Rant Warning: Need More Sci Fi!

[GobotFool]

Silent running is a pretty good film as I recall but it was some time ago that I watched it.

Disneys Black Hole is another one I remember since you mentioned Silent Running.

410671[/snapback]

I went back and watched blackhole again, not an awful film, still it's a movie whose production design has more merit than the actual story.

[Boxer]

Lately there hasn't been much entertaining Science fiction on TV for me to pick up and watch anything. The new Galactica feels more like a teenage sci-fi violence fantasy than anything science fiction- to say nothing of the story and neglegance of it's own canon and established themes.

Last Sci-fi anything I've watched was the last season of Enterprise, and for the pure reason that it focused more on story and the mythos of trek than trying to sneak in flesh shots of T'pol to an excessive degree... There was good storytelling here and I thought the relationship between T'pol and Tucker was going somewhere until Bragga stuck his ugly head in for the last episode. Some 'gift for the fans.'

Solaris was good because it was a human drama, and ultimately what science fiction should be: How the human being reacts to unusual surroundings. What makes humans human? How do we react in enviroments outside our control? great films like 2001 paint this pretty well, and I think it's a good angle for science fiction flicks. Space is an unknown and should be treated as an unknown, not necissarily just a canvas for the latest special effects.

never got around to seeing Serenity / Firefly, mostly because I've lost interest in anything american entertainment can come up with. Might give it a try someday.

I'll have to keep my eye out for the fountain though.

[Vermillion21]

I found Silent Running to be pretty boring .....

[Gui]

I think the main problem of SF nowadays is well summarized by JsARCLIGHT and Penguin: (young) people want entertainment, nothing more...

Excuse me for saying so, but isn't that kind of the point? I didn't go to see Serenity because I felt I wasn't bored enough. I didn't go because I was hoping to find something educational, or something of intellectual value. I went because I wanted to be entertained. And I found it to be quite so.

The problem is, most of Hollywood is so out of touch with the rest of America that they are more or less guessing what people might find entertaining. That's when we wind up with movies like Aeon Flux.

409716[/snapback]

Yup, the door was already open: sure it's normal to seek entertainment but what sort of entertainment are you talking about? I'll be 33 in a few days and what Hollywood calls 'entertainment' doesn't entertain me any more. It does entertain a young audience though but such audience is easily entertained anyway... Of course I like nice action scenes and explosions, good-looking babes accompanying charismatic heroes and all the 'standard' stuff but isn't it more entertaining with a good story aswell? This story doesn't need to be highly intellectual or educational, but simply something different than 'bad guys having their asses kicked by the good one' which is basically the main plot done over and over at nauseum

It's a shame really, especially when you see that contemporary SF novels often present a strong potential for visual/action scenes: see Banks' Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons, Simmons' Hyperion too or Brin's Startide Rising, and many more. Main difference with Hollywood SF is that such stories often have a strong story with interesting and unusual characters most of the time. And we still wait for Spielberg's Foundation by the way... Instead of that we get things like The Matrix ruled by the Frankenstein Complex when 30 years earlier Daniel Galouye wrote Simulacron 3

Therefore, I don't go to the theaters anymore (the last time was for Ice Age 2 and I got exactly what I expected: some good laughs...), but I'll try to take a look to Serenity anyway: I often hear it's a good movie

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Haven't had a chance to read through the thread yet (3am at time of writing) but I am looking forward to the Battle Angel Alita movie.

What they really need is an epic sci-fi on the scale of an RPG like final fantasy or something. Massive cast, enough to fill a trilogy, huge fantasy worlds, lots of varying technology, moody atmosphere, moody lighting and feel for each world etc

Those are kinda all the things I like about star wars. If you played final fantasy 6, (super nintendo game) there was a star warsy feel to that game. So in some epic sci-fi if the characters go to a new planet: customs, politics, religion, laws, dress, climate, calendar etc are all unique. There has to be a hint that the world itself the movie is based on really exists outside the confines of the movie. You have to be able to want a person to be curious about the stuff inside that world from what they see, to care.

For me SW = WWII atmosphere with dirty beat up vehicles in space, land, air, in snowy, sandy, swampy, foresty environments etc. (like a james bond movie the location has to be exotic and give you the "I wish I was standing there and being there" feel that OT star wars gave me. (space by itself can be interesting but I want planets and unique looking cities and stuff on the star wars scale)

After lord of the rings and PT star wars, there really needs to be a fantasy or sci fi movie that is epic enough in scope and depth to get me excited and fill in the gap.

I think there are just way too many superhero movies.

Edited June 24, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[EXO]

Let's talk about upcoming films, not old ones that already passed... the title is "More Sci-Fi" right?

Here's one that maybe of interest

http://www.sunshinedna.com/videos/8

not sure what to make of it. Danny Boyle... director of Trainspotting, but also of The Beach.

[the white drew carey]

Let's talk about upcoming films, not old ones that already passed... the title is "More Sci-Fi" right?

Here's one that maybe of interest

http://www.sunshinedna.com/videos/8

not sure what to make of it.  Danny Boyle... director of Trainspotting, but also of The Beach.

411206[/snapback]

Could be good, could blow chunks. I'll keep my eyes on it.

[chrono]

It's a shame really, especially when you see that contemporary SF novels often present a strong potential for visual/action scenes: see Banks' Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons, Simmons' Hyperion too or Brin's Startide Rising, and many more. Main difference with Hollywood SF is that such stories often have a strong story with interesting and unusual characters most of the time. And we still wait for Spielberg's Foundation by the way... Instead of that we get things like The Matrix ruled by the Frankenstein Complex when 30 years earlier Daniel Galouye wrote Simulacron 3

Well the biggest problem with contemporary SF is that unless they radically rewrite it they simply can't make a single movie from a single book! They either radically screw it up completely losing the books characters, mood, and plots. OR they use alot of the book and are forced to do thought dialogue that people hate from some reason.

Besides it's almost impossible to translate Iain Bank's material into a movie. They are simply way to many abstracts and dialogue to reduce or show without looking chessy. Brin's StarTide Rising 'could' work but it has nearly 2 movies worth of material in it and if you crush it into a single movie most of the aliens would come off are the 'Evil aliens of the week' variety and devolve into a CG action flick. So much potential, but so little talent to properly translate it!!! Most of these would be best made into a single season series or Maxi-series to better flesh out the story which will make the story's far better then a 2-3 hour rush movie would do.

Thank you! I totally forgot that Spielberg, the hack, was/is going to RUIN Foundation. NONE of Asimov's material has ever been made into ANY movie worth of collecting or watching more then once or even watching to begin with! His material has ALWAYS required an established background to be built in order to enjoy the story. But sadly more then half of his material cannot be used because it's outdated, by other, newer, materials doing the same thing(the matrix, bladerunner, gunhed, etc.).

This also doesn't cover the nearly complete lack of talented actors under 60!

And we can't forget that Battle Angel is being made!

EXO, that looks a little weak and definatly in the vein of Silent Running.

We can build a gadet to change an object close to 12 million km's in size, but yet we can't build a spaceship with FTL, coldsleep, or a semi decent design that doesn't require months in space for this silly plot to happen.

[Noriko Takaya]

Speaking of Event Horizon, I've heard there is a longer gorier cut that cleans up some of the story issues and raises the terror angle some. Not sure if this is true or just rumors, anyone know?

410422[/snapback]

Paul Anderson states on the extras disc on the new Event Horizon release that he would have liked to have released a director's cut, but a lot of the footage was lost or destroyed or something like that. There were some deleted scenes, but not much to make a difference in story telling.

[JELEINEN]

Also, what happened to Itano and Mikimoto's Titania project? I haven't followed anime in the last two years (too busy watching Miami Vice to watch anime aimed at little kids.)

410005[/snapback]

It appears Titania has fallen off the face of the Earth. I'm a huge fan of Tanaka Yoshiki's stuff, so I was really looking forward to this. Speaking of whom,I actually re-watched the first LoGH movie last night and that thing is still one of the most amazing things ever.

[sketchley]

What about the upcoming GiTS movie that's supposed to be released this summer (here in Japan)? I read, just now, on wikipedia, that it's in the works for Production IG and will be based on the SAC version of the series.

Has anyone heard anything above and beyond that? It's near future, but definitely science fiction.

Also, there's the Appleseed II movie too...

[azrael]

What about the upcoming GiTS movie that's supposed to be released this summer (here in Japan)?  I read, just now, on wikipedia, that it's in the works for Production IG and will be based on the SAC version of the series.

Has anyone heard anything above and beyond that?  It's near future, but definitely science fiction.

Also, there's the Appleseed II movie too...

411292[/snapback]

I think we are or should be excluding anime from this discussion. Animation can do levels of sci-fi that live-action production can't on a "regular" budget.

[Gui]

When I remember how much the first movie was sh!tty, I don't think the second one will be better: actually sequels more or less always are worse...

It's a shame really, especially when you see that contemporary SF novels often present a strong potential for visual/action scenes: see Banks' Consider Phlebas or Use of Weapons, Simmons' Hyperion too or Brin's Startide Rising, and many more. Main difference with Hollywood SF is that such stories often have a strong story with interesting and unusual characters most of the time. And we still wait for Spielberg's Foundation by the way... Instead of that we get things like The Matrix ruled by the Frankenstein Complex when 30 years earlier Daniel Galouye wrote Simulacron 3

Well the biggest problem with contemporary SF is that unless they radically rewrite it they simply can't make a single movie from a single book! They either radically screw it up completely losing the books characters, mood, and plots. OR they use alot of the book and are forced to do thought dialogue that people hate from some reason.

411223[/snapback]

I think this reason is that these thought dialogues are not entertaining... At least for some people. Actually the majority of viewers

Besides it's almost impossible to translate Iain Bank's material into a movie. They are simply way to many abstracts and dialogue to reduce or show without looking chessy. Brin's StarTide Rising 'could' work but it has nearly 2 movies worth of material in it and if you crush it into a single movie most of the aliens would come off are the 'Evil aliens of the week' variety and devolve into a CG action flick. So much potential, but so little talent to properly translate it!!! Most of these would be best made into a single season series or Maxi-series to better flesh out the story which will make the story's far better then a 2-3 hour rush movie would do.

Thank you! I totally forgot that Spielberg, the hack, was/is going to RUIN Foundation. NONE of Asimov's material has ever been made into ANY movie worth of collecting or watching more then once or even watching to begin with! His material has ALWAYS required an established background to be built in order to enjoy the story. But sadly more then half of his material cannot be used because it's outdated, by other, newer, materials doing the same thing(the matrix, bladerunner, gunhed, etc.).

This also doesn't cover the nearly complete lack of talented actors under 60!

And we can't forget that Battle Angel is being made!

411223[/snapback]

Dude, they were just some examples: my point is that contemporary SF novels emphasize far much more onto action and SPFX than previous authors did (except for the space operas trend from the 30s...), AND they propose interesting stories/characters too. Therefore there's some potential with these authors : maybe Hollywood should envisage to work with some of them instead of simply adaptating their work...

And gimme a break with the argument of 'OMFG, it's too much long to make a single movie!!!' All these authors are great short-stories writers aswell: it's a Dick's short-story which allowed Verhoeven to make Total Recall, and I for sure saw far much worse SF movies

Finally, I don't see why 2 movies inspired by Asimov sucked hairy balls all the (possible) others ones should be a disaster aswell. And I don't think that the End of Eternity or The Gods Themselves should be considered as outdated: actually, I don't know any time travel stories which go beyond the Asimov concept of controling time, except maybe the mad machines from Hyperion...

[chrono]

Dude, they were just some examples: my point is that contemporary SF novels emphasize far much more onto action and SPFX than previous authors did (except for the space operas trend from the 30s...), AND they propose interesting stories/characters too. Therefore there's some potential with these authors : maybe Hollywood should envisage to work with some of them instead of simply adaptating their work...

I know they were examples and I addressed them anyways. However even if the authors worked with the re-writers/producer/director the studio would still try to push their veiw of the material over the writer.

And gimme a break with the argument of 'OMFG, it's too much long to make a single movie!!!' All these authors are great short-stories writers aswell: it's a Dick's short-story which allowed Verhoeven to make Total Recall, and I for sure saw far much worse SF movies.

That is the normal agruement when it comes to countering the "It's too long for a single movie!" statement. But that statement always pops up because the fan feels that you need most of the book intact in the movie in order for it to be true to the book. And it takes a rare writer to brilliantly re-write a book into a movie well enough to get praise from both sides. But generally we book fans feel that most books-to-movies are fairly poor and never fill out the background plot well enough. Never really filling out the emotional build-up quite right.

As for you explain... meh! Dick was simply an AWSOME writer who gave the rewriter tons of basic material to work with at the very beginning.

I don't know any time travel stories which go beyond the Asimov concept of controling time

We since 1990 Time Travel story's have been thrown-up nearly annually, so even with the HINT of Time Travel the story drops down to a B level because eveyone knows the main plot already! It's like reading LoveCraft after watching 50 horror movies. You get bored really quick!

I'm not saying your wrong I'm just disagreeing.

[Gui]

Dude, they were just some examples: my point is that contemporary SF novels emphasize far much more onto action and SPFX than previous authors did (except for the space operas trend from the 30s...), AND they propose interesting stories/characters too. Therefore there's some potential with these authors : maybe Hollywood should envisage to work with some of them instead of simply adaptating their work...

I know they were examples and I addressed them anyways. However even if the authors worked with the re-writers/producer/director the studio would still try to push their veiw of the material over the writer.

411473[/snapback]

I tend to agree with you on this one, this was what happened to Asimov's I, Robot: maybe this could have been avoided if the original author was still here to defend his work... We'll never know until we try

And gimme a break with the argument of 'OMFG, it's too much long to make a single movie!!!' All these authors are great short-stories writers aswell: it's a Dick's short-story which allowed Verhoeven to make Total Recall, and I for sure saw far much worse SF movies.

That is the normal agruement when it comes to countering the "It's too long for a single movie!" statement. But that statement always pops up because the fan feels that you need most of the book intact in the movie in order for it to be true to the book. And it takes a rare writer to brilliantly re-write a book into a movie well enough to get praise from both sides. But generally we book fans feel that most books-to-movies are fairly poor and never fill out the background plot well enough. Never really filling out the emotional build-up quite right.

411473[/snapback]

Actually, it's the same problem with all books, SF or not: cinema implies some sort of compromise. Also, directors have the right to give their own interpretation of a story: it became interesting more than once (2001, A Space Odyssey, Blade Runner,...) but of course it depends of the talent of the director... like in any other movies btw

As for you explain... meh! Dick was simply an AWSOME writer who gave the rewriter tons of basic material to work with at the very beginning.

411473[/snapback]

First, I think Dick's reputation is way overrated (and I mean waaay overated...)

Second, I didn't read the original short story but some friends of me did so and they all agreed on the fact that it was very short and, well, uninteresting (basically, this story ends when the guy goes to Recall and has his brain freezed instead of getting artificial memories : if the original really was like this, then the script writer of Verhoeven did a great job IMO...)

I don't know any time travel stories which go beyond the Asimov concept of controling time

We since 1990 Time Travel story's have been thrown-up nearly annually, so even with the HINT of Time Travel the story drops down to a B level because eveyone knows the main plot already! It's like reading LoveCraft after watching 50 horror movies. You get bored really quick!

411473[/snapback]

Asimov's novel talks about CONTROLING time, not SIMPLY TRAVELING it: this technology allows to model societies in order to avoid wars, ecological disasters, rise of fascist nations or whatever. This idea is truely unique and has nothing to do with Wells: actually it's more a logical continuation of Anderson's Time Patrol except that in Asimov's novel time is domesticated instead of being watched by some sort of time cops who do in sort that history doesn't change despite all its dramas. Asimov's concept looks completely different as well as innovative to me, all the more as one of the main plots is a love story while I'm at it

Oh, and In the Mouth of Madness is the best horror movie I've ever seen... precisely because of the heavy influence of Lovecraft's work

I'm not saying your wrong I'm just disagreeing.

411473[/snapback]

No problem I'm just disagreeing aswell