Can Someone Explain Macross Zero?

[illadave]

Just finished watching all of Macross Zero... but i'm still confused! Can someone please explain how Zero is related to the original series?

it'll be so helpful!

thanks

[myk]

Don't let the superior animation and arguably better looking variable fighters than the original Macross series throw you off, it's a prequel to SDF: Macross, that still carries the Macross message of peace, love, song and variable-fighters with missiles and triple barreled autocannons to conquer all...

Edited March 25, 2006 by myk

[Roy Focker]

A little background from you on your own experiences (how many macross have you seen) will help us to know how much we'll need to explain to you.

[jenius]

You clearly haven't seen Macross Wars: A New Hope yet. You see, in that series we actually learn that the force is present in all living beings and that Protoculture were the first Jedis. Their order spread throughout the 'verse until their own creations, the Sith Lords known as the Evals, mutated becoming super powerful evil creatures. A great galactic war then spread out across the cosmos. Before the Proto-jedis were completely defeated by the Sith they set up some safe-guards on their distant colony planets to make sure that the colony planets wouldn't be more enfluenced by the dark side of the force than the light side. Earth is a colony planet and the AFOS is similar to the tunnel of fear that Yoda made Luke pass through. If the humans can overcome hatred and learn to love then they can become true universal Jedis. Shin accomlishes this by putting down his light saber when approaching the AFOS. In the end, he, and the AFOS, both vanish like ObiWan Kenobe.

Edited March 26, 2006 by jenius

[eugimon]

Wha??? Are you serious? I totally missed that part, is this after shin discovers that the VF-0 is actually a clone of his dead mother?

[JB0]

Wha??? Are you serious? I totally missed that part, is this after shin discovers that the VF-0 is actually a clone of his dead mother?

384060[/snapback]

That part was only in Robotech.

[reddsun1]

Macross Wars: A New Hope. I been meaning to rent that one.

As near as I can make out, the whole premise of MZero is that some many thousands of years ago, an alien culture [not the same "proto-culture" responsible for the Zentraedi, Supervision Army, etc. I gather?] came to Earth and "helped along" man's evolution to some degree, altering human DNA, etc. as is stil evident in the Mayan islanders' blood samples. Perhaps they deemed mankind too violent and warlike in nature, and apparently upon leaving Earth, the bird man Kardun [or "Carlton" as some subtitles called it, LOL] was left behind as a sort of safe-guard? I think the bird man was left behind to make sure man couldn't spread his wicked ways to other civilizations, should he ever become capable of space travel. Just a theory based on this. When Kardun awakes, he asks Sara if man has managed to make space ships yet, and if they are still fighting wars. When she affirms, he says something to the affect of "precautions must be taken" and promptly begins blasting the nearby ships. I don't think this alien culture was meant to be taken as the same that's responsible for the Macross. After all, in all the vastness of the Macross universe what are the odds of there only being one or two other cultures besides human?

Edited March 26, 2006 by reddsun1

[JB0]

Macross Wars: A New Hope.  I been meaning to rent that one. 

As near as I can make out, the whole premise of MZero is that some many thousands of years ago, an alien culture [not the same "proto-culture" responsible for the Zentraedi, Supervision Army, etc. I gather?] came to Earth and "helped along" man's evolution to some degree, altering human DNA, etc.

It was the protoculture.

http://macross.anime.net/story/chronology/...0000/index.html

" PC 2870

A Protoculture survey ship stops temporarily on "Earth." By genetically reconstructing the native life, it plots the emergence of a sub-Protoculture adapted to the planetary enivronment, "Humankind," to prepare for future colonization. During its return to its home planet, the survey ship is destroyed by military ships opposed to the Stellar Republic. Records of Earth and Humankind are eventually lost. [PC 2900] "

Perhaps they deemed mankind too violent and warlike in nature, and apparently upon leaving Earth, the bird man Kardun [or "Carlton" as some subtitles called it, LOL] was left behind as a sort of safe-guard?  I think the bird man was left behind to make sure man couldn't spread his wicked ways to other civilizations, should he ever become capable of space travel.  Just a theory based on this.  When Kardun awakes, he asks Sara if man has managed to make space ships yet, and if they are still fighting wars.  When she affirms, he says something to the affect of "precautions must be taken" and promptly begins blasting the nearby ships.  I don't think this alien culture was meant to be taken as the same that's responsible for the Macross.  After all, in all the vastness of the universe what are the odds of there only being one or two other cultures besides human?

384076[/snapback]

It was established before Zero that we were the results of genetic tinkering. It actually comes up in the original series that humans are almost genetically identical to the zentradi, and bear the marks of genetic engineering in their DNA. That implies a similar origin.

Remember, the protoculture had conquered most of the galaxy. There were the protoculture, and there were everyone the protoculture conquered. Then there were races engineered by protoculture survey ships so there'd be someone to conquer once they made it out here en masse.

But the evaluation of the homicidal alien birdmech thingie is pretty much spot-on.

That's probably also why it requires Sara as an operator. It leaves a "cancel button" in the system by putting a human in control(albeit one jacked into a mech with homicidal tendancies that's screwing with her head).

If Sara changes her mind about us needing to be blasted back to the stone age for another try, she can stop it(and does).

Edited March 26, 2006 by JB0

[reddsun1]

Ah, thanks for the clarification. So, we're pretty much "tampered goods" eh? It figures as much. Damned aliens, with their anal probes, and thier cow-butchery, and their crop circles... Oh, wait a minute; they've got them cool ass transforming robots and such. Guess they ain't all that bad.

[jenius]

It leaves a "cancel button" in the system by putting a human in control(albeit one jacked into a mech with homicidal tendancies that's screwing with her head).

If Sara changes her mind about us needing to be blasted back to the stone age for another try, she can stop it(and does).

As Shin drags Sara's near lifeless corpse to the escape pod, Sara asks Shin to take off her helmet...

[JB0]

Ah, thanks for the clarification.  So, we're pretty much "tampered goods" eh?  It figures as much.  Damned aliens, with their anal probes, and thier cow-butchery, and their crop circles...  Oh, wait a minute; they've got them cool ass transforming robots and such.  Guess they ain't all that bad.

384091[/snapback]

Was a popular theme in sci-fi for a while.

The "missing link" between apes and cavemen wasn't found for a long time, and it was a fun way to explain it. It still shows up every now and then, but a lot less regularly than it used to(we've filled out a lot more of the homo genus since On the Origin of Species was first published).

It leaves a "cancel button" in the system by putting a human in control(albeit one jacked into a mech with homicidal tendancies that's screwing with her head).

If Sara changes her mind about us needing to be blasted back to the stone age for another try, she can stop it(and does).

As Shin drags Sara's near lifeless corpse to the escape pod, Sara asks Shin to take off her helmet...

384092[/snapback]

Haw.

[illadave]

thanks you guys! it's helping me out a lot. i never watched the original series (BUT i should receive it on monday since i bought the whole SDF Macross series for only 50 bucks!!). BUT, i did watch some episodes of Robotech, but i don't count that. the only ones i have seen were macross: DYRL, zero, and plus. Plus is my all-time favorite (another bragging moment: i bought the dvd for $6.50 off ebay!).

also, is shin a birdman? why do sara and shin both leave to space? and are the birdmen the same as zentraedi?

Edited March 26, 2006 by illadave

[JB0]

also, is shin a birdman?  why do sara and shin both leave to space?  and are the birdmen the same as zentraedi?

384131[/snapback]

My take(keep in mind I haven't watched the show since episode 5 first came out)...

Sara left to get the AFOS away from Earth, I'm pretty sure.

Shin left to follow Sara.

The birdmen are the protoculture.

Edited March 26, 2006 by JB0

[illadave]

damn...so what exactly is protoculture? or should i just watch the original series?

[fansubs2000]

thanks you guys!  it's helping me out a lot.  i never watched the original series (BUT i should receive it on monday since i bought the whole SDF Macross series for only 50 bucks!!).

Plus is my all-time favorite (another bragging moment: i bought the dvd for $6.50 off ebay!).

384131[/snapback]

At those prices they must be the Hong Kong bootleg version right?

I do agree though, Macross Plus was awesome and one of my favorites.

[jenius]

I got the 5 ep Mac0 DVD for $5 and the subtitles are PERFECT. You can definitely find Mac0 nice and cheap. A sidenote to that though... the eBay user that sold it to me disappeared very quickly after I got it... and my copy just has "MACROSS ZERO" written with a sharpee on a DVD+R

Protoculture is a power source... HAHAHA (you can sense the sphincters of most MW users quinching as they read that... um, that is, if you get the Robotech joke there)

Protoculture are the beings who started it all. They create a big galactic empire. They go to planets and manipulate the DNA of the inhabitants there to some day resemble the Protoculture and fit into the galactic empire. They create warrior species meant to protect the empire. The warrior species goes to war with itself so they create a SUPER warrior species to kill the warrior species. The SUPER warrior species gets infected by beings from a parallel universe and begin brainwashing the original warrior species. The original warrior species breaks up into two (or three if you divide the meltrans and zentrans) groups, the brainwashed "supervision army" vs. the non-brainwashed Zentraedi. The Supervision Army loses a ship when it crashes into Earth. When the Zentraedi arrive to pick it up/destroy it, they find that Earth has developed into what is essentially a protoculture colony (as the protoculture had hoped it would).

Zero tells the story of mankind's passing the Protoculture's test to actually be an inductee into the Protoculture Republic. MacrossTV tells the story of what happens when mankind is the unknowing last reminants of a once great republic... and then sets off to rebuild it... kinda.

NOTE - everything I said is rife with my own understanding... which may very well be wrong. MacrossTV will help you understand everything but I'm one of those people who contend the Macross universe relies heavily on not-animated information. Basically, you better go to the compendium to help you understand things or read the FAQs here.

Edited March 26, 2006 by jenius

[Zinjo]

also, is shin a birdman?  why do sara and shin both leave to space?  and are the birdmen the same as zentraedi?

384131[/snapback]

My take(keep in mind I haven't watched the show since episode 5 first came out)...

Sara left to get the AFOS away from Earth, I'm pretty sure.

Shin left to follow Sara.

The birdmen are the protoculture.

384132[/snapback]

The Sara part is right.

We are not completely sure if Shin is dead or not, it got all paranormal with him at the end.

The Birdmen are most likely Protoculture vehicles, as the AFOS needed Sara to work properly (which seems to imply that Sara's family may have been decendants of the protoculture race).

According to Kawmori et al. The protoculture became a peaceful race and established a Galactic Repulic of sorts. Their eventual Civil war was what the Zentreadi and the Supervision Army end up fighting for over half a million years.

The biggest casualty of the war was the Protoculture race itself, who, as far as anyone knows, may have been completely wiped out.

As for how it relates to the SDF Macross series, it is a prequel which gives us a glimpse into the Unification War (that Focker, Global and Admiral Hayase fought in), the first apearance of Variable fighters in the world and our first taste of the many mysteries surrounding the once powerful and enigmatic Protoculture race, the authors of Overtechnology.

Edited March 26, 2006 by Zinjo

[illadave]

i appreciate all the help you guys!

as for the SDF Macross set that I bought, it is the original copy! it's all nine volumes in a nice box which even includes the holographic card that came with it. interestingly, the guy put it at a $49.99 buy it now price tag. i guess i was looking at the right time, because once i saw that price, i had to get it! i just can't wait for it to come. it should be coming on monday.

i went on this complete Macross binge, as I have already purchased Zero, the original macross series, Flashback 2012, 20th anniversary special, AND Plus. I'm looking forward to watching Plus on my surround sound system...

[Dante74]

The "missing link" between apes and cavemen wasn't found for a long time, and it was a fun way to explain it. It still shows up every now and then, but a lot less regularly than it used to(we've filled out a lot more of the homo genus since On the Origin of Species was first published).

384097[/snapback]

Thank God we did. No wait, that doesn't make sence...

[JB0]

The biggest casualty of the war was the Protoculture race itself, who, as far as anyone knows, may have been completely wiped out.

If I recall, most sentient life in the galaxy was wiped out at the end, with the protodevlin war.

And there might still be some protoculture left. The chronology's last mention of them says "near annihilation of Protoculture". Once their interstellar network and central government collapsed, it would be a lot harder to track down all the outlying colonies. So there could be a few protoculture worlds off in the far side of the Milky Way.

The "missing link" between apes and cavemen wasn't found for a long time, and it was a fun way to explain it. It still shows up every now and then, but a lot less regularly than it used to(we've filled out a lot more of the homo genus since On the Origin of Species was first published).

384097[/snapback]

Thank God we did. No wait, that doesn't make sence...

384182[/snapback]

*laughs*

[Keith]

The biggest casualty of the war was the Protoculture race itself, who, as far as anyone knows, may have been completely wiped out.

If I recall, most sentient life in the galaxy was wiped out at the end, with the protodevlin war.

And there might still be some protoculture left. The chronology's last mention of them says "near annihilation of Protoculture". Once their interstellar network and central government collapsed, it would be a lot harder to track down all the outlying colonies. So there could be a few protoculture worlds off in the far side of the Milky Way.

Very likely, or at least likely some additional Protoculture influenced worlds. The Zolan's have already been found afterall. Come to think of it, the way the AFOS left, and the way the Ginga Kujira left weren't entirely dissimilar, perhaps both were pieces of a test to finding the remaining Protoculture? I still say Sara & Shin will pop up in the next Macross Project..

[Macross73]

The biggest casualty of the war was the Protoculture race itself, who, as far as anyone knows, may have been completely wiped out.

If I recall, most sentient life in the galaxy was wiped out at the end, with the protodevlin war.

And there might still be some protoculture left. The chronology's last mention of them says "near annihilation of Protoculture". Once their interstellar network and central government collapsed, it would be a lot harder to track down all the outlying colonies. So there could be a few protoculture worlds off in the far side of the Milky Way.

Very likely, or at least likely some additional Protoculture influenced worlds. The Zolan's have already been found afterall. Come to think of it, the way the AFOS left, and the way the Ginga Kujira left weren't entirely dissimilar, perhaps both were pieces of a test to finding the remaining Protoculture? I still say Sara & Shin will pop up in the next Macross Project..

384498[/snapback]

Speculation here but coudn't Shin & Sara have gone to have meet the "nearly extinct Protoculture' race? Perhaps as representatives of our peaceful culture.

Edited March 27, 2006 by Macross73

[Keith]

Perhaps, but considering nearly 50 years has passed in the canon chronology, more than likely their meeting of any nearly extinct Protoculture would result in them being part of some grander scheme test on humanity. Humans just barely half ass passed the AFOS test, just barely survived the Protodevelin, and just barely saved the Ginga Kujira. All of thsee events could be construed as luck.

Besides, after so many years, who's to say any remnants of the Protoculture would be the same as when they were nearly whiped out. Could be some crazed militant faction who either forgot who they once were, or no longer cared. There does afterall have to be a source of conflict.

[JB0]

Perhaps, but considering nearly 50 years has passed in the canon chronology, more than likely their meeting of any nearly extinct Protoculture would result in them being part of some grander scheme test on humanity. Humans just barely half ass passed the AFOS test, just barely survived the Protodevelin, and just barely saved the Ginga Kujira. All of thsee events could be construed as luck.

Besides, after so many years, who's to say any remnants of the Protoculture would be the same as when they were nearly whiped out. Could be some crazed militant faction who either forgot who they once were, or no longer cared. There does afterall have to be a source of conflict.

384505[/snapback]

Don't care is more likely. They've been isolated from their people, alone in the middle of nowhere, for millenia. The protoculture empire is more like their Atlantis or Babel at this point than their Rome. They don't really give a crap what hare-brained schemes it concocted.

[illadave]

Man... this is some great information you guys! Now all I need to do is look up some of your terms (AFOS, Ginga Kujira (?), etc.).

What else are some good sites to look at?

On another note: I got my SDF Macross collection and Macross Plus in the mail today! Gotta love eBay!

[JB0]

Man... this is some great information you guys!  Now all I need to do is look up some of your terms (AFOS, Ginga Kujira (?), etc.).

What else are some good sites to look at?

AFOS was the big birdmech in Macross Zero.

But macross.anime.net for all your information needs.

On another note: I got my SDF Macross collection and Macross Plus in the mail today!  Gotta love eBay!

384768[/snapback]

WOOT!

[Zinjo]

Don't care is more likely. They've been isolated from their people, alone in the middle of nowhere, for millenia. The protoculture empire is more like their Atlantis or Babel at this point than their Rome. They don't really give a crap what hare-brained schemes it concocted.

384703[/snapback]

I tend to agree with JBO in that respect.

If there are any militant protoculture decendants it would likely be ones who might control the Supervision Army.

After all, according to the chronology there were protoculture citizens brainwashed into fighting the civil war as well as Zentraedi and they may have become accustomed to the taste of battle and conquest.

The only real survivors of that war were the armies from both sides.

Edited March 28, 2006 by Zinjo

[Knight26]

I still say that Shin and Sara settled down on some remote planet somewhere, possibly and old Protoculture colony, and started having babies, and one *shudders* was Nekki Basara.

[EXO]

I still say that Shin and Sara settled down on some remote planet somewhere, possibly and old Protoculture colony, and started having babies, and one *shudders* was Nekki Basara.

385095[/snapback]

now, if THAT isn't an argument for birth control...

[briscojr84]

I still say that Shin and Sara settled down on some remote planet somewhere, possibly and old Protoculture colony, and started having babies, and one *shudders* was Nekki Basara.

385095[/snapback]

now, if THAT isn't an argument for birth control...

385098[/snapback]

Oh lord don't start the Macross 7 stuff please.

Although I've only seen the first episode non-dubbed I've been saving up my pennies, both the mecha and character art wowed me especially the character art this time it was highly detailed.

[Zinjo]

Although I've only seen the first episode non-dubbed I've been saving up my pennies, both the mecha and character art wowed me especially the character art this time it was highly detailed.

385183[/snapback]

Don't expect anything on the caliber of Macross Plus or even Zero and just enjoy the characters and their interactions. With that in mind you'll be fine...

Edited March 29, 2006 by Zinjo

[briscojr84]

Although I've only seen the first episode non-dubbed I've been saving up my pennies, both the mecha and character art wowed me especially the character art this time it was highly detailed.

385183[/snapback]

Don't expect anything on the caliber of Macross Plus or even Zero and just enjoy the characters and their interactions. With that in mind you'll be fine...

385232[/snapback]

Oops, actually I meant I only saw the first ep of zero non-subbed, I already have all of 7, including movie, plus episodes, and dynamite. [And that's all I'm going to say about it].

[JB0]

Although I've only seen the first episode non-dubbed I've been saving up my pennies, both the mecha and character art wowed me especially the character art this time it was highly detailed.

385183[/snapback]

Don't expect anything on the caliber of Macross Plus or even Zero and just enjoy the characters and their interactions. With that in mind you'll be fine...

385232[/snapback]

Oops, actually I meant I only saw the first ep of zero non-subbed, I already have all of 7, including movie, plus episodes, and dynamite. [And that's all I'm going to say about it].

385313[/snapback]

"LISTEN TO MY SONG!"

"Umm, I'm really not a fan of rock mus-"

"LISTEN TO MY SONG!"

"Oooookay then..."

[David Hingtgen]

All my M7 stuff is on my previous PC's hard drive, somewhere in the garage. I still have to get all the other stuff though---the M7 OVA, etc. I've only seen the basic 49 eps, really want to see "Fleet of the Strongest Woman".

[rei]

Wow! I just finished it tonight (and a bottle of wine). Pretty heavy. I'll definitley need to watch it over. But I really like it and it wasn't as Apocalypse Now as I thought. Watch it with an open mind and you feel the Macross in it. It just focuses more on details of characters we aren't familiar with but it ties in to the big picture. I wish there was more Roy though. I 50/50 had a feeling he wasn't going to have the stage for the most part but it was enough. When you watch SDF Macross and DRYL afterwards, you see Roy as a humble dude because he has been though some serious X-File experiences that isn't hinted in the sequels.

Claudia? Oh well.

Now I MUST have a VF-OS

BTW, the VF0 in blue (like the TV Jenius) is bad ass. I hope they release it.

Edited April 20, 2006 by rei