Gundam Show Thread - MSG thru Witch from Mercury

[Sketch]

Hope this new UC movie doesn't turn out to be another F91.

F91 + Crossbone is probably my favorite UC storyline. Forget Unicorn, I want a 12 part Crossbone OAV series.

[Bri]

Nice to see a new Gundam project in the works. I have only seen unicorn modelkits. Where is the background story from?

[Gubaba]

Nice to see a new Gundam project in the works. I have only seen unicorn modelkits. Where is the background story from?

It's a series of novels currently running in Gundam Ace. It's freakin' long (is it eight volumes so far...?), and my Japanese friends tell me that the author's writing style is, um, "difficult."

In other words, we will never get a translation of it.

It does, however, feature Mineva Rao Zabi, all grown up.

[Excillon]

I hope they take a split second to decide once and for all the fate of Amuro and Char. I mean, we know they died in CC, but they never really set it in stone, I hope they do finally. To be honest, I'd like to see Amuro die and Char survive. I haven't read any of the Unicorn novels, and I know very little about it. I know it happens after CC and before F91, right? Are the Titans around in Unicorn?

[Keith]

Titans are gone as of hte end of Zeta. I also doubt Char would outlive Amuro, like it or not, Amuro was the superior Pilot/Newtype.

[REbirth]

F91 + Crossbone is probably my favorite UC storyline. Forget Unicorn, I want a 12 part Crossbone OAV series.

F91 was nice, but the story is rushed to hell and back. It needs Crossbone (and F90 manga) to flesh it out.

I just hope UC doesn't follow its failed track.

[Gubaba]

I hope they take a split second to decide once and for all the fate of Amuro and Char. I mean, we know they died in CC, but they never really set it in stone, I hope they do finally. To be honest, I'd like to see Amuro die and Char survive. I haven't read any of the Unicorn novels, and I know very little about it. I know it happens after CC and before F91, right? Are the Titans around in Unicorn?

No, from what little I've been able to glean from the chapters themselves, there's a new Neo-Zeon group fully fronted by a Char-lookalike named Full Frontal. Don't know much about him...people in the book seem to think he might be Char, but it's pretty clear he's not.

I'm making it sound ridiculous, aren't I? Apparently, it's quite good.

It starts in U.C. 0001, with a piece of technology that goes missing, then picks up in U.C. 0096. Not sure if Amuro and Char's fate(s) is/are referenced, but I kind of doubt it.

They died in both versions of the novelization of CCA (Hi-Streamer and Beltorchika Children), so I always assumed that they both died in the movie, too. (Yeah, yeah, I know...Amuro already died in the MSG novels...that's a different story...)

[REbirth]

No, from what little I've been able to glean from the chapters themselves, there's a new Neo-Zeon group fully fronted by a Char-lookalike named Full Frontal. Don't know much about him...people in the book seem to think he might be Char, but it's pretty clear he's not.

He is the real Char Aznable, not the Casval/Char/Quattro guy we know in MSG, Z Gundam and CCA.

[Gubaba]

He is the real Char Aznable, not the Casval/Char/Quattro guy we know in MSG, Z Gundam and CCA.

Ah...Is THAT who he is? Interesting...

I guess Unicorn isn't following Gundam the Origin's version of the backstory, then...since not only did the real Char die, but we saw the body.

[Shmitty]

Firstly, there is no way to know it for sure right now, and secondly that would make no sense as a;

In the show canon, there was no REAL Char, he was fabricated by Casval.

And b; In the novels/ The Origin the REAL Char is killed when the shuttle he is on explodes.

It's more likely that Full Frontal is an actual Char clone.

[VFTF1]

I really have to finish watching MSG... I think I'm going to be old and grey by the time I get around to it.

The problem is - every time I watch Gundam I find myself wondering "so...when do the hot singing girls show up?" or "so...when does this transform into something that doesn't resemble itself, only crouching?" and most often "so - when does something remotely happy and optimistic happen?"

Not to detract from the show though - but dag...in retrospect and compared with other anime I'm watching/have watched...it's bleak...stark...sad... Although - I give it credit for not being as abysmal as Ideon: Be Invoked...

too bad my computer crashed just when I was getting into the series (MSG). I was half way in and then kaput. So naturally I've been recovering Macross and Gurren Lagann and still have to recover NGE...

Will be a while till I get back to Gundam.

God.

For all the technological wonder of the internet, I sometimes think that I'd save more time jus getting on an airplane, flying to Japan and spending a couple thousand bucks on DVDs and then getting a multi-Region player.

It might "cost less" in money to download the fansubs - but by Chrome - it costs a helluva lotta time!

Pete

[Ghost Train]

Correction, Full Frontal is "A Char":

[Gubaba]

Correction, Full Frontal is "A Char":

Ah, yes, yes.

You see, what Kai Shiden REALLY meant to say was "Quattro is A., CHAR." as in "Aznable, Char."

But it was revealed in Tomino's Zeta Gndam novels that Kai doesn't know how to use punctuation correctly.

[Phyrox]

Correction, Full Frontal is "A Char":

The fact that in the very next sentenceleaves out a necessary article (either "a" or "the") makes me doubt the difinitiveness of "a Char," and what it implies.

[Gubaba]

The fact that in the very next sentenceleaves out a necessary article (either "a" or "the") makes me doubt the difinitiveness of "a Char," and what it implies.

Do you take all Engrish so seriously...?

[Roy Focker]

Did anyone else not like Gundam Wing?

Prior to Wing's Cartoon Network run US Gundam products was very rare. I had a few toyss, manga and knew and some working knowledge of the UC. Not knowing what Wing was I was excited to finally see a US Mass Market release of Gundam. Wing was a big shock. I couldn't stand the 5 Gundam pretty boy pilots. They either the personality of wimps, overly anger or no personalty of all. Wing was really big. To me it was as different as Macross F was to Macross. Only difference is that I cared to keep watching Macross F to the end.

[MDP310]

Did anyone else not like Gundam Wing?

Prior to Wing's Cartoon Network run US Gundam products was very rare. I had a few toyss, manga and knew and some working knowledge of the UC. Not knowing what Wing was I was excited to finally see a US Mass Market release of Gundam. Wing was a big shock. I couldn't stand the 5 Gundam pretty boy pilots. They either the personality of wimps, overly anger or no personalty of all. Wing was really big. To me it was as different as Macross F was to Macross. Only difference is that I cared to keep watching Macross F to the end.

The first I heard about Gundam was Wing, but the first shows I actually saw were 0083 and 08th MS Team. When I actually started to watch Gundam Wing, I was blown away. By how crappy it was. I didn't like any of the characters, especially Heero. I have trouble getting into a show where the main character switches between homicidal jerk, and suicidal jerk multiple times an episode. The mecha designs were lame, and the story didn't make any sense. It seemed like gundam pilots were turning traitor simply to have an episode where Sandrock fought Heavyarms or Deathscythe fought Wing, then they would be friends again next week. Ugh.

Gundam X was awesome, though. I still have to finish watching it, but it grabbed my attention and kept it, unlike Wing which I couldn't bring myself to care about.

[Gubaba]

Did anyone else not like Gundam Wing?

Prior to Wing's Cartoon Network run US Gundam products was very rare. I had a few toyss, manga and knew and some working knowledge of the UC. Not knowing what Wing was I was excited to finally see a US Mass Market release of Gundam. Wing was a big shock. I couldn't stand the 5 Gundam pretty boy pilots. They either the personality of wimps, overly anger or no personalty of all. Wing was really big. To me it was as different as Macross F was to Macross. Only difference is that I cared to keep watching Macross F to the end.

I never saw it...I had been quite excited when AnimeVillage.com had opened, and I snapped up the Gundam Movie Trilogy, 0080, and 0083. I figured Zeta would follow soon after.

Imagine my surprise when Wing was the first Gundam TV series to make it to the U.S.

As UC stuff came out on DVD, I snapped it up, but I kept waiting and waiting for a subbed MSG, Zeta, and Double Zeta. Zeta finally came out, and I'm still waiting for the others...

But for me, Gundam has always been the story of Amuro and Char. The side stories and post-CCA stuff...well, I'll watch it, and I like a lot of it, butI don't think of it as the "main" story of Gundam.

The alternate universe stuff doesn't really interest me.

[lechuck]

Didn't like Wing either. I was lucky I introduced myself to the wonderful Gundam X first (love that post-apocalyptic setting) before going onto Wing.

And although the latter was produced after X it is a very poor representation of Gundam.

Poor characters, endless monotone monologues, constant alliance swapping, and more monologues, which then leads us to an obligatory battle.

That's what I remember Wing for.

Edited April 25, 2009 by lechuck

[kung flu]

Having known only UC gundam for most of my life, when Wing came to the west I was totally confused, I was wondering why the characters/mecha were all different from what i've seen before. I didn't know there was such things as a Alternate Universe genre at the time.

tbh i was shocked that they made such shows and didn't know what to think. I avoid alternate shows like the plague, but i know thats unfair as i'm judging shows which i haven't seen at all. Turn A being the only AU i've seen and that was an awsome show, but i still can't bring my self to watch G, Wing, Seed, 00, X.............. Theres just too much of it and the direction in which these shows are going is a real put off, theres just too much pretty boys, emos, girly boys and way too much fan service compared to the UC shows.

Fanservice is fine, but when they over do it it ruins the characters in a show, having big breasted characters or really short skirts dosen't really make me want to take that character seriously. If Emma Sheen had really big knockers and they took every chance to bounce them and include panty shots alot of the time, I don't think i would have that much respect for that character. The same can be said for all these pretty/girly boys found in Wing etc...... They don't come across as charaters I would care about.

Edited April 25, 2009 by kung flu

[kung flu]

Edit- double post please delete

Edited April 25, 2009 by kung flu

[F-ZeroOne]

Wing is like an itch that can't be scratched... However, I somehow doubt we were the intended audience. I once met a nice lady at a con who had made a t-shirt of Zechs. The image was hand-stitched. There is something going on there that is not meant for people who know the difference between different marks of Zakus.

What does annoy me more is the Gundams we haven't got yet. Bandai, I want to give you my money for Turn-A. You like money Bandai! I know you do! So you must be not releasing it because you hate me!

[Gubaba]

Wing is like an itch that can't be scratched... However, I somehow doubt we were the intended audience. I once met a nice lady at a con who had made a t-shirt of Zechs. The image was hand-stitched. There is something going on there that is not meant for people who know the difference between different marks of Zakus.

What does annoy me more is the Gundams we haven't got yet. Bandai, I want to give you my money for Turn-A. You like money Bandai! I know you do! So you must be not releasing it because you hate me!

I like to think Bandai really messed up in how they released the UC series out of order (releasing CCA before Zeta seemed especially silly), instead going for movies and OVAs before touching any of the TV shows...but I'm not sure it would have worked any way they went at it.

It seems like the first idea was to release it all in chronological order through AnimeVillage.com.

Then they got Wing on Cartoon Network, and I think their goal was to get people curious about the show through Wing, and then lead them to UC. But that didn't really work. Instead, you got kids thinking that Wing WAS the original, and UC was just a cheap, dated-looking knock-off.

I think the REAL problem was that, by not releasing any Gundam animation in the U.S. until 1998, they simply waited too long. The general anime fans didn't want to relate to twenty-year-old series, with multiple timelines, confusing chronology, and hundreds and hundreds of episodes. If they had released the first series in the first big anime push of '92 or '93, it might have been more successful.

Although, even then, any series longer than 26 episodes has always been facing an uphill battle...unless it's Ranma 1/2.

[kung flu]

I think Bandai tried to make gundam BIG in the west too fast instead of introducing it slowly, they jumped straight in hoping to make a big success. Instead of releasing it on video first they went straight to TV instead. If they release an old show like gundam like the way other companies have done with votoms and patlabor, it would have been better. Bandai hoped they can achieve big success in a short time, when in reallity the success they have in the east took many years to achieve.

[Gubaba]

I think Bandai tried to make gundam BIG in the west too fast instead of introducing it slowly, they jumped straight in hoping to make a big success. Instead of releasing it on video first they went straight to TV instead. If they release an old show like gundam like the way other companies have done with votoms and patlabor, it would have been better. Bandai hoped they can achieve big success in a short time, when in reallity the success they have in the east took many years to achieve.

But... But... They DID release it on video first!

[kung flu]

But... But... They DID release it on video first!

When?, I'm talking about First Gundam TV series, but i'm from the UK where it was never released at all, I'm just thinking of the USA mostly. If votoms, patlabor etc can be released without the big marketing, then so can gundam, bandai just went all out and failed. If they introduced UC slowly, the fan base would eventaully build up, even if it takes years.

[Gubaba]

When?, I'm talking about First Gundam TV series, but i'm from the UK where it was never released at all, I'm just thinking of the USA mostly. If votoms, patlabor etc can be released without the big marketing, then so can gundam, bandai just went all out and failed. If they introduced UC slowly, the fan base would eventaully build up, even if it takes years.

Well, in '98, they released the Gundam Movie Trilogy, 0080, and 0083 through AnimeVillage.com. You couldn't get them in stores, at least initially. They allowed that to happen in either '99 or '00.

Then Wing debuted in '00, with MSG following in '01.

[REbirth]

But for me, Gundam has always been the story of Amuro and Char. The side stories and post-CCA stuff...well, I'll watch it, and I like a lot of it, butI don't think of it as the "main" story of Gundam.

The alternate universe stuff doesn't really interest me.

This is the complete opposite for me, considering I'm dead-tired with the OYW-CCA stuff (and stuffs involving the two big mans, Amuro and Char), so that point the conflict doesn't hook me up anymore.

F91 breaths new life into UC, too bad the story is super uber rushed, Crossbone is never animated and Victory, while good, is largely ignored by UC fans.

About AU shows, G Gundam, Gundam X and Turn A Gundam all rock, G Gundam is a different take on Gundam by Yasuhiro Imagawa, Gundam X is basicallly UC in the far fetch future, and Turn A is supposed to be the End of Gundam.

[Gubaba]

This is the complete opposite for me, considering I'm dead-tired with the OYW-CCA stuff (and stuffs involving the two big mans, Amuro and Char), so that point the conflict doesn't hook me up anymore.

F91 breaths new life into UC, too bad the story is super uber rushed, Crossbone is never animated and Victory, while good, is largely ignored by UC fans.

About AU shows, G Gundam, Gundam X and Turn A Gundam all rock, G Gundam is a different take on Gundam by Yasuhiro Imagawa, Gundam X is basicallly UC in the far fetch future, and Turn A is supposed to be the End of Gundam.

I'm not sure what you're talking about when you say that Victory gets ignored...most Gundam fans I know like it. Now G-Saviour...THAT gets ignored.

I can understand being dead-tired with OYW stuff...they make far too much of it (especially if you include comics), but you're not the first person I've heard who's sick of Char and Amuro, and I don't really understand it. They're central in MSG. Char is quite important in Zeta, but Amuro's a relatively minor character. They get referenced in Double Zeta, but don't actualy appear. And they're the main characters again in CCA. Compare that to the many, many, MANY Gundam productions that DON'T feature them...I'm confused.

Anyway, I don't want more with Char and Amuro, their stories are done. And so, as far as I'm concerned, is the true story of Gundam. It ended for me in 1989, and I'm happy with it that way.

I'm not saying this is how other people should view Gundam, it's just how I view it.

To me, Gundam is Tomino's story, and I'm not terribly interested in other creators' "take" on the saga. Likewise, MSG, Z, ZZ, and CCA are the core story of Gundam (again, to me), and although I enjoy other Gundam series, and get Gundam Ace every month, I'm just not as attached to anything beyond that core story.

[kung flu]

Yeah, gundam to me is mainly about Char and Amuro or the Zeon/Earth conflicts and it's factions, without them, gundam is nothing. Sure the show is named after the robot, but its the characters and story that makes it stand out more than the other robot shows that have come and gone. I beleive the old shows have really struck a great balance between robot and character development, while most shows they just concentrate on the robot and its gimmicks.

I wouldn't mind if they made side stories during the oyw to cca era as it would expand the universe further. Although oyw is over done, they still come up with some great stuff like igloo.

imo victory is one of the best gundam shows out there, making shows/stories beyond cca is a added bonus for me and again also expands the universe, but what i don't like is some of them always have to have a Char type character whether it be a clone or some guy in a mask. Char died, they should quit trying to bring him back. Unicorn, i would like to read or see if they make an anime, but hearing that a character like char is in it, really ruins it a little.

[Excillon]

Aside from G-saviour, I like anything Gundam, even Wing. I agree the UC stuff got a bit played out. They need to spread the timeline out further. I mean, it all takes place in such a small window.

Honestly, right now my favorite universe right now is Seed (ducks). I hope they stay with it, it's a nice loose reboot of UC, and hopefully a chance to fix the mistakes of UC, and I think Kira is a much more likable character than Amuro.

Personally, I had the worst trouble with G gundam. It was hard to watch, I'm not into the whole Dragonball/tounament thing. It's a shame too, I thought the main Mecha like God, Dragon, Maxter, Master and Speigel were pretty cool designs.

[REbirth]

Yeah, gundam to me is mainly about Char and Amuro or the Zeon/Earth conflicts and it's factions, without them, gundam is nothing. Sure the show is named after the robot, but its the characters and story that makes it stand out more than the other robot shows that have come and gone. I beleive the old shows have really struck a great balance between robot and character development, while most shows they just concentrate on the robot and its gimmicks.

I wouldn't mind if they made side stories during the oyw to cca era as it would expand the universe further. Although oyw is over done, they still come up with some great stuff like igloo.

To me, this is what drags Gundam down, Gundam is a war of ideals with robots, not just a story involving two rival guys and some big political factions, that's why as much as G Gundam differs from the norm, it's still considered a Gundam, plot-wise.

Character development-wise, I don't think G Gundam/Gundam X/Turn A characters are any lackluster compared to the UC characters, some are even better than existing UC characters. I'm kind glad we never have a Reccoa-like character in those shows.

But the last part is where we differ, I still watch mecha shows for the robots rather than the characters, unless the characters are annoying to the point that I can't stand them piloting said robots.

@Gububa: I'm sick of Amuro and Char due to CCA, the biggest Amuro/Char fanservice movie ever.

[Gubaba]

@Gububa: I'm sick of Amuro and Char due to CCA, the biggest Amuro/Char fanservice movie ever.

I still don't really get it...CCA is SUPPOSED to be all about them. That's kind of like saying that Return of the Jedi was nothing but Luke and Vader fanservice. Or that DYRL had too much Hikaru, Misa, and Minmay.

But whatever...if you don't like 'em, you don't like 'em. It's a pretty safe bet that no future Gundam animation will have them in it, so the point is kind of moot.

[REbirth]

It's a pretty safe bet that no future Gundam animation will have them in it, so the point is kind of moot.

Or will they? lol

Considering how desperate Sunrise tries to make newer AU shows to be like UC as much as possible (without being UC, yeah).

I won't be surprised if they later re-introduce Char and Amuro in new UC shows to attract more fans.

Edited April 26, 2009 by REbirth

[Gubaba]

I won't be surprised if they later re-introduce Char and Amuro in new UC shows to attract more fans.

Man, that would be lame.

In Gundam Evolve? Sure. A brief cameo in MS Igloo? Okay.

But if they put them in a major role in anything, I don't think it would work.