1/60 YF-19 and possible QC issues

[Onimusha-shin]

agreed. there really isn't a reason for Yamato to hold back on new runs given that the demand could rise any time with more macross fans influencing others rookies to buy in as well.

i'm holding off the 0S still, as there's no reason the 0S will stop production, especially with the anime series' exposure to a larger fanbase/audience.

having said that, i guess i'll probably wait for 2nd run or at least till a verdict has been arrived on whether the 1st run has a decent passing rate in terms of QC problems.

Edited September 13, 2006 by Onimusha-shin

[do not disturb]

There is rarely a retailer that does that. look at Toy-Wave, VF-0S went down from $160 to $130 USD.

Haterist, there is no reason for Yamato not to rerelease the M&Ms. It's only a matter of time.

i know, cause while Ken likes to make money, he's not a complete a-hole like tisinc. its crazy but if the price goes up $1, tisinc jacks his price up $5, thats how he works, thats why i don't buy from him or others like him.

as far as the M&M's i'm sure it coming, but so far there hasn't been any news about it nor the demand to really warrant it. if the price of those valks gets really high, perhaps yamato will do it, but probably after a few more new releases...though i don't know what VF-1's are left to make outside of the TV max and TV ben?

getting back on topic,

i can't really foresee any QC issues cause i don't know how it will transform? that usually gives you a better idea of what to look out for and where the problem areas are. for the price their asking, i hope they send a production sample to graham before they release it, atleast that way they can make improvements based on his feedback....lets hope.

[Nani?!]

Although I wholeheartedly agree that yamato should make their first runs just as good as their second or third, I think the problem also lies in the tolerance level of most of us here. The VF-0s is a prime example of QC issue paranoia. It's really not that bad... I mean, think back in the day when we had tab b issues, broken hips and floppy bodies. The stuff we're looking under the magnifying glass is nothing compared to those atrocities.

Skipping the whole first run might sound smart individually, and ONLY IF there is a second run for a particular valk, but I dont see how that helps the whole community in general if enough people just deem the first run "the one to pass"...

Even though I understand why people are paranoid, I kinda find it annoying when it comes to the point where people outright say that they'll wait until OTHER members get it, see how messed up theirs is and post "PHEWWW, I'm glad I waited!" all for some slightly loose elbow. You know that's just mean... wtf are the first run buyers, then? test dummies? c'mon now...

We should instead focus on QC problems that yamato's designers made (which are virtually minimized these days)... Those graham usually catches with his reviews. Small minute manufacturing qc issues dont disappear 100% at the second run either... if an factory worker in the line is chatting up with his/her friend for a couple of valks that he/she failed to screw 2 revolutions less, then hell, there's a qc issue right there.

[rnurmin]

Voted for the 2nd run.

Just couldn't risk $200 for 1st run toys

[UN Spacy]

Do you guys think Yamato is still considered a garage toy company?

[do not disturb]

Even though I understand why people are paranoid, I kinda find it annoying when it comes to the point where people outright say that they'll wait until OTHER members get it, see how messed up theirs is and post "PHEWWW, I'm glad I waited!" all for some slightly loose elbow. You know that's just mean... wtf are the first run buyers, then? test dummies? c'mon now...

well these aren't exactly cheap where people(alteast i'm not) are willing to deal with it if its a lemon, and someone being first to buy/do something by definition makes them a test dummy.

theres those people who have to be the first on the block to get something, i used to be one but i learned my lesson with the konig monster and it was a $150 lesson at that. so i don't see the problem with the people who would rather wait for a review for 'test dummies' to take it out for a drive before getting behind the wheel themselves. what if graham got a 19 and it turns out that its a total POS? i can't speak for everyone but i know i'd be first in line to say, "phew, i'm glad i waited for the review", i mean its a $200 toy for crying out loud! if someone has to be first to get something because they're impatient, then thats their problem isn't it? whats the old saying, a fool and his money will soon be parted and i don't want to be a fool.

[Nani?!]

well these aren't exactly cheap where people(alteast i'm not) are willing to deal with it if its a lemon, and someone being first to buy/do something by definition makes them a test dummy.

theres those people who have to be the first on the block to get something, i used to be one but i learned my lesson with the konig monster and it was a $150 lesson at that. so i don't see the problem with the people who would rather wait for a review for 'test dummies' to take it out for a drive before getting behind the wheel themselves. what if graham got a 19 and it turns out that its a total POS? i can't speak for everyone but i know i'd be first in line to say, "phew, i'm glad i waited for the review", i mean its a $200 toy for crying out loud! if someone has to be first to get something because they're impatient, then thats their problem isn't it? whats the old saying, a fool and his money will soon be parted and i don't want to be a fool.

haterist. Please read my whole post to the end if you're going to reply specifically... it seems you skim just the top and middle and I hate repeating and explaining to you what I've already wrote.

I say in the bottom of my post that we should wait for graham's review for any flawed design-related QC issues. What I say we shouldn't do is plain out avoid the first release in MASS just because it's the first release and because there are some slighlty loose joints reported here and there... It can leave mass amounts of first releases unsold and hence risk a second release from ever happening...

Also, first run buyers are often the REASON you get a second run... I don't think calling us "impatient fools" is something prudent for you to say...

[do not disturb]

i didn't call anyone "impatient fools", i said if someone is impatient, its their problem...how is that an insult?

a fool and his money will soon be parted is an old saying, i don't want to be a fool is my statement, who am i calling a fool?

also, loose elbows weren't the only issues with the 0S, loose knees, broken tail spikes, random pins falling out, gunpod not holding, and other various issues have been posted here. just because the one you got only had one problem means that you were lucky, but theres plenty of people here that weren't as lucky and got the shaft on a rather expensive toy. if you got the craptastic version that some of the guys here got, you'd be singing a different tune wouldn't you? and who could blame you? i know i'd be pissed.

anyway, i think you're reading way too much into what i post so that being the case, i'll just walk away before this becomes more of an arguement than a discussion.

peace out dude

[Nani?!]

i didn't call anyone "impatient fools", i said if someone is impatient, its their problem...how is that an insult?

a fool and his money will soon be parted is an old saying, i don't want to be a fool is my statement, who am i calling a fool?

also, loose elbows weren't the only issues with the 0S, loose knees, broken tail spikes, random pins falling out, gunpod not holding, and other various issues have been posted here. just because the one you got only had one problem means that you were lucky, but theres plenty of people here that weren't as lucky and got the shaft on a rather expensive toy. if you got the craptastic version that some of the guys here got, you'd be singing a different tune wouldn't you? and who could blame you? i know i'd be pissed.

anyway, i think you're reading way too much into what i post so that being the case, i'll just walk away before this becomes more of an arguement than a discussion.

peace out dude

*thumbs up*

[Arthurius]

I would buy second edition only. After my purchse of the vf-0s, i lost confidence in first edition. I cant buy another vf-0s, so i am stuck with a loose toy, that doesnt feel at all like the sturdy feeling of the 1/48th. For those that got the money to buy multiples, go for it. For those that find 150-200$ expensive, wait for second release.

[drifand]

With the amount of air that Yamato forces you to ship, I think it's a good chance that the toy will come in safe.

The bent VF-0 tailfins were caused by the individual boxes being packed too tightly in their shipping cartons; this I heard from my 'reputed local dealer'. The first run were packed 6 to a carton, wall-to-wall (IIRC...), and so despite the huge amount of nothingness in the boxes, any bumping of the carton could damage the fins. After feedback from unhappy dealers, Yamato changed it to 4(?) in a carton (with padding). These numbers could have been remembered wrongly, but the gist is the same. I still got my 'regular's discount' for this 2nd-run.

As for the instances of misaligned Tampo's skulls etc, it depends on whether you give credance to the (pricier) Japan-import versus (slightly cheaper) China-import QC issue. I've found that when it comes to Bandai toys like SOCs and Armor-Transform figures, the HK-editions don't really lose out to Jp-editions because Bandai's factories already have excellent QC in general.

For Yamato stuff, I simply won't take the chance, especially if I like and want to own the pricey toy in question... only Jp-import from now on. I'm just glad I HAVE the choice.

[Mog]

It ultimately comes down to how much you really want the Valk.

When I first heard about the 1/48 GBP, I jumped at the first chance to preorder it. Sure, I learned later on about the fiasco that was the 1/60 version of the armor, and I later heard the warnings about the fragile plastic tabs in the chest armor. But none of that stuff really deterred my desire for the 1/48 GBP; I would have bought it irregardless.

Now with the YF-19, at its current selling price, with the (apparently) minimal accessories, and the potential for QC issues, it goes from a "must have" to a "I can wait a little bit longer" item for me personally.

But if the YF-19 is something you really, really want right now (like me with the GBP), who cares what us "wait and see" folks think?

Sure, we'll benefit from your reviews, tips, and insights. But I'm sure me and others will return the favor when our personal "must have" items come out with their first production runs........[cough] YF-21 [cough] Beta/Tread, ahem, reasonably priced [cough].

[David Hingtgen]

drifand---there are different versions depending on what country they're initially shipped to?

[drifand]

drifand---there are different versions depending on what country they're initially shipped to?

Dave, I really don't know - it depends on the DEALER's business choice.Tthere are wholesalers based in Japan as well as HK/China, and for various reaons, stock from HK/China is usually/almost always cheaper compared to that from Japan. Why? We can only guess:

- No import taxes?

- No additional shipping required??

- No QC??? (tongue firmly in cheek)

So... where do the online dealers get their stock from? And for what reasons, besides availability?

Good question.

Like I said, I'm just glad I have the choice of a brick & mortar store to shop from. The new YF-19 is a must-have even at its high price, but because of my long-running experience with complex Yamato products, not 'right now'.

[kensei]

The bent VF-0 tailfins were caused by the individual boxes being packed too tightly in their shipping cartons; this I heard from my 'reputed local dealer'. The first run were packed 6 to a carton, wall-to-wall (IIRC...), and so despite the huge amount of nothingness in the boxes, any bumping of the carton could damage the fins. After feedback from unhappy dealers, Yamato changed it to 4(?) in a carton (with padding). These numbers could have been remembered wrongly, but the gist is the same. I still got my 'regular's discount' for this 2nd-run.

If you are talking abnout the VF-0S tailfin, how close they are together in a case does not matter. It is how the person packed it in the plastic tray. When packed properly, the spikes have adequate clearance.

Edited September 14, 2006 by kensei

[wolfx]

Although I wholeheartedly agree that yamato should make their first runs just as good as their second or third, I think the problem also lies in the tolerance level of most of us here. The VF-0s is a prime example of QC issue paranoia. It's really not that bad... I mean, think back in the day when we had tab b issues, broken hips and floppy bodies. The stuff we're looking under the magnifying glass is nothing compared to those atrocities.

.

Yeah...i was just commenting on the note that if Takara , Kaiyodo and Kotobukiya can do it, why can't Yamato, in terms of QC?

If we discount toy design (complicated) out of the picture, i don't think there really should be an excuse for poor QC, especially at the price they are charging. That's why i ask, what's the reasons for the lack of QCs? Are the factories crap? If so, change factories....use the ones Takara are using.

Is they money we're paying for the toy going straight into someone's pockets instead into QC? If so, fire that guy and lynch him.

And i don't think "Yamato is smaller than Takara and Bandai and thus have no funds for better QC" argument will work here. QC is QC....you can't produce toys without it really. So really, what's wrong with Yamato?

[kensei]

It's true that they should all be as good as each other. But you know, Yamato is an established player and can compete with the big boys now with their cash cow the 1/48. I'll admit that I've never had anything so bad as cracked hips (actually I have, but I should have stopped moving it, now I perform that diagnostic on all my valks), but it is way better than back then. It just annoys me with the VF-0S's elbows and knees succumb to gravity, and I can't hold a simple pose.

1/48 wins the award for sturdiest design yet. VF-0 is more intricate.

[BinaryFalcon]

I'm waiting, at least for a little bit.

Mainly its due to the slew of general releases all within 60 days of each other, but slight apprehension about QC issues does have at least something to do with it.

If I didn't already have an MP Starscream, Prime with trailer and VF-0A on preorder I'd likely have preordered the -19 as well.

But it was the last to the party and I'd already spent a bit more than I really feel that I should, so the QC fears win out and I'm going to delay the purchase a couple of months, most likely.

[Arthurius]

Oh my God, you have the same pre-orders as me!!! Prime, starscream and vf-0a!!!! woohooo!!! They better not mess up the vf-0a though, like they did the 0s.

I'm waiting, at least for a little bit.

Mainly its due to the slew of general releases all within 60 days of each other, but slight apprehension about QC issues does have at least something to do with it.

If I didn't already have an MP Starscream, Prime with trailer and VF-0A on preorder I'd likely have preordered the -19 as well.

But it was the last to the party and I'd already spent a bit more than I really feel that I should, so the QC fears win out and I'm going to delay the purchase a couple of months, most likely.

[BinaryFalcon]

Oh my God, you have the same pre-orders as me!!! Prime, starscream and vf-0a!!!! woohooo!!!

Yeah, it's kind of funny how I got there. Starscream I'd originally planned to skip, because I've never been as obsessed with Starscream as it seems everyone else is. When I saw shots of the resin prototype I reconsidered a bit, because it looked pretty good, but the lack of finished colors and most importantly, a view of the underside had me mostly on the fence. Then I saw finished pics including the nearly pristine underside of the jet mode and was much more interested. The relatively low price ($100) sold me on it.

Prime (MP-04) was a tougher sell, because I'd grabbed one of the first run MP-01s when they were on preorder. Spending that much for just a trailer seemed a bit excessive to me, but the more I thought about it the more I realized that 1. It's Optimus Frickin' Prime! and 2. I know that if I don't get it, I'll be kicking myself 6 months down the road when I can't get my hands on one. So... I caved.

The VF-0A... again, I considered skipping it, for similar reasons to Starscream. Different head, which doesn't wow me nearly as much as it seems to wow everyone else, and to be honest, the shots of the 0A in the all gray scheme seems rather "flat" or "empty" to me somehow in a way that the 0S isn't.

But... It's a VF-0, which has taken its place as my favorite VF, and I really would like to have as many of them as I can. Ideally I'd like at least 3, so I can display them in all modes.

So the 0A got in simply because it's an excuse to buy another VF-0.

Mostly I'm justifying all of this because the rest of my Macross collection is comprised of an old Jetfire, a now broken VF-11 (hip joint failure during 3rd transformation) and a Y-19.

They better not mess up the vf-0a though, like they did the 0s.

How so? Overall I was pretty pleased with my 0S. It's a touch loose in the arms, but it can hold the gunpod with both arms for support and doesn't fall over in battroid mode, so I can't complain too much.

Besides, it gives me an excuse (however weak) to buy another later on to display in a different mode.

Edited September 16, 2006 by BinaryFalcon

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Cannon fodder has always been good if you plan on displaying more than one of the same thing together. It's one of the reasons I bought the vf1A brownie. It helps that I like the paintscheme to the 0A too.

But everyone will need at least 1 Roy 0S for the reactive armor. Stuff putting a cannon fodder in a sumo suit. I wonder if yamato will release a reactive armor with 0S bundle at some point? Hopefully the joints can support the weight of the armor on them so it doesn't flop around. Also I wonder if they will release a "fat robot hand" for this?

Edited September 17, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[GutsAndCasca]

I'm a lil' late to this thread, but FYI, I already have my yf19 bought and paid for. I'm just waiting for the stork to arrive at my door.