Transformer Starscream Masterpiece has arrived!

[Twoducks]

TFmaster from tfw2005 has posted a pic of his repaint:

Fantastic job but I definitely find that the anime colours make this great mold look simpler and make MP-03 look more realistic. To each their own.

Edited October 8, 2006 by Twoducks

[Extra Large Mumma]

Thanks for the pics and link, Two Ducks. The rear landing gears look like those of the VF-11B (crude-looking wheel connected to a slap of plastic)! Given the size of the new SS, I don't think it's that hard to give those wheels better rims (like in one of the pics of the actual F-15 that David H. posted). One of the reasons I like the 1:48 VF-1's and 1:60 VF-0's is because their LGs look cool.

[Uxi]

That is a good paintjob.

I would prefer flats instead of glosses, grey instead of silver, and a gold tint to the canopy, though.

Edited October 8, 2006 by Uxi

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I really feel bad for people who are fans of both real-world aircraft as well as fictional transforming robots. It seems like the two will always be at odds with each other. While there are some lines that are rooted in realism, and others that come close (like MP SS), it seems like the designers of said robots usually aren't hard-core aircraft fans, so there will most likely always be things that bug the more knowledgable. Myself, I know squat about real planes. I do, however, think SS would look nicer if they had used gray instead of the blue-green. Maybe I'll wait for MP-05 Skywarp (we all know it's gonna happen )

I think they should make a see-through starscream when he appeared as a ghost at one point. Call it low visibility starscream. Make this limited edition like yamato credit card valk.

Edited October 9, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[David Hingtgen]

RFT---that is actually a rare (but totally possible) configuration for a Strike Eagle--pure air-to-air. 6 AMRAAMs, 2 Sidewinders. Also, the wing pylons can carry any mix of AMRAAMs and Sidewinders. Sparrows are conformal tank-only. (Or on the fuselage itself if the conformal tanks are off) The way the Type 4 and 5 conformal tanks are designed (the types used on real F-15E's, not what MP SS has) the forward 2 positions on the lower pylon are swappable---there's actually always 5 hard points---3 bombracks and 2 missile launchers--but due to spacing/arrangements you can only actually have the following combinations working, from fore to aft:

1. Missile/Missile (actual configuration is M/B/B/M/B)

2. Bomb/Bomb/Bomb (actual config is B/M/B/M/B)

3. Bomb/Missile (actual config is B/M/B/M/B)--have to drop the bomb first before the missile can fire in that configuration---so no point in "fighting your way in" to bomb stuff---only real use would be "fighting your way out" after dropping bombs---but the F-15E would excel at that---with the bombs and drop tanks gone, and the improved power of late F-15E's, in that instance they should actually be able to out-fight the F-15C.

While pure air-to-air is pretty rare, a mixed load (left/right) of missiles and bombs is decently common. Here's one with AMRAAMs and Paveway bombs:

PS--I saw that repainted MP SS earlier, when it was only like 80% done. I'd love to see one in grey, not silver---he matched the G1 red and blue shades perfectly it seems, but wonder why silver. Either way I like it a lot more than the Takara scheme.

[drifand]

[promethuem5]

The more pics I see, the more I want mine... why Transforer-god, why must you make me wait until Tuesday!?

[wolfx]

The argument of realistic VS cartoon has become stale. I'm bored.

Anyway here's the problems found on mine which others have already found in other forums. Do be aware, for those who are getting it.

[promethuem5]

Looks like there's nothing to be done about the canopy hinge, but were those stress marks there OOB, or after transformation? Alot of people are saying that if you really take your time and move things exactly how they are meant to, the marks should be pretty avoidable... And have we decided yet if the white shoulder strip chipping is on purpose or not?

[wolfx]

Looks like there's nothing to be done about the canopy hinge, but were those stress marks there OOB, or after transformation? Alot of people are saying that if you really take your time and move things exactly how they are meant to, the marks should be pretty avoidable... And have we decided yet if the white shoulder strip chipping is on purpose or not?

Some people reported that the stress marks can't be avoided and some are OOB there. They reckon that the plastic is made to bend, but the quality of the plastic was slightly off causing the stress marks. Starscream requires abit of bending to get it to transform.

[promethuem5]

Well, as long as it doesnt break and the marks on on the back, I dnt care. I just want mine....now!!

[David Hingtgen]

Drifand--that's a pretty inaccurate drawing of TF-15A #2, 71-0291. Probably most famous as the "bicentennial" F-15 in gloss white/red/blue.

If you want to see what it really looked like, try here: http://www.airliners.net/open.file/0889876/L/

I can scan/post plenty of pics where F-15E's look blueish or even greenish---doesn't mean they're green, just that photographs can be really off. I have yet to see an F-15/16/B-1/2/52 mis-painted green instead of dark grey, but plenty of pics where they kinda look like that.

Photos of grey rant: Grey will drive photo-developers (and cameras) nuts, they always try to color-correct one way or the other, especially when the sky is visible--they'll tend to try to make the sky "look right"---which will often tint the whole exposure bluish or greenish. Early F-15 pics suffer from that tremendously, as they try to take out the blue, because they think the planes are supposed to be grey in a blue sky--but everything looks too blue. Except that, early F-15's WERE blue, and they flew in California in the summer, in incredibly super-blue skies. So a lot of early F-15 pics look they're in "normal" blue skies with grey paint, instead of the super-rich blue skies with blue paint they actually were. They "corrected" the exposure, but actually made it wrong. Same thing happens with ship photos all the time---taking "neutral" pics and trying to match the greenish Atlantic, or taking blue out from Caribbean pics----which will really mess with the grey color of the ship.

IMHO Takara took one of those greenish pics and used it as a reference, rather than the 98% of GOOD pics where they show up as the correct dark grey. Or 9even better) looking up what color they're supposed to be, then buying that color to see what it is. I know they sell F-15E grey in Japan at every hobby shop. And that there are plenty of F-16's in Japan painted the right color. Why reference bad pics when the real thing, or correct color paint, is readily available? That'd be like trying to match Corvette yellow from a scan of a magazine, when your local dealer or Autozone has the exact touchup paint just sitting there on the shelf for sale.

[KingNor]

Photos of grey rant: Grey will drive photo-developers (and cameras) nuts, they always try to color-correct one way or the other, especially when the sky is visible--they'll tend to try to make the sky "look right"---which will often tint the whole exposure bluish or greenish. Early F-15 pics suffer from that tremendously, as they try to take out the blue, because they think the planes are supposed to be grey in a blue sky--but everything looks too blue. Except that, early F-15's WERE blue, and they flew in California in the summer, in incredibly super-blue skies. So a lot of early F-15 pics look they're in "normal" blue skies with grey paint, instead of the super-rich blue skies with blue paint they actually were. They "corrected" the exposure, but actually made it wrong. Same thing happens with ship photos all the time---taking "neutral" pics and trying to match the greenish Atlantic, or taking blue out from Caribbean pics----which will really mess with the grey color of the ship.

arrg you broke my brain...

soo... no green strike eagles... well that sucks i guess i don't like the green again...

but all difrences aside, i dont' want to take away from peoples enjoyment. this is still an amazing peice of actionfigure technologie, i wish everyone and their decepticon well :-)

[Retracting Head Ter Ter]

---but the F-15E would excel at that---with the bombs and drop tanks gone, and the improved power of late F-15E's, in that instance they should actually be able to out-fight the F-15C.

Dave, I have seen arguments for both sides but how would the late E fare against the C in performance when 'clean'. Does the higher thrust more then compensate for the added drag of the CFTs and the permanent pylons and extra weight? Can the E match the straight line dash of the C? Thanks!

Basically, if you wanted to go up and kill that Flanker, is it better to hop into a E or a C (ignore radar differences for this one).

Edited October 9, 2006 by Retracting Head Ter Ter

[Macross73]

just wanted to say what a great figure SS is. i ordered three, 2 for me and one for someone else but they backed out. their loss. But my point is, this is a cool toy and though i was worried during the trasnforming - its complex compared to the 1/48 VF. Its definately a good idea to take your time and not force anything. mine dont have any stress marks. Its an excellent item.

[attachmentid=37240] [attachmentid=37157] [attachmentid=37239]

Edited October 14, 2006 by Macross73

[JB0]

PS--I saw that repainted MP SS earlier, when it was only like 80% done. I'd love to see one in grey, not silver---he matched the G1 red and blue shades perfectly it seems, but wonder why silver. Either way I like it a lot more than the Takara scheme.

Same here.

The silver's actually interesting, though. I think he was going for a bare metal look. Cybertron's finest backstabber has no need for puny human paint, and will run naked if he darn well wants to.

But as you said, either way it's better than Takara's current paintjob.

[David Hingtgen]

Quick note to JB0--I considered he was going for bare metal, but bare F-15's aren't silvery for the most part. I think he just thought it looked cool. There was a fairly recent F-15 painted silver for testing though, and it'll match that pretty well.

Now for F-15E vs C: Late-build E's have MUCH more engine power than the C, even more than a Super Tomcat. The power increase is about 4 times that of the weight increase. Also the airframe itself is stronger, and can cope with more G's for longer periods.

If the E's conformal tanks are removed that day, drag-wise it'd be about 99% the same as the C. (Slightly slightly more drag on the E due to minor airframe changes). A late-build E should certainly out-climb and out-accelerate the C, period.

Now, a standard E would be decidedly poor compared to the C, having the same engines but more weight.

I really don't know/can't comment on drag effects of the CFT's. It's there, but I really don't know how it'd compare to a C/D's conformals, or "E with just conformal vs C/D with 3 externals, for the same fuel load". A "plain" conformal tank has far less drag than the same amount of fuel in drop tanks, but all F-15 conformals have external pylons, but the E has the most. (I've still never been able to tell for sure if there was ever an utterly plain conformal for the F-15, even in testing--one pic of the first set looks like it, but others seem to indicate more like a mini-pyloned version of the C/D's)

Top speed: AFAIK no F-15C can actually do Mach 2.5 like early F-15A's could. Especially now. Long story short, but you can assume most fighter jets cannot acheive their "top" speed, even stripped down to airshow demo standards. Engine power vs reliability---they're tuned for reliability most of the time. A late-build E has more drag, but a lot more thrust, but the engine is more optimized for cruising and low-level, than high-speed dashing like the C's engine. But the raw power increase may be more than enough. (Engine specs are never published for all conditions/speeds). F-14B/D top speed is controversial for the same reason.

I would actually vote the F-15K for being the fastest nowadays, especially if they ever get the -132 engine in it. The GE nozzles have a lot less drag than unfeathered PW ones. And with most A's having had engines retrofitted, I doubt any A can hit 2.5 either.

(Most F-15's now would top out around Mach 2.3 AFAIK)

And there's always pylons! The only way you'll have a drag-free F-15 is if you plan to fight with guns only. In which case the C model has an advantage, for it carries more ammo than the E. Missiles and wing pylons affect drag even more than engine power or airframe drag.

[JB0]

Quick note to JB0--I considered he was going for bare metal, but bare F-15's aren't silvery for the most part. I think he just thought it looked cool. There was a fairly recent F-15 painted silver for testing though, and it'll match that pretty well.

So it matches a real F-15 by accident(traditional Starscream red excepted)? I find that incredibly amusing.

Anyways, Starscream isn't real F-15 metal. He's super-high-tech Cybertron metal.

[Uxi]

So it matches a real F-15 by accident(traditional Starscream red excepted)? I find that incredibly amusing.

Anyways, Starscream isn't real F-15 metal. He's super-high-tech Cybertron metal.

Yeah, but the Ark made him imitate a real F-15...

[Radd]

I've got to be the only person that doesn't like that repaint, metallic or not. I mean, take the green/blue of MP Starscream and make it a grey tone, fine, that looks more realistic and more G1 Starscreamish, and still looks good. But personally, I'd take what Takara did over more "accurate" G1 colours as portrayed in that fan repaint. Just my take on the matter.

More and more I'm leaning towards ordering one of these, rather than waiting. Just in case they get difficult to find and Hasbro takes the mold and does something I don't like with it.

Edited October 9, 2006 by Radd

[Retracting Head Ter Ter]

If the E's conformal tanks are removed that day, drag-wise it'd be about 99% the same as the C. (Slightly slightly more drag on the E due to minor airframe changes). A late-build E should certainly out-climb and out-accelerate the C, period.

Is there a picture of an E without the CFTs? I'd love to see a picture of an unmounted CFT too!

So what you are saying is that the late E would not be able to outperform a C when both are clean. i.e. The E with conformals but both vehicles with no external stores.

[Fit For Natalie]

You see, this is what happens when Japan makes an expensive Transformer without input from Hasbro - it becomes a fragile collector piece that owners are scared of transforming because it might break or the paint comes off.

Look at MP Prime - you can chuck him at a wall and he'd probably make a hole in it. Transformers should be toys made to be played with, no matter how much it costs, goddammit!

A fair number of times Takara has complained about having to adhere to Hasbro's US safety standards

Yeah, but the Ark made him imitate a real F-15...

Well, consider that (most of the time) TFs can be thrown and bashed around without significant damage. If they were made of the same materials as the real vehicles they are based on, they'd fall apart all the time. Edited October 9, 2006 by Fit For Natalie

[David Hingtgen]

Here's an E with the conformal tanks off. Could be for maintenance, could be because the wing CO wanted to see how fast it could go. (It is the wing commander's plane, but no way to know if he's flying it)

[Project Phoenix]

I thought we're talking about a Transformers toy?

It's a robot from another world, does it matter what color it has or what kind of equipment it is carrying? They have lasers and beam weaponry so what do they care about what we humans think what color it should be and what F-15 it is based on. It is a robot in 'disguise' right? After all the backstabber couldn't care less if we humans think the colors are wrong/right/whatever.

Great toy BTW, I dig it.

[David Hingtgen]

When there's 3 physically identical characters, with ONLY color differentiating them, color becomes very important.

Especially when Starscream had a dark grey face, but Thundercracker had a silver face---and the toy has a silvery face...

[JB0]

When there's 3 physically identical characters, with ONLY color differentiating them, color becomes very important.

Especially when Starscream had a dark grey face, but Thundercracker had a silver face---and the toy has a silvery face...

Ah, but Starscream is such a clever traitor that he knows Megatron suspects him far too much for him to scheme effectively. So he's disguised himself as Thundercracker for MORE backstabbity goodness!

[KingNor]

if Max's valk came as green, the gripe-ing wouldn't be questioned.

"it says max on the side, what are you complaining about!?"

Edited October 10, 2006 by KingNor

[Radd]

Actually, the toy has a noticibly bronze-ish face, the pictures are accurate. It's not unreasonable to suspect Takara might give Thundercracker and Skywarp actual silver faces, rather than Starscream's bronze look.

Edited October 10, 2006 by Radd

[promethuem5]

Uhh....can't wait to get home....my baby's gonna be there waiting for me.

[David Hingtgen]

Either way, I thought the face color change was almost as bad as the rest of the colors. SS has a dull grey face, to clearly contrast with the other 2. (Though the "later" 3 seekers all have grey faces I think)

Changing head and face colors is pretty unprecedented--I mean, Prime ALWAYS has a blue head with a silver "mouth plate". If they made it deep grey, people'd sure complain.

[promethuem5]

Oh. My. God...... opened up my baby.... Best TF since MPC Convoy, hands down. Maybe even better, because it's much more detailed and is alot more stable and playable without all the die-cast. THIS is what a Transformer toy should be.

[Radd]

Changing head and face colors is pretty unprecedented--I mean, Prime ALWAYS has a blue head with a silver "mouth plate". If they made it deep grey, people'd sure complain.

Wrong on the "unprecedented" part. G1-G2 Megatron. Silver face with white-ish grey helmet in the G1 colour scheme, replaced with a purple face and a bronze-ish helmet with the G2 tank colourscheme. The colourschemes between the toys and the cartoon have always been different, and there are differences between the cartoon and comic book colour schemes (Megatron's colour scheme in the comic is from an earlier design for the cartoon that wound up never being used).

[KingNor]

think we'll see a MP shockwave?

[drifand]

Kawamori's interview translated on Seibetron:

http://www.seibertron.com/news/view.php?id=8612

So:

1. Alt mode 'realism' intended to supersede bot mode.

2. It's supposed to be 'gray', and there's 'enough red' to show it's SS.

3. Shoji wanted to do more to cover the underside but would have compromised bot mode too much.

4. The hip kibble are supposed to evoke 'samurai wearing 2 swords'.

Rage on, fans!

Edited October 11, 2006 by drifand

[Matt Random]

I received SS today. I have mixed feelings about it. Beautiful, highly detailed toy but I'm afraid it will have removable wings soon. I was super careful (I own Yamatos after all) and I still got cracks in the wing hinges. The problem is that the toy is just too tight. One end of the metal pin is pentagonal and is presumably intended to hold the pin in place but everything is so tight that the pin spins and stresses the plastic.

The canopy hinge on mine wasn't fully painted out of the box. The shoulder stripes didn't have any defects. There's some nasty blotches in the panel lines and at least one bubbly area in the paint (jet piece on the forearm).

The second transformation went better. I've found that it helps to pop the back piece up first (the piece with the airbrake) so that the wing hinges don't have to be bent sideways to clear the tab on the back piece. I may have been able to avoid the stress marks and the cracks if the transformation in the instructions had been laid out this way. I can't wait to get home and play with it some more. Hopefully the wing hinges will stand up to the test of time.

Edited October 11, 2006 by Matt Random