enjoyment of the games. While I am not a player of MMO games I might give it a look in if it turns out to recapture that "feel" of the first which I personally felt the second game lacked immensely.

The one area that I really enjoyed about the KoTOR games was the "choose your response" conversation method... I wonder how that whole dynamic translates into a MMO environment. I mean, I don't know about you guys but it was the story and those great "choose the total a-hole thing to say OOPS Darkside!" spots that got me to slug through the game. I found the actual game play itself rather... standard, but the story twists and the diverse ability to guide your path through non-combat action really sold me on the game.

[Sumdumgai]

Force Lightning was my favorite ability in KOTOR1 and 2. Force lightning the crap out of everything around you until they drop, while you scream at your monitor: "POWAAAAA! UN-LIMITED... POWAAAA!."

[David Hingtgen]

Force lightning, even maxed out, was never powerful enough. Force exlposion was much better for multiple targets, or Death Field.

[lord_breetai]

Lord_Breetai from edmonton here... I know people on Bioware's writing staff... time to stalk them and torture them for information.

I'm just kidding.

[Shin Densetsu Kai 7.0]

KOTOR II wasn't needed in my opinion. It added some new things that were pleasing, but overall, KOTOR didn't need a sequel. Besides you could still be a sith in the first one!

I think KOTOR II suffered as a result of being helmed by a different company(even if the CEO's from both that company and Bioware are a married couple I believe).

Since Bioware is rumored to be working on III, I think it has potential to be just as good, if not better than the first.

I liked the story a lot. Subtle hints, but the revelation of who you really are was not something I could see coming.

[Warmaker]

KoTOR II would have been great but it was blatantly rushed to be released in time for Ep.III when it hit the theaters.

An interesting site is the KoTOR II / The Sith Lords Restoration Project.

And KoTOR II: The Missing Content.

It seems the devs for KoTOR II intended alot to be done with it. There were far more quests and places to visit in the works but they ran out of time. More quests, background, and alot of spoken character dialogue were intended and some actually sitting in the game but not utilized (check the site for more). Different possibilities as to how your party members turn out, depending on choices made in the game, more than what was officially done but not released (Atton Rand is a big example).

In short, the devs for KoTOR II were ambitious, and I can't fault them for that. But they ran out of time and it wouldn't surprise me if Lucasarts was applying pressure for the game to be released in time for Ep.III, just like a bunch of other crap to be released at that same time.

The game really could have used alot more dev time. Seeing what was left incomplete and how ambitious the plans were, makes me wonder how much better KoTOR II could have been.

Edited April 28, 2007 by Warmaker

[Duke Togo]

TSLRP is coming really close to being finished. I think we'll see a release before the winter hits.

[Uxi]

I have been thinking that perhaps KotoR 3 will be the MMO... kinda. I'm imagining confined to PlayStation Network, Xbox Live and/or PC servers. Maybe all 3 segmented, though if they could join them that would be great.

[Ishimaru]

KoTOR II would have been great but it was blatantly rushed to be released in time for Ep.III when it hit the theaters.

An interesting site is the KoTOR II / The Sith Lords Restoration Project.

And KoTOR II: The Missing Content.

It seems the devs for KoTOR II intended alot to be done with it. There were far more quests and places to visit in the works but they ran out of time. More quests, background, and alot of spoken character dialogue were intended and some actually sitting in the game but not utilized (check the site for more). Different possibilities as to how your party members turn out, depending on choices made in the game, more than what was officially done but not released (Atton Rand is a big example).

In short, the devs for KoTOR II were ambitious, and I can't fault them for that. But they ran out of time and it wouldn't surprise me if Lucasarts was applying pressure for the game to be released in time for Ep.III, just like a bunch of other crap to be released at that same time.

The game really could have used alot more dev time. Seeing what was left incomplete and how ambitious the plans were, makes me wonder how much better KoTOR II could have been.

I feel ya.

The ending really left me with so many questions, it was so empty and lacked so much story in the end.

[Warmaker]

The ending was the worst. Not only was it so weak but it was sudden and abrupt. You don't get to find out what happens with your party members afterwards or what they intend to do... sort of. The ending just gives like a simple, single sentence for each... "Handmaiden makes babies!"... WEAK! Kind of like, "Okay, thanks for buying and playing KoTOR 2! Thanks for your money!"

(Exit stage right)

The other thing that bothered me was the glaringly bad quality of the cutscenes. Wow did those suck compared to the original game.

[Duke Togo]

They released a rather large video patch for the PC game that bumped up the resolution on those FMV cut scenes. The TSLRP ending should be far more fleshed out and complete.

[Warmaker]

I can't wait to see how it turns out when they're finally done. They've been at it for years.

[Duke Togo]

(Several other gaming and Star Wars sites, including IGN and TheForce.net, are carrying this story as well)

BioWare’s Upcoming MMO Based in KOTOR Universe

By Alex Petraglia on Friday, October 19, 2007 at 10:00 AM EST

A source close to BioWare confirmed to us today that the studio’s upcoming untitled massively-multiplayer online RPG will be centered around the Star Wars universe, specifically that of Knights of the Old Republic, which the developer released in 2003. The game garnered critical acclaim and spawned a less-popular sequel, released by Obsidian two years later.

The game is being developed by the company’s Austin studio, formed in 2006 and headed by BioWare Creative Director James Ohlen, whose past credits include the first KOTOR, Neverwinter Nights, and Baldur Gate’s I and II.

This is not the first Star Wars-related MMORPG: Star Wars Galaxies debuted in the summer of 2003, followed by several expansions. It was generally well-received by fans and critics, but subscriber numbers plunged and never recovered after a controversial gameplay update in 2005. It’s estimated that the game now has fewer than 100,000 subscribers and less than 20,000 active players.

It’s currently unknown whether or not EA, which acquired BioWare last week, will act as publisher for this title, or if the studio had a previous arrangement with another publisher.

Expect the game sometime in 2009.

Editor’s Note - We’ve gotten several emails asking about the validity of this news. The only rumors we post here at Primotech will explicitly be stated as such.

[Duke Togo]

TSLRP is coming really close to being finished. I think we'll see a release before the winter hits.

Current Build: 0.9b1

0.9b1 will be the only build in the 0.9 family.

1.0b1 may take a few weeks but it will be the next build.

The invite-only beta will begin upon its release.