Fort Max Posted September 27, 2006 Posted September 27, 2006 Now I just need to actually get my new flat netted up and I can finish it at last.
Father Jack Posted September 27, 2006 Posted September 27, 2006 I liked it. I'm not going to over anylize it I just liked it.
Seven Posted September 27, 2006 Posted September 27, 2006 (edited) I just have to ask about episode 6 now that other people have watched it: SPOILER QUESTION (highlight): Why was it necessary to use Earth as the final weapon? Why not use Mars or Mercury? It seems kind of silly to me considering you'd think they'd want to preserve their homeworld even if they have colonized other planets. Not to mention they'd permanently damage the planet just by moving it the way they did. Terraforming technology by their time or not, it'd take a long time to get things back to normal. It'd be like hitting the reset button on the whole planet. Edited September 27, 2006 by Seven
TSP Posted September 27, 2006 Posted September 27, 2006 I must say that the ending wasn't bad at all. By the time the first episode was released I wasn't sure about this series. Actually I disliked how they slaughter the past Gunbuster story.Watching the first few episodes would be like being raped by the whole FLCL crew. The ending sure has a great showdown. I enjoyed every single moment (Yeah, hate me!)of this Anime. At least the ending wasn't as lame as that of Macross Zero.
Noriko Takaya Posted September 27, 2006 Author Posted September 27, 2006 But story-wise GB2 has always been weak with a C- level of anime quality, but what made it not really GB is the lack of consistancy and it's fad-based reliance on insanity style anime. ...but when your covering old territory any freshness of story universe is lost and that really hurts unless you make it unique, which GB2 really never did. Yeah, what he said. Actually, I did not hate it as much as I did when I first saw episode 1. But to me I feel the series was missing a lot of what the first one had going for it. While the artwork was fine, I feel that Diebuster would have been more believable as a sequel if someone had at least asked Mikimoto to consider doing this series. His characterizations lent more plausability and emotion to the original story than the current series. And God no, I do not want to see another sequel. Gainax would be dangerously treading the ground that the evil dark lord George Lucas has...
TSP Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 Well maybe next month would be the right time to announce Top O Nerea-Lifebuster OVA Series 4 "A New Hope"
wolfx Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 I just have to ask about episode 6 now that other people have watched it: SPOILER QUESTION (highlight): Why was it necessary to use Earth as the final weapon? Why not use Mars or Mercury? It seems kind of silly to me considering you'd think they'd want to preserve their homeworld even if they have colonized other planets. Not to mention they'd permanently damage the planet just by moving it the way they did. Terraforming technology by their time or not, it'd take a long time to get things back to normal. It'd be like hitting the reset button on the whole planet. Cuz the space monster was heading straight for it so its easy to use it as a battering ram. Maneuvering something of that mass much less moving it won't be easy.
Fortress_Maximus Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 (edited) I think he can't accept it as a sequel to gunbuster. I know I cannot and I doubt I am alone. At best Top2 is acceptable, but it seriously is lacking in the elements that make the original so timeless. Yeah, what he said. Actually, I did not hate it as much as I did when I first saw episode 1. But to me I feel the series was missing a lot of what the first one had going for it. While the artwork was fine, I feel that Diebuster would have been more believable as a sequel if someone had at least asked Mikimoto to consider doing this series. His characterizations lent more plausability and emotion to the original story than the current series. And God no, I do not want to see another sequel. Gainax would be dangerously treading the ground that the evil dark lord George Lucas has... I completely concur. Edited September 28, 2006 by Fortress_Maximus
Seven Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 If it was named differently and had all the Gunbuster references taken out, it would have been enjoyable on its own merit, both for art and story. I do think that it suffers from the "smaller scale" problem, where instead of expanding upon the universe in the first series, they compact things down - limiting humanity to the Sol system, lesser powered space vessels, the showdown in episode 6 being much less grand than episode 6 in first series, etc. I use to watch the end of the first series and be amazed at the jump in technology, then wonder what the technology of 10,000 years later would be like. I'm a little underwhelmed after seeing what that future - sperm shaped ships, wacky looking robots, limited human capabilities (for the most part, the exception being Topless). I wanted to see the cool stuff in episode 6 of the original be expanded on like the floating dolphin crew members, psychic crew members, gigantic ships, the neat technology on the bridge of the Eltreum and more! Maybe they can "Macross II" this? Thinking back over the series, notice how Lark's cat disappeared and never showed up again? Why bother introducing the damn thing in the first place?
Duke Togo Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 I think Top2's biggest weakness was that it went back to the same well too many times. You can't make a homage piece of a homage piece, it just comes off as un-original and contrived. I got all the pep talks in the original, I've seen all the big bad Buster attacks, and I've seen the shirt being ripped open deal. Could they not come up with anything different?
wolfx Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 Thinking back over the series, notice how Lark's cat disappeared and never showed up again? Why bother introducing the damn thing in the first place? That was a random cat that Chiko used to communicate with Lark with her Topless powers. Not sure if its Lark's cat though.
Seven Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 That was a random cat that Chiko used to communicate with Lark with her Topless powers. Not sure if its Lark's cat though. Oooh, that was Chiko communicating through the cat?! I have to rewatch that episode I guess.
UN Spacy Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 (edited) How many of you were suprised by the ending? SPOILER-Highlight to read. Who would've thought Noriko and Kazmumi would end up in orbit? Edited September 28, 2006 by UN Spacy
wolfx Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 How many of you were suprised by the ending? SPOILER-Highlight to read. Who would've thought Noriko and Kazmumi would end up in orbit? I think most of us already knew and guessed the ending somewhere around episode 4, if you looked back on the mega thread. Me and chrono included.
Twoducks Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 The fight and the preparation for it where nice as well as the over the top super weapons (go Earth!) and homage attacks. But I agree with what others have said. The series leaches too much out of the original and ends up collapsing under all the leached material. It fails to be its own entity and ends up being a very pretty looking but average series (with some really nice fights here and there). The characters weren’t anything special whereas Noriko and company’s problems and sacrifices made you care for them. The whole psychological trauma Noriko must suffer due to all the jumps in Earth time… I liked the Buster Machines more than the humans in Top2. Nono: “Wow you are awesome I want to be your friend/slave!†Lark: “No! you are annoying†Nono: “Come ooooooon†Lark: “Well ok, you are fun in a retarted way†Nono: “Hey look, turns out I’m more awesome than you†Lark: “Crap I’m jealous; I need to be the dominant/cooler one in a relation†Nono: “My awesomeness is getting owned!†Lark: “That’s because you need my awesomeness too (neat, I’m the dominant/nonexpendable one again)†FIN
wolfx Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 It just occured to me that the strategic council of old people might be the Eltreum's original esper crew (or their descendents), hence their weird body structure. http://www.macrossworld.com/mwf/index.php?...st&id=13823 But they also mention that the "legendary fossil fleet" has just been found and the screen shows the Eltreum. Wasn't the Jupiter colony that the Eltreum? Perhaps similar model. Shrug.
Fortress_Maximus Posted September 28, 2006 Posted September 28, 2006 I think Top2's biggest weakness was that it went back to the same well too many times. You can't make a homage piece of a homage piece, it just comes off as un-original and contrived. I got all the pep talks in the original, I've seen all the big bad Buster attacks, and I've seen the shirt being ripped open deal. Could they not come up with anything different? Nope that would be *gasp* doing something original! I agree on all counts, these and other reasons are why I geneally do NOT like or look forward to remakes of older anime series.
wolfx Posted September 29, 2006 Posted September 29, 2006 The wiki for Diebuster just went up yesterday. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Diebuster
wolfx Posted September 29, 2006 Posted September 29, 2006 And browsing through some Gunbuster sites, they called the original Uchuu Kaijuu as STMCs or Space Terrible Monster Crowd. Where was this term coined?
Seven Posted September 29, 2006 Posted September 29, 2006 And browsing through some Gunbuster sites, they called the original Uchuu Kaijuu as STMCs or Space Terrible Monster Crowd. Where was this term coined? I believe this name was first coined in one of the Super Robot Wars games.
Noriko Takaya Posted September 30, 2006 Author Posted September 30, 2006 Thought I would share this image with you from Gainax's front page. A Gunbuster related image not featuring the women, but the men, of the series. And I must say, this drawing has to be one of the best I have seen submitted to Gainax. I just wish I could blow the image up to 1600 x 1200 without any distortion. Enjoy!
Fort Max Posted September 30, 2006 Posted September 30, 2006 That is fantastic, thanks for sharing it with us Noriko.
Morpheus Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 (edited) I just watched Diebuster in one night marathon. Decent show with probably the largest mecha in anime history . What I don't understand is that Earth supposed to be deserted or heavily damage after the final battle, or did Noriko return to the 'wrong' planet since the entire solar system is messed up thanks to the buster machine Edited October 4, 2006 by Morpheus
Beltane70 Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 What I don't understand is that Earth supposed to be deserted or heavily damage after the final battle, or did Noriko return to the 'wrong' planet since the entire solar system is messed up thanks to the buster machine They definitely return to the right planet. During the end credits you can definitely make out the Pacific coast of North America as well as eastern Asia.
chrono Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 It seems that the movie really ties the 2 together even more! Spoiler spoiler: 2chan thread was talking about a new scene where Lark actually meets with Noriko and Amano.
wolfx Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 It seems that the movie really ties the 2 together even more! Spoiler spoiler: 2chan thread was talking about a new scene where Lark actually meets with Noriko and Amano. Sweet! That's the least they could do for us fans, in terms of new animation. Sigh. Yeah i wonder how they moved earth back to its original orbit or if it even did.
Seven Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 What I don't understand is that Earth supposed to be deserted or heavily damage after the final battle, or did Noriko return to the 'wrong' planet since the entire solar system is messed up thanks to the buster machine I believe there is a period of ten years between the final fight and when you see Lark again. Hence why Chiko looks much more mature in her scene. That would probably be enough time for them to get Earth right again.
jwinges Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 Spoiler alert See below My question is... Does anyone think that Nono will ever return? Do you think that Lark expects to see Nono ever again? I rather like the Lark and Nono characters.
bsu legato Posted October 4, 2006 Posted October 4, 2006 Does anyone think that Nono will ever return? She'll be back in Gunbuster 3: Die Buster, Die!
Noriko Takaya Posted October 4, 2006 Author Posted October 4, 2006 I've kinda been thinking about this one. When Lark pulls Earth out of orbit, shouldn't have Earth's eco system been destroyed? I mean, pulling the planet out of orbit would have been cataclysmic on a Biblical scale. There would have been tremendous gravitational stress on the continents, and the sudden drop in temperature would have killed off what plant and animal life remained on the planet. The atmosphere probably would have been torn away too. Then there are other things that would go wrong. But here we have Lark ten years later standing on the surface watching birds fly by and grasses blowing in the wind. Granted, mankind probably has the ability to terraform, but they would have to get Earth back into its original orbit, not to mention tilting it back on its proper axis. That would take longer than ten years. I realize that a lot of you out there like this series, but it's like a slap in the face to the hardcore Gunbuster fan. Ugh! The more I think about it, the more I realize that I do not like this show. But that's me. And now they are going to tie the two series together by having Noriko and Lark speak? Argh! I am now going to go outside and play in traffic.
Twoducks Posted October 5, 2006 Posted October 5, 2006 They could explain it off saying the ring that was circling the planet was generating artificial gravity to keep everything in it's place so no mass would be lost on the way (like all the air, water, animals...). More mass = bigger impact = bigger chance of success... but that doesn't explain why the characters were so flat
wolfx Posted October 5, 2006 Posted October 5, 2006 Well if its a show 10,000 years into the future, its easy to cook up alot of fantastic stuff that makes impossible things posssible. I mean , as ridiculous as moving a whole planet sound, the whole series was about fantastic stuff anyway. A single bot killing millions of enemies on screen. Buster machines armed to the teeth with energy weapons, missiles and machine guns....so ya i wouldn't overanalyse moving a whole planet too much, though what you brought up irked me as well, Noriko. But i wished there were science lessons with Diebuster. At least tell us wth are the Topless, buster machines, etc. It would probably made the series more akin to the original and made more sense of everything that was goin on.
chrono Posted October 5, 2006 Posted October 5, 2006 Well you gotta admit that the "Buster Blossom" was just great humor via stereotyping. Really we should start seeing how much parody is in this version. Episode #1: The 'heroes journey' that you see in just about every anime. The maid uniform gimick. FLCL reference with Larks Buster coming out of "no-where space".
wolfx Posted October 5, 2006 Posted October 5, 2006 Well you gotta admit that the "Buster Blossom" was just great humor via stereotyping. Really we should start seeing how much parody is in this version. Episode #1: The 'heroes journey' that you see in just about every anime. The maid uniform gimick. FLCL reference with Larks Buster coming out of "no-where space". Another FLCL parody would be powers coming from forehead? Powers are lost when they reach "maturity". I wonder what it meant that humans were slowly evolving into Variable Gravity Wells, and the emergence of Topless was the 1s indication of this? Hmmm.
Seven Posted October 5, 2006 Posted October 5, 2006 I wonder what it meant that humans were slowly evolving into Variable Gravity Wells, and the emergence of Topless was the 1s indication of this? Hmmm. It is explained by the professor dude when talking about how the Buster Corps evolved down a very similar path to the space monsters. Simply, it seems that as creatures evolve into space the most efficient evolutionary route tends to take them down the same path as the space monsters, hence why the Buster Corps were going down that path (at an advanced rate due to being self replicating machines) and humanity as well with the emergence of Topless powers. Since the Buster Corps were programmed to destroy any beings with traits of the space monsters, Topless became a target as evolution took its course. I suppose you could imagine that given another 100,000 years or more, humanity may evolve into something resembling the space monsters and less "human" (possibly along the lines of an Evangelion unit? Hmmm...).
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