Ghost in the Shell Live Action - March 31, 2017

[renegadeleader1]

1 hour ago, Chronocidal said:

What's sad is that they're just as inept at understanding how to successfully adapt an anime as they are at picking franchises that will adapt well.

If they're so obsessed with the actiony popcorn flicks, they need to pick something less cerebral to begin with.  There's plenty of anime like that out there.  It just doesn't stand out, because that's the stuff that probably doesn't do well in Japan.

Someone remind me why Riding Bean or Gunsmith Cats hasn't been adapted yet?

[Dynaman]

Saw it this afternoon, decent movie - better than I expected.  Now I want to watch all the GitS movies and TV shows.  

Although now I am really tempted to see what they would make of Ghost in the Shell: Innocence... 

[Thom]

I saw it today and I thought it was really good. I like ScarJo a lot which is always a plus. Visually, it was stunning. Story-wise, I thought it held together well from beginning to end. One thing I was noting was how she was walking, and it seemed odd at times, until I finally just figured it was her moving a bit stiffly in her android body. There was very little laxness in it, which I thought was fitting. As for the plot, I was really glad it didn't turn out to be her against her own team, and I like how they pulled together for her at the end.  The guy playing Batou was really good and I was sorry to see the doctor die. I was really hoping there would be a scene with her mother near the end and I wasn't disappointed.

My only draw backs would be that it should have been solely about a mission, and not her backstory, at least not in a first movie. I feel they should have waited until a sequel to uncover her history, to let the character solidify as a person trying to live in her own 'body.' But that was about it. And probably won't happen now if it is doing so poorly. Shame too, because I did like it a lot. And not just because Johanson is in that ultra-tight suit!

I'll be buying this when it comes out!

[kajnrig]

4 hours ago, Dynaman said:

Although now I am really tempted to see what they would make of Ghost in the Shell: Innocence... 

They borrowed some bits from Innocence, I remember, specifically two things: the geisha saying "Help me" and the doctor/scientist they spoke to in order to deep dive into said geisha having a similar personality to and eye cybernetics as Dr. Harlad or whatever her name was.

Edited April 9, 2017 by kajnrig

[sh9000]

 

[cwmodels]

So I saw the live action Ghost in the Shell movie earlier this week... It is not a good movie by all means. Even though I am familiar with the original property, I was never really a fan of it. I've always thought the manga was overly complex, and Mamoru Oshii anime movie was excessively slow and boring. I didn't really mind the idea that a big Hollywood version can simplify some of the themes and contents, but what was delivered on screen was just piss poor in it's conception. The movie started with a clumsily written opening text that poorly established the world, and then cuts to three expository scenes that explains what the opening text tried to explain. The movie was stumbling right out of the gate from the get-go and the pacing was choppy all the way after that. What bothers me the most is the absulote lack of personality and motivation for every single character. The dialogues were pretty blend and most of the acting was subpar. It's like the director want to duplicate the anime visuals but never thought of all the practical implications when transferred to a live action movie with real people. 

American movies are usually very good at combining action with special effects, if they don't want to include all the cerebral stuff, they could've just gone with a straight forward story of Section 9 being a kickass group of rag tag guys stopping cyber crimes, and I would've been perfectly OK with that. But instead the director decided to slavishly adapt all the anime movie scenes but not the context each represents, so in the end it all comes up completely hollow without any meaning. All the special effects used for world-building are just crammed onto the screen for the sake of more stunning imagery, but with a lack of visual believability in its sci-fi implications. It's really the first time I thought a movie have TOO MUCH SPECIAL EFFECTS.

Another interesting point this movie bought to light for me is how outdated Ghost in the Shell is as a science fiction piece. When the original manga was created in the late 1980's, cybernetics and humanity in machines was the hot sci-fi theme used in many anime, books and movies (Terminator, Robocop, Bubble Gum Crisis, Star Trek's Borgs). But since then, real world advancement in A.I. and genetic research have pushed sci-fi themes more into that realm of exploration. I thought the lack of including any modern science understandings in this world made it unable to compete as a sci-fi property, similar to how most 1920's science fiction pulp is completely unreliable to us today.

I don't know if anyone noticed... the actress that plays the female doctor, she tries to convey distress by shaking her head back & forth while she talks in every scene. The director should've told her to keep her head still because it's bad over-acting, and that Reverse-Flash crap was driving me frakken crazy!

 

 

[nhyone]

20 hours ago, sh9000 said:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B06XT8SXTS/ref=tmm_blu_title_0?ie=UTF8&qid=&sr=

Waiting for it to drop to US$14.99. 

[sh9000]

It probably will or the standard $19.99.

[Dynaman]

17 hours ago, kajnrig said:

They borrowed some bits from Innocence, I remember, specifically two things: the geisha saying "Help me" 

The problem with that was they never went anywhere with it.  

[electric indigo]

 

[sh9000]

 

[kajnrig]

http://variety.com/2017/film/box-office/ghost-in-the-shell-box-office-1202027114/

The Japanese manga adaptation topped the foreign box office this weekend, taking in a leading $41.3 million from 46 markets. That brings the science-fiction adventure’s global haul to $124.4 million, a disappointing result given its $110 million production budget and the tens of millions spent marketing and distributing the picture. Some publications are conservatively estimating that “Ghost in the Shell” will end its run $60 million in the hole.

[azrael]

And we have another Warcraft. Flops domestically. Makes up in foreign markets.

[sh9000]

 

[kajnrig]

4 hours ago, Dynaman said:

The problem with that was they never went anywhere with it.  

To be fair, they didn't go anywhere with a lot of things. WA-HEEEEEY

No but seriously, thinking on the movie some more and not going anywhere, why did they include the "Kuze's network" thing? Maybe I missed something. Inane conjecture here, so feel free to ignore:

It's such an irrelevant detail when it first gets brought up, and it's really unclear how Kuze intended to use it. His plan, as far as I remember, was to eliminate members of project 2501(?) while finding out 1) what they did to him, and 2) his memories; and then upload himself to his alternate network to "regenerate." Either before the upload or after, he also wanted to destroy Hanka Robotics(?). My question: What does "regenerating" entail? Does it mean preserving his ghost/memories/etc. while his body is reconstructed? Does it mean "repairing" his ghost/memories/etc.? In either case, why wouldn't he have "regenerated" already just to replace his body? It's clear his physical body is dysfunctional. There's no reason why he shouldn't have upgraded to something more robust, or at least functional. Also, if uploading of the ghost to an artificial network is possible already, then doesn't that defeat the purpose of the whole "Major is the first of her kind" subplot? It means that a form of cyberbrain exists in this world, even if it involves a massive computer array. Theoretically everyone could upload themselves to "the network" in this fashion. Also also, if he can do this, then wouldn't it be more prudent to do this first and hack into Hanka Robotics to find out the information he needs? He was perfectly able to wirelessly hack into the two truck drivers, unless it's supposed to be the case that he had done so physically some time earlier and implanted some sort of backdoor to get at them... I dunno.

Later, when he's recreating the "ascension to a higher being" scene with ScarJo, he says something like "come with me to my network, we can evolve beyond these people and then take our revenge." What? How would they "evolve"? In the original version, they make it clear that they would merge together, and the result of the merger would NOT be either the Major or the Puppet Master, but a different being altogether. Or would they simply be dispersed consciousnesses across various servers? If so, then again, why did Kuze not do this in the first place?

[cwmodels]

 

[electric indigo]

11 hours ago, kajnrig said:

No but seriously, thinking on the movie some more and not going anywhere, why did they include the "Kuze's network" thing? Maybe I missed something. Inane conjecture here, so feel free to ignore:

 

  Hide contents

It's such an irrelevant detail when it first gets brought up, and it's really unclear how Kuze intended to use it. His plan, as far as I remember, was to eliminate members of project 2501(?) while finding out 1) what they did to him, and 2) his memories; and then upload himself to his alternate network to "regenerate." Either before the upload or after, he also wanted to destroy Hanka Robotics(?). My question: What does "regenerating" entail? Does it mean preserving his ghost/memories/etc. while his body is reconstructed? Does it mean "repairing" his ghost/memories/etc.? In either case, why wouldn't he have "regenerated" already just to replace his body? It's clear his physical body is dysfunctional. There's no reason why he shouldn't have upgraded to something more robust, or at least functional. Also, if uploading of the ghost to an artificial network is possible already, then doesn't that defeat the purpose of the whole "Major is the first of her kind" subplot? It means that a form of cyberbrain exists in this world, even if it involves a massive computer array. Theoretically everyone could upload themselves to "the network" in this fashion. Also also, if he can do this, then wouldn't it be more prudent to do this first and hack into Hanka Robotics to find out the information he needs? He was perfectly able to wirelessly hack into the two truck drivers, unless it's supposed to be the case that he had done so physically some time earlier and implanted some sort of backdoor to get at them... I dunno.

Later, when he's recreating the "ascension to a higher being" scene with ScarJo, he says something like "come with me to my network, we can evolve beyond these people and then take our revenge." What? How would they "evolve"? In the original version, they make it clear that they would merge together, and the result of the merger would NOT be either the Major or the Puppet Master, but a different being altogether. Or would they simply be dispersed consciousnesses across various servers? If so, then again, why did Kuze not do this in the first place?

 

The way I took it, it was a matter of timing. Kuze was still completing his network, filling the gaps in his "Ghost" and executing his revenge when Section 9 interfered. He wouldn't need his robot body any more, so why update it. He would also leave his human brain and go completely digital, which is the big leap in this movie, contrary to the source material, where live evolves from code. His plan to evolve once in the network is still plausible, because he would exist in a different realm with different modes of perception. 

[nhyone]

I'm usually wary of origin stories (*yawn*), what's more a live-action anime adaptation (they suck), but Chris Stuckmann, a YouTube movie reviewer, gives this an A- (Ghost in the Shell - Movie Review) — and knowing he watches anime — I trust his recommendation and went to watch it.

I like it.

The key is not to expect it to be Ghost in the Shell (GitS) 1995, but a cyberpunk movie. In fact, I get vibe of Blade Runner and The Matrix for scenes that were not lifted directly from GitS. (GitS was heavily influenced by Blade Runner anyway.)

The film lifts many iconic imagery as-is from the anime, although not always in the same context, but tells its own story — more simple and much less philosophical than the anime — and is still cohesive and coherent. It stands on its own. I'm fine with that. I treat it as an alternate universe.

There was hoo-ha online that GitS was white-washed due to casting a white female lead over a Japanese one. I have the reverse issue with it. It would have been better if the Section 9 Chief was dubbed over in non-Japanese market. It was jarring to listen to half the conversation and reading the other half.

If I have any issues with Scarlett Johansson as The Major, it was that her thermoptic camouflage suit wasn't skin tone-y enough.

It's too bad with the poor box office numbers that we will not get a sequel. But why do films need sequels? Blade Runner and The Matrix didn't...

 

My original text:

Spoiler

I'm usually wary of origin stories, what's more a live-action anime adaptation, but Chris Stuckmann gives this an A- (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89yKotapLFE) -- and knowing he watches anime -- I trust his recommendation and went to watch it.

I like it.

The key is not to expect it to be GitS, but a cyberpunk movie. In fact, I get the vibe of Blade Runner and The Matrix for the scenes that weren't lifted directly from GitS.

Personally, I feel the film stands on its own. Many iconic imagery were lifted as-is from the anime, although not always in the same context. I'm fine with that. I treat the film as an alternate universe.

On white-washing, it would have been better if the Chief was dubbed over in non-Japanese market. It was jarring to listen to half the conversation and read the other half.

If I have any issues with Scarlett Johansson, it was that her thermoptic camouflage suit wasn't skin tone-y enough.

It's too bad with the poor box office performance that we will not get a sequel. But why do films need sequels? Blade Runner and The Matrix didn't...

 

Edited April 13, 2017 by nhyone
Same content, but edited to be better

[no3Ljm]

1 hour ago, nhyone said:

But why do films need sequels? Blade Runner and The Matrix didn't...

Blade Runner 2049.

Matrix Reloaded.

Matrix Revolutions.

 

[Negotiator]

I believe he is saying they did not "need" sequels.

[Thom]

Yes, I would much rather Matrix had stopped after the first movie. The latter two ruined it.

[sketchley]

7 hours ago, Negotiator said:

I believe he is saying they did not "need" sequels.

Sarcasm doesn't really work on message boards, does it.  LOL

 

1 hour ago, Thom said:

Yes, I would much rather Matrix had stopped after the first movie. The latter two ruined it.

Agreed.  It's almost as if they are from two different movie universes.

That said... the 3rd movie ruined the alternate-universe sequel series.  The end of the 2nd one had so many possibilities (E.g.: Neo waking up out of a constructed reality - the so-called Matrix actually being a constructed reality inside of that constructed reality!).  But alas, they opted to go down the standard Hollywood action route... T.T;

 

Nevertheless, it's interesting that Matrix (the first film) pops up in discussing this movie.  The Matrix itself lifted many shots (and in some cases, scenes!) from the first animated GiTS movie.  The two most obvious ones are the timing of the collapsing marble panel at the end of the lobby shootout sequence, and the exploding watermelons in the market chase!

So, that begs the question: did either of those two scenes (shall we call them Easter eggs?) make it into this live action remake?

Edited April 12, 2017 by sketchley

[kajnrig]

Not to beleaguer the point, but I just got done with the first season of SAC, and maaaan... This movie should have been about the Tachikomas. That's all.

[CoryHolmes]

Saw this last night, and I don't really have much to add to the conversation.  A solid 6/10 for me.  It should've been longer, gave more time to let some of the ideas germinate a bit more and really ripen.  It felt a tad rushed, crammed into only 107 minutes.

 

That being said, I noticed a few editing flubs that really annoy me.  Towards the end, when the Bad Guy puts his hands on Aramaki's desk, in one shot he's got his hands curled into the knuckles, and in the reverse shot they're flat!  I'm not the most observant of people, but that really irks me.

 

ps: Batou was awesome.  Aramaki was double extra plus awesome.

[CoryHolmes]

On ‎4‎/‎11‎/‎2017 at 7:30 AM, nhyone said:

There was hoo-ha online that GitS was white-washed due to casting a white female lead over a Japanese one. I have the reverse issue with it. It would have been better if the Section 9 Chief was dubbed over in non-Japanese market. It was jarring to listen to half the conversation and reading the other half.

I'm usually wary of origin stories, what's more a live-action anime adaptation, but Chris Stuckmann gives this an A- (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=89yKotapLFE) -- and knowing he watches anime -- I trust his recommendation and went to watch it.

I like it.

The key is not to expect it to be GitS, but a cyberpunk movie. In fact, I get the vibe of Blade Runner and The Matrix for the scenes that weren't lifted directly from GitS.

Personally, I feel the film stands on its own. Many iconic imagery were lifted as-is from the anime, although not always in the same context. I'm fine with that. I treat the film as an alternate universe.

On white-washing, it would have been better if the Chief was dubbed over in non-Japanese market. It was jarring to listen to half the conversation and read the other half.

If I have any issues with Scarlett Johansson, it was that her thermoptic camouflage suit wasn't skin tone-y enough.

It's too bad with the poor box office performance that we will not get a sequel. But why do films need sequels? Blade Runner and The Matrix didn't...

 

I've been thinking about this, and now I think that was done to show that nobody bothers to actually learn a language any more.  They just chip in the language into a processor and get everything translated for them via implants.

 

I love how pervasive the cybernetics were in this society.  From the mundane and utilitarian to the ultra snazzy and top of the line, cybernetics are in every corner of society.

[kajnrig]

Tangentially related, but this showed up on my Youtube feed (also, I may or may not have already posted the video, but I think it's a good one):

 

[JetJockey]

I kept my word since whenever I last posted here and will watch the movie for free someday. I probably won't post a review as from what I've heard it's pretty bad if you are a fan of Motoko Kusanagi. Yes a fan. I remember getting into it with someone here before about what fans will accept.  It's like the people behind the movie didn't care about the "casting" issue and made things even worse with a character reveal thus showing their true feelings. Anyway, I found a few things to post / share. Fans of Motoko or series might find these worth watching.

 

I found Happy Console Gamer's review interesting. I know I posted a few videos from him before. He's a big fan of anime, Macross, as well as Ghost in the Shell.

 

 

These are good reviews too. She seems to be a fan and references things in the series. She made non-spoiler and spoiler reviews.

 

 

 

Someone on Neogaf found this one. These guys had me cracking up. WARNING! THEY SPOIL THE TWIST AT THIS MOMENT! ALSO SWEARING WARNING!

 

 

And the disappointment some actresses felt about the movie. It's worth a read since people like to post that on the street in Japan reaction. This interview is really honest.

 

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/ghost-shell-4-japanese-actresses-dissect-movie-whitewashing-twist-990956

 

It's safe to say that at this point after last weekend's numbers that the movie is a financial flop. It will be lucky if it crawls to $50 million in the United States. Which honestly I'm happy about. I've never wanted a movie to fail before either. But all the bs and selling points going on around the Internet about how Hollywood works and why Scarlett was chosen were upsetting. Now people are still coming up with garbage about how Ghost in the Shell was never that good to begin with or the movie was never going to be profitable. Or it looks and sounds good, which is Tron Legacy all over again. It's all bs. I wish it was even more of a flop but they probably got lucky with the Hollywood marketing machine selling it. Too bad that machine couldn't work for the right reasons.

[no3Ljm]

 

[Hikaru1234567890]

21 hours ago, no3Ljm said:

 

I don't know how I feel about this, I heard some ThreeZero figures had large amounts of issues with them. Would have preferred it to he Hot Toys making a 1/6 Major. But, only time will tell to see how good this is.

[UN Spacy]

Many theaters in my area are down to ONE showing per day.

I guess I'd be catch it in theaters before it's too late. 

[kajnrig]

If it's down to that, you're likely only going to have 'til Thursday to catch it. I was lucky enough to catch Your Name the week before it was removed from the theater's lineup.

[Graham]

I think it lasted about a week here in Hong Kong. It's been gone from the cinema for ages already.

[Black Valkyrie]

 

Didn't watch it until now .

 

 

[GU-11]

17 hours ago, Hikaru1234567890 said:

I don't know how I feel about this, I heard some ThreeZero figures had large amounts of issues with them. Would have preferred it to he Hot Toys making a 1/6 Major. But, only time will tell to see how good this is.

Hot Toys is probably too busy with its Marvel movie licenses. 

Besides, HT is really bad when it comes to rubberized suits. If they made a thermoptic version fig, be prepared for possible chemical reactions or even plain old dry rot. 

As for the movie itself, just going to wait for my local cable tv network to air it. The reviews dont sound promising enough to warrant the price of a ticket.

[peter]

I just came back from watching this, and though I have a huge hate-boner for Robotech, I’d probably cringe at a Leonard DeCaprio Akira or a Toby McGuire Robotech, I actually enjoyed this film.

I have the manga and watched the original film more than a dozen times and I was totally okay with this film.  Scar Jo was fine as this character.  It would have been cool if she managed to get at least a few lines down perfectly to exchange with Aramaki’s character (Takeshi).

Batou was awesome, I thought the actor did a great job.

I liked the ending.