Roger Posted March 16, 2008 Posted March 16, 2008 Really. This thread is becoming quite silly. Yes, but it did give us this line: Roger, tell your sister..... you were right I nominate chowyunskinny for a Lifetime Achievement Award. You guys give those out here, right? I'd like to find out what color Volume 2 is going to be.
jwinges Posted March 16, 2008 Posted March 16, 2008 Oh yeah, it's totally their fault that you bought that toy. It was pretty well established the price wasn't confirmed. Logic and previous comments all placed the Beta's price at $150-200. You guys whining about stores not honoring these prices sound like spoiled children. You thought you were getting away with a sweet deal and now that you aren't you're acting like you've been ripped off and are entitled to something. Where the hell was this established...it sure wasn't noted on the BBTS's site. And frankly I haven't been reading up on the beta on macrossworld. Its still false advertisement and is against the law.
Alpha OTS Posted March 16, 2008 Posted March 16, 2008 Where the hell was this established...it sure wasn't noted on the BBTS's site. And frankly I haven't been reading up on the beta on macrossworld. Its still false advertisement and is against the law. "Silly."
danth Posted March 16, 2008 Posted March 16, 2008 I canceled my pre-order. I can't say without a doubt that I won't end up paying $150 for the Beta anyway, but I want to see the actual finished product before I worry about that. If it's surprisingly awesome looking, then maybe. More likely I'll not pre-order, wait for reviews, and hold out for a better deal. But I'm really hoping all the canceled pre-orders convince Toynami to drop the price. I can't blame the online stores for changing the price, because a pre-order is not like a binding contract, and the item itself is not even available yet. Like Roger said, the customer can back out at any time, so I can't blame the retailers for doing the same when Toynami goofs up. The one sure thing is it would have been stupid not to jump on that pre-order, just in case.
GobotFool Posted March 16, 2008 Posted March 16, 2008 Where the hell was this established...it sure wasn't noted on the BBTS's site. And frankly I haven't been reading up on the beta on macrossworld. Its still false advertisement and is against the law. Maybe they did do it to attract business. I'm not the owner of the shop. But this is just one pre-order among hundreds on the same website. Mistakes are made, and they sent all people who preordered it a very clear e-mail about the change in price. False advertising to me would be charging me 150 for a toy that was advertised at 80 dollars. BBTS very clearly corrected this error, and no one was charged any money, and all people who made their pre-orders based on the information that it was 80 dollars can easily back out no strings attached. No ones been screwed here. No one lost any money. Mistakes happen, but if you expect them to sell you a 150 dollar toy because they made an error in its pre-order price I don't know what to say. Other than you being disapointed that the Beta's not as cheap as you hoped it would be, I don't see how anyone has actually been cheated because of this.
Jasonc Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 (edited) Actually there is a law here in Minnesota requiring online companies to uphold their prices to Minnesota residents no matter what the cause of the mistake or price change or the location of the business. All I have to do is simply file a case in civil court...its a rather open and shut deal. I've known a few people who have done this and won without even hiring a lawyer. And if they did the courts would have made the offending business pay those lawyer fees. I highly doubt this has anything to do with pre-orders, especially since they don't even have the product, and none of your money has been taken. Is it false advertising? Yes, but the question any court would ask is if the advertisement in question was intentional or not. Was the error corrected? Also, the fact that both sites have given fair and reasonable time for us as consumers to change our orders, there's no harm, no foul. I was figuring it would be adjusted, while at the same time, hoping that the $80 price tag would hold. And to anser Roger's question, I still think $150 should be the max they should charge. And by that, I mean MAX. $150 for the Voltron was fine, but for this toy that won't be nearly as complex, I'd be a little hard to take one for that amount. I can wait to find them cheaper. $125 or less is good. Now, is a difference of $25 gonna break my wallet, no, but when I pay that amount for what I get from a foreign company like Yamato, even after shipping and all, then from what the domestic, Toynami, it doesn't make sense to me. Edited March 17, 2008 by Jasonc
Roger Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 I got some info from Toynami on the identity of Masterpiece Beta Volume 2: it's the red one. The four planned Beta Masterpieces will correspond to the Alpha Masterpieces: http://toynami.com/robotech_mpc_alpha.html
promethuem5 Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Makes sense... now to know if the paint will match with the MPC or the Aoshima Legioss at all...
protostar8 Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 so I can't blame the retailers for doing the same when Toynami goofs up. But really, it wasn't Toynami's screw up, it was BBTS's screw up (and from what I understand they generally honor their pre-order prices when they mess up). It clearly states in the e-mail Joel sent everyone that the catalog had "$79.99 minimum". BBTS just assumed minimum meant exactly and popped them up as quickly as possible to draw pre-orders. They took a risk and now are saying they want no share of the blame for the screw up and pre-order customers don't even get a small discount for their mistake to make up for it. Even if I buy a Beta, it sure as hell won't be from BBTS unless they are cheaper or offer pre-order customers a discount of some kind. In all honesty, I still think the toy isn't worth more than $100 MAX, especially if Toynami goes the smart route and makes most of it hollow (b/c who really wants really heavy parts that serve no purpose other than to stress joints???).
Roy's Blues Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 quick question. How do we know that the beta released shortly will match the colors on the previous MPC release? IIRC the1-4999 number was a slightly different color than 5000-? at least on the intakes...
jenius Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 The chances they get the color perfect are slim but they should be close enough. It's only the first 3K of Scott's that are different from the last 10K. Otherwise the Alphas all have the same paint throughout the entire run.
danth Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 It clearly states in the e-mail Joel sent everyone that the catalog had "$79.99 minimum". From how I understand it, that price was supposed to be the minimum stores were allowed to charge. In other words, the Toynami price list said that stores had to charge at least 79.99, implying that the wholesale cost would be even less than 79.99. It wasn't supposed to mean that the retail price would be 79.99 or more. Now, Toynami is saying the minimum stores can charge will be more like $150.
Vermillion21 Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Grand scheme of things, it's another proverbial feather in Toynami's crap-filled cap. QFT - Another "win" for Crapnami ....
Arthurius Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 The minimum indicated cost is supposed to be what BBTS can (is allowed to) charge customers for the pre-order. The minimum amount was changed by Toynami from 79 to 149, and thus the new price from BBTS. Here is the quote from BBTS: "They do enforce minimum pricing with retailers on this, so the lowest price they allow is the best we can do for you on this item". Thus, like they said, min price was 79$, then Toynami changed the minimum price to 149$. So this shows that the marked MINIMUM cost of 79$ was not a misread by BBTS, but shows they did exactly what they were supposed to do. Here is the whole quote, by Roger, from BBTS: "Hi - We have just recently been informed by the president of Toynami that the MSRP of the New Generation Beta Fighters will be somewhere between $149.99 and $199.99. Our original price of $79.99 was incorrect. The confusion on this item was caused by some unclear information on their price sheet. The sheet said the price was 'to be disclosed' at a later date, but there was an asterisk '*' by the item number, and a asterisk '*' note on the bottom of the page stating that all Masterpiece items with the asterisk were to be priced at a $79.99 minimum price. I apologize for this error, it was an honest mistake on my part due to the MSRP they inferred on the price sheet. If you need to cancel or reduce your preorder - that is no problem at all, simply login to your account and update the quantity on order to zero to remove the preorder. When Toynami does officially announce the MSRP, we will sell them at the lowest possible price that they allow - which most likely will be $149.99, but they are still working with factories to nail down the final price. (They do enforce minimum pricing with retailers on this, so the lowest price they allow is the best we can do for you on this item) I again apologize for the error, but on the bright side, with a MSRP, the figure should be that much more amazing. Thanks! Joel www.bigbadtoystore.com"
EXO Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 But really, it wasn't Toynami's screw up, it was BBTS's screw up (and from what I understand they generally honor their pre-order prices when they mess up). It clearly states in the e-mail Joel sent everyone that the catalog had "$79.99 minimum". BBTS just assumed minimum meant exactly and popped them up as quickly as possible to draw pre-orders. They took a risk and now are saying they want no share of the blame for the screw up and pre-order customers don't even get a small discount for their mistake to make up for it. Even if I buy a Beta, it sure as hell won't be from BBTS unless they are cheaper or offer pre-order customers a discount of some kind. In all honesty, I still think the toy isn't worth more than $100 MAX, especially if Toynami goes the smart route and makes most of it hollow (b/c who really wants really heavy parts that serve no purpose other than to stress joints???). You blame the retailer because they listed the toy for the minimum price they were allowed to advertise for? Yeah, it's a great freakin rule that they honor their screw ups but in this case, they did exactly what the catalog said they could do. They should seriously reconsider their rules. They shouldnt be so giving if their "loyal" customers can't be forgiving. I havent ordered from BBTS since the first release of the 1/48s so I have no investment in them, but it was pretty obvious that people jumped on the fact that there might be a mistake and they're going to get the best of them.. I think they should charge a 50% restocking fee on the people that cancel just to further piss people off... they can't win anyway.
eyesonme78 Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 i think i will be getting the toynami one, provided the price does not exceeds $150.. but it's always hard to say.
eugimon Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 POS... so all this talk made me think of my MPC alpha, took it out of storage after at least a year, and hey, the chest ratchets broke. sitting in a box, in a closet, the plastic went all yamato on me.
jenius Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 So does that mean the intakes/chest move freely now? The toy didn't fall apart right, it just looks sloppy? Consider yourself lucky, I had an arm fall off on a toy that was sitting completely unused. The MPC Alpha is such a fail in regards to durabilty it just makes no sense. Here's how I imagined it worked: Factory guy: "Hey, so you said to make all the moving parts out of thin plastic and the parts they support out of heavy diecast right?" Toynami: "Yes, that's exactly right." Factory guy: "And the hands, everyone's going to be fidgeting with them, you want them made out recycled erasers?" Toynami: "Yes, that's exactly right." Factory guy: "Aren't you touting this as an Alpha toy and collectible people will actually be able to pay with?" Toynami: "I don't pay you 7 yuan an hour to ask me questions!" Be afraid people, there's probably an exec right now talking to Factory Guy about the Beta...
eugimon Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 yeah, the chest pieces just rotate freely. I took the thing apart and it's no wonder the ratchet failed. The teeth are really deep and there's basically a little plastic tab on the outer ring that pegs into the chest piece. So basically, everytime you rotate the chest, you risk a chance of snaping the retaining peg off. Yup.. no way am I paying 150 bucks for the beta, fraking POS.
Hiriyu Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 (edited) Nevermind Edited March 18, 2008 by Hiriyu
dizman Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Why are you guys worrying, after the beta comes out and proves that its a pos it'll come down to $80 bucks real fast.
mechaninac Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Add me to the legions of disappointed pre-order buyers who cancelled instead of putting up with Toynami's BS. I do not blame BBTS or TMP for the screw up; I would expect them to eat a $20-30 discrepancy but not a 87.5%, at a minimum, difference in MSRP, even if they misinterpreted the promotional flyers they used as the basis for their pricing. I do hope that the bean counters at Toynami will get some feedback for these and other vendors about the appeal of their product at their asking price and recess accordingly (not very likely considering the company in question). Now, like most here, I'll be waiting for reviews and the laundry list of features before even considering to buy the Beta at anywhere near full price.
wwwmwww Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Yeah, and I never even knew those were supposed to be there. Don't recall seeing them in the animation or in any artwork. They're in the episode with the Synchro Cannon when Rand/Ray gets all angry on the blonde male Invid/Inbit. Any chance of someone posting a screen capture showing these missles as seen in this episode? Thanks, Carl
miriya Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Is there a model kit of the Beta in Robot mode? Has one ever been made? Is one available? And if so where?
wwwmwww Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 I remember seeing the Tread-Beta protos selling on eBay for over $1k. Are you talking about the Gakken toy? If Toynami sold any prototypes on eBay I sure didn't see them. Curious... Carl
eriku Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Are you talking about the Gakken toy? If Toynami sold any prototypes on eBay I sure didn't see them. Curious... Carl Yes, he's referring to the smaller scale Gakken toy.
wwwmwww Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Is there a model kit of the Beta in Robot mode? Has one ever been made? Is one available? And if so where? Yes... The only place you might find an original is on Yahoo Japan, however I think this kit has been recast a time or two by others. Carl
Phyrox Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 (edited) Any chance of someone posting a screen capture showing these missles as seen in this episode? Thanks, Carl There is also a short shot of them on a shadow tread/legioss combo in either the last or the penultimate episode: Edited March 17, 2008 by Phyrox
miriya Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Yes... The only place you might find an original is on Yahoo Japan, however I think this kit has been recast a time or two by others. Carl Nice! Is that yours? I would love to see a finished photo too. Maybe with the increased interest in mospeada someone will recast again.
akim Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Any chance of someone posting a screen capture showing these missles as seen in this episode? Thanks, Carl Found this: akim.
wwwmwww Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 There is also a short shot of them on a shadow tread/legioss combo in either the last or the penultimate episode: Nice... thanks for digging those up. Nice! Is that yours? I would love to see a finished photo too. Maybe with the increased interest in mospeada someone will recast again. Yes, that is mine. I haven't finished mine but I have seen pictures of this kit completed. I'll see if I can dig them up, it was several years ago though so don't hold your breath. Found this: akim. Nice!!! May I ask where you found that? Thanks, Carl
CoryHolmes Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Nice!!! May I ask where you found that? No, you may not.
wwwmwww Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 No, you may not. Too late... I already asked. Carl
CoryHolmes Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Too late... I already asked. Carl Damn! Late again!
bsu legato Posted March 17, 2008 Posted March 17, 2008 Ask all you want, you guys. If said bit of line art happens to...shall we say...go missing, then I'll gladly scan the exact same drawing out of the ole' REF Field Guide. After sitting on my bookshelf for about 20 odd years, it'd be about time for that thing to earn its keep.
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