For the 'ol X-Com fans... "UFO Extraterrestrials"

[Axelay]

How does one aquire this "editing" weapons thing.

Everything you could ever want can be found here.

Lovely collection of X-COM editing tools

Do not mess with the ClarkWehyr Enterprises X-COM Editor Suite unless you have the very original X-COM for DOS. I have an old Microprose compilation set which has X-COM, TFTD, MOO, and MOM, and even though it's a DOS version this press has different install paths than the original DOS version did. I couldn't tweak the editor program enough to realize that it should be looking for new paths, so I just have to let it fall by the wayside. Damn shame, too, as that used to be everything I used.

I recommend this editor for tweaking weapons.

UFO.EXE editor

What's nice about it is that it can be run in Windows. Bear in mind that it makes changes to the default values of the game, so better be really sure you want to change something before you do it. I currently have my troops carrying standard assault rifles which use pistol magazines (AP) with 30 rounds and slightly increased power, rifle magazines (HE) with 12 rounds and increased power, and proximity grenades (stun) which can either be rifled or thrown. I just like the notion of having a good weapon which the aliens can't use against us. It's not overpowered, but it is versatile. I still have to buy all of the ammo all the time, and I don't mess with the time values or accuracy for the weapons. Plus, I've used XCOMUTIL to give the aliens a boost to all of their stats so that we can really have some knockdown fights.

[hutch]

Mr. March, I bow to you. That is absolutely amazing.

This game is so much ridiculous fun.

[Warmaker]

Mr. March, I bow to you. That is absolutely amazing.

This game is so much ridiculous fun.

It's even more ridiculous when you consider this franchise was allowed to be ran into the dirt

The last official X-Com game was in about 1998, X-Com Interceptor, and it was awful. My friend who introduced me to the franchise had it... and it was "bleh."

[Mr March]

Mr. March, I bow to you. That is absolutely amazing.

This game is so much ridiculous fun.

Any more fun and we'd be guilty

I noticed in your most recent posts you assaulted your first alien base. Which month did you first discover it? Which method discovered the base (X-COM agents or scouting with the Skyrangers after noticing activity in the are/notable increase on the graphs)? And when did ya destroy it?

I think my first base came around month six and I let it operate until just recently, I think 4 months or something (I love raiding the Supply Ships for the alien bases, it's how I build up my elerium stores). I saw a bunch of UFOs in south east asia and knew something was going on (the graphs confirmed it), so I scouted with a Skyranger and two Interceptors for about 4 days and finally found Alien Base 1 in Singapore.

I see you're using Blaster Launchers. I have some questions for you. I find that I never get a lot of ammunition for the Blaster Launcher. In all my bases, the ratio of Blaster Launchers to Blaster Bombs is 1:2 or at best 1:3. It's the only alien weapon in the game for which I have ever manufactured ammunition but do so only if I've already built everything else requiring elerium and have a large reserve. I still use the Rocket Launcher with Large Rockets up until the end of the game. I pull out Blaster Launchers only for three very specific missions: Alien Base Assaults, Ethereal Battleships and of course the Assault on Cydonia. Do you use Blaster Launchers in regular missions once you've researched them? Do you find you get more ammunition than I have described?

Just in general, what have you got and where are you at in the game right now? Give me some details Mr. "I love the smell of dead Sectoids in the morning"

Edited May 2, 2007 by Mr March

[Mr March]

It's even more ridiculous when you consider this franchise was allowed to be ran into the dirt

The last official X-Com game was in about 1998, X-Com Interceptor, and it was awful. My friend who introduced me to the franchise had it... and it was "bleh."

To be honest, I dropped out after Terror From The Deep. It was such a blatant attempt to cash in by giving players just more of the same but with a facelift. And it was ridiculously hard, though I suppose now with my current Enemy Unknown skill level I might not find it so bad. Apocalypse is worth playing if you want more, but it's not so great that I went crazy over it. I didn't like the retro-style changes nor the bright primary colors which was really jarring when the game music tried to be spooky like the original in an environment that looked like SimCity. And despite the fact that the game engine worked, I don't care for the real time fighting. If I want to play real-time games, I have my real-time games. When I want turn-based, I want turn-based. I much prefer the grander scope and greater degree of control in X-COM:EU, even with it's dated graphics.

To me, the X-COM franchise is much like the Star Control franchise or the Fallout franchise. They all had one really awesome game that demands inclusion in any credible "Best of" list, they featured one other game that was just "pretty good" and then either really lousy sequels or could-have-been vaporware projects. It's a shame, but after these experiences I really don't want to waste my time on games unless they are worth it. I moved on from those franchises and went to other games more worthwhile based on individual merit. But like you, I wish another good X-COM game would be made.

Edited May 2, 2007 by Mr March

[Warmaker]

I loved X-Com Apocalypse. It was really the only X-Com game I had alot of experience in. I never played Terror From The Deep. I never saw it in any stores. Same thing with the original X-Com, and this was the mid 90's. At that time, Apocalypse was new, so it was easy to find. I was introduced to the franchise pretty much half-way through it's time.

Now, like I said, I never played the original. But the real-time criticization I've read and heard of Apocalypse, is it aimed at the tactical (troopers, urban maps, etc) or the geoscape? The geoscape was real time. The tactical game was toggable to real-time or turn-based. Me and my friend tried real-time and it wasn't to our liking. But you could select turn-based in your options, and that's where the fun was The tactical game did suffer in that you didn't get vehicles for the tactical gameplay like tanks. Yes, you could get tanks, but only for the geoscape.

Fallout - One of the first PC games I ever bought. I had my first computer when I was stationed on Okinawa. I can still remember the level of immersion that game presented. It oozed style and supported a wide variety of gameplay. You could be a heavy handed brute, a sharpshooting gunman, or a smooth-talking character. What's funny is if you roll a female character with a good appearance. Lots more "options" and dialogue Simply put, my style of play for Fallout was: Speak softly and carry a biiiiiig stick (gun) and I would go far. Nothing that a whole inventory full of ammo couldn't solve. Especially the groin shots. Or a critical hit from a Laser Rifle. Or a critical hit from an automatic weapon. Awesome death animations...

[LePoseur]

How true Mr. March, how true. I've been lurking in this topic for a while, especially as I still drag out the old Enemy Unknown beast once and a while to play through it again (much like Wasteland or the Zelda on the NES), but I wanted to add this...

Brief X-com history:

I literally almost flunk out of college due to the first game, which, after coming back from Japan, my cousin mails to me without note or explanation. I had seen it in the stores, but the box was so uninteresting, and I was already content with my Civilization, X-wing, Pirates Gold triforce, that I didn't need a new game. But X-com knocked my socks off and came just a hairs berth away from unseating Wasteland as my all time favorite game. Finish the mars mission, got off the expulsion list and awaited a sequel.

Terror from the Deep comes out, spiffy new CD format allows for "wows" during the opening movie (graphics we laugh at no though) and then ...

TFTD pisses me off.

Blatant rip-off is so appropriate. Hmm, lets see, change the color pallet, replace the art work and go. So, let me get this straight, my guys are underwater, WALKING across the ocean floor to travel?!? I shoot holes in the side of ships and the water stays outside?!? Agh!

Although some things were fun, the oil rig missions were fun, there was an awesome gun for sniping if I recall correctly. Nothing like sneaking up to the top level (5th level?) of an oil rig and raining death down on anything that moves.

But the game still pissed me off. Apocalypse was a different game altogether.

After all these years no one seems able to recapture that original X-com magic. Sad, but I guess that's why it's a classic.

Anyhow, back to lurk mode.

Edited May 3, 2007 by LePoseur

[ruskiiVFaussie]

Everything you could ever want can be found here.

Lovely collection of X-COM editing tools

Do not mess with the ClarkWehyr Enterprises X-COM Editor Suite unless you have the very original X-COM for DOS. I have an old Microprose compilation set which has X-COM, TFTD, MOO, and MOM, and even though it's a DOS version this press has different install paths than the original DOS version did. I couldn't tweak the editor program enough to realize that it should be looking for new paths, so I just have to let it fall by the wayside. Damn shame, too, as that used to be everything I used.

I recommend this editor for tweaking weapons.

UFO.EXE editor

What's nice about it is that it can be run in Windows. Bear in mind that it makes changes to the default values of the game, so better be really sure you want to change something before you do it. I currently have my troops carrying standard assault rifles which use pistol magazines (AP) with 30 rounds and slightly increased power, rifle magazines (HE) with 12 rounds and increased power, and proximity grenades (stun) which can either be rifled or thrown. I just like the notion of having a good weapon which the aliens can't use against us. It's not overpowered, but it is versatile. I still have to buy all of the ammo all the time, and I don't mess with the time values or accuracy for the weapons. Plus, I've used XCOMUTIL to give the aliens a boost to all of their stats so that we can really have some knockdown fights.

Thanks man! Haven't time to look at it now but really appreciate the excellent info you just churned out.

[wwwmwww]

I also called the local Gamestop and they said they'd have the game in tomorrow. Knowing me I'll rush out and buy it but I would like to know what I can before I do.

Well I called the local Gamestop again yesterday and they are now telling me they'll get the game in on June 2nd, not May 2nd as they did Monday. Has there been a delay? The official website is still saying this game came out May 1st.

http://www.ufo-extraterrestrials.com/

Has anyone got a copy yet? If so where did you get it?

Thanks,

Carl

[LePoseur]

Don't hold your breath. Before April it was February. And I'd wager before that it was Christmas 2006.

Still... it's getting closer. Hope it'll be worth it, but then again, I'm not holding my breath for that either.

[Akilae]

FWIW, it's out in Russia... and soon in the UK... sooner or later it'll hit the US

[Mr Frosty]

Here is the latest from Matrix Games about the release:

"Here is latest official word:

Hi Everyone

Here is the final release information on UFO: ET with some important changes. The game will only be available from Matrix Games / Tri Synergy in North America (United States, Canada, Mexico and any U.S. Territories (Puerto Rico, Guam etc.). We are sorry for this late change but we only just recently been made aware of this new restriction from the European publisher. We are sorry for any problems this might have caused our overseas customers.

Matrix will be releasing the game for digital download Friday May 4th at 00:01 A.M. or easier said one minute passed midnight tonight. The Matrix / Tri Synergy release will be using our own serial number system and NOT the Starforce system. Remember this is a large download (1.8 gigs) so anyone downloading it may want to use a download optimizer / download manager. Matrix recommends the free version of StarDownloader. If you are not sure what StarDownloader does it explains it very well on the main page of the web site.

Our Game On Demand version will also be available for at the same time as the digital download version is available. Our Game On Demand version is our boxed product that is shipped from our warehouse and come in a DVD Case with full color sleeve, three CD's with full color labels and a printed manual. The Game On Demand should start shipping around May 18th. Remember if you order a Game On Demand you can download our digital version immediately at the time of your order and start playing right away as your box version wings its way towards you.

The North American retail release will be available around the week of May 21 at EB Games and GameStop stores. Check with Tri Synergy for information and other retailers."

[ruskiiVFaussie]

FWIW, it's out in Russia... and soon in the UK... sooner or later it'll hit the US

lol, Just about EVERYthing is in russia before it's anywhere else. From personal experience.

And cheap too!

[Mr March]

Now, like I said, I never played the original. But the real-time criticization I've read and heard of Apocalypse, is it aimed at the tactical (troopers, urban maps, etc) or the geoscape? The geoscape was real time. The tactical game was toggable to real-time or turn-based. Me and my friend tried real-time and it wasn't to our liking. But you could select turn-based in your options, and that's where the fun was The tactical game did suffer in that you didn't get vehicles for the tactical gameplay like tanks. Yes, you could get tanks, but only for the geoscape.

Apocalypse didn't have a geoscape, more like a cityscape. Regardless, my criticism was directed more towards the battlescape mode where you could switch between real-time and turn-based.

[Mr March]

How true Mr. March, how true. I've been lurking in this topic for a while, especially as I still drag out the old Enemy Unknown beast once and a while to play through it again (much like Wasteland or the Zelda on the NES), but I wanted to add this...

Brief X-com history:

I literally almost flunk out of college due to the first game, which, after coming back from Japan, my cousin mails to me without note or explanation. I had seen it in the stores, but the box was so uninteresting, and I was already content with my Civilization, X-wing, Pirates Gold triforce, that I didn't need a new game. But X-com knocked my socks off and came just a hairs berth away from unseating Wasteland as my all time favorite game. Finish the mars mission, got off the expulsion list and awaited a sequel.

Terror from the Deep comes out, spiffy new CD format allows for "wows" during the opening movie (graphics we laugh at no though) and then ...

TFTD pisses me off.

Blatant rip-off is so appropriate. Hmm, lets see, change the color pallet, replace the art work and go. So, let me get this straight, my guys are underwater, WALKING across the ocean floor to travel?!? I shoot holes in the side of ships and the water stays outside?!? Agh!

Although some things were fun, the oil rig missions were fun, there was an awesome gun for sniping if I recall correctly. Nothing like sneaking up to the top level (5th level?) of an oil rig and raining death down on anything that moves.

But the game still pissed me off. Apocalypse was a different game altogether.

After all these years no one seems able to recapture that original X-com magic. Sad, but I guess that's why it's a classic.

Anyhow, back to lurk mode.

Hehehe, another really old-school gamer I remember the fun, as well as the frustration, of Wasteland. As I mentioned before in this thread, "Peels off a final shot" was a source of constant annoyance, though it was part of the charm of the game world that helped make Wasteland so unique. I haven't touched that game since the years around its release. I'm curious how I would feel playing such an old title now. Sometimes really old games never go out of style with me but others just don't stick with me. Probably be annoyed more with the sound than anything else (BEEP, BEEP!)

[promethuem5]

Was X-com Interceptor the third-person shooter where you were the robot? I played that one and while it had nothing to do with X-com really, I remember it being a really entertaining third person shooter for a twelve year old...

[Warmaker]

X-Com Interceptor was the space flight version. X-Com Alliance was the shooter, IIRC, but I never tried it.

[Axelay]

I can't believe this. I installed X-COM and did some tweaking with it... and I actually became bored with it. I know, I know, it's heresy. It's still got elements of fun, but what drives me crazy is that the combat is so predictable even on harder difficulty levels. I was still feeling an X-COM jones, so I decided to install TFTD.

Holy crap.

It is about 900 times harder than I remembered, and that's even with my customized rifles! I have to say that the missions in it are infuriatingly fun, although the whole Geoscape makes little sense to me. I had forgotten how annoyed it made me that you can't shoot down anything over dry land. How stupid. Ah well, I'm 3 months into a new game, and the aliens have already attacked my main base once, started sending Battleships to engage me, and have attacked 2 shipping routes. I think I have pissed them off a bit.

[Mr March]

No big surprise. Cheat codes, walkthroughs and editing, the three sure fire methods in gaming that turn fun into work, IMO.

[ruskiiVFaussie]

Yeah, once you edit weapons making it too easy it gets boring. Agree with you Mr March.

[wwwmwww]

http://www.matrixgames.com/games/game.asp?gid=342

I see the above states:

Game Requirements

* Windows 2000/XP/Vista with DirectX 9.0ca nd greater

* 1.5 Ghz Processor

* 128 MB Video Card with DirectX 9.0c compatible drivers

* 256 MB RAM

* 2.6 GB free hard disk space

* CD-ROM

* Windows compatible Mouse and Keyboard

Cool... so it supports Vista.

Carl

[Ladic]

ok, I got the game.

It is very very similar to the original, it even has the original music.

The Interface has changed a bit, but mostly the placement of the stuff, but it has all the same buttons.

Some things I still have not figured out, are how to buy soldiers, engineers and scientists, you can't do it thru the buy/sell menu.

In the battefield you no longer have the button that saves enough AP for an aimed, snap and autoshot. But instead it will tall you have many AP your desired movement will cost you.

There is no longer a Whole Map view of the battlefield, I miss this the most.

I also miss that the World Map is no longer of Earth, but some random planet.

[Lynx7725]

Hmm, saw a UFO game that's called UFO:Afterlight. Something about us losing Earth but colonizing Mars. Anyone know anything about this?

[Akilae]

screenies Ladic?

Edited May 11, 2007 by Akilae

[Warmaker]

UFO: Afterlight is a sequel to UFO: Aftermath.

As for UFO Extraterrestrials, I also got the Matrix Games' download version. I'll put up my little opinions on it after I do some errands.

[Ladic]

ok, ill upload some screenshot.

[Ladic]

Another thing is that the Interceptor fights are different from the Oiriginal, it now takes places on the World Map and you apparently have no control on how to fight it, you just seem to send the aircraft and it does the fighting auto.

Also some new troops arrived to my base, but I never bought them, so maybe they just send you troops, scientists engineers, when u need them????

Anyways here are some screencaps

[Ladic]

Also, don't know if it is coincidence or not, but Botht battles I've fought, the map has been exactly the same.

Edited May 11, 2007 by Ladic

[Ladic]

When u go get your soldiers promoted, they give u points with which you can raise individual stats.

Also when In combat, the Fog of war dissappears much less than before.

In the Original when u looked in a direction, u could all the way to the end, now you see alot less in front of u.

[Vinnie]

To get scientists and engineers you have to build more laboratory and workshop facilities. To get soldiers, apparently you just have to wait for them to show up. That really sucks because on one of my missions I took 7 out of my 8 recieving wounds that laid them up for 10-20 days. I had no way to respond to UFOs for a couple weeks.

Also you can control how your interceptors engage the UFOs. It's just like the original with Standard/Cautious/Agressive attack patterns. Those buttons are right below your status update window in the world view (see your screenshot with the interceptors.) I do like how you can double team UFOs now though.

I'll post some more thoughts later, but I am enjoying this!

Edited May 11, 2007 by Vinnie

[Warmaker]

Like I said, I got the download version from Matrix Games. Also, I'm putting up opinions based on my experience with X-Com: Apocalypse, not X-Com: Enemy Unknown (I never played EU). I'll shorten UFO: Extraterrestrials to just UFOE.

The above is the geoscape (am I using the right term here?) for UFOE. Very straight forward but for me there was one annoying problem. To scroll around this made up planet, you had to use the very sluggish arrow buttons at the bottom of the screen. I can't click on a spot to jump and center the view to that area. It does jump when you hit icons such as the crashed UFO button on the left side. The geoscape is realtime but you can control the speed of time for your needs.

Also, regarding UFO detection. When you start off, you have 1 pretty well developed base. But you can't detect what's going on on the other side, so establishing new bases will be a later concern. I say later since your growth potential is very, very slow due to "recruitment" than budget concerns. I'll get into recruitment later.

The above 2 are screenshots from the UFOPEDIA section of the game. Topics are self explanatory and more are added as you do more research. Real simple and to the point. I love the recycling of UFOPEDIA from the old X-Com games.

The above is the trooper or "agent screen." Click on the arsenal and click onto the new spot on the trooper's inventory. Real simple though I do wish that there was a small area that told the weapon's statistics.

This screen also is shown when in a tactical mission and you hit the Inventory for that Trooper. The right column will show the gear that Trooper is "on top of" for that tile and can pick up. Interestingly, it costs no Action Points to access, sort / arrange, and reload weapons while in a mission, unlike in X-Com: Apocalypse.

Here is a screenie of the Research Screen. For every Research Module you possess, you get 10 scientists. Put more on a project, the faster the research is for that one. Scatter them, you do more simultaneous research but they will all be slower in pace.

Here's the Production Screen where you produce items that your scientists have discovered / unlocked. Same rules just like Research.

I have no problems whatsoever with Research and Production.

Here's the Buy / Sell Screen. You buy conventional gear, vehicles, and armaments here. Simple, right? It is but there is a bit of a problem. I know some players in other X-Com games have made good money here. In X-Com Apocalypse, I made good money here from conducting raids (Cultists and other human enemies of X-Com) or selling off alien gear that I considered "low tech" and won't be a danger to my field agents should they fall in the wrong hands. Not so in UFOE. There are no raids to "acquire" surplus gear except from alien incursions. Ok, I can live with that. But what about items that you produce from the Production Screen, stuff you produce from your own facilities? Not really but technically you can. You can sell the hi-tech items you manufacture, but they sell for pretty low prices, far lower than the cost required in making them in the first place. That was a big blow, IMO.

-----

Ladic had also shown a screenshot of a base layout. You can purchase and add modules to a base adjacent to existing and fully built modules. An interesting note is that there is no Entry / Exit Point(s) with the base. I have yet to be attacked at my sole base, but this looks a bit weird.

-----

The above is a tactical mission and my trooper had just chucked a grenade at a somewhat remote target. The effects get the job done but it's of course nowhere near what games tend to show off these days.

The above is what you'll see when you select something like a rifle and then click on the target. I have a rifle equipped trooper sight in on the target and this little window pops up for the chances of hitting as well as the Action Point Costs. The top is Aimed, second is Snap Shot, and the third is a 3 Round "Auto Attack."

Wounds? Just like in X-Com: Apocalypse, you could get damage that reduces your health. Sometimes you also suffer Wounds that bleed hit points away per turn if left untreated with more advanced (and researched) Medikits. The starting Stimpacks only heal damage, not wounds, which is fine by me.

-----

RECRUITMENT

In X-Com: Apocalypse, YOU controlled the rate of growth of the number of Troopers you had. You go out and select recruits from a pool of possible candidates. You hire them and each Trooper adds to the total upkeep of X-Com. Each trooper of course can be seriously injured or killed.

In UFOE, it gets weird. It is quite hard to get an agent killed. If they're put down during a tactical mission, they're badly injured. When you beat the mission, everyone gets on the transport and goes back to base. Upon return, they're hospitalized for what could be a very, very long time. If you win your missions, you will never lose an agent. "WTF?" you ask? You can still lose them if you lose a tactical mission entirely. You can also withdraw early from a mission, but you will leave behind (and permanently lose) any incapacitated Troopers.

UFOE more importantly does not allow you to recruit Troopers as you need. The game mandates when you receive new troopers. Or to be more exact from my early game experiences, new trooper (big emphasis on the singular form of trooper). The new troops come sporadically and very, very slowly, and from what I've seen, only 1.

So, combine the complete lack of control on the growth of your organization, the long downtimes for agents, and the frequency of missions which oftenly cause serious injuries, this seriously affected my gameplay. Do not be surprised to find yourself with having most of your Troopers in the Infirmary with only 1-2 fit for combat duty. Also, unlike X-Com Apocalypse, you can't force lightly injured agents to participate in a mission (though with appropriately depleted ability). In UFOE, once in the Infirmary, they're fit for nothing. In X-Com Apocalypse, I had the option to recruit lots of brand new, low skilled recruits that need training and experience, but they bolster my numbers when I need it. Not so in UFOE.

-----

GEOSCAPE COMBAT

Pretty simple, IMO. You get a warning that a UFO has been detected. You then can opt to launch an intercept with your fighters. If the UFO is shot down over the water, there's no subsequent land tactical mission. If it crashlands on solid land, then an icon can appear and you can dispatch a transport. Before launching of the transport, you can select and outfit the Troopers for the mission. The starting transport allows up to 8 Troopers or Vehicles. Taking a Vehicle takes up 4 Trooper slots. This probably changes with later developments.

Not long ago, I got a warning that the aliens took over a region, but I promptly dispatched a section of Troopers and a Vehicle to enter the "converted" alien base and destroy it. Too bad I couldn't keep the base...

-----

TACTICAL COMBAT

I know the graphics aren't fancy by today's standards but IMO, the artwork ranges from okay to nice and detailed. Building interiors and are done very nicely with lots of detail.

Most things on the map are destructible, but IMO, some of it is too easily destroyed. Usually a single shot from my rifle will make an opening in a wall. That wasn't the case in X-Com: Apocalypse. Yes, I can destroy walls, windows, etc., but taking making an opening in a wall takes more power than a single rifle shot or laser shot, usually requiring explosives or a shot from a powerful weapon.

Ground Elevation... all the tactical missions I have ran showed no differences in Ground Elevation. Unless you get into a multi-storied building or such, EVERYTHING IS FLAT!

In addition, from the missions that I have played, the maximum number of floors and "elevation" is 2 (or 2 storied buildings and such). This is quite sad compared to X-Com: Apocalypse where we had a maximum of 8 or9 stories for buildings! We had apartment complexes and neighborhoods in Apocalypse. Not so in UFOE! I still have to see something like catwalks or other interesting places for units to walk and position themselves in.

Movement and Positions. There is no "Run" feature in UFOE. There's only walk. In X-Com Apocalypse, you could have your Troopers run, though it incurred fatigue and a gradual lowering of total Action Points until you gave them rest. Your ability to spot dangers while running is also greatly reduced. In UFOE, you have no such option. Positions... There's Standing and Kneeling. No Prone Position whatsoever!

Speaking of Positions... I have yet to notice a benefit to kneeling other than wasting Action Points, 3 pts a piece to get up and down. I have yet to notice benefits to accuracy while Kneeling. I have yet to notice any benefits to kneeling as to how easy your are to be hit by enemy fire. IMO, you're better off standing in the open ground than kneeling in the open ground. At least with standing, you're not wasting points to get down and up and "walking" to the nearest cover.

It really pissed me off that positions and movement were so minimalized.

Fog of War. Ladic touched this and I'll add more. I hate it. FoW in UFOE is very close and there are no long ranged engagements. Everything feels point blank.

I wish UFOE let your units see far! Let their vision for the tactical map only be disrupted by objects and the size of the target (if they can be seen at a distance). You may see something, but can you engage it with your weapons? Probably no. It depends on the gear (Laser Sniper Rifle, Missile Launcher, or very d**n good accuracy while in the Prone). X-Com Apocalypse let you do this.

Oh, I said accuracy didn't I? This early in the game, unless a target is right in front of you (1-2 tiles away), your standard Rifles and even the Laser Rifles I just researched and manufactured are atrociously inaccurate. Unless your trooper is "elite" than your chances to hit with an Aimed Shot at a distance with your Rifle is quite poor. A waste of ammo.

My tactics are reduced to the following:

Engage with a single Missile at long range.

Creep up or rush at point blank and use Auto Fire.

Or, since it's too dangerous to run forward and you don't have an unlimited supply of missiles, you will rely on grenades. In UFOE, I go through grenades like I breathe air. So bad are weapon accuracies (unless using missiles) that I rely on 'nades as my sole, reliable means of fighting the enemy. My troopers carry more grenades than Stimpacks and Rifle Magazines combined. I have designated troopers who's sole purpose is Missile Mule for the Missile Launcher guy. Everyone else is Rifle with 1 magazine and tons of grenades.

Action Points and Fire Selection. The only time you select your mode of fire for a trooper is when you say so for that action. You can't leave a trooper to only use Aimed, Snap Shot, or Automatic for "Overwatch" or preferred firing situations. For instance, I'm at a short hallway with a turn coming up. In such close terrain in X-Com Apocalypse, I would have my Troopers going down that hallway with Automatic weapon fire selection to quickly engage and completely hose down whatever threat comes out or is around that corner. In X-Com Apocalypse, I could have my Troopers only use controlled Snap Fire to strike a balance with speed and time to aim / accuracy because the terrain is distant and optimal enough. In UFOE, you get no such control. With the hallway example I gave, my UFOE troopers will slowly go down that hallway saving 80% of their Action Points each turn, and still be rushed by something around the corner and let out maybe 1 shot to protect themselves.

As Ladic also said, there is no "Save Action Points" when you make your Trooper do something in UFOE. In Apocalypse, depending on the Weapon Fire Mode, the Trooper stops to give you a warning that he has the minimum number of points to fire just once with that fire mode during the enemy's turn for Overwatch purposes.

There is also no "Overhead Map" in a corner.

-----

I'll probably add in more, plus screenshots given time.

But my final judgement so far: UFO Extraterrestrials is fine in its own game. But if I compare it to even X-Com Apocalypse, especially the Tactical Combat, it is far inferior. What was possible in the Tactical game in Apocalypse was amazing, considering that it is 10 years old now! There's 2 areas that I feel UFOE was superior to X-Com Apocalypse... The Geoscape since Apoc. didn't have one!... and having vehicles, since Apoc. did not let you bring tanks and such into a tactical mission.

Edited May 11, 2007 by Warmaker

[Mr March]

I do like how you can double team UFOs now though.

Uh, you could double team UFOs in the original X-COM. Not only that, you could have up to 4 interception craft attack a single UFO in the original X-COM. That's how you take out the Battleships.

[Mr March]

But my final judgement so far: UFO Extraterrestrials is fine in its own game. But if I compare it to even X-Com Apocalypse, especially the Tactical Combat, it is far inferior.

Wow, that's one helluva damning review. Apocalypse isn't as good as the original X-COM and if UFO: Extraterrestrials isn't even as good as Apocalypse...no need to fill in the rest. I suspected the graphics were as bad as they looked in still shots. Sometimes stills can be misleading, but it's good to know my first impression was dead on.

I'm really curious to see the Gamespot review on this one.

[Warmaker]

It's a pretty low key release, so I dunno...

The thing that kills me with the Tactical combat is that there's far less possibilities.

In Apocalypse, I was worried about enemy fire from a 4th story window.

I was worried what was hiding in this ravine to my Troopers' flank since I didn't look down there.

I can't position snipers or heavy weapon teams on a rooftop to provide ample observation and support.

Put it this way... in the old X-Com Apocalypse, the Tactical combat made me think in 3 dimensions, worrying about height, observation, etc. Not so in UFOE. It felt more "2D."

The tension of close ranged fighting is there, but that's just it. For me, it seemed it was only about close ranged fighting, regardless of the weapons I was using.

The first indication I had that there was no long ranged fighting was the lack of a Sniper Rifle of any sort. Granted, I'm still fairly early in the game. But then again the shortness of the Fog Of War sort of enforces my concern.

I hated to bag the game when you look at the tone of my opinions. Heck, I initiated this thread for the game! You can tell that yes, the game wasn't a high production value, but there was some love put into it. I have yet to experience any freezeups or CTDs. But considering that a game so closely being identified with the X-Com series just seems to lack some of the options, possibilities of the originals which came out 10 or more years ago... it was disappointing.

Edit to add: I'll give it a chance and beat the thing. Heck, I paid money so I might as well see it through. Maybe it'll improve with more features down the road. I'll see.

Edited May 12, 2007 by Warmaker

[Mr March]

Yeah, definitely play it through and beat it if you can maintain enough interest. You've already made the investment of cash, so you best get as much as you can out of it.

As for me, I've been a gamer for far too many years to ignore the warning signs of mediocrity when I see them. I'll find more entertainment reading the reviews for this game than I ever will playing it. Still, at least this software company made an attempt and you have to give them credit for that. Hell, there were hordes of bad Master of Orion clones (and a lousy sequel) that came out for years before Galatic Civilizations II finally resurrected the sci-fi 4x genre. I guess we're still waiting for the champion of squad-based tactical games

Edited May 12, 2007 by Mr March