Official Transformers Super Thread 3

[wolfx]

More pics of low viz screamer.

[David Hingtgen]

Every comment from Hasbro so far has been "even if we do bring it over, it'd be late 2007 at the earliest". There is practicaly zero chance of a US release within the next 12 months. Remember that the UK waited for what, 2 years to get Masterpiece Prime? Hasbro takes their time when they want to.

Takara will probably be up to "Clear Sunstorm" by then for repaints...

And from the last 2 batches of "latest pics", SS looks "F-14 green-grey" again, sigh. "Gunship grey" has NO green/blue in it. If there's the slightest hint, then it's wrong. How hard is GREY to make? Black+white=grey. Not black+white+green.

Edited August 3, 2006 by David Hingtgen

[GobotFool]

If there is any single thing I am disapointed by is the lack of perfect transformation with the nullrays.

[Vermillion21]

Thanks for the pics wolfx ... the MPC is lookin' sweet. I know the colours are "accurate", but I still like it. I wonder how the fighter mode looks beside a 1/48 Yammie?

[HoveringCheesecake]

It looks better painted, but the shoulder and hip pieces that are hanging off are bugging the heck out of me.

[Veritas]

You know i was really waiting for better pictures of this paint scheme before i made my decision about whether or not i'd be buying him and i'm def. leaning towards purchase. The kibble in robot mode to make up for a better jet mode does still bother me a little, but i'll get past it. To tell you the truth, I'm just happy they're continuing the MPC line at all... seeing as what they're doing to BTs we should count our blessings.

[HoveringCheesecake]

It would have been better if they had gone for either a) uber cartoon accuracy or b) uber realistic version... what we got was a compromise between the two that just looks... well odd.

[Phyrox]

It would have been better if they had gone for either a) uber cartoon accuracy or b) uber realistic version... what we got was a compromise between the two that just looks... well odd.

422063[/snapback]

Well, compared to just about every transformer ever...he is pretty "uber realistic."

The alternators are the only thing I can think of where someone who didn't know better might be fooled into not knowing it was a robot.

I don't understand some people here, but that Starscream is hands down the best looking transformer I've ever seen.

If we had stuff like this when I was young, I would have died of a stroke.

[LL Cool VF1J]

[

422063[/snapback]

Well, compared to just about every transformer ever...he is pretty "uber realistic."

The alternators are the only thing I can think of where someone who didn't know better might be fooled into not knowing it was a robot.

I don't understand some people here, but that Starscream is hands down the best looking transformer I've ever seen.

If we had stuff like this when I was young, I would have died of a stroke.

422093[/snapback]

Totally! Starscream is awesome, hands down.

[chowyunskinny]

You honestly have to ask if Takara will repaint that?  When they re-released the G1 seekers, they made clear ghost THUNDERCRACKER in addition to "ghost" Starscream.  And Sunstorm.  And clear Sunstorm.  And black Starscream. And TV-color Starscream. And I think clear black Starscream.  When they do a half-dozen non-canon repaints of a mold, you can bet they'll do the canon ones. 

And c'mon---they made "unarmored Ultra Magnus" from MP-01. 

Not making SW and TC would be like Yamato not making Max and Milia's VF-1J's once they had done Hikaru's...   

Also, Takara likes making black repaints of everything.  Even if they do no other repaints, they'll do a black one.  And Skywarp is already SUPPOSED to be black. 

Even if for some unfathomable reason "the king of repaints" decided not to do Skywarp, they'd probably do "Black Starscream".  Which is pretty close.  And considering the pinky colors used on MP-03, it'd be REALLY close to SW lavender.

422011[/snapback]

I hope you were exaggerating a little bit because AFAIK there was never a clear ghost Thundercracker, Clear Sunstorm or black Masterpiece Convoy. I'll be pissed if there is, because that's more stuff to hunt down.

Skywarp and Thundercracker are no-brainers and if they do Sunstorm it'll probably be an e-hobby or Japanese fan club exclusive. Any color past that I'd have to guess would be a Lucky Draw color.

I don't think they are going to milk the colors as bad now that it's TomyTakara.

For example, look how much they repainted the Subaru Wrx in the Binaltech line and how often new Binaltechs were being released before. The last two were Skids and Broadblast and they were released last november.

[kensei]

More pics of low viz screamer.

422027[/snapback]

The detail is simply fantastic. Amazing.

[wolfx]

More pics of low viz screamer.

422027[/snapback]

The detail is simply fantastic. Amazing.

422107[/snapback]

I really doubt that the final product will be panel lined to the extent of that prototype picture, though i wish it were so.

[Abnolds]

That is really cool looking, I wonder how it would look kitbashed into jetfire? Seeing as this is one of the best transformer jet-modes wer'e ever gonna see.

Also, does anyone know a release date for classics jetfire?

[Guest sh002]

422027[/snapback]

it would have been closer to thundercracker

[HoveringCheesecake]

Well, compared to just about every transformer ever...he is pretty "uber realistic."

The alternators are the only thing I can think of where someone who didn't know better might be fooled into not knowing it was a robot.

I don't understand some people here, but that Starscream is hands down the best looking transformer I've ever seen.

If we had stuff like this when I was young, I would have died of a stroke.

422093[/snapback]

You missed my point. For some reason they decided to make him into a realistic jet, but they screwed up on the conformal fuel tanks on the side of the intakes, and his freaking cannon is on the wrong side. Seems to me like the cannon was a foolish mistake, maybe theres a reason to have the conformal tanks the way they are. And the colors. Like I said, they have grown on me. I'd buy it if it weren't for the hip and shoulder pieces hanging off.

Also, if I had this as a kid it would probably have been broken the first day I had it. It doesn't look very durable.

[Limbo]

I'm looking for a place to preorder SS... where is the best price out there?

[GobotFool]

Well, compared to just about every transformer ever...he is pretty "uber realistic."

The alternators are the only thing I can think of where someone who didn't know better might be fooled into not knowing it was a robot.

I don't understand some people here, but that Starscream is hands down the best looking transformer I've ever seen.

If we had stuff like this when I was young, I would have died of a stroke.

422093[/snapback]

You missed my point. For some reason they decided to make him into a realistic jet, but they screwed up on the conformal fuel tanks on the side of the intakes, and his freaking cannon is on the wrong side. Seems to me like the cannon was a foolish mistake, maybe theres a reason to have the conformal tanks the way they are. And the colors. Like I said, they have grown on me. I'd buy it if it weren't for the hip and shoulder pieces hanging off.

Also, if I had this as a kid it would probably have been broken the first day I had it. It doesn't look very durable.

422203[/snapback]

It's probably going to be as durable as any binaltech. And this isn't for kids, this is for adult collectors.

[HoveringCheesecake]

It's probably going to be as durable as any binaltech. And this isn't for kids, this is for adult collectors.

422242[/snapback]

I was responding to the person who was talking about how excited they would have been to get one as a kid. I know it isn't for children.

[David Hingtgen]

I know there's a clear Thundercracker--it may have actually been those little PVC "legends of", but it looked more like the G1 mold when I saw it. Been a while, and small blurry pic (bad catalog scan I think)

Black Prime---was thinking RiD, sorry if you thought I meant MP. (So many Primes, so many repaints)

Anyways, the point that Takara will do "even more than everything we've seen on-screen" for repaints is still there.

[eugimon]

It's probably going to be as durable as any binaltech. And this isn't for kids, this is for adult collectors.

422242[/snapback]

I was responding to the person who was talking about how excited they would have been to get one as a kid. I know it isn't for children.

422250[/snapback]

so, you're expecting adults, to revert to being a clumsy seven year old when they get this?

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

The alternators look pretty fragile to me in pics but they hold up pretty well AND they are aimed at adults. You won't see many complaints about busted pieces even from people who actually play around with them. I don't think this will be that fragile. Not in a "OMG I'm afraid to touch it, it's so delicate!" kind of way at least.

The thing I worry about in toys is how posable they are. I can't stand toys that have floppy limbs or limited posability that when you try to hold them, they become sort of a hassle to handle because you can't touch them in a certain area or they will fall apart. (see the 1/72 yf19 as an example. The robot mode upper half isn't even locked onto anything. It's much more of a display than a toy in that sense) And the yf21, it's gerwalk mode is just not safe to even bother posing as the slightest shake will send it toppling over.

I also hope that joints are ultra tight so that they can suport the weight of the limbs. Unlike others, I don't just pose my toys/figures in a "standing up straight" stance. I like to have them in an action pose like a freeze frame from an anime or something if possible as a way to express some of the character's motion or energy. (example: putting prime in a mid-"jumping in the air" pose suspended in the air on a stand like in the movie where he somersaults while blowing away the targets )

Edited August 4, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[eugimon]

Well, compared to just about every transformer ever...he is pretty "uber realistic."

The alternators are the only thing I can think of where someone who didn't know better might be fooled into not knowing it was a robot.

I don't understand some people here, but that Starscream is hands down the best looking transformer I've ever seen.

If we had stuff like this when I was young, I would have died of a stroke.

422093[/snapback]

You missed my point. For some reason they decided to make him into a realistic jet, but they screwed up on the conformal fuel tanks on the side of the intakes, and his freaking cannon is on the wrong side. Seems to me like the cannon was a foolish mistake, maybe theres a reason to have the conformal tanks the way they are. And the colors. Like I said, they have grown on me. I'd buy it if it weren't for the hip and shoulder pieces hanging off.

Also, if I had this as a kid it would probably have been broken the first day I had it. It doesn't look very durable.

422203[/snapback]

here's a shot of an F-15 with conformal fuel tanks:

Those look pretty similar to the ones SS are sporting. What are you fiending about exactly?

As for the foolish canon mistake... maybe they were trying to emulate this:

but decided to save a little on tooling costs. just tell yourself it's a compromise they made to keep costs down, or because it's a TOY... you know,, like how his rear landing gears come out of odd places and how... you know... transforms into a robot.

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

Actually that reminds me: where are our 1/72 alternator jets?!

[David Hingtgen]

I'll post the same pic I used at the 2005 boards, but the pic eugimon posted will work just as well:

See the big huge crease? That's where the conformal tank and the F-15's own structure meet. The conformal tank is a quite separate part. It's as if Takara put a bunch of putty in the area and blended the two together. The conformal tanks "pinch in" at the top, and are not at all blended with the frame. From head-on, that area should have a pretty distinct kidney/bean shape due to the pinching in/taper caused by the crease. Takara actually has it bulge OUT. It's convex instead of concave. It also eliminates any hope/chance we had of the CFT's being removable, FAST pack-style. (Which I can't figure out why it wasn't done so in the first place--it's Kawamori, who loves nothing more than large removable parts on transforming jets---so why does MP-03 have them molded in place? They could EASILY have been single large pieces of plastic held in with just 2 tabs in fighter mode). Want to cover up all the robot kibble in fighter mode? Take 2 secs and put them on. Just have to take them off (another 2 secs) to transform to fighter mode. It would also eliminate all arm kibble, 2/3 of the intake kibble, and 1/2 of the hip kibble. A win-win situation for everyone, no matter what mode or sculpt you prefer. But no, they're MOLDED ON. Gah, even non-transforming plastic model kits of the F-15E don't have the conformal tanks permanently molded on. Or even diecast ones!

As for the cannon vs refuelling port--IT WAS CORRECT ON THE FIRST MOLD. They changed it. Even the very first drawings had it correct, and even showed an open refuelling receptacle--I thought it might be a gimmick they were going to do. The original artist of those drawings, and the original F-15 sculpt, clearly knew what the left and right sides should look like and function. But when they added the conformal tanks, they added a non-existent gun muzzle. And there was no need to even re-sculpt it at all, the conformal tanks don't affect that area. They already have the refuelling port there (and it's still there on the current mold)--they certainly weren't trying to add it in later by adding a gun muzzle in front of it. You don't try to "save costs" by re-sculpting. It was already right, they screwed it up. Leaving it as it was would have cost no money at all, and would have been correct.

Since the odds of an acceptable Thundercracker repaint are low (they can't even do SS right, what are the odds we'll get metallic sapphire blue?) I'm seriously considering buying one just to repaint, and have been planning how to carve in the groove needed to make the conformal tanks look right.

Edited August 4, 2006 by David Hingtgen

[eugimon]

okay... I see the detail now, thanks David.

all in all, I have to say it's a very minor thing. Even with the dual canon thing.

[Crazy Canuck II]

I'm not trying to start anything, but I find it hard to be concerned with tiny little details when a good portion of the underside is nothing like an f-15 or the fact that it has laser guns hanging off the wings? Ok I can kinda see the desire to have a totally accurate plane from the sides and top, but to me that kind misses the point. These are "Robots in disguse" after all and no disguise it perfect. I always assumed a transformers alt mode only had to be good enough not to attract attention from the average person.

I don't know, just something to consider.

Edited August 4, 2006 by Crazy Canuck II

[Limbo]

Preorder tips, anyone??

I'm looking for a place to preorder SS... where is the best price out there?

422232[/snapback]

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

I'm not trying to start anything, but I find it hard to be concerned with tiny little details when a good portion of the underside is nothing like an f-15 or the fact that it has laser guns hanging off the wings? Ok I can kinda see the desire to have a totally accurate plane from the sides and top, but to me that kind misses the point. These are "Robots in disguse" after all and no disguise it perfect. I always assumed a transformers alt mode only had to be good enough not to attract attention from the average person.

I don't know, just something to consider.

That's why if they did SS in alternator jets line, people could demand vehicle mode accuracy and details. The way I like to see it is this: the details in masterpiece for vehicle mode are more like a bonus or the icing on the cake. (whereas with alternators the vehicle mode has to pass as a model kit of the actual thing as this is what an adult collector is buying it for: the accuracy and realism that alternators give which are based on the real vehicle)

Actually what I would like to see is alternators as a line with varying vehicles. They should not have a rule where the alternators HAVE to be of a certain size or price. Instead, just release all kinds of vehicles with realistic look and details, at varying prices like any other line. This way they could get away with a proper-sized alternator truck to be the optimus prime of that line rather than be forced to make him the same size of the others.

Edited August 4, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker

[HoveringCheesecake]

so, you're expecting adults, to revert to being a clumsy seven year old when they get this?

422289[/snapback]

No, I'm not. Care to put anymore words in my mouth? Or shall I make another post stating my opinion so you can nitpick? Seems like that is all you do.

[David Hingtgen]

My point was: whoever sculpted it obviously spent many hours toiling over drawings and photos of the real thing. It's panel-by-panel perfect over most of it. Then with the latest revision, they really botched up one particular area. WHY? Did they hire a new sculptor just for the conformal tanks? Was he told to change it to a knowingly incorrect configuration?

It'd be like if just before the VF-0A comes out, Yamato decides to sculpt on an extra head laser, and then fill in the auxiliary intakes, eliminating them.

Basically, the only scenario to explain it is like this:

"Ok, I'm supposed to sculpt on conformal tanks to the F-15. I have tons of reference photos, so I'll do that for 80% of them, but totally ignore the photos and drawings for the front part, and do my own artistic interpretation---and while I'm working on that area I'll go over and add in another gun just because I feel like it---I'm sure that's exactly what my bosses want in going for as realistic and accurate fighter mode as possible, because that's the whole reason we're changing the mold in the first place--a more realistic fighter mode"

I ask similar questions every time I see a model etc. plane become LESS accurate as the mold is revised from prototype to final production. You can't get the conformal tanks utterly perfect for 80% of their length without very closely following photgraphs from every angle (it's a complex 3D shape) and constantly comparing your work to the real thing---so why was the front part screwed up?

[chowyunskinny]

While there's all this debate about realism of Transformer's alternate modes, I'd like to discuss the whole "Robots In Disguise" premise.

I find it amusing that the whole "Robots In Disguise" pretty much went out the window when they introduced Metroplex and Trypticon in the G1 Line. I mean, these guys were friggin cities that transformed into robots.

like i'd be driving and go "hey, i don't remember there being a city here!"

"huh, i don't remember seeing it yesterday"

"oh well, I must be remembering wrong...nope you're not a robot...yup, you're definitely a city"

Edited August 4, 2006 by chowyunskinny

[Vermillion21]

I ask similar questions every time I see a model etc. plane become LESS accurate as the mold is revised from prototype to final production.

Maybe as the figure went from prototype to production, they realized that their initial design was either not cost effective to make, or flawed? Just a thought ....

[JB0]

I ask similar questions every time I see a model etc. plane become LESS accurate as the mold is revised from prototype to final production.

Maybe as the figure went from prototype to production, they realized that their initial design was either not cost effective to make, or flawed? Just a thought ....

422379[/snapback]

In this case it might just be that Starscream is too trigger-happy to get by with just one cannon and 2 lasers(the cannons are mirrored, right? They didn't just move it from the right wing to the wrong one?).

[Twoducks]

Are we talking about a toy plane that turns into a robot or an exact model kit replica of a plane? There's a big difference between the two.

The SS toy looks like an F-15, but he is not an F-15 (those things aren't toys created to transform into cool looking robots).

[1/1 LowViz Lurker]

While there's all this debate about realism of Transformer's alternate modes, I'd like to discuss the whole "Robots In Disguise" premise.

I find it amusing that the whole "Robots In Disguise" pretty much went out the window when they introduced Metroplex and Trypticon in the G1 Line. I mean, these guys were friggin cities that transformed into robots.

like i'd be driving and go "hey, i don't remember there being a city here!"

"huh, i don't remember seeing it yesterday"

"oh well, I must be remembering wrong...nope you're not a robot...yup, you're definitely a city"

Yeah but I reason that it became convenient to stay into cars (for practical reasons) once they realised the humans were not cars but flesh and bone organisms. At first it was a disguise (just like the vf1 being kept a secret by the military about being transformable into a giant robot as long as possible) but then as time went on, alternate modes aided them in certain tasks.

Take devastor for example he can actually be useful as a set of construction robots when used in vehicle mode. By transforming into those things you can actually do useful task as well as kick ass in robot mode equiped with standard weapons for fighting and stuff. Humans use and built construction vehicles because they are useful to us, so the question is: "why not steal our designs or way of doing things for convenience?" ...and at the same time blend in with us wherever possible.

Maybe there are other reasons it would be convenient: these are aliens and like super heroes it might be convenient to have a secret identity to avoid interference from us where both aliens sides are engaged in a secret war that the public isn't supposed to be aware of. (we are disregarded as we are not really taken seriously as a threat) Seeing a transformer would be as rare as say a person getting a good photograph of spiderman or superman or someone witnessing a car crash. Sure they might appear in front of us occassionally but for the most part we go about our business and they are not the focus of our attention because they don't try to attract attention. The disguise = the bonus you get by choosing to copy us. The alt mode provides practicality. (by copying the design of say a plane, you can take advantage of being able to fly for example)

Edited August 4, 2006 by 1/1 LowViz Lurker