electric indigo Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 I saw it yesterday with three friends who are absolutely not into science fiction, and we all liked every bit of it. On a purely technical level, this is the most brilliant movie I witnessed so far. Every shot displayed how much work has been put into the making of this world, I felt right at home in Cameron's hardware and set designs, and the scenery blew away anything LOTR had impressed me with effortlessly. The Na'vi were much better than Gollum x 2000, given their range of acting and performances in the different surroundings, and they were convincing all the time. Ironically, I can't remember when a "real" actress from a recent Hollywood movie delivered such a touching performance as Neytiri when she cries for the tree or her father . There were few points where the movie could have been better, but nothing really critical IMO. The Helos made me for the first time not miss the old days of physical FX models. Can't wait for the next Cinefex issue.
eriku Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 Anyone checking out the toys yet? I picked up a 3" Na'vi Sully and the larger 6" version of the same. Both are quite excellent, with the biggest difference being that the 6" version has more/better articulation. Another difference is the 6" version has a removable knife on his chest strap. Very cool. I doubt I'll get any of the human figures, but I'll definitely pick up more Na'vi and probably the power suit. I think this is the most nicely done line of movie figures Mattell has produced so far.
eugimon Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 Really? I thought the toys looked horrible.
-Snowblind- Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 I saw it last Monday. There's really nothing to say that hasn't already been said... no, it's not original, yes it looks fantastic, etc etc. Overall I enjoyed it and will probably buy the blu-ray. As for the toys... I agree with eugimon - they looked pretty horrible. Kind of surprised they didn't go with Hasbro. They seem to have a winning formula for the 3 3/4" toys these days.
eriku Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 I haven't looked closely at the humans, but the Na'vi have great sculpts (although the face and hair looks a bit off on Sully) and paint and lots of articulation. The 3" figure I have reminds me of a modern Star Wars figure in terms of detail and quality, and the 6" figure is right in line with Mattell's recent DC and MOTU figures. I haven't handled any of the mechs or vehicles yet, but from what I've read they seem to be good toys. Apparently the iTag feature is fun, but I don't have a webcam so I haven't checked that out.
peter Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 Ironically, I can't remember when a "real" actress from a recent Hollywood movie delivered such a touching performance as Neytiri when she cries for the tree or her father . There were few points where the movie could have been better, but nothing really critical IMO. The Helos made me for the first time not miss the old days of physical FX models. Can't wait for the next Cinefex issue. I totally agree on all those points. Her facial expressions were incredibly realistic and very moving at times. The movie really didn't have much room for improvement, maybe just a few bits here and there. Everyone's saying that the story was unoriginal and predictable, but as far as stories and plot-lines go, eventually they will repeat themselves. Didn't Shakespeare say that when writing a story, there are only 21 possible plotlines? Not sure if that's true, but it kinda makes sense. I saw several elements that triggered thoughts of Last Samurai, Dances with Wolves etc...it can't be helped. In ever movie, story, or book, you're gonna see similarities from other movies, stories and books. It's up to the story teller to mask the basic plotline. I saw a comparison of Harry Potter and Star Wars once, and I was convinced they were the same story. Anyways, great movie.
Twoducks Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 Saw the toys a month ago and while the action figures were nice the robot suit looked like a$$ (as a toy and as a design). Curiously, I really enjoyed the scenes that had the mecha in them. And the last fight was just an awesome piece of action.
eriku Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 The Collection DX review of the suit makes it sound pretty good: http://www.collectiondx.com/review/action_figure/amp_suit Josh also makes the good point that Hot Toys or some other company is almost guaranteed to make a better version.
jenius Posted December 30, 2009 Posted December 30, 2009 Everyone's saying that the story was unoriginal and predictable, but as far as stories and plot-lines go, eventually they will repeat themselves. Didn't Shakespeare say that when writing a story, there are only 21 possible plotlines? Not sure if that's true, but it kinda makes sense. I saw several elements that triggered thoughts of Last Samurai, Dances with Wolves etc...it can't be helped. In ever movie, story, or book, you're gonna see similarities from other movies, stories and books. It's up to the story teller to mask the basic plotline. I saw a comparison of Harry Potter and Star Wars once, and I was convinced they were the same story. Anyways, great movie. The trick is making a similar plot line FEEL fresh. Giving it a twist here or there. Avatar doesn't do this. From the second whats-her-bucket says only five people have flown whats-its-feet and that whoever does so is respected as King you KNOW that Sully is going to do this, bring together the tribes, and fight off the humans. There's a lot of film left at this point so you know a good deal in advance what's going to happen and you're just sitting back and watching it unfold. There's no curveball pitched to you. You also KNOW (and by know I mean you expect it with some conviction) from the moment that Ripley is killed and fails to enter her avatar that Sully is going to successfully undergo the same process at some point. So, when the slaughter happens at Super Happy Treeland and the tables are turned on Jake you can say to yourself "Alright, pick yourself up Jake, get that terror bird, rally your troops, almost die, and then become a native." It's one thing to say stories have similar plot points. That's bound to happen. Movies also normally have a pretty traditional format with three major acts, introductions, difficulties, resolutions. As long as the movie keeps you on your toes by misleading the viewer occasionally that's not an issue. Avatar never really attempts to mislead viewers. It points you in a direction and then takes you down that path. It's a pretty path... but not a surprising one.
peter Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 (edited) The trick is making a similar plot line FEEL fresh. Giving it a twist here or there. Avatar doesn't do this. From the second whats-her-bucket says only five people have flown whats-its-feet and that whoever does so is respected as King you KNOW that Sully is going to do this, bring together the tribes, and fight off the humans. There's a lot of film left at this point so you know a good deal in advance what's going to happen and you're just sitting back and watching it unfold. There's no curveball pitched to you. You also KNOW (and by know I mean you expect it with some conviction) from the moment that Ripley is killed and fails to enter her avatar that Sully is going to successfully undergo the same process at some point. So, when the slaughter happens at Super Happy Treeland and the tables are turned on Jake you can say to yourself "Alright, pick yourself up Jake, get that terror bird, rally your troops, almost die, and then become a native." It's one thing to say stories have similar plot points. That's bound to happen. Movies also normally have a pretty traditional format with three major acts, introductions, difficulties, resolutions. As long as the movie keeps you on your toes by misleading the viewer occasionally that's not an issue. Avatar never really attempts to mislead viewers. It points you in a direction and then takes you down that path. It's a pretty path... but not a surprising one. That's okay, I don't always need surprises in a movie. Sometimes it's safer for the writers that way, instead of throwing in some plot twist that just pisses people off....for example, wiping out all the characters you like. This movie went well, despite the predictabilaty. A good amount of the main cast died off without it being a complete tragedy, the tides turned at a good time, and the bad guy died in a rewarding fight scene. No annoying characters, no horrendous acting, I left the theatre with a smile = good movie. It worked for me, maybe not some else. Edited December 31, 2009 by peter
EXO Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 The trick is making a similar plot line FEEL fresh. Giving it a twist here or there. Avatar doesn't do this. From the second whats-her-bucket says only five people have flown whats-its-feet and that whoever does so is respected as King you KNOW that Sully is going to do this, bring together the tribes, and fight off the humans. There's a lot of film left at this point so you know a good deal in advance what's going to happen and you're just sitting back and watching it unfold. There's no curveball pitched to you. You also KNOW (and by know I mean you expect it with some conviction) from the moment that Ripley is killed and fails to enter her avatar that Sully is going to successfully undergo the same process at some point. So, when the slaughter happens at Super Happy Treeland and the tables are turned on Jake you can say to yourself "Alright, pick yourself up Jake, get that terror bird, rally your troops, almost die, and then become a native." It's one thing to say stories have similar plot points. That's bound to happen. Movies also normally have a pretty traditional format with three major acts, introductions, difficulties, resolutions. As long as the movie keeps you on your toes by misleading the viewer occasionally that's not an issue. Avatar never really attempts to mislead viewers. It points you in a direction and then takes you down that path. It's a pretty path... but not a surprising one. I totally agree. I tell my friends that haven't seen it is that the only thing I don't like is that Cameron foreshadows everything that's gonna happen. Starting off with the jellyfish thingies making him the "One". Neytiri's task of having to train Jake. Trudy's little blurb about martyrdom, Grace's death after failing to "go thru the eye of Ewan, the legend of the turokwhatevers, and his prayer to the tree. I don't think that the story is ridiculous as GI Joe or Terminator: Salvation, but it's kind of a step back from realizing that the audience are way too sophisticated to be spoonfed the direction story takes. I agree also with Peter's point about people being too harsh about the familiar plots, I don't think it's more derived than even Dances with Wolves and Last Samurai which I thought at that time were derived from other stories like Lawrence Of Arabia. I think peope are confusing the critism of familiarity with predictibilty.
electric indigo Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Really? I thought the toys looked horrible. I think this one has some modding potential:
eugimon Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 I think this one has some modding potential: okay, that one isn't bad, but the bird thing, the cat thing, those are hideous
Kelsain Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 Saw this a while back, found it rather amusing: AVATAR IN 5 PANELS Seen at Geekologie (may be naughty words in the comments)
emajnthis Posted December 31, 2009 Posted December 31, 2009 I think this one has some modding potential: I bought one of those a couple of weeks before Christmas and still haven't opened it yet. I guess i should get around to doing that.
taksraven Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 The trick is making a similar plot line FEEL fresh. Giving it a twist here or there. Avatar doesn't do this. From the second whats-her-bucket says only five people have flown whats-its-feet and that whoever does so is respected as King you KNOW that Sully is going to do this, bring together the tribes, and fight off the humans. There's a lot of film left at this point so you know a good deal in advance what's going to happen and you're just sitting back and watching it unfold. There's no curveball pitched to you. You also KNOW (and by know I mean you expect it with some conviction) from the moment that Ripley is killed and fails to enter her avatar that Sully is going to successfully undergo the same process at some point. So, when the slaughter happens at Super Happy Treeland and the tables are turned on Jake you can say to yourself "Alright, pick yourself up Jake, get that terror bird, rally your troops, almost die, and then become a native." It's one thing to say stories have similar plot points. That's bound to happen. Movies also normally have a pretty traditional format with three major acts, introductions, difficulties, resolutions. As long as the movie keeps you on your toes by misleading the viewer occasionally that's not an issue. Avatar never really attempts to mislead viewers. It points you in a direction and then takes you down that path. It's a pretty path... but not a surprising one. I know what you mean, especially with the riding the bird bit. To me that was pretty normal flagging/signposting of what was going to happen, that is becoming more and more common place in today's films. Look at it from the studio executive's point of view. They never want to shock or surprise their audience too much, they just want everybody to be in a warm, happy place. To work that way you can never throw a curve ball or do something totally unexpected. Also, by flagging the events that are coming in a film, the audience get another warm happy feeling and the sensation that they have a brain when they are able to guess what is coming up in a film. Its all about keeping the audience relaxed and comfortable. Don't rock the boat. Taksraven
eugimon Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 meh, it's a fairytale. It's not trying to be a serious discussion on colonialism and indigenous people's issues. And when a shows DOES throw curve balls, then the same people bitch and moan about that. You just can't win.
shiroikaze Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 Excuse me for coming out of left field but, I can't wait to see this on a box of Frosted Flakes.
Graham Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 Saw the 3D version yesterday and enjoyed it much more than expected. Yes, the story was extremely simple and predictable, but the CG combined with the 3D really did offer an immersive, believable experience. I'll probably see it once more. Not sure if I'll buy the DVD though, as, I think a lot of what makes the movie special will be lost on a 2D small screen. Graham
electric indigo Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 Not sure if I'll buy the DVD though, as, I think a lot of what makes the movie special will be lost on a 2D small screen. What I expect from the DVD is to give us some 30 minutes that have been cut from the theatrical release.
Duke Togo Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 Not sure if I'll buy the DVD though, as, I think a lot of what makes the movie special will be lost on a 2D small screen. Graham That pretty much sums it up right there. You strip away the 3D effects, and it's a movie that's not even really worth buying on DVD. Not sure I'd stop to watch it if it were on cable. The 3D effects are perhaps the sole reason to see it.
EXO Posted January 1, 2010 Posted January 1, 2010 It's the opposite for me. I think the 3D is just a throwaway gimmick (for any movie) Though I hardly buy any more DVDs/bluray. I find that they show everything that I can possibly want to see on HD cable. I end up recording something and watch it until I've seen enough times to finally delete it, as I did with the recent broadcasts of the Man With No Name movies (oh how good they looked in HD!) Though I might get this one for all the behind the scenes stuff. Can't say it's to complete my Cameron collection as I never bought Titanic or True Lies (or Piranha 2).
Vile Posted January 2, 2010 Posted January 2, 2010 I think the 3D is necessary, not so much because it's 3D but because the seems to look crap in 2D, judging from the trailers. However, even if the 2D is 'fixed' for the DVD, I still don't think it will work on a small screen - hence the comparison to Last of the Mohicans that a lot of people arund the interweb have been making. You just don't get the sense of immersion and scale that you do in the cinema.
promethuem5 Posted January 2, 2010 Posted January 2, 2010 Saw it today. The 3D is cool, and the movie is entertaining, but I found it really hard to be engaged by it when, like jenius pointed out, the movie is impossibly stupid and predictable. You already know the whole plot from the first moments, so the movie just drags on and on and on for what feels like an eternity. I also found the movie totally condescending and bleak if you're looking for any kind of message... corporate people are bad, science can't solve anything, might makes right, people of funny colors cannot be reasoned with, army is bad, humans are bad, people of funny colors are ignorant and stupid, it went on and on, portraying noone in a very good light. During the final battle between Corporal Scar and Blue Jake, Corporal Scar manages to correctly point out why it is effed up that Jake will win... you don't leave the movie with a very good feeling. And godammit, Unobtanium.
Dynaman Posted January 2, 2010 Posted January 2, 2010 I found it enjoyable. Yeah, you know how it will turn out the instant the cast is shown, BUT I didn't mind. The effects are perfect, and the 3D was used to great effect as well. The writing was solid if not inspired, and the acting from everyone was excellent. I don't expect every movie to be shakesperian (yeah, I probably messed up the spelling). I expect a movie to entertain, and this one did that.
electric indigo Posted January 2, 2010 Posted January 2, 2010 After seeing her concert, I'm convinced that the genetic engineering of the Avatars was used 60 years ago to create Grace Jones.
peter Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 My second time watching it was in 2D in a crappy ghetto theater because the nice 3D Imax theater was sold out.......it still rocked.
taksraven Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 Saw this a while back, found it rather amusing: AVATAR IN 5 PANELS Seen at Geekologie (may be naughty words in the comments) Frame 5 is kinda wrong. Any Academy awards won by this film will not be won by the director personally (Best Picture, Best Director, etc), but rather they will be won by the SFX teams. SF rarely, if ever, wins any other type of award. Not a legitimate artform according to the upper classes, I suspect. Taksraven
ntsan Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 2D is still beautiful, and more crispier than 3D version
eugimon Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 2D is still beautiful, and more crispier than 3D version deeper color reproduction as well
eriku Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 I plan on seeing this again in 2D. While the Real 3D presentation I saw was cool, I found it a bit too distracting. Maybe it's because my brain isn't wired correctly to look at 3D effects and think, "Oh my gosh, that thing just came right AT me!!" If anything the 3D makes it look more fake and artificial to me and pushes me out of the film rather than drawing me in. My main hope for this movie is that they release a special edition with the word "unobtainium" replaced by some other word. Any other word. I know it's a petty complaint, but the two times they spoke that word in this film it was like everything came to a screeching halt. Wouldn't have been much different if one of the Na'vi would have stopped mid-speech, bent over and farted directly at the camera with full THX-enhanced seat-rattling reverberations.
jenius Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 I would hope in the Avatar universe "unobtainium" is slang for some large scientific name or the commercial name of the element.
eriku Posted January 3, 2010 Posted January 3, 2010 (edited) Yeah, I suppose it could have a longer name like "Stuffwearealloutofbecauseweuseditallandnowweneedmoreium". Speaking of dumb slang terms, was "Pandora" just the human slang word for the planet and not actually what the Na'vi called it? I don't recall the Na'vi referring to it as Pandora. I assume they didn't have a formal name for it, sort of like how "Na'vi" just meant "the people". Edited January 3, 2010 by eriku
RD Blade Posted January 4, 2010 Posted January 4, 2010 I can't imagine them having a name for their planet because they probably don't know what a planet is.
eugimon Posted January 4, 2010 Posted January 4, 2010 I can't imagine them having a name for their planet because they probably don't know what a planet is. what? even ignorant dark age europeans, first humans in recorded history so dumb to think that the earth is flat, had a name for the big thing they lived on.
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