JsARCLIGHT Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 My favorite guns are:That I own: Glock 21 Ruger GP100 That I'd like: (But probably won't/can't get) Styer P90 Styer Aug HK G36 series HK UMP And Sci fi: Warhammer 40k Bolter Another Glock man, Salut brother! And the GP100 is a darn nice revolver, especially the heavy barrel .357 version. As they say all the time in the movie "Payback": Nice Balance! ... as for your wish list, you can get civilian legal H&K SL8 and USP and have them dolled up to look just like the G36 and UMP, just lacking the extra features like folding stocks and flash hiders. I know a guy here in Saint Louis that does those conversions, they are pricey (then again so are the guns) but they turn out really nice.
Opus Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 Put it on a tri-pod and split the ammo and batteries between the squad. A more practical approach is to carry a radio and call in an airstrike.
VF19 Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 its the truth! And you do realize that a bolter is an automatic rocket launcher, VF-17. I would pick my favorite sci fi gun to be Fortune's railgun. hands down.
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 its from the movie. i have no idea if its true.
Druna Skass Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 I would pick my favorite sci fi gun to be Fortune's railgun. hands down. What about Ah-nold's railgun in Eraser, it looks eaiser to use?
Graham Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 Guys, discussions on firearms, knives, swords and fantasy weapons in this thread is fine, but please no discussion on how to make napalm, or improvised explosives. Maybe I'm being overly paranoid, but in today's political climate talking about that sort of thing can lead to people getting arrested and the site being closed down. Graham
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 Guys, discussions on firearms, knives, swords and fantasy weapons in this thread is fine, but please no discussion on how to make napalm, or improvised explosives. Maybe I'm being overly paranoid, but in today's political climate talking about that sort of thing can lead to people getting arrested and the site being closed down. Graham yeah, sorry about that. i was quoting a line from the movie Fight Club. didn't mean to start something likle that.
Lynx7725 Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 This thread is very interesting to me, but I personally cannot make much contribution to this as my nation has very strict gun-control laws. (It's okay, as a result we are peaceful and it's rather safe to wander around late at night.) One thing which I haven't seen in the discussion is the types of ammunitions -- things like FMJ, hollowpoints, ball, etc. I'm actually fairly interested in these also, since a good gun can deliver the ordnance, but the ordnance can have some fairly interesting effects too. Just not too sure if Graham's okay with discussing munition types here..
Graham Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 Just not too sure if Graham's okay with discussing munition types here.. No problems with discussing ammunition. G-
Druna Skass Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 As far as ammo goes can someone tell me about those dum-dum rounds? I've just heard little things about them but nothing really on the technical side. I just want to know what they are and why they're banned.
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 22, 2003 Posted October 22, 2003 The Dum Dum bullet (outlawed by the Hauge / Geneva Conventions for being "brutal" and "cruel" in their use in warfare) actually gets it's name from the British arms factory in India were it was invented in the late 1800's. A "Dum Dum" is basically any type of bullet with an exposed lead core or other means that allow the bullet to shatter or fragment upon impact and cause massive internal damage to the target. People always think Hollowpoints are Dum Dums but they are not, Hollowpoints "expand" on impact causing a wider wound channel. Sometimes there are bullets in the modern world that are boarderline "Dum Dum" like the NATO 5.56 round, which is a jacketed normal nose bullet that has a tendancy to fragment when it strikes bone or other hard material, thus increasing the wound channel.
Mechamaniac Posted October 22, 2003 Author Posted October 22, 2003 Sometimes there are bullets in the modern world that are boarderline "Dum Dum" like the NATO 5.56 round, which is a jacketed normal nose bullet that has a tendancy to fragment when it strikes bone or other hard material, thus increasing the wound channel. The other nifty side effect of FMJ rounds is that if they don't fragment, they tend to bounce off of ribs etc. My father's friend caught an AK round in Viet Nam. He was hit in the upper right shoulder, and the bullet bounced and tumbled all over the place, finally exiting his right ankle. He lived to tell the tale, and show the scars.
valkyrietestpilot Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 (edited) hmm,nato 5.56.is that the round the new ak shoots? i heard that the ak was recently downgraded from 7.62 to 5.56 in an effort to try to increase range & accuracy Edited October 23, 2003 by valkyrietestpilot
Opus Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 hmm,nato 5.56.is that the round the new ak shoots? i heard that the ak was recently downgraded from 7.62 to 5.56 in an effort to try to increase range & accuracy You're probably thinking of the AK-74, adopted in 1974,which fires a 5.45 mm. round. It is easily distinguished by it's orange bakelite mags. It really has nothing to do with range or accuracy it's more about the number of rounds a soldier can carry.
kanata67 Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 Guys, discussions on firearms, knives, swords and fantasy weapons in this thread is fine, but please no discussion on how to make napalm, or improvised explosives. Maybe I'm being overly paranoid, but in today's political climate talking about that sort of thing can lead to people getting arrested and the site being closed down. Graham you guys got me edited... "oppression of free speach" and more liberal whining omitted Good thing I didn't go into real detail I will say that I always thought it kind of silly to keep people from knowing some of the common ingredients... wouldn't we be better off if the cashier at the supermarket was suspicous of the hooded guy buying a lot of houshould cleaners? Can we discuss beige-boxing and other abuses of the infra-structure? j/k on a seroius note... what would you guys recomend in a .380?
Cdr Fokker Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 As for the airsofts, the base spring guns are quite plasticy, but look very realistic. The gas blowbacks, especially the expensive ones, have as much metal as a real one, in some cases. The main importance of the gas bloback is semi-automatic fire. With a low end spring gun, the slide has to be cocked for every shot. A gas blowback is a repeating gun, and works just like a real one. Been a while since I looked over the "other" forums here... should've jumped in earlier, especially since I've noticed the talk of Airsoft by several people. In response to the quote above: you're forgetting the core Airsoft gun which forms the backbone of all skirmishers' loadouts. I'm talking, of course, about the AEG (Automatic Electric Gun). AEGs are select-fire (except for the PSG-1) and rely on NiCd or NiMH battery backs for power. The battery drives a motor connected to a gearbox, which ends up driving a piston back which is then released and slams forward due to a highly-compressed spring either inside of or attached to the piston. AEGs can look HIGHLY realistic, but don't function as realistically as GBBs. Metal body kits are abundant for the main types of AEGs (Armalites and H&K's) and produce a very convinving replica. Probably the best Airsoft website for the English-speaking world is Arnie's Airsoft, based in the UK, but covering worldwide Airsoft news, offering numerous articles and reviews, and more: http://www.arniesairsoft.co.uk In addition, a few other notes on the types of Airsoft guns: GBBs can not only be semi-auto, but also select-fire. The KSC TMP, Maruzen MP5K, and KSC G18C are just a few examples. The KSC Beretta M93r even has a three-round burst capability. Also, different companies offer various GBBs suited for a variety of purposes. KSC and TM GBBs are intended more for skirmish use, often lacking trademarks and having a less-realistic finsh, but being powerful and reliable. WA (Western Arms) produces the highest-quality GBBs. The finishes are amazing, though most are more suited to be display pieces than anything else (though certain models are very skirmish-viable). KJW (Kuan Ju Works) produces cheap copies of TM (and now KSC) GBB pistols which are of moderate quality but lower price. They are also suited primarily for skirmish use, much like the "originals." KWC is yet another manufacturer of gas guns, primarily mid-level guns, though recently new GBB/NBB rifles have been announced by KWC. There is also another category of gas-powered Airsoft guns (mainly pistols) - NBBs, or non-blowbacks. These guns use the same gas as GBBs, but do not recoil the slide. While this is less realistic, these guns are quieter, generally cheaper, and more reliable due to the lower number of moving parts. Spring-powered, single-shot weapons are generally known as springers, though this term really only applies to the lower-grade weapons. In addition to the run-of-the-mill low-powered, moderate-quality springers, there are also Airsoft sniper rifles which are powered by a similar but more advanced and powerful spring-cocking system. However, these spring sniper rifles are beginning to lose ground to newer high-power, gas-powered bolt action rifles, such as Tanaka's Kar98K.
Druna Skass Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 (edited) Was there any real diffrence between the Springfield 1903 and the Mauser it was based off of? I've heard it was just a direct copy but I also heard it took some elements from a Lee Enfield design. Edited October 23, 2003 by Druna Skass
bsu legato Posted October 23, 2003 Posted October 23, 2003 Was there any real diffrence between the Springfield 1903 and the Mauser it was based off of? They're pretty darn close. In fact, even the 30-06 is just a lengthened 8mm case necked down to .30 cal. The Springfield has much better sights, though.
valkyrietestpilot Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 (edited) kanata67,if your going to go with something in a .380,i'd recommend something by walther.the ppk & others in the series are what james bond carried & are among the highest quality in the .380's.i also owned a russian made one that was pretty nice. a .380 is only slightly smaller than a 9mm i believe. Edited October 24, 2003 by valkyrietestpilot
Opus Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 I think the .380 is just an automatic version .38 calibur round. The 9mm is about .36 calibur. Personally I don't like .380 but I hear that the Bersa Thunder is a real nice piece. http://www.bersa-llama.com/cat_thunder380.html
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Meh, the .380 ACP (or 9mm Kurz for you German sprekenzies out there) is a weak round. Sure anything can kill ya but it won't necessarily "stop" someone. I'd say go for something with some ass behind it like a .40 S&W or a .45 ACP. They make lots of small C&C guns in those nice heavy stopping calibers these days.
Opus Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Meh, the .380 ACP (or 9mm Kurz for you German sprekenzies out there) is a weak round. Sure anything can kill ya but it won't necessarily "stop" someone. I'd say go for something with some ass behind it like a .40 S&W or a .45 ACP. They make lots of small C&C guns in those nice heavy stopping calibers these days. Not everyone buys guns with the intention of shooting people. I keep a Colt model M .32cal just for farting around cause it's fun to shoot. On the street I carry my PT-99 9mm or my Glock 30 .45ACP.
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Come on....what red blooded male hasn't wanted a PPK at one point or another? A Smith & Wesson? And you've had your six. *bang*
Graham Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 kanata67,if your going to go with something in a .380,i'd recommend something by walther.the ppk & others in the series are what james bond carried & are among the highest quality in the .380's.i also owned a russian made one that was pretty nice. a .380 is only slightly smaller than a 9mm i believe. Choosing which gun to buy based on a fictional movie character, is not a terribly good idea, especially if it is for self defense. Personally, I'm not very fond of the PPK. Pros and cons are as follows: - Pros 1) It's slim, thus fairly easy to conceal. 2) It points very well. Cons 1) Very heavy double action trigger pull for the first shot. 2) People with large or meaty hands can suffer from slide bite. 3) Fires a round with marginal stopping power, even using the best JHP rounds. 4) I find reliability to be not too good. Probably the best of the PPK type pistols is the SIG 232, but it is fairly pricy. Personally, even just for or plinking I don't enjoy shooting anything smaller than 9mm. Graham
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Not everyone buys guns with the intention of shooting people. Well then in that case lets hook him up with a nice Walther P22 comper and he can plink cans all day! My point was that the PPK is an outdated gun, you can get something just as small and conceilable with a better round chambering, lighter weight, better shooting feel/response and higher magazine capacity. The PPK, as Graham said, is more cultural icon than functional. I have shot a few, they are jerky and cumbersome... not as intuitive as some other small guns. My pick for a small baby gun for plinking targets or threats is a nice baby glock... 26, 27, 33, 36 you name it they are all small, pack a whallop and are easy on the hands and even easier to shoot. But if you just have to go Bond then at least get his new Walther P99, it comes in a healthy .40 S&W chambering! And does anyone else remember that James Bond protested it when M ordered him to start carrying the PPK rather than his Browning? He was downright insulted by the gun!
Isamu Atreides 86 Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 kanata67,if your going to go with something in a .380,i'd recommend something by walther.the ppk & others in the series are what james bond carried & are among the highest quality in the .380's.i also owned a russian made one that was pretty nice. a .380 is only slightly smaller than a 9mm i believe. Choosing which gun to buy based on a fictional movie character, is not a terribly good idea, especially if it is for self defense. Personally, I'm not very fond of the PPK. Pros and cons are as follows: - Pros 1) It's slim, thus fairly easy to conceal. 2) It points very well. Cons 1) Very heavy double action trigger pull for the first shot. 2) People with large or meaty hands can suffer from slide bite. 3) Fires a round with marginal stopping power, even using the best JHP rounds. 4) I find reliability to be not too good. Probably the best of the PPK type pistols is the SIG 232, but it is fairly pricy. Personally, even just for or plinking I don't enjoy shooting anything smaller than 9mm. Graham Graham, i've got big hands and am looking into buying a pistol...whats my best bet??
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 (edited) And does anyone else remember that James Bond protested it when M ordered him to start carrying the PPK rather than his Browning? He was downright insulted by the gun! It wasn't a Browning. It was a Beretta, and in .25 no less. Yeah, that would have been much better. Look, there's more to shooting than having the most expensive race gun on the block, or the most lethal man-stopper in the world. Some people enjoy the history behind these antiques. Sure a Broomhandle Mauser would be frighteningly impractical today, but it's also one of the first semi auto's ever made. A Colt 1851 Navy might be an absolute PITA to load, shoot and clean but it's also one of the handguns that "won the west." I thought some of you would have a better appreciation of history. <_< Edited October 24, 2003 by bsu legato
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Graham, i've got big hands and am looking into buying a pistol...whats my best bet?? Is it your first handgun? If so, get a .22 and learn to shoot the right way.
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Ooops, there I go confusing all the different guns Bond carried again. But he did carry a Browning 9mm in one movie and a S&W Magnum .44 in another!
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Ooops, there I go confusing all the different guns Bond carried again. But he did carry a Browning 9mm in one movie and a S&W Magnum .44 in another! I remember the S&W (Live and Let Die was my favorite bond movie when I was young and dumb) but where was the Browning?
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 (edited) Although Bond is assigned a Walther PPK as his new official handgun earlier in the film Doctor No, he uses a Browning 1910 .32 caliber to kill Dent. This gun may have been substituted because it allows for easy connection to a silencer. Edit to add: That's where I got the Browning in the original post I made Edited October 24, 2003 by JsARCLIGHT
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Yeah, I remember that now. He didn't get a "real" PPK until From Russia With Love, IIRC. I think it was just a matter of a PPK being unavailable, or maybe just a lazy prop handler. They used silenced PPKs in Where Eagles Dare, I believe.
JsARCLIGHT Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 I know this is getting sort of off topic, but if anyone has seen any of the original Flemming Bond novel covers they all tend to feature a different gun on each one, ranging from revolvers to russian pistols.
bsu legato Posted October 24, 2003 Posted October 24, 2003 Apparently, there;s a fair bit of "anime magikuu" involved with Bond's PPK in Dr. No. When he's first issued the gun, it's actually a Walther PPL. Then when he reaches Jamaica, it has turned into a PP before switching to a PPK in later scenes. Then he shoots Dent with the silenced Browning. But the most impressive feat is when Bond shoots at the "Dragon" his pistol has become a Colt 1911 before switching back to an actual PPK!
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