VF-14 Vampire customized art

[grebo guru]

Hey all,

Here's my stab at the VF-14 Vampire. I colored in dark Blackbird-ish tones, but followed the patterning of the Macross M3 color scheme.

Much like with the VF-2SS, I can't figure out where your typical gunpod would be mounted in fighter mode. And don't say "inside the leg, like the ElgerZorene"! That'd work for the VA-14, but this version is too skinny (IMO). Plus, I don't think it looks as cool. Anyway, I'm no fan of the Metal Siren, but I do like its gunpods -- and since they're supposed to be paired underwing, they work well with this VF. w00t!

No head variations for this one yet... but I'm workin' on it.

Grebo!!

[Zinjo]

FUGLY VF....

Sorry dude, not my favorite design AT ALL....

[jenius]

Is that the mech (or a modified version of it) that was the bad guy in Mac7? It definitely has some funky elements. The flaps that come up to form pecs on the chest? A triangle head with a point on top? It also kinda looks like it went in for a circumcision and lost the whole trunk. +Yeah, I think I'm with Zinjo on this one. I'm sure your artwork is good though.

Edited November 19, 2006 by jenius

[grebo guru]

Yeah, the VF-14 "Vampire" is essentially the UN Spacy VF upon which the Varauta Fz-109 "Elgerzorene" was based. Technically, the Fz-109 is a modified version of the VA-14, itself a heavier version of the VF-14.

I know it's an odd bird, the Vampire, but I'm coming to like it. As a General Galaxy design, it's got that whole "we don't do things the way Shinsei does 'em" vibe goin' on -- and it's pretty menacing looking. Plus, of course, it's pretty similar to the SR-71 Blackbird in fighter mode. Gotta love that.

Grebo

Is that the mech (or a modified version of it) that was the bad guy in Mac7? It definitely has some funky elements. The flaps that come up to form pecs on the chest? A triangle head with a point on top? It also kinda looks like it went in for a circumcision and lost the whole trunk. +Yeah, I think I'm with Zinjo on this one. I'm sure your artwork is good though.

[emajnthis]

Much like with the VF-2SS, I can't figure out where your typical gunpod would be mounted in fighter mode.

I'm not sure if it's accurate, but i remember seeing line art (not too sure if it was fan made) showing the gunpod eject from within the arm (hand moves aside and jettisons the folded gunpod). It's in a wallpaper thread somewhere in the forums.

[briscojr84]

Isn't it in M3, maybe some-one who's played it can enlighten us.

[grebo guru]

Inside the arm?!? Gah! That must be one small gunpod...

(runs off to search the wallpaper threads)

I'm not sure if it's accurate, but i remember seeing line art (not too sure if it was fan made) showing the gunpod eject from within the arm (hand moves aside and jettisons the folded gunpod). It's in a wallpaper thread somewhere in the forums.

[Zinjo]

The irony of it, is that SK used some design elements from this Fugly design in the ultra cool looking SV-51!

The head, and broken off nose cone in the main body to name a couple.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Zinjo

[briscojr84]

Wasn't General Galaxy started by a Zentraedi or headed by a Zentraedi engineer or something like that, the proportions kinda remind me of a Nousjaedul suit.

[grebo guru]

You are indeed correct, BriscoJr84.

(And I miss "Brisco County, Jr." too....)

[Kelsain]

Inside the arm?!? Gah! That must be one small gunpod...

(runs off to search the wallpaper threads)

IIRC, it was stored in the leg, like the VF-17, firing forward from underneath in fighter mode. Unlike the 17, it didn't launch out of the leg, but the leg opened, Robocop-style, and then the gunpod was retrieved.

Edited November 20, 2006 by Kelsain

[Penguin]

I'm not sure if it's accurate, but i remember seeing line art (not too sure if it was fan made) showing the gunpod eject from within the arm (hand moves aside and jettisons the folded gunpod). It's in a wallpaper thread somewhere in the forums.

The lineart in the Macross 2 This Is Animation shows the folded gunpod ejecting from inside the SAP forearm armour on the VF-2SS. It didn't appear to be available in fighter mode. Without the armour, the VF-2SS cannot carry a gun pod in fighter mode.

[Penguin]

IIRC, it was stored in the leg, like the VF-17, firing forward from underneath in fighter mode. Unlike the 17, it didn't launch out of the leg, but the leg opened, Robocop-style, and then the gunpod was retrieved.

The "Nexx Special" VF-2SS has a special gun pod in right leg SAP armour. The standard VF-2SS doesn't have the leg holster.

[grebo guru]

Ohhhh, I missed that he was talking about the VF-2SS (with regard to the gun coming out of the forearm). Somehow, I thought he meant that the VF-14 stored its gunpod in its arm! No way there.

The info in this thread about the VF-14 storing its gunpod in a pop-out leg holster, Robocop-style, is interesting to me. I'd love to see a pic (screen grab or something, I guess). It does make sense, I suppose, as the Fz-109 stores its gunpod in its leg... though I really don't find such an arrangement terribly "credible".

Grebo!

The lineart in the Macross 2 This Is Animation shows the folded gunpod ejecting from inside the SAP forearm armour on the VF-2SS. It didn't appear to be available in fighter mode. Without the armour, the VF-2SS cannot carry a gun pod in fighter mode.

[sketchley]

Make that two of us.

The VF-14 "Vampire" is from M3.

It makes sense that the gunpod is stored in the leg, and is retrieved in the same way as the Fz-109. Though, with the missile launchers that are supposedly also in the legs too, it's definitely a tight fit!

That said, with the trend in VFs in M7 and Plus, with space in the leg for an engine, a weapon pallet, and sometimes even a gun pod too, Kawamori Shouji must be of the mind that the thermonuclear engines must be getting quite small by the 2040s.

[jenius]

The irony of it, is that SK used some design elements from this Fugly design in the ultra cool looking SV-51!

I find the SV-51 pretty equally hideous. I'm not saying your opinion is wrong, lots of people love it, I just find the cut off crotch, strange head, and overall thin design to be a put-off.

I do agree with everyone about the leg holster being a bit of a stretch. Isn't that part of the reason the VF-17 has the odd GERWALK mode or was it simply because they needed to keep the arms pointed backward to give it a means of forward propulsion?

[sketchley]

I do agree with everyone about the leg holster being a bit of a stretch. Isn't that part of the reason the VF-17 has the odd GERWALK mode or was it simply because they needed to keep the arms pointed backward to give it a means of forward propulsion?

It had something to do with the laser guns that are in the arms, and to give the whole thing a more sleek, aggressive looking gerwalk mode. It may also have to do with utilizing the thrusters in the shoulders as breaking thrusters, as the knees on the VF-17 don't appear to be able to bend backwards.) Forward thrust comes either from the legs/main engines (angled the right way,) or small thrusters in the ankle and two that are normally concealed in what becomes the back of the VF-17 (seen in the detail-up review battroid lineart.)

In both VF-X and VF-X2 the VF-17 does have a more regular looking gerwalk mode.

It should be kept in mind that the VF-17 is primarily a space based fighter, and the design reflects this.

Edited November 21, 2006 by sketchley

[jenius]

or small thrusters in the ankle and two that are normally concealed in what becomes the back of the VF-17 (seen in the detail-up review battroid lineart.)

Ah yes, I had forgotten those. I think they're also on the Bandai toy so i should have remembered. Needless to say, I'm no fan of that alternate Gerwalk. I always thought a big part of the reason for having a Gerwalk was to be flexible in where you were aiming your weaponry but still utilizing some of the advantages of a full flight mode... the VF-17's Gerwalk seems to be going for something different.

[Zinjo]

Ah yes, I had forgotten those. I think they're also on the Bandai toy so i should have remembered. Needless to say, I'm no fan of that alternate Gerwalk. I always thought a big part of the reason for having a Gerwalk was to be flexible in where you were aiming your weaponry but still utilizing some of the advantages of a full flight mode... the VF-17's Gerwalk seems to be going for something different.

IMO the best mode for the VF-17 was the battroid. All other modes just didn't impress me... Initially I hated it entirely unltil I saw Millia's red one, THAT sold me on the Battroid VF-17

[grebo guru]

I'm quite fond of the VF-17... even despite (or perhaps because of?) its foibles:

1. The oddly arbitrary and seemingly pointless Gerwalk configuration. I prefer the more conventional arrangement, which happily can be managed without any alterations.

2. That gunpod stored in the leg. I understand the reasoning, but it would seem to be sacrificing valuable room for engines and/or reaction mass. (It's a clever overall gimmick though.)

3. The damn thing cheats at transformation. From Battroid to Fighter mode, there's definitely some flattening going on. My Bandai toy looks soooooo chubby in Fighter mode!

4. The VF-17's transformation pattern is almost exactly like that of the Legioss. The arms, the legs, and the chest all do the same thing in both mecha. It's really only the head and cockpit block which transform differently. (Seriously, it's true. Compare 'em for yourself!)

As for the SV-51, I personally think it is very, very ugly indeed... But that doesn't mean I dislike it. Machines are, in many cases, supposed to be ugly. Considering that the SV-51's role is that of the "opposite" to the VF-1, which is aesthetically schweet, the SV-51 is pretty much obliged to be ugly and gawky. Also, it's the "bad guy" mecha, so it has a duty to be unpleasant and unfriendly-looking. Finally, it's supposed to evoke the image of the alien "bird-man", so that's yet another reason for it to have a freakin' wierdo look to it.

The thing is, in Battroid mode I think the VF-Zero is really ugly too... but in a different way. It looks so flat and stiff. Now I understand there are reasons for this (what with it being a sort of "prehistoric" Valkyrie), but still, it's not easy on my eyes. I tell ya, if I'd been designing a precursor to the VF-1... well, I wouldn't, but if I did... I'd have a very different take on the idea.

Grebo!!!

Edited November 21, 2006 by grebo guru

[sketchley]

In gerwalk mode, I believe the arms can still pivot, thus allowing the "elbow mounted" lasers to be aimed off of the centerline.

Grebu, don't forget that the Vf-17 also has weapon pallets in it's legs, too. Meaning that there is room for the engines, gun pod, AND either the B-7 or the B-11A internal pallet (and any others that may exist). The fuel is probably stored in what becomes the back, and the wings.

Agreed that the SV-51 is supposed to be visually distinct from the VF-1.

Fun fact: the SV-51 is the only VF (that I know of) that Shoji Kawamori designed in 3-D first, before drawing. In other words - it's the most accurate VF in all modes, to date. I believe that is one of the reasons why it is so spindly, and has so many parts that merge and morph together in the different modes - but hey, that's what a transformer is supposed to do, right? Right.

Anyhow, going back to the topic of this thread - can the Macross II gun pods be removed, and replaced with those from the Fz-109? The Varuta ripped off the VF-14 in designing that VF, why not take the basic shape of the gun pod too? It'd also make fitting the gun into the leg that much easier.

Also the colours - purple (at least the shades chosen) don't give the VF enough menance. It is named Vampire afterall. The original colours (dark blue and light blue) had a lot more contrast. I suggest retaining that. Either go all black (and make the tie-in with the mystery jets on the sets in Macross Plus) or other colours that are more bold and aggressive.

Edited November 21, 2006 by sketchley

[grebo guru]

Attached is an image of the VF-14 with its colors tuned to a more black-like scheme, and with its gunpods in a variety of deployments.

Sketchley, thanks for your suggestions. I love insightful feedback like this. I'll look at the Fz-109's gun and see what I can do with it.

Anyhow, going back to the topic of this thread - can the Macross II gun pods be removed, and replaced with those from the Fz-109? The Varuta ripped off the VF-14 in designing that VF, why not take the basic shape of the gun pod too? It'd also make fitting the gun into the leg that much easier.

Also the colours - purple (at least the shades chosen) don't give the VF enough menance. It is named Vampire afterall. The original colours (dark blue and light blue) had a lot more contrast. I suggest retaining that. Either go all black (and make the tie-in with the mystery jets on the sets in Macross Plus) or other colours that are more bold and aggressive.

[sketchley]

The colours look good, but I still don't like the gun pods. The VF-14 should still be able to mount a gunpod along the centerline - if not carry the rather lethal looking gun pod of the Fz-109; that thing has four nasty bayonnet like spikes on the front. Nasty.

[Knight26]

As everyone else seems to have said, it looks good but needs a different gunpod, that one really doens't work with it.

[Kelsain]

I was looking for that shot of the gunpod deploying from the leg, but still haven't found it. Considering the sheer number of battles these things are in, it could take a while. I'm pretty sure it was on Gigil's fighter. You'd think this would be easier with all the recycled footage, but it might have been a one-shot.

[sketchley]

I think it's in one of the first few episodes... somewhere between the 2nd and 6th. Then again, I could be wrong...

[grebo guru]

I have lineart of the gunpod, its storage in the leg, and how it is deployed -- for the Fz-109, of course. But the Elgerzonrene (and thus the VA-14) has much fatter lower legs than the VF-14.

Grebo

[Kelsain]

I have lineart of the gunpod, its storage in the leg, and how it is deployed -- for the Fz-109, of course. But the Elgerzonrene (and thus the VA-14) has much fatter lower legs than the VF-14.

Grebo

Ah, OK, you've seen that too. I was, for clarity to the others, speaking of the Elgerzorene. And I did find the illustration later in the afternoon on Brisco's site. See below, from his Fz-109 page.

Now, in M3, does the animation give any indication of where the gun fires from? I've never played any of the macross games myself. Seems to me that if it came from the leggish region, the robocop holster would still apply. I see that the VA and Fz can store more in the leg, but then again, it's canon that Mylene's VF-11 could fit its engines and 6 missiles in it's gams.

On that note, I know you've also been customizing the designs to fit your RPG. To wit, I have an alternate suggestion to the wing-mounted pods. On the VF-1, the gunpod is mounted on the arms, which are ventral on the fighter mode. The VF-14's arms are dorsal in the fighter mode, and it has a large expanse of free area there, between the arms. What if the pods were mounted there? Pathetic "I'm at work" sketch attached.

[Kelsain]

Or,

Mounting the gunpod(s) on the ventral wing-root. This would be a stable position, mounted on the waist-fins in battroid, like the Y/VF-21 (also a General Galaxy design), and be within easy reach of the battroid. See attached.

Back to the idea of mounting them in the leg and having room for fuel/being fatter on the Fz109...

Perhaps the Fz109 has an integrated Fast Pack-like fuel reserve, as it is predominantly a space fighter. This would explain the chunkiness.

Edited November 30, 2006 by Kelsain

[grebo guru]

Wow, Kelsain, I'm liking your efforts here. There's a lot to consider. Both the arm and wing-root placements have their merits.

Hmm! Must consider more. Much potential.

Thanks for the pix!

[jenius]

Grebo, are you using a particular drawing software? Every now and then I get the urge to jot down doodles on the computer and would like to know if you have any recommendations. Obviously I'm not looking to do ultra cool valks are anything, just something that doesn't look straight MSPaint.

[sketchley]

Try Photoshop.

[grebo guru]

Try Photoshop.

Yes, I do use Photoshop. However, I know it's not within everyone's reach... it's a damn expensive program. Worth it, though.

[jenius]

Yes, I do use Photoshop. However, I know it's not within everyone's reach... it's a damn expensive program. Worth it, though.

Yeah, I could probably just come up with something work-related that I'd rather do at home to get the program though It probably is about time I got photoshop with all the pictures I take anyway...